Bazooka to Fusion?

Ok, So I have the 8 inch Bazooka Tubbies right now and they sound ok but I was debating on upgrading to the Fusion 5.25I Series or the 6.25 T Series 3 way combo.
I am running a 4/3 amp and the third channel is bridged channel 4 and 3 to run the sub and ch 1 and 2 run my tower speakers. Right now they are getting about 75-100 watts RMS.
Would you think I would see a noticeable difference from the Bazooka to the Fusions?
Also, does anybody run Fusions right now and are they happy with them? I'm trying to figure out what I'm going to do before the season gets here (also to keep me going through winter without boarding). Thanks for you help!

Fusion as far as I know has gone out of business, and with recent warranty issues (excluding myself), I see why. Run from Fusion, and run fast.

Stay away from Fushion, their chrome will pit in less than 6 months even if you take great care of them. Matt at Active WaterSports gave me a full refund and I upgraded to a pair of Skylon 450's.

Not a sales pitch but check out active watersports in Oregon, they are great and stand behind everything they sell, before and after the sell and they sell just about everything in the audio realm (WetSounds, DBot, Skylon, Etc.).

Thats definitely the one thing I have heard people say is that the chrome has issues. The ones I was looking at had a black backing to them with a small chrome ring in the front. I figured that wouldn't be too bad since there want much to pit. The ones I was looking at were only $375 for a pair of fusions so I thought that wasnt too bad compared to regular pricing. From what I have read the sound quality is pretty good though. I looked up the diamond components they use and they seem to have good reviews. Fusions website is still up, but that doesnt mean anything lol. I was just wanting to see if the sound quality would be better and cleaner than the Bazooka's I'm running now...
Thank you for the comments so far,

"their chrome will pit in less than 6 months even if you take great care of them"

Have had mine for 4 years now, no pits...

Tank, what about the sound Quality, are they pretty good, can they handle about 75-100 watts RMS and do they sound clear? Can you hear them decent riding back 80 ft?

I have the T-3 combo series, and I'm running 250w/channel. I can hear them well at 85', pretty clear, will not be painful like HLCD.

Tank,

Than you are one of the luck ones because the majority have had pitting issues within the first year, thus no more Fusion. I'm not bashing...they sound great and looked great until the pitting began. Yes, you can have them re-chromed for about $250 with a lifetime warranty.
It's up to you. But my advise to Greg is to research all the board & boat forums for information on the pitting issue and let him make up his own mind.

That's exactly what i've been doing....lots of research lol...Ive read web reviews, called around to shops for their opinions and with the pricepoint at what it is, I may end up going with the black covered ones with a chrome ring...not sure yet...I just know that I want something that sounds good and wont give me the issues the bazooka's are giving. They seem finicky and dont have the crossover or tweeter I wanted when i bought them...sigh..

Have you checked out the Kicker KTM6's? Best bang-4-the-buck out there right now. Loud and clear with 150W's rms to each one. ABS enclosures = no pitting, rubber inserts for different tower dia's. Just another option.

http://kicker.com/kmt6

Tige Mike, I did look at those and I have heard mixed reviews as well, most of them saying that they were ok, but not so impressive. I noticed that they are horn drivers which I have heard makes them clearer and louder without as much distortion. I guess I still have some time before the season. I just want something that will sound good for more than 2 seasons like the ones I have now...

I've only come across a couple of not so satisfied customers, one had to0 low of power to them, the other, a WW member, found he had a bad amp upon further investigation. When powered right, like any speaker, they are impressive when you look at their cost to performance. No way could they be compared to a Wet Sounds or NVS, but keeping mind they dont cost as much either. Try and get a listen from a set if you can, any of what you're looking at for that matter $.02.

Mike, that was another question I had. I am running probably 75-100 watts per channel to the tower speakers. Will this be enough to make the Kickers sound decent?

They will sound fine at low to mid volume levels, but probably "clip" and distort at higher volume levels due to the low wattage. To really take advantage of them, they need atleast 150W's so an amp upgrade would be recommended. There a plenty of speakers out there that will sound good at that wattage level, but being loud and clear at rider length, is as much about the amp as it is the speakers.

Did you see that Bazooka has a Compression Horn tower speaker now as well, I haven't heard them yet though. They will need about 150w's also (for the 8" but 100W's for the 6.5")

If your amp is putting out anywhere close to 100W's (rms @ 4ohm), look at some cans loaded with the Wet Sounds ws650's.

Lol..this amp was an upgrade from 200 watts max 2 channel to 600 watts on a 4/3 channel to run the sub on bridged ch 3/4. I didn't know that Bazooka had a compression Horn as well. The biggest thing i'm fighting is that the bazooka's distort loudly because the crossover that is supposed to feed it to the tweeter is....missing lol..I think I got an older model that didnt have a crossover or tweeter or anything...

So the tweeter is just wired to the mid-bass???

Sorry, wasn't knocking your current amp, plenty of speakers out there that would be driven powered just fine with that amp.

No, its cool, I didn't think you were knocking the amp, this one will just have to work for a while haha...Actually, they dont have a tweeter at all. They have the side ports to open for it, but there is nothing there, when we took the speaker apart, it literally was just a car speaker. I dont know if the ones I bought were the first batch or what, but they dont have any kind of crossover or tweeter, has the side space for a seperate tweet, but there is nothing there. And they say they take about 75-125 watts RMS but I don't see how. I think I just got an early set. I got em for 200, then had to get the brackets, so 230 for it all about years ago, not too bad I didn't think. Im looking at the kickers and fusions right now debating. At least our season wont start for a little longer (wish it would, but I got time to make up my mind on speakers)

Another Question I wanted to ask for both the Fusion and Kicker owners, is do either have a crossover built in or are they able to take around 80hz and above. The way the amp is set it has a low pass, off, and High pass...High pass is on, but it still pulls some mid bass through that my current dont handle well. Can either sets of speakers take either 80hz and above or 120hz and above without issues? Im more concerned with the low end if it will take it without distorting...Sorry to have all these questions, I just want to make sure I get something that won't require me getting bass blockers for 80-150 range

Is your EQ in the Head Unit set "flat"?

The set of KTM6's I got running are @ 100Hz and the amp is set to Hi pass with about 175W's rms to each.

(Message edited by chpthril on January 17, 2009)

Yeah...I probably need to get a new head unit at some point. My car has a 7 row adjustible EQ so I'm used to that, this deck in the boat has just preset settings...The EQ is set to off...Bass is -2 and treble is 1 or 0 I think. Its been a couple months since I looked at it. Amp is set to High pass, but im not sure if High pass is 80 hz and above or 120 and above.

I would wonder about buying stuff that people are having problems with. Online I saw all the Fusion stuff on closeout so they might not be around much longer. I think if you did a search you would find many complaints in the past as well as in this post about the quality problems. I remember not to long ago someone couldn't even get ahold of Fusion for warranty stuff. I know this doesn't answer the sound question but my .02

I was searching around for reviews of the Fusion stuff and could only fine 2 reviews on it. I am looking at the Kicker stuff now and its positive reviews all the way around. I tried calling Fusions number earlier and it went to a answering machine (could be that it is the weekend as well). The Kickers are alot cheaper. Rich, could you post the link you saw that had the reviews, Maybe I googled the wrong terms for searching on them. I am between Fusion and Kicker...The Diamond Audio speakers seem to have good reviews on their own but the Kickers do as well.

Sorry, I cant remember and I tried but couldn't find them either.

Yeah, I looked under different subjects for search. No problem Rich, thank you for your input. Like I said I want to know everybody opinion so I am happy with the set I get. Im kinda leaning towards Kicker, just not a fan of the ABS Plastic but I like the horn compression on there.

Greg stay as far away from fusion as possible. I have gone through three sets of them and all the same problem with the pitting. It took for ever with the customer and then i just got fed up. I switched to wetsounds. Yeah they might be a bit on the expensive side but they will stand behind there product 100% and to me thats worth paying more for. And they are so loud and will do more than you ever need..

Does anybody have any experience with the infinity's. I started looking at my tower and a dual bracket speaker will not work due to having to mount the speakers on the side of the tower instead of on top, due to how the bimini is setup.

I looked at your profile pic, I see what you mean.

Are these the Infinity's you're talking about?


Go with a pair of Wet Sounds loaded Monster cans: www.monstertower.com

Hey Mike, yup those are the Infinity's. I didn't mean to waste everybodys time by looking at the wrong speakers. I wish the mounts would have worked, but being the way that bimini was designed they have to go on the side, somewhat limiting my ability to get certain types. The thing which is an annoyance right now is the bazooka's move with vibration and wind, even tightened all the way up and putting no slip padding inside. I'll look at the wetsounds. Thanks again Mike for helping me with suggestions. Now you see the headache with speaker choices I am at....lol

Don't worry about it Greg. Alot of us have been there. Its a big investment. You got alot of time in winter during the down time to do it right. I looked around for ever it seemed. Boat shows are nice to check speaker brands out and find a dealer who can point you in a good direction.

Greg, for what it is worth, I have the Fusion T series 6.5's, black cans with chrome trim: http://www.fusionsports.com/popup.htm?images/T_Series_525_Blk_large.jpg

We've had them for three seasons and we push them hard all summer, though I've only got moderate power going to them (JL Audio amp; I forget how much power is going to them). Good quality sound from the diamond Audio speakers, just not quite as loud as the horn tweeter types. Our chrome "rings" didn't pit so bad until we kept our Enzo in a slip over the winter. Pitted, yes, horrible, no. If you have any other questions, go over and see my friends at CBK in Kingsport. Great dealership. Good luck.

Obviously, with the statements related to the company going out of business(??), unless you can get a really good deal on them (we've never had problems with ours, and a friend of mine has the 5.25 combos and hasn't had any problems either), other alternatives might be your best bet.

(Message edited by steedracer on January 18, 2009)

Hey Patrick, I talked to CBK about them since they were listed as a dealer but they said they quit carrying them about 2 years ago and moved to wetsounds, but they had nothing but praise for the Fusions saying they ran them for years and they were good.

I am looking at the 6.5 T Series since its a bigger Single post speaker.

I was thinking about regarding the pitting, just applying a wax or clearcoat to protect it a little better.

I found some for a good price and the biggest thing im worried about is the sound and quality at riding that far back.

With the Wetsounds, I need another amp to feed it the power it needs and the cans are a good price, but its more in the end that I can afford right now.

I could hear the bazooka's decent except for issues with it having a sweet spot and then nothing.

The boat is stored in a sealed barn when not in use and it doesnt sit in a slip ever. We usually wash it down every other time and try to clean it up in between.

Biggest thing that is motivating me to head in this direction is the lack of 1 post tower speakers better than what I have, hence the question about the infinitys lol...

Not able to change towers right now to accomodate speakers in the middle, so i'm trying to make it work as best I can.

FWIW, the KTM6's are only an inch wider, but not as tall or as deep as the Infinity's. If your board racks swivel, either one may get in the way.

There are a lot of options out there that would not require and amp swap. If you jumped up the the Wet Sounds Pro60's for example, you would need another amp, but a set of cans loaded with the Wet Sounds XS650's would work great.

Monster: http://www.monstertower.com/

Skylon: www.skylonsports.com

Dbots: www.dbot5.com

Aerial: www.aerialwakeboarding.com

Audio Formz: www.audioformz.com

Titan: www.titanwake.com

I was almost ready to jump on the Kickers, but they have 2 mount posts. I cant accomodate that unless I put it lower on the tower. That would get in our way. The infinitis only have 1 mounting bracket. Our Board racks dont swivel so they arent an issue on that one. I'll try to take closer pics to show you what some of my issues are. What is the difference in Wetsounds speakers and cans loaded with wetsounds?(pro 60s vs XS650?)

The Pro60's are a pro audio level speaker with a HLCD (Horn Loaded Compression Driver) The XS650 is a 6.5 traditional cone style speaker.

Check out there site www.wetsounds.com for more info.

I was going through the same process as you earlier this summer choosing speakers. Instead of buying something I will regret later down the line, I just bought the Wet Sounds Pro 80's and called it a day.

I just saw that the KMT6's are less than $250 on Ebay. Wow! For the price, that is hard to beat. I would suspect that they sound like the Evids 6.2 that folks don't talk much about anymore. The Evids now go for $400+

Greg,

I think you would be going backwards swapping out the Bazooka 8 inch for the Fusion 6 inch.(yes, fusion is out of business) You may gain some better sound quality up close but sounds like your issue is music at the rider. Right now, power is the bigger problem vs. the type of speaker. Sticking with the same power and then going to a smaller speaker is not going to gain you any volume. Just maybe some cleaner sound based on a higher quality driver etc..


I see in your profile the way the speakers are mounted. And the way you have it wired. Step one would be to upgrade to a small amp like our SYN Micro to power your subwoofer and bridge your 4 ch amp to 2 chs on the current tower speakers you have.

Next step would be to upgrade the towers to the PRO 60's or PRO 80's. Since you have the 8 inch bazooka's now. I would say go with the PRO 80's.

This would be a huge improvement over what you have now.

Right now you are using car audio based speakers. Even the Kicker KMT6 are car audio based. As those DO NOT have a compression driver. Only a car tweeter behind a horn. I think the bazooka horn ones are like that as well. More of a horn loaded tweeter set up.

The compression horn wording gets thrown around a lot. So when looking. Make sure it is a true compression driver if you are looking for pro audio based.

The driver in the PRO 60 and PRO 80 is our Pro-Axial driver. This is our proprietary driver. There is a mid bass driver with a oversized magnet and a compression driver magnet piggy backed to the mid bass driver. Then we have a horn flare firing through the center. So each speaker has 2 drivers. A horn loaded compression driver and a mid bass driver. These are designed to project sound far distances and also have a wide dispersion. So you can hear music when you ride as they will project sound out into the flats.

The best analogy I use is, these use concert speaker technology. You go to a rock concert and they have large horn loaded speakers on the stage. Because they have to overcome outside open air, large areas, lots of background noise. So they use a speaker designed for this application. You do not see some tiny home theater in a box type speakers on the stage do you. No. Because they are not the right speaker for the application. A home theater in a box may be fine in a living room but not at a rock concert.

Same goes with tower speakers. A car audio based speaker is fine for tower speakers if you are wanting music in and around the boat and hanging out. Which is where the XS-650 in the cans comes in. This speaker provides great sound and a ton of punch.

But when wanting to experience the music at 80 feet back. Stepping up to a speaker that is designed specifically for that application will give you a lot better results.


So I guess it depends on what you are really after. Just some better sound in and around the boat. Then my suggestion is to add more power to what you have and if you still want to upgrade and keep the budget low, look at the monster cans with the XS-650. If you are wanting music when you ride. Upgrading to the PRO 60 or 80's will give you an enormous difference and worth the time and effort.

But I would suggest changing your amp to bridged right now. You can do it without buying a new amp just to see. Bridge the amp on the towers and set the high pass crossover on 80 hz to 100 hz. I am not sure where the bazookas like to be.

If you like this, then adding a dedicated sub amp would be the ticket and might get you buy until the budget allows upgrading to the PRo 60 or 80's.

Tim
Wet Sounds

Tim,
Thank you, right now, I may just have to bridge the amp and see how it sounds. We have lots of Medical bills coming up so I wouldn't be able get Pro80s or 60s right now...sigh...My main goal is good sound to the rider, inside sounds ok so I want to hear it clearly at 80ft and not just have one sweet spot. You are right on the mark with what I want. I want it to project and have a larger throw span.