Mandatory Life Vests For All Passengers????

The following email was forwarded to me by Zane Schwenk...

Please forward this to anyone that cares about boating. They are trying AGAIN to make PFD's mandatory for ALL boaters. Can you imagine all boaters having to wear a PFD at all times while operating their boat?

This would certainly put a hit on the marine industry as a whole. Please DO NOT take it lightly as this is the second time in recent years that this issue has come up.

Please take a moment to send a note to your senator and congressman about this issue. Unless they know how you feel, I can see the USCG pushing this through and at that point it will be to late. Also drop the same note to your state representatives. Not sure who your represenitaves are? No problem, click the link below and put in your state and zip code, contact the rep that covers your business address along with home.

http://www.visi.com/juan/congress/.
For the state of Ohio http://www.legislature.state.oh.us/.
For Indiana http://www.in.gov/apps/sos/legislator/search/ . For Kentucky http://www.vote-smart.org/index.htm .

Do it now. Unless your elected represenitaves hear from you, this will get passed, Why? because it sounds like they are doing something good.

Thanks for your support



Good Afternoon Sir/Madam,

Your article in the Dec 05 issue wherein the United States Coast Guard is making another valiant effort to reduce the number of fatalities caused by boating accidents. I applaud their efforts having spent over 22 years in Search and Rescue and Law Enforcement for the Coast Guard.


These are much the same as the goals set forth for the airline, auto, and rail industries, to reduce the number of accidents and therefore deaths. To say that a PFD either contributed to or prevented a boating accident would be absurd and ridiculous. Speaking of the absurd, you can buy a common, ordinary toaster, designed to warm your slice of bread. There are settings applicable as to "how brown" you want the toast, but the braid dead is provided with volumes of written material as to what would happen to you should you drop it in a bath tub or squirt it in the back yard. All in an effort to keep some poor fool who should be tied up inside the house from electrocuting himself. The auto industry has dash bags, side bags, crushable steering wheels and dashboards; literally thousands of other "safety" features to reduce accidents and deaths. We have spent billions (with a B) for designed safety features, rules and regulations to keep us Safe from Ourselves - and yet, we kill 118 individuals on the highways of America EACH and EVERY day.


Registration of boats goes UP and the accident rates go DOWN as does the number of fatalities, and yet, the Coast Guard wants nothing more than to have EVERYONE wear a life jacket ALL the time.


2004 BOATING DATA; ONLY FIVE FATALITIES PER 100,000 REGISTERED BOATS
• 13 MILLION REGISTERED BOATS in 2004 (6.3 million in 1973)
• 676 Fatalities in 2004 as compared to 1754 in 1973


Now, how are you going to make a Federal Law which reguiring EVERYBODY ALL the time wear the PFD ??


Are you going to make it the size of the boat - (Carnival Cruise Lines vs. the PWC) , the weather condition (FAC to raging Force V), the age of the person (little kids, teens, adults, senior citizens, wheel chair bound), the water being sailed upon - (back yard pond, inland lake, Great Lake, Ocean)?


What are the conditions going to be or will it be EVERYBODY ALL the time?


Two problems become quite evident:


One, the USCG, the State, and Local law enforcement officals have way more to do with Homeland Security than to be checking life jackets.
Two, this does absolutely nothing, zip, zero, nada to do with the advancement of recreational boating.


If the governments (Fed, State, Local) continue this relentless pursuit of taking care of or protecting everybody all the time when 95% of those people could and should exercise a modicum of intelligence. They would KNOW when, where, and under what conditions should the PFD go from "readily accessible" to "on and secured". Otherwise, the the boating public will soon tire of a recreational activity in which their pleasure is too greatly encumbered by the "do gooders".


Respectfully,

James P. Sutherland
Commander, USCG (ret)

This is the biggest CRAP ever!

Lets mandate PFDs for everyone swimming in backyard pools!

The USA is retarded.

Although I wouldn't want this to pass into law, I would suggest you find someone other than James P. Sutherland to be your spokesman.

That letter would never be taken seriously by anyone.

Maybe I'm not reading this clearly enough but I'm seeing a lot of pronouns without antecedents.

"They are trying AGAIN to make PFD's mandatory for ALL boaters."

Who is "they?" Is "they" a real group of people or a governing authority or the same "they" that are trying to get prayer further banned from schools via a lady who has been dead for over a decade?

"Your article in the Dec 05 issue"

What article and an issue of what?

I'm not saying that I don't believe that there could be a real effort to enforce mandatroy wearing of PFDs on all boat passengers, I just think we're a little short on information to start firing letters off to Congressmen.

And maybe someone who knows more than I do about the subject can chime in, but I was under the impression that the USCG does not have the authority to enforce that kind of thing on all waterways. I thought the DNR's of each state made the rules for their respective lakes and rivers. Those are certainly the guys I see patrolling my lake.

The USCG has the authority to enforce this regulation on all waterways connected to the Great Lakes, Gulf, or ocean. Since most states have a law that automatically adopts USCG standards, it is a defacto nationwide law.

There is an advisory council for recreational boating that the USCG chairs. The membership is made up of all state agencies with recreational boating responsibilities. That body's annual report goes to congress with recommendations. The mandatory PFD recommendation has been discussed every year. It goes to congress every few years.

Yes, this is a serious proposal. If there is a few people in every district who actually writes a letter, it will fail. Each letter counts for a large number of votes in the mind of the rep. Since the budget is coming, that is the time it would be inserted. Now it the time to write. You have one rep and two senators. Write to all three. Use your own words, not a form lwtter. Be short, but explain your position in detail. Sign your name and include your contact info. This sounds silly, but include a picture. It is harder to vote against a human.

I agree. That letter is horrible!

I don't see how this could happen. Can you picture Gates and Ellis walking the decks of their yachts with vests on over their Polo shirts? Too general.

Just wrote all three.

although the letter may not be up to par, if the author is really a commander(pretty damned high in the ranks, O-5) some consideration would be taken by the current coast guard.

I did too. This is stupid.

Thanks Karl for clearing up the issue of USCG authority, but I'm still pretty sketchy on just how serious a proposal this is. So far I have Karl and David (via Zane Schwenk) who say it is serious but don't give a real source in either case. There's a Dec 5th issue of something but it's not specified what it's an issue of. Does anybody have ANY information that can be looked up and verified concerning this issue (either on-line or at the local library)? I just think it'd be wise to get a copy of what exactly they are proposing before passing judgement on it. I'll look for info myself when I get a chance and pass on any actual facts I find.

The commanders letter certainly does lack a certain level of diplomacy. But I do appreciate his no nonsense tell them how it is approach.
Its nice to know not everybody goes down the politically correct road.

I have a weird feeling that this is not true...I tried looking up some of the legislation trying to go thru but didn't find anything on this.

However, bassfan.com had an article from Feb-2004 wanting to stress the importance of this and it should be law for all boaters...I guess that's another reason to hate the fisherman

http://www.soundingsonline.com/stories.html?story=10

http://www.ntsb.gov/events/symp_pfd/papers/PII.3_Griswold_NSBC.pdf

http://www.csbc.ca/PDFfiles/USNTSBCommentsreMandaWearPFD.pdf

There are a lot of people who what to protect us from ourselves. Most have never spent a day on the boat riding and hanging. Most have no understanding of recreational boating. It is up to us to educate them and block them from imposing something on us that we don't need.

gates walking on his yachts with vests over their polo shirts....hahahahahah lol.thats funny

http://www.nasbla.org/pdf/Model%20Acts/new/Personal%20Flotation%20Devices%2092105.pdf

Here is the latest, solid information.

2004 seems to be the year this was a big deal, KG. Just ask Karl. All of his stories are from 2004 (November, August, and October, respectively). If nothing has even been written on the subject in over a year, I doubt there's a whole lot of action taking place right now. I could be wrong on this, but I'd think that at least somebody would find this newsworthy if it's as impending as the top post would have us believe. I'm going to go ahead and go out on a limb here and call bull on Schwenk's email. It's either purposely misleading or (more likely) based on old information that is probably not going to be acted on, at least not without it being covered a bit more by some news source or another.

I could see Gates wearing the life vest on his yacht. Some big yellow job with his captain's hat held on by a chin strap

Update: Just read through Karl's most recent article (came while I was writing mine). Looks like the same old stuff to me. Is the children under 12 requirement new? Don't see anything about being forced to wear a PFD, only that one be made readily available (as per current law anyways).

(Message edited by hal2814 on February 10, 2006)

Remember that this has been festering under the surface for many years. There are a lot of people who push for this every year. Mainly insurance companies who look at the statistics and how to keep from paying out.

As for timining, 2004 is the year for 2006. I spent some time as a lobbyist in DC and 8.5 years in the USCG Marine Safety field. I don't have any infomation from by friends in CG HQ that anything is pending other than the normal noise. Keeping up with your reps and senators is aways a good idea on a variety of issues. Ask them to let you know if there is an issue you want to be informed on - PFDs, Waterways usage policy, dredging, ballast issues, wake surfing, helmets, etc. The more they see your name, the more clout you have with them.

Keeping up with your representatives is one thing. Firing off a copy of a letter on an issue that's not even really an issue right now is quite another. I will conceed that it does usually take a year or two to actually get anything done legislatively so 2004 could indeed be "the year for 2006" for many issues but in general those issues are at least talked about some time between 2004 and 2006.

I'd advise everyone to keep an eye on the issue if it concerns you and if you feel the need to write your congressman over this, go ahead and do it but at least take the time to write your own thoughts down instead of copying a 4th-hand letter on the subject.

"Your article in the Dec 05 issue wherein the United States Coast Guard is making another valiant effort to reduce the number of fatalities caused by boating accidents."

Let’s not start off with an incomplete sentence.

OK, that's just a poorly written letter all together. We can do better than that!

That's lame. I don't understand how people can propose mandatory PFD's but any jack off can buy a boat that goes 100mph in rough waters. I am all for a Boaters Safety course that is mandatory and has a 5 year renewal period much like a drivers license. That is legislation that I could support. Maybe they can put everyone in those beer goggles and show them what inebriated boating is like, that would be pretty funny.

Liscense like you need one for a vehicle. Except this is driver's training for boats, then you get your temp, then you take a test to get your liscense. I dont know....what do you think? I know I dont want to be wearing a vest while I am on my boat enjoying the sun. Talk about a farmers tan. heheh lol

(Message edited by zride on February 10, 2006)

First Article posted by Karl mostly talks about boats that are less than 21 ft. More specifically 50% of boating fatalities involve boats that are 21 feet or less; and that mandatory PFD wearing on these boats would save an estimated 200 lives per year.

How long is that new X-2?

Further reading shows this is probably a dead issue, for now. Keep writing letters. Hopefully the next letters will talk about dredging and levee repair. In addition, we could ask for an annual debris collecting barge that can be pulled though out the delta to clean up all the winter trash and hyacinth. Project to be funded by homeland security.

If this law passes the new X2 is 21.1 feet .

(Message edited by mitchj on February 10, 2006)

The new X2 is 20'0".

Russell I think you missed my point

that is GAAAAAAAAAAAAAYYYYYY and is this in all states or just certain ones and even if they do twra Tennesee wildlife recreation association isnt ever out on the lake im at so wont effect me 2 much at home

so my initial gut feeling on the this 'letter' was correct after all.

I can't help but ask...
Karl, your posts sound as if you would like to see this happen. Perhaps I misread the tone.

This seriously sounds like that stupid CA bicycle helmet law. If passed it will probably be loosely enforced. Most of us on here are the safer drivers on the waterways; informed and up to date. I would Imagine this would require some serious tax payer dollars to enforce to a degree that would effect us. I think the majority of the boating population would have to read about this law at the local launch ramp to realize it even existed. Then how many would actually follow the rules, like j-walking. Would the water po po's be running around all day ticketing people without vests? Doubt it.

How would I get my sexy tan????

i'm sure our input would help, but i think the boating industry will most likely be fighting this to the death.

I'm a firm believer that the government does whatever they want to do. They may lead the people to believe that their concerns actually count, but when it's all said and done they are so out of touch and lobbyists have played their card that we the people have no say. My wife calls me a pessimist, I call myself a realist. If they choose to have everyone wear a vest, then wear a vest we will and it has no bearing on how much protest is raised unless the lobbyist representing the general boating population(if there is such a lobbyist) slides the most cash into the hand that counts.

maybe we can hand the right man a boat and he will lobby to keep the vest off

Well put Randy!

I do agree with you Randy but only partially. Changes can be made, look at the repeal of the helmet law in florida. It is always easier though before the new law is written in to stop it. If people dont know or dont care then yes laws will be passed to protect us from ourselves. We were so close to a 100hp limit on motorcycles about 10-15 years ago it isnt funny. People fought the heck out of it and won...now we have bikes out of the box almost doing 200 mph...damn thats fast. Boats are the same and if enough people scream and yell youll keep the idiots that dont boat out of our business. Safetycrats I believe is what they were called back in the day. Oh yea if it did get passed i'll bet they try to sneak it in for under 21' or something like that so they wont piss off the larger boats and then it will make it easier to slide over to the larger boats so even if they try and its for a boat smaller then yours i'd make your voice be heard or it may effect you in the future, if not right now.