Articles
   
       
Pics/Video
       
Wake 101
   
       
       
Shop
Search
 
 
 
 
 
Home   Articles   Pics/Video   Gear   Wake 101   Events   Community   Forums   Classifieds   Contests   Shop   Search
WakeWorld Home
Email Password
Go Back   WakeWorld > Boats, Accessories & Tow Vehicles

Share 
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old     (CPanner)      Join Date: May 2015       07-10-2017, 5:45 PM Reply   
I have business opportunity that will be great in the long run but I'll take a hit on my short term finances. I currently have a 2014 G21 that I'm considering selling but I don't want to be without a boat. So question is, what would you downgrade to? Wakeboard is all that matters, I could care less about the surf wave. And I'd like to stick with a pickle fork style bow.

The two boats I have in mind are a 2012ish MB sports tomcat. Or a gen 2 XStar. $60k CAD would be my comfortable limit.
Old     (simplej)      Join Date: Sep 2011       07-10-2017, 6:39 PM Reply   
Axis a22 or gen 2 x star. Wouldn't waste my time with anything else.
Old    Mike (BCPMike0663)      Join Date: Apr 2010       07-10-2017, 6:53 PM Reply   
Gen 2 x star all the way. I am heading in the other direction, I have a gen 1 Xstar and I am heading to a G23. But I ride behind a gen2 Xstar all the time and it is a great wake. Would be close second choice to the G.
Old    Tom (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       07-11-2017, 5:32 AM Reply   
A22 would be a great downgrade.
Old    C.I.E. J-Rod (jarrod)      Join Date: May 2003       07-11-2017, 6:27 AM Reply   
The 2015 and up A22 wake is better than the Gen 2 Xstar if that is your primary concern. I've owned two A22s and 4 Gen 2 Xstars and I would never want to go back. I also agree with the Tomcat move. You get a great boat for a great price.
Old     (simplej)      Join Date: Sep 2011       07-11-2017, 6:40 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by jarrod View Post
The 2015 and up A22 wake is better than the Gen 2 Xstar if that is your primary concern. I've owned two A22s and 4 Gen 2 Xstars and I would never want to go back. I also agree with the Tomcat move. You get a great boat for a great price.
Would you really call it better or just different?

If memory serves correctly the a is a little bit smaller and a touch less volume but a bit lippier so you get the same boot out of it.

The A also gets there with less ballast I think. But it's been 3 seasons since I have ridden the two.
May as well throw the T 22 in there too if you can get over the pickle fork thing. A little bit rampier than the A and assist the most consistent boat I have ever ridden regardless of conditions and weight placement.

I prefer all these wakes to the g21 personally
Old    C.I.E. J-Rod (jarrod)      Join Date: May 2003       07-11-2017, 6:57 AM Reply   
Fair. Different. Here's why the A22 is better for me.

The wake on the A22 is steeper and has more lip (closer to the G21). I'm a big fan of the wedge and what it does.
The Xstar wake is longer and rampier. I had to load the back heavy to get the lip I like. It takes way more weight to get there. In the X we were running 5-6 thousand pounds. The A22 produces a big wake more efficiently. Also, it maintains the same shape even if you want to run it a little smaller for a beginner. When you start pulling weight out of the Xstar, it goes flat in my experience.

The A22 likes a lot of midship and bow weight. The xstar needs a ton of weight everywhere, but it needs a lot of weight in the stern so we were walking forward to the bow to get on plane (except when we had the 8.1).

The layout of the Xstar has the windshield set far back with a huge bow and small main cabin. The A22 has a more modern and optimized layout so that the main cabin is much bigger.

Don't get me wrong, we loved the Xstar. That was the bees knees back then.

Last edited by jarrod; 07-11-2017 at 7:00 AM. Reason: typeo
Old     (CPanner)      Join Date: May 2015       07-11-2017, 7:25 AM Reply   
The A22 is out of the question. For some reason in Canada they are not a budget boat at all. For example a 2015 A22 is listed at $95k.

I've done my fair share of riding behind a Gen2 XStar so I know I like it. Can anyone give me a decent comparison to the Tomcat?
Old     (simplej)      Join Date: Sep 2011       07-11-2017, 8:31 AM Reply   
What about an older one?

Say 2012 range? If we're talking wakeboarding I'd probably stick with an A over an f21
Old    Mason Obray (MCObray)      Join Date: Mar 2013       07-11-2017, 9:17 AM Reply   
Ski Nautique 2001
Old     (CPanner)      Join Date: May 2015       07-11-2017, 10:37 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by MCObray View Post
Ski Nautique 2001

I will own a SN2001 one day!!
Old    PLR (dbdb)      Join Date: Oct 2005       07-11-2017, 10:55 AM Reply   
I have a 2010 X25 and I have been recently looking at 14 G21's (I've been looking at 2014's because they weigh less and its at the limit of my lift). Would you consider an X25 + some cash?
Old    PLR (dbdb)      Join Date: Oct 2005       07-11-2017, 10:56 AM Reply   
Here is a pic of the boat....
Attached Images
 
Old     (CPanner)      Join Date: May 2015       07-11-2017, 10:59 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by dbdb View Post
I have a 2010 X25 and I have been recently looking at 14 G21's (I've been looking at 2014's because they weigh less and its at the limit of my lift). Would you consider an X25 + some cash?
Looks like you're in Chicago and I'm in Canada so logistically I don't see it working. Thanks for the offer though.

That being said I don't remember the 2014 weighing any less than the newer G21's. The 2016 G23 and G25 got an overhaul and ended up a few hundred pounds heavier but I think the 21 still weighs the same??
Old    PLR (dbdb)      Join Date: Oct 2005       07-11-2017, 12:18 PM Reply   
2014 G21 - 5,200lbs
2016 G21 - 5,550lbs

I was told they had a lamination process change which added the weight. I remember reading that the 2015 was somewhere around 5,400lbs, but I can't find that on the interwebs anywhere. My sunstream floatlift has a 6K floating limit and a 5500lb working limit. I think that the 5200 is really the most I'm willing to try on it.
Old    Mike (BCPMike0663)      Join Date: Apr 2010       07-11-2017, 12:44 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by CPanner View Post
The A22 is out of the question. For some reason in Canada they are not a budget boat at all. For example a 2015 A22 is listed at $95k.

I've done my fair share of riding behind a Gen2 XStar so I know I like it. Can anyone give me a decent comparison to the Tomcat?
I rode behind a 2017 Tomcat 22 foot early last week. I don't know how much the hull has changed since the year you are looking at, but the one I rode was super steep, it was like hitting a brick wall. The wake was big but not my favorite. Plus the finishes and over all quality of the boat, I would rather have a Gen2 Xstar for sure.

We went from our 2003 X-2, to the Tomcat, to the G23 last week. And I will say the G23 is F-ing awesome in all aspects.

But in your situation it would Gen2 Xstar for me!!
Old    Ryan Stover (onetogofast)      Join Date: Jun 2012       07-11-2017, 12:52 PM Reply   
The stock 1800 ballast in my 12 MB F21 puts up a very nice wakeboard wake!
Old    D.F.T.R. Josh (downfortheride)      Join Date: Jun 2005       07-11-2017, 4:39 PM Reply   
I owned a 2012 Tomcat and is really a great wake. If you like newer and budget I suggest a look at the Moomba Helix. Wakeboarding wake is way above average and the technology would help with resale. Here's mine with stock ballast and it gets even better with a little more weight. Wake has a great transition but steep at the top for some good kick.
Name:  Helix12.jpg
Views: 926
Size:  186.6 KB
Old    Shawn (shawnmdarnell)      Join Date: Feb 2003       07-13-2017, 10:22 AM Reply   
I've a 2015 Tomcat F21 with a Raptor 400 in Northern California. 60K
Attached Images
 
Old    Tyler Conley (TC_Mastercraf_X5)      Join Date: Feb 2013       07-13-2017, 10:57 AM Reply   
Our group rides interchangeably between a G21 and an A22. I will say there is no replacing a fully loaded G, but bang for you buck its hard to beat a loaded A22. Having a 12 A22 I would go with the a 13 as they switched their vinyl and its ALOT better than prior generation Axis vinyl quality
Old    Russ Constable (Midnightv10)      Join Date: Feb 2012       07-13-2017, 2:07 PM Reply   
2012 F-23 Tomcat in Vancouver Washington $62.5K

https://portland.craigslist.org/clk/boa/6203568261.html
Attached Images
   
Old    Ryan Stover (onetogofast)      Join Date: Jun 2012       07-13-2017, 5:34 PM Reply   
Now Midnights is about the baddest boat you'll get for the money!!! ^ that boat is bad to the bone
Old     (simplej)      Join Date: Sep 2011       07-13-2017, 5:58 PM Reply   
Except he's in Canada so multiply the price by 1.3....
Old    Markj (markj)      Join Date: Apr 2005       07-13-2017, 11:16 PM Reply   
Do you have to use the booster seat (not sure MB's have them) when wakeboarding? Doesn't look like you can see over the bow.
Old    Ian Brown (onlyinboards)      Join Date: Oct 2014       07-14-2017, 8:26 AM Reply   
I would 2nd Midnights boat
Old     (SoulSurfer)      Join Date: Oct 2016       07-14-2017, 9:02 AM Reply   
On my 16 MB F22, I do use the seat bolster when pulling wakeboarders and surfers. Most of my wakeboarders ride at 19.5 - 21 mph.
Old    Scott (scottb7)      Join Date: Oct 2012       07-14-2017, 11:53 AM Reply   
Yep, when i drive my friends a22 i got to roll up the life jacket and sit on it...Not necessary with my g21...just sayin...

z5 bimini, mirror, and a22 is not a good combo...You got to sit on the life jacket, and then you can't use the mirror cause it is in the way. And very little head room with z5...
Old     (simplej)      Join Date: Sep 2011       07-14-2017, 12:40 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by scottb7 View Post
Yep, when i drive my friends a22 i got to roll up the life jacket and sit on it...Not necessary with my g21...just sayin...

z5 bimini, mirror, and a22 is not a good combo...You got to sit on the life jacket, and then you can't use the mirror cause it is in the way. And very little head room with z5...
Tell your friend to drop the rear weight. Absolutely no reason a properly loaded and propped axis should be running bow up. For about 3 seconds when you plane up you get a blind spot while the wedge engages otherwise shouldn't be needed.

Use the bolster when surfing, normal for any boat though
Old    Scott (scottb7)      Join Date: Oct 2012       07-14-2017, 1:30 PM Reply   
I think i am going to start a new thread just for how to load an a22 for wakeboarding. please take a look. there and respond on that....
Old     (CPanner)      Join Date: May 2015       07-15-2017, 12:35 PM Reply   
I'm looking for $60k Canadian. Unfortunately our exchange is horrible right now so I'm not interested in any boats from the states. Pretty sure I've decided on a Gen2 Xstar unless a hell of a deal on a newer A22 comes up.
Old    Mike (BCPMike0663)      Join Date: Apr 2010       07-16-2017, 12:21 PM Reply   
Good choice!!!
Old     (Froggy)      Join Date: Nov 2013       07-17-2017, 4:54 AM Reply   
Is the G paid off ? Will the new boat be paid off ? Or are you just trading for a different payment ?
How much will you loose on the G? You have already taken the biggest hit on the G value.
Old    C.I.E. J-Rod (jarrod)      Join Date: May 2003       07-19-2017, 9:43 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by simplej View Post
Tell your friend to drop the rear weight. Absolutely no reason a properly loaded and propped axis should be running bow up. For about 3 seconds when you plane up you get a blind spot while the wedge engages otherwise shouldn't be needed.

Use the bolster when surfing, normal for any boat though
Agreed. Plus you can just flip up the seat.

An A22 should have the swim platform out of the water. If it's buried, your wake is probably soft and wide. And you're driving bow up.
Old     (CPanner)      Join Date: May 2015       07-19-2017, 10:49 AM Reply   
The G is not paid off, however I got it from a guy that needed to sell it bad. I'll make money when I sell it.

The XStar will be bought in cash.

Reply
Share 

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:31 PM.

Home   Articles   Pics/Video   Gear   Wake 101   Events   Community   Forums   Classifieds   Contests   Shop   Search
Wake World Home

 

© 2016 eWake, Inc.    
Advertise    |    Contact    |    Terms of Use    |    Privacy Policy    |    Report Abuse    |    Conduct    |    About Us