Dealers fake MSRP pricing

This is my first time buying a new boat and I am finding that each of the dealers that I have dealt w/ are provind fake MSRP prices that are $5-10k above what it should be. Two examples are the MSRP of a base 07 X1 w/ no options at $52500 w/ trailer and a base 07 Vride at $49,000 w/ trailer. Both Mastercraft and Malibu post the starting MSRP on their website so why would dealers think that people are that stupid? Is this a common practice in the industry?

My second question is how do I tell them to stop lying and give me an actual price? I have heard that you should shoot for about 10% off of MSRP as a good deal and anything above that is gravy. Is that 10% off of the real MSRP or the fake one that the dealer provides? I know that it is a faux pas to use dealers against each other, especially if they are selling the same boat, but I am in a unique positiont that I have about 2 Malibu dealers and 3 Mastercraft dealers that are equidistant from me. Do you think that it would be ok to tell them how I know they are lying b/c of other quotes that I have or should I just try to get them down nicely and tell them that I am young and plan on buying more boats in the future?

Sorry for venting but I have never seen this practice in any other industry and it caught me off guard. It makes you appreciate how much easier it is to buy a car now that you can get actual dealer invoice pricing to negotiate from. In the boating world you can't even get the correct MSRP!!!

Thanks for your help.

johnny. just look at the same boat in 05 06 and 07. you may be able to get more boat if its one to three years old. like the new malibu thats 20 feet. there asking about 53-55. if you look at used boats you can find 04,05 vlxs for the same price. just do your research and dont be set on just one boat. be willing to travel in order to get a better deal. good luck

you can find a 05 or 06 used for in the 43-46 range. with more stuff in the boat

i mean 05 x2 or 06 x1 same thing

I know exactly how you feel, I was shown an 07 pricelist for an 06 boat. Then I called on a boat and was told a price 4k higher than they were advertising on their own website. You will have a tough time getting a "crazy" deal on a boat now as the "season" is starting soon and very few boat shows left.

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Both Mastercraft and Malibu post the starting MSRP on their website so why would dealers think that people are that stupid?

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umm...basically because MSRP on the manufacturer's website doesn't include the price of the trailer OR ANY additional options. Adding a flip up bolster seat, perfect pass, pop up cleats, heater, hot water shower, docking lights, bimini and boards racks can all add to the price of the boat.

Now, a salesman might point at a boat in their showroom that's loaded up with options and say "the MSRP for that boat is..." and that's a bit different. In this case he's basically saying that the Manufacturer's Suggested Retail Price of the boat PLUS the cost of the trailer PLUS any added options on the boat is $________. It's just a starting price that you can hopefully work down from.

Hey Johnny- Why two threads in this forum of the exact same topic?? Are you trying to inflate your post numbers like dealers inflate their MSRP's?

^^^lol

Another example for you. I went to a dealer last fall and got a quote on a brand new 2006 for 39,500. This spring the exact same boat was at this dealer's spring boat show with a suggested MSRP 3K higher than the suggested MSRP they had posted last fall. Plus they had the boat listed as a "boat show special only" price of 42,999.

Bob - Prices have gone up since fall.

Anyone is more than welcome to educate me if ANY of the information I post here is inaccurate. It is what “I think” I know…..though I am not in the business, just been through the boat buying process a few times in the last few years…..

In the end, boat pricing is 100% consumer driven. MSRP is really moot. Some may say 10% is the standard deal, but there are dealers that wouldn’t not sell you a boat at 10% off MSRP. There are others that you may get 15-17% or more…..

Allotment of boats & how many boats that dealer knows he can sell at the price he sets….that is the price. When on my extensive boat search, I narrowed to 3 boats and was ready to sign with the dealer that I felt I got the best deal from. Not so much lowest price, just the best deal from what my research said others were paying. I was VERY surprising where my final offers were. Fact is, if I didn’t want to pay X amount, the dealers knew they could sell those boats to someone else for that price. We are not talking cars where the dealer can just order another, then another, then another….as many as they can sell…. Call the dealer up the street and grab one of theirs….

You are in a somewhat unique situation as you can play dealers against each other, that will help….but only to a point. Again, dealers know how many boats they are allotted and how many boats they “feel” they can sell. That is not to say they will not try to maximize the profit on each boat, but they know the numbers they will not go below….regardless if others don’t feel that is too much profit.

Anyway…I guess my whole point is that MSRP is such a odd random number that is thrown out as a ridiculous starting point and in the end, it doesn’t much matter if that is up or down 2-3 K….because the minimum profit the dealer is willing to take is really the bottom line. So in the end, just don’t worry about MSRP.

RESEARCH, RESEARCH, RESEARCH. Send unsolicited email to people on this forum that own the boat you want. See if they will discuss pricing and what they know. This was by far the most informative thing I did while researching my boat purchase. Spend A LOT of time at all the dealerships, know the boats and work the price.

In the end, all that matters is that you hand over a check and are happy with what you paid. Not if you got a better or worse price than the guy down the street…..just that you paid what you thought was “fair.” If it is not what you consider “fair”…..well, go elsewhere….

Anyway....how is that for a Saturday morning novel....

Malibu's MSRP on the ride series does include a trailer.

EJ hit it on the head. I think people know if they are getting a good deal, and a good deal isn't always the best price. Just remember that when you buy a boat from a dealer that you have to deal with them every time something needs to be done to your boat, so having a great dealer may be more important than saving two or three thousand dollars. I have found that good service after the sale goes farther than anything you can do before or during the sale.

I agree good service is definitely worth something. However, boat dealers need to think a little about their repeat business when selling boats to customers. Dealers are certainly allowed to make money, however how many people have boats for sale for 5k, sometimes more, than what a new leftover could be bought for. Do you think the customer will come back to the dealer when he/she realizes the best price could have been much lower.

EJ I agree with almost everything you have to say except one thing. IF a dealer ran out of new boats I would almost guarantee the manufacturer would find him some more to sell.

(Message edited by johnsvt on March 10, 2007)

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Dealers don't have to 'take' the suggestion.

It's important that you pay at least 20% under MSRP if you want to get cheap insurance. I bought an X1 last year for $47 with an MSRP of $63. The difference saved me a ton of money on insurance.

Mastercraft's msrp is ridiculus. They start high so that when you talk them down, you feel as if you are getting a great deal, when you may still be paying too high. malibu is somewhat the same although their msrp isn't as high. As stated above, prices are consumer driven, when people slow with buying boats, prices will fall, builders have a very large profit margin, so they have plenty of room to come down on their prices.

Matt,

Nice deduction for someone who has NO IDEA what they are talking about!

Tell me Matt What is MSRP on a CC 220 LOADED vs. selling price or a Malibu 23 Wakesetter loaded MSRP cs. selling price.

If you already have not bought a boat for this season, then you might be in trouble for finding a great deal. Sales are going to start picking up again and dealers are going to be getting some steady sales, at this time they will be less likely to drop prices much. I would either do it right now or wait till the end of the season.

You'd probably be extremely pissed if you knew what kind of margins were in those boats, but as long as we continue to pay, the prices will continue to rise.

TK I guess you are the one that knows it all. I have no idea what the price of a correct craft boat is. I don't see cc mentioned anywhere in my post. Obviously , you are tied into mc in some way, that it why you defend them so much. If you could read, I stated mc's msrp was way too high. How do I know this, I was offered an 06 x1 for 35800. The MSRP was 52k. Now what about that isn't ridiculus. There is no way you can argue that mc's msrp aren't crazy. Just to clear things up, I live 30 min. from the "world headquarters" of mastercraft. I wakeboard with some of their employees, and they sit and laugh when they are told what people pay for their boats. I guess I still don't know what I am talking about, huh. By the way all manufacturers inflate msrp, mc just takes the cake.

By the way TK, I think I'll go cry now that you in all your infinite wisdom have decided I don't know anything. You know just as well as I do that mc's msrp is ridiculus and their selling price can be as well. Now I'm pretty sure that is what the original post was about, wasn't it. Also, I'm not paying extra up front just so I can feel good about someone changing my oil when I take my boat in. I'll pay bottom dollar, service the boat myself, and go from there. Oh, on pricing and msrp, Mastercraft just recorded their most profitable year in history. Gee, I just don't see how since they aren't making enough money on their boat.

Thank you for all of your help. As for the double posting, my comp died as I was though the first post and I didn't think it posted. Mastercraft does post their $42900 MSRP w/ trailer on their website so I feel that should be a standard. I am realizing that I have about 1 week to purchase the boat now or wait until after the season is done. I have been surprised by the difference between different dealers, especially when talking to some of them about the left over 06's. Some of them are willing to give you $500 off as compared to an 07. I guess there might be people out there who think that is a good deal, but to be that would be stupid b/c you are going to take such a depreciation hit right off the bat. If there is anyone who is willing to PM me or email what they paid for either left over 06's or new 07 X1's or V-rides, I would greatly apprecaite it. I think I have a pretty good idea of what I should pay, but would love some verification. Again, that you for all of your help.

Johnny...check your email

"Bob - Prices have gone up since fall"

I should have been more clear. When I said exact same boat, I meant the same exact 2006 boat I was sitting in this past fall. Price shouldn't go up on a year old boat!