East vs West Challenge for '07

I was feeling this emptiness when I realized that we weren't calling each other out on manufacturing some worthless piece of...eeerr, I mean, challenging the alternate side of the country with manufacturing the most unique ride. A noble quest indeed.

Ed, and your bretheren, this year let's make it the LIGHTEST rideable board. No limit to dimensions, BUT a 180 pound person must be able to ride it for at least...lets say 5 minutes.

No limits on cost, materials, methodology, etc.
The board must be finished by the time your lakes freeze.

Shall we just make this an annual end of season tradition? Are you up to the challenge this year or shall we just call you folks LOSERS?!

You can call us anything you want except "late for dinner" or "LOSERS". I might be speaking for ED, but I'm sure he would say, "THE CHALLENGE IS ON" . You do know that Ed works for a top secret company. I bet he has access to all kinds of durable extremely light weight materials, especially the kind of material found in Area 53. BTW, I think Ed won the challenge last year for the heaviest rideable board. I think that beast weighed 25 lbs!

LOL! Roy, I almost gave myself a hernia lifting the Recycle This! I'm not sure there is much practical information derived from the heaviest board per cubic foot experiment, albiet it was fun. This year though, can you imagine what Kayley could do on a properly sized board that weighs say 2 pounds with fins and traction? I think that she would be the youngest competitor to EVER successfully throw a shuv. I have a name for THAT board...visualize a pink stripe down the middle: the pink mohawk.

So is it safe to say the challenge is on? The '07 don't call me late for dinner east vs west lightest board challenge. Sheesh, I wonder if I could make the title longer.

Now everything is coming to light... You are busted surfdad but your secret is safe with me... he he he

Good Sir, the gauntlet has been laid down and picked up. Our first entry though totally un surfable, is already complete.



Roy, I have several ideas, but I'm time limited. My goal should be to have hardware ready for the Lake Norris Surf and Turf II (Season Extender) I'll have to talk to the materials guys, there doing some work with soy based materials, might be fun to extend the recycling/alternative materials thrust a little further.

David, you are SWORN to secrecy! However, I will need that liquid nitrogen in short order...ooops, I've said too much!

Don't you mean N2O?

The goal is lightest board surfable with a 180 pound rider. We chose Kayley as our rider.

How in the heck are you going to get Kayley to weigh 180 pounds? You'd more than double her body weight. Go ahead and enlighten me on how you are going to CHEAT!

N2O - laughing gas - too funny, just you wait until we pull out our 6 oz blank that we'll disolve with acetone after covering.

Kayley's weight fluctuates wildly. After eating a couple of burritos at Chipotle, she might be close to 180.

LOL - define "a couple"? She'd have to eat 360 burritos and carry a LARGE soda in each hand to get up to 180 pounds!!!!! You two are scheming something.

I just checked - I did say pounds, not grams or something.

Jeff, I'm offended that you would think we would ever try to cheat although we might try to bend the rules as much as we can. Especially when nobody is looking. I might have exaggerated a little bit about Kayley's weight. BTW, David B. states "Now everything is coming to light... You are busted surfdad but your secret is safe with me... he he he" That sounds like you might also have a scheme up your sleeve.

No schemes Roy, but I'll CHANGE the rules to suite me! WHICH is not the same as cheating.

6 oz shaped blank, pretty much done with the shaping part.

This is going to be hard to beat. You could probably just cover the blank with Calibrated stickers and call it a day. I think we might have to invoke the midwest rule into the contest.

Midwest rule- all materials must be purchased at Lowe's, Home Depot or Walmart.

Hmmm... No stringer in that board.

So how will this competition be judged? I mean I could take a picture of "Recycle This!!" on a scale that reads 6 ounces. I guess we should tape the ride to document ride time.

I don't have great access to standard surfboard materials, but I guess that's the point.

Jeff, do your lakes freeze? I think you have an unfair advantage there you could work on this thing until California finally drops off in to the ocean?

Jeff, stop showing him stuff. You are going to tip him off!!!!!!!!!!!! he he he

Ed, Norris Lake never freezes so this will cancel Jeff's advantage. I think Jeff might have had his 6 ounce blank before he challenged our manhood by calling us LOSERS if we didn't accept his challenge. I would file an official protest but I don't know who to file the protest with.

recovery..how far away from the boat you can get and still recover for that same 180lb rider.i think would say alot for the board especially since weight is a huge factor in yalls wager.imo..can i enter this contest

It's actually 6 oz, - the wind came up while I was working on it and almost blew it away! I could get a picture of it flying!

I thought about the whole Calibrated sticker covering, but my understanding is that there aren't any left after the World's

I'm planning on covering it with graphite (carbon) so I need the Midwest rule STRICKEN. I'm going to go ahead and vacuum bag it, hopefully with better results than you had Ed with recycle this.

I have to laugh about the rules, we were walking around the block and James was going to take a piece of 1 pound density foam, cut it into the shape of a surfboard...but only about 1 inch in length and then tape it to is NORMAL board such that he could stand on it then say he RODE it .

Ok, how can we verify the weight? My board won't sit on my postage scale such that you can see the readout. A cooberating witness? Or...I can go with the honor system here.

The ride...I'd love to see a video of riding a board that winds up under 2 pounds.

I know David, but then again, maybe I'm sending those guys off on a wild goose chase!

Billy, absolutely...East vs West vs South. All we need is someone from the great white north.

Roy! No fair figuring out how I got busted!

Not sure why Jeff bothered to weigh the board if he's going to dissolve it. It might explain why there isn't a stringer. I stomped my foot through Recycle This!! just before Nationals. A hollow glass shell might be very brittle and weak. I might have to get Jac working on ideas too.

(Message edited by Bigshow on August 30, 2007)

The 6oz blank is my last bit of wiggle room. If I am over by 5 oz, I'm dissolving the blank Otherwise, I'll leave it intact and cover it with graphite, if I can get the stuff to bend around the rails.

Waterdog,

I think the contest should be open to whoever wants to enter. I read your profile and I must admit that you do look like a ringer!

Jeff, since there is some honor among thieves, I think the honor system will work unless somebody steps up and offers a huge first place prize.

Can we change to Midwest vs West vs South? No true buckeye would ever call Ohio the east. The east ends at the Pennsylvania boarder.

Maybe we should do it by time zones? I'm ok with the "Don't call me late for dinner lightest board challenge" and have no geographical references at all - sheesh we are the crew aren't we? We're still working on the name!

The "Don't call me late for dinner lightest board challenge" sounds better and better everytime I read it. I like the idea of more people wanting to join the challenge. It appears that there are some outlaws in the great state of Texas. Wonder if they are man enough to join the challenge?

We had a major break through on design, I think we can get Recycle This!! down to 18 pounds!!

Advances in technology are just wonderful. Nobody a year ago would have ever thought in their wildest dreams that Recycle This!! could be reduced to 18 pounds.

That is almost a 30% reduction!!!! Just think in 5 more years that board might be in the 12 pound range! At that rate, you'll be able to remove the injury disclaimer: Use of this board may cause muscle strains, lower back problems and herniated discs. Use ONLY after prior consultation with a Chiropractor and ALWAYS wear a weight belt.

If Kayley is 180 pounds...James wants to enter THIS board

You ship it, she'll ride it!

It's going to be tough to beat James' design just above.

I roughed out a design and ordered about $64 worth of materials.

Dang it, I estimated the weight of the raw materials and I'm already up to 2 pounds. After some trimming and fitting the board will lose some weight but I'll still need a covering.

Jeff, I'm naming this one the "Light Stick".

About weighing to determine final weight. Carol has a postal scale we could use that. If my results are like Recycle This!! I'll use a near by truck scale located on I71.

Any other rules to this? I need to take some pics, we may have a Colorado entry!

I tried to get the midwest rule introduced but it wasn't allowed. As far as I know the only rule is the lightest board a 180 lbs rider can ride 5 minutes, wins the contest.

I think the primary rule is to have fun. The only thing on the line here is bragging rights. After that what are the rules:

1) Done before the lakes freeze where you’re at, totally unfair
2) The board must survive for at least a 5 minute ride. I take that to also mean that multiple consecutive rides totaling to 5 minutes is the acceptable.
3) The ride(s) must be video taped
4) The rider weight must be at least 180 pounds (or Kayley holding two large drinks)
5) The winner receives a left over, $5, 3rd place, NWL Wakesurf Nationals trophy; you must pick up the trophy
6) The only rule that I'm sure of is that the competition entry fees is $1,000,000 made payable to me

(Message edited by Bigshow on September 01, 2007)

I think it would be good if we pick a date that the 5 minute run must be completed by. I suggest Columbus Day (Oct 8th). A lot of good Karma picking Columbus Day if you're from Columbus. Columbus also crossed the ocean riding waves.

Hey Ed,

I've sent in my entry fee, be sure to let me know if it doesn't arrive.

I can't believe how you two make such a BIG deal out of the freezing lakes cutoff! That seems perfectly fair, you two make it sound like lakes never freeze in California or Texas What was our high today? 108? Just 76 degrees left to go!

Don't you think we need something more appropriate to the contest title? The "Don't call me late to dinner lightest board challenge!" That just screams LEFTOVERS rather than a left over trophy. How about a cold chicken leg? in aluminum foil? I'll supply that trophy, again, winner has to pick it up. I can leave it out by the front gate if we are away...I wonder if the coyotes might find it?

I'm good with October 8, Karma Sharma

Timmy! You have to enter! Ed and Roy are making the rules up as they go along anyway, so it really doesn't matter what they say here, it will be different as soon as they need an advantage!

Jeff, I hope you sent cash, I don't take checks.

Just because you have ice in your automated ice machine the freezer that doesn’t mean that the lakes actually ever freeze.

Well if you want to bring food in to it, I can never finish a chipotle burrito. The prize could be the left over portion of Kayley’s 180 burritos. Now Jeff is going to claim that’s about 179.75 burritos, I’m thinking it’s about a half of one.

As far as contest name maybe it should something about the world’s lightest stick challenge. How about the 2008 Disposable Stick Challenge. I wonder if any media would be interested in this little competition? I suppose we have to build the boards first.

Dang, I got a head of myself I'm already on to next year's challenge, that should be the 2007 Disposable Stick Challenge.

Rob and I will probably have the heaviest entry in the contest. Rob might but I don't understand anything about EPS, POLYU, epoxy, micro-balloons, foam blanks, Graphite, etc. Home Depot rocks! I think we might call the board "The Tortoise".

Slow and steady wins the race while the rabbits crash and burn!

Roy, I was thinking of calling my entry the Hindenburg, but I hope it doesn’t crash and burn.

Roy is talking some smack! But that is a good point, the board has to survive the 5 minute ride. In my experience, big and heavy and slow usually can't make the 5 minute mark!

Ed, you make up some crazy numbers. I believe I used 360 burritos. I've seen Kayley, there is no way she's eating even one! So unless your entire crew is planning on eating off of Kayley's plate, the leftovers are going to be in the 359.5 range!!!!!

Ed, just explodes in mid-air?

Isn't a lighter than air surfboard a possibility?

I would guess that it is. How much volume would you need to make that happen though? The derigibles were HUGE. I do believe that the TV series Myth Busters did something on that with footballs, that the capacity of the football wasn't enough to make a difference. So, you'll be riding a board that is 80 feet long and 20 feet high and weighs .75 pounds?

At least at the end of this, we'll still have a board left =] Well, if you can call it a board.. haha

You know Robbie, you will walk away from this challenge with so much more. Your father is so invilved in both your life and Kayley's and I think that spending time on this project will allow him to show you how MUCH enjoys spending time with you. I think later in life, you'll recognize the values that he instilled that will reflect in your succeses. I know that you are aware of it now.

I do love the opportunity for families to have a common sport/activity that they can all join in together. Like BEATING the Midwesterners

I just finished wetting out the top vail and quickly weighed it, looks like my final entry will come it at 25.6 oz. I "might" be able to trim that last .6 of an ounce, but not much more than that. I'm fairly confident that if we are careful with it and I can get it post-cured, we should be able to make the 5 minutes.

SSSSSSooooooooooo...25.0 to 25.6 oz is my final weigh-in most likely.

This exercise was very interesting to me. Hopefully the board doesn't snap barring that disaster I've laerned a few things. Now, this is epoxy over EPS, using a traditional hand layup.

My weight, broken down by material is:

EPS core 6 oz
Fiberglass 1 oz
Resin sealer and laminate 18 oz.

If I was better at it, I'm sure that I could trim the resin weight. However, I can see the benefit of vacuum bagging in this context. Bagging will force more of the resin out and I believe due to the pressure exerted by the vaccuum, requires less resin to begin with.

In retrospect, I beleieve that with changes in methodology I could have cut the resin weight down to 6 oz.

Interesting and informative!

Who is going to be you test rider, Dennis?

Yes, Dennis...he will be losing 70 pounds before the weekend.

you guys know this is the nerdiest forum on wakeworld right? maybe even the nerdiest online but i love reading all this

Are you suggesting that an accountant and an engineer can't be as cool as a designer; all of which spend way too much on an internet forum to be cool in the real world anyway?

thats exactly what im suggesting but hey keep going, i love seeing the crazy ideas you guys come up with.

and hey im not here to judge, im in here just as much as you guys almost

Sean, you use "nerd" as if it's a bad thing!

Ed? It's Cool now, not Hip? Sheesh, did someone send out a memo on that nomenclature change? I swear I never received it!

Ok folks here is your target weight. 23.8 oz. I'm amazed that I got it under 1.5 pounds. So what do the Home Depot Special and Balsa Buster weigh in at?

Nice, is that the weight with fins or without?

Give me a break on the schedule here, You had your materials here and were under way when you issued this challenge.

Sure, concede defeat and you can have all the time you want! I chose an appropriate building methodology and readily available materials - YOU ordered your material from NASA! I can't help it that your security clearance didn't pass!

No fins, it's a skimboard (hopefully for 5 minutes after that, it's probably just bits of foam)

jeff that is amazing!!!! i dont see how anyone can beat you with that weight!

but in all fairness i think if others are gonna have fins than you should too, just put a small wakeboard fin in the center and call it done

i think the next challenge should be who can make the heaviest surfable board i heard about some guy that had one tipping the scales at 25lbs

NASA no, more like the hobby shop, I don’t have a local surf shop. Remember I live in Ohio, I’m over 400 miles away from the east coast and over 2,000 miles from the west coast.

No fins I think that’s brave. I'm putting on a fin to improve stability and reduce the chance of a fall requiring more starts.

How about more board particulars, width, length, rocker, cost…

NO NO NO! No more surf vs skim vs longboard debate! I'll just put a piece of tissue paper on there if I have to have a fin.

We've already won the heaviest board division, I think it was 60 pounds wet and with hardware (see doorknob ).

I have a picture of the worlds largest surf board, built in Australia, on the wall at work. It's a huge board with about a dozen people on it. Looks like the board has a tow eye and rope and it's getting towed. I'll have to scan it.

Although it has no door knob I think the Australian surf board weighs more.

Will have a better idea on the weight of the Home Depot special (aka, Pink Mohawks) this weekend. Still tweaking the specs. Our target is to build 4 prototypes that weigh less than 4 lbs each, work less than 8 hours and spend less than $40. Our budget might increase depending on how much duct tape we use.

When a driver sets a land speed record he has to also do a back up run that must also beat the previous world record. We like this idea so we have decided to not build a "Girlie Man" board than can only be hopefully ridden for 5 minutes. We are going to build a "Manly" board that can be ridden by all three Home Depot team members. Please note; we are not try to change the rules. The lightest board that an 180 lbs rider can ride for 5 minutes wins the contest. We just choose to hold ourselves to a higher standard!

Slow and steady wins the race, while the rabbits crash and burn!

Ed, I got the EPS from a local agriculture supplier - not a surf shop. In fact I have two blanks of 1.5 EPS that should be delivered, before December. Maybe.

It's 4'6" long, 1" inch thick at the thickest point, 20.25" wide and has just over 2.5 inch of nose rocker. I put just a smidgen of concave in it.

Let me see on the cost.

EPS - $12
Epoxy - $48
Microballons $12
Vail - $18
Allocable consumables (gloves, tongue depressors, mixing containers, sandpaper for the rotary pad, masking tape, spreaders) I'm estimating another $8

So that is a total of $98? Round it to $100 to include electricity and soap to clean my hands 8 trillion times. (although I have most of all the above material still left, I have a huge jar of microballons and the majority of the epoxy left over, really only the EPS is mostly gone).

The next project though, will be more expensive I am already into the rocker table $104.

Ed, how can anything WITHOUT a doorknob, TRULY be considered a surfboard?

Roy? Your plan looks to be guranteeing you last place? You folks in the midwest sure do thing different!

Jeff, so where's the door knob on your ultra light?

I'm not sure Roy is set up for last place. I've yet to see any surfing video, Will either sub 2 pound design survive?

Ed! It's a SKIMBOARD no fins or doorknobs, everyone knows that. I'm keeping my fingers crossed for the 5 minutes.

Jeff, I'm counting on our board lasting the whole 5 minutes. What happens if your sleek rocket hits a little twig floating in the water or a roller and snaps in half. He who laughs last, laughs loudest.

Yeah there is that risk of self-destruct in there - well, if it survives the start, I think I'm good. The way I figure, it either will last 2.7 seconds or the full 5 minutes

hahaha jeff thats so sick. i couldent think of a better way to end the whats what behind the boat debate than a pic of you on a door.

It does across that way doesn't it Johnny. "You think you're bad?! Surf a pink door or shut up!"

We are off on the water today, with our entry. I do have a witness in Dennis...that is if we need one, my concern is that...I'll post pictures of what's remaining from our test.

James is our test rider, fully suited and wet he's 180 (got to get his hair wet, though ) Dennis and I are both on the EASY side of 180 and Judy is..."never in a million years going to be 180". So...keep your fingers crossed!

A construction update. My balsa order still hasn't shown up I went out and bought a some aspen at Lowe’s and more balsa at a hobby store. So now the longitudinal stringers are aspen, that will add weight but at least I'll get some strength.

I still need to drill the holes in some of the stringers. I also need to cut and fit check the 1/8 x 1/16 stringer slots.

I still need to make a few lateral stringers but this is what the fit check looks like.




Built in fin

wow thats a trip right there.

What's the weight at so far Ed?

So we took the West Coast entry out today. We had to triple PFD James to gain enough weight The test pilot.

I forgot to set PP!!!!!! James made a successful deep water start, but at around 12.2 MPH disaster hit.

Now, according to the rules there was no limit on the number of pieces that could be ridden for a total 5 minute run

The back half -technically this is being ridden revert

Did I mention that my understanding is that there was NO limit to the number of pieces that could be ridden