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Old    Mike (BCPMike0663)      Join Date: Apr 2010       01-19-2017, 10:28 AM Reply   
Well I have now struck out on two X-stars between 2008 and 2010. I have always been a Mastercraft guy but now I am starting to look at other options. I have posted a couple of threads but I can't seem to find the right fit. We have expanded our budget and search to start looking at used G's. Problem is I have been out of the scene for a while. I used to ride behind early 2000 Super Airs all the time but I have just been riding behind our 2003 X-2 for the last handful of years.

I have started to do some research on G's but I would I like to know what the must haves are for my search and what year is best or better? Looking at 2013 to 2014 I would assume. Budget 80 to 90K.

Thanks, Mike
Old    Tom (laptom)      Join Date: Apr 2002       01-19-2017, 10:45 AM Reply   
Skip the 2013 if it is a non super charged version. The 2014 non-sc received the 2:1 gearbox a is smoother, more efficiently and more powerful. Otherwise not a lot of differences till 2016.
Old    Stephen P (stevo8290)      Join Date: Sep 2008       01-19-2017, 11:27 AM Reply   
I have heard some of the earlier year models have a bigger wakeboard wake. From my understanding they made some slight changes to make the surf wake better thus sacrificing the wakeboard wake. Now don't get me wrong I'm 100% sure any g23 wake is way more than enough. But if you want the absolute biggest wakeboard wake on the planet, find out which model JD Webb is running, rumor has it's the biggest wake on the planet.
Old     (Bevostein)      Join Date: Oct 2015       01-19-2017, 12:16 PM Reply   
Same hull 2013-2015. Hull was updated in 2016 to reduce splash over the bow in rough water and more closely integrate the back end with the NSS system.

Laptom is right on 2013 year. Skip it unless you get the 550 or are certain you will never run additional ballast weight or large crews. 409 engine was offered during some years. Avoid it as well, even in years with the 2:1 ratio.

If you end up with a 2013 make sure the prop shaft was replaced or have dealer replace under warranty before sale is finalized. They had a batch of shafts that had shearing issues. Some say it was just on the 550s but I'm not certain of that.

You occasionally see a used 2013 without the NSS system since that was an add-on introduced after the boat hit the market. Obviously you would want to avoid those or price accordingly for adding NSS

New line of direct injection engines were introduced in 2016 IIRC.

Those are the big differences that come to mind
Old    BLAIR BARHAM (jonblarc7)      Join Date: Jul 2006       01-19-2017, 12:18 PM Reply   
If you haven't rode behind one, I don't think you under stand how big it really is in stock form. Above stock is just crazy
Old    Miguel (migs)      Join Date: Aug 2006       01-19-2017, 3:28 PM Reply   
^^^that
Old    Mike (BCPMike0663)      Join Date: Apr 2010       02-08-2017, 7:27 AM Reply   
Can anyone tell me how tall the boat is on the trailer with the tower folded down? I am having my garage modified but it doesn't look like I am going to be able to up high enough to fit the boat with the tower up without some major reconstruction which I would rather avoid. Thanks, Mike
Old    DTB (DatTexasBoy)      Join Date: Aug 2012       02-08-2017, 11:16 AM Reply   
I have a 16 Supra SA right in your price range for sale. It competes with both these boats in wake and surf. You can get new financing on it and will save you hundreds on monthly payments.
Old    Eric (Fixable)      Join Date: Oct 2012       02-08-2017, 12:39 PM Reply   
Mike- with tower down, I just barely get my G23 in an 8'6" tall door. It was way too close for comfort. I would say that you would want a 9' door, if you will be regularly going in and out.....
Old    Eric (Fixable)      Join Date: Oct 2012       02-08-2017, 12:47 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevo8290 View Post
I have heard some of the earlier year models have a bigger wakeboard wake. From my understanding they made some slight changes to make the surf wake better thus sacrificing the wakeboard wake. Now don't get me wrong I'm 100% sure any g23 wake is way more than enough. But if you want the absolute biggest wakeboard wake on the planet, find out which model JD Webb is running, rumor has it's the biggest wake on the planet.

No difference in wakeboard wake. I consistently ride a 2013, and a 2016, back to back, and can't tell any difference. The hull changes for surf were not made to a portion of the running surface that is in the water at wakeboard speeds.
Old    Mike (BCPMike0663)      Join Date: Apr 2010       02-08-2017, 12:50 PM Reply   
Perfect Eric!! That is the info I needed thanks again. Originally we were looking at 2014s but now are leaning towards biting the bullet and getting a 16. Any input on this???
Old    Eric (Fixable)      Join Date: Oct 2012       02-08-2017, 1:59 PM Reply   
Mike- A close friend has a '13, and I had the '16 (I have a '17 now). Personally, after having the '16, I definitely wouldn't want a 13-15. However, the biggest reason for that is- we run a very extended season. The bow spray on the 13-15 can get a bit uncomfortable when the water is only 50-60 degrees splashing in to the boat. During the hotter summer months, it doesn't bother me at all. Both generations have good surf waves, but the 16-17 is definitely a little cleaner, and quite a bit more powerful on just stock ballast. That said, I do still really like the wave on the 13-15.

The audio systems are also WAY better on the 16-17.

Overall, I wouldn't hesitate on a 13-15, but I would want it to be drastically cheaper than a '16. The changes they made really make a great boat just that much better. I would say, that if you are looking to stay within a certain budget, I would try to find a low option 2016, and then add stuff as the budget allows in future years. Even the base engine is fine with the 2:1 gearbox (unless you were planning to wakeboard with HUGE amounts of extra ballast). If it has the H6, you will be fine for any scenario.
Old    MLO (cbarguy1)      Join Date: Dec 2012       02-08-2017, 3:56 PM Reply   
Just curious, what happened when you were shopping for xstars? Nothing good on the market, people asking for too much money or just decided to move up to a G?
Old    Mike (BCPMike0663)      Join Date: Apr 2010       02-09-2017, 2:28 PM Reply   
MLO,
I was close to deals on two X-stars and they fell through. They were both out of state, one got sold out from underneath me and the other we could not come to an agreement. The more my wife and I talked about it, we decided we didn't want to buy a boat that was already 7 years old (I only wanted the old X-Star hull). We started looking at G's and now have decided with our family situation it is better to up the budget and buy a boat we can have for the next 7-10 years. I would still entertain an X-Star if the right deal showed up (Pointing at you Phatboy) but for now we are looking at G's.

Eric,
How much does it cost to upgrade each year? Are you trading it in? I hope I am not being too personal, just intrigued.

Thanks, Mike
Old    Miguel (migs)      Join Date: Aug 2006       02-09-2017, 10:54 PM Reply   
Since we're talking about G's, I'll post a pic of one. Just because.
Attached Images
 
Old    Eric (Fixable)      Join Date: Oct 2012       02-10-2017, 4:59 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by BCPMike0663 View Post

Eric,
How much does it cost to upgrade each year? Are you trading it in? I hope I am not being too personal, just intrigued.

Thanks, Mike
It costs me next to nothing. Usually just the amount that the prices increased on the boat. (About $4300.00 this year)

The same person buys my 1 year old boat every year, and the dealer gives me an incredible discount on the new boats, because they know they will sell one every year.

My buyer likes the custom stuff I do to the boats (LEDs, stereo upgrades, bigger heater, RGB underwater lights, etc.). Also, He owns a lake resort, so the depreciation hit is not as big of a deal when it's a business expense. I am able to sell it to him at a good average used value, and still in perfect condition.

Pure luck, really. I'm sure it will stop working at some point, but the last 5 years have worked great! I just have to stick to MasterCraft or Nautique, and 23'........ Which is fine. I'm not really that interested in other brands or sizes.
Old    Mike (BCPMike0663)      Join Date: Apr 2010       02-10-2017, 7:33 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fixable View Post
It costs me next to nothing. Usually just the amount that the prices increased on the boat. (About $4300.00 this year)

The same person buys my 1 year old boat every year, and the dealer gives me an incredible discount on the new boats, because they know they will sell one every year.

My buyer likes the custom stuff I do to the boats (LEDs, stereo upgrades, bigger heater, RGB underwater lights, etc.). Also, He owns a lake resort, so the depreciation hit is not as big of a deal when it's a business expense. I am able to sell it to him at a good average used value, and still in perfect condition.

Pure luck, really. I'm sure it will stop working at some point, but the last 5 years have worked great! I just have to stick to MasterCraft or Nautique, and 23'........ Which is fine. I'm not really that interested in other brands or sizes.
that is awesome! If someone wants to make this deal I will buy new every year no problem. Thanks again for all your input. I am getting my garage ready, and my hydrohoist adjusted to fit the larger boat. Then we will see if I can find the right fit. If not I may wait until the fall. Thanks again, Mike
Old    MLO (cbarguy1)      Join Date: Dec 2012       02-10-2017, 2:00 PM Reply   
Mike,

Thanks for the insights. I ask because I have a gen2 x* and am happy to hear that a few others still like them too. Seems like they have fallen out of favor now that the market is mostly surfing.

And since we're posting pictures for no good reason here's one. Show us your new beast when you get it.
Attached Images
 

Last edited by cbarguy1; 02-10-2017 at 2:04 PM.
Old    C Johnson (YYCBoarder)      Join Date: Apr 2013       02-10-2017, 2:08 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by cbarguy1 View Post
Mike,

Thanks for the insights. I ask because I have a gen2 x* and am happy to hear that a few others still like them too. Seems like they have fallen out of favor now that the market is mostly surfing.

And since we're posting pictures for no good reason here's one. Show us your new beast when you get it.
Great looking boat! I love wake on the gen2 xstar.
Old    Mike (BCPMike0663)      Join Date: Apr 2010       02-10-2017, 2:20 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by cbarguy1 View Post
Mike,

Thanks for the insights. I ask because I have a gen2 x* and am happy to hear that a few others still like them too. Seems like they have fallen out of favor now that the market is mostly surfing.

And since we're posting pictures for no good reason here's one. Show us your new beast when you get it.
Your boat looks exactly like PhatBoy's. He is a member here and my best friend. I keep trying to get him to sell me his boat but he won't budge. I am not a surfer and if MC would have kept that hull that is what I would be looking for. But from my understanding the G23 now has the best wake of current boats.
Old    MLO (cbarguy1)      Join Date: Dec 2012       02-10-2017, 2:31 PM Reply   
Small world. I'm in WA state and don't see a lot of g2*s, especially the anniversary models. I think the later models are limited because they were sold during the great recession years (2008-2011).

Aside from the 40th I think this is my favorite. The PWTs are nice too.

Sorry for the thread jack. I miss summer.
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Last edited by cbarguy1; 02-10-2017 at 2:39 PM.
Old    Mike (BCPMike0663)      Join Date: Apr 2010       02-10-2017, 7:14 PM Reply   
You can hi-jack if you get someone to sell me one of these boats at a good price.
Old    Mike (BCPMike0663)      Join Date: Apr 2010       03-11-2017, 4:56 PM Reply   
Crazy, we went to the boat show and were surprised how big the G21 was on the inside. We thought it would be the same as our X-2 but it felt way bigger. We are now leaning towards that boat. We are going to demo both the G21 and G23 in the near future.

But for how:

School me on G21.

Thanks, Mike
Old     (Ttime41)      Join Date: Nov 2011       03-12-2017, 8:22 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by BCPMike0663 View Post
Your boat looks exactly like PhatBoy's. He is a member here and my best friend. I keep trying to get him to sell me his boat but he won't budge. I am not a surfer and if MC would have kept that hull that is what I would be looking for. But from my understanding the G23 now has the best wake of current boats.
Only if you buy into hype. As someone who only wakeboards, there are boats from other brands that I would way rather ride behind.
Old     (simplej)      Join Date: Sep 2011       03-12-2017, 8:58 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ttime41 View Post
Only if you buy into hype. As someone who only wakeboards, there are boats from other brands that I would way rather ride behind.
Are you joking? The g23 is THE best wake money can buy.

If you were complaining about the g21 I would understand but...

What in the hell other boat would you ride over a g23
Old     (Ttime41)      Join Date: Nov 2011       03-12-2017, 11:13 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by simplej View Post
Are you joking? The g23 is THE best wake money can buy.

If you were complaining about the g21 I would understand but...

What in the hell other boat would you ride over a g23
Comparing stock ballast to stock ballast against the G23:

Supra SA- Same size, better shape

Malibu M235- Just plain bigger

Last edited by Ttime41; 03-12-2017 at 11:14 AM. Reason: .
Old     (CPanner)      Join Date: May 2015       03-12-2017, 11:49 AM Reply   
Supra SA- stock to stock I'd argue the SA is smaller. Better shape is an opinion.

Malibu M235 - only way you could say it's bigger is when you include plug and play, in that case you're not really making a fair comparison. You can add bags to a G23 and it will be significantly better than an M235.

Wakeboard boat of the year 4x in a row, on a riders poll. Can't really call that hype. There may be boats that YOU would rather ride behind but the fact of the matter is the G23 is the best wakeboard boat currently on the market.
Old     (Ttime41)      Join Date: Nov 2011       03-12-2017, 12:36 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by CPanner View Post
Supra SA- stock to stock I'd argue the SA is smaller. Better shape is an opinion.

Malibu M235 - only way you could say it's bigger is when you include plug and play, in that case you're not really making a fair comparison. You can add bags to a G23 and it will be significantly better than an M235.

Wakeboard boat of the year 4x in a row, on a riders poll. Can't really call that hype. There may be boats that YOU would rather ride behind but the fact of the matter is the G23 is the best wakeboard boat currently on the market.
Arguing that the SA wake is smaller is splitting hairs. The fact is that it is a huge, clean wake that actually has some shape to it (not just a huge roller like the G). I won't even get into how much better that boat drives and turns than the G.

The only reason the M doesn't have the reputation as the biggest wake in the industry is because it was never marketed to riders, and because people look at the MSRP and assume that it is unattainable. Not to mention, there are a whole lot less of them, so there isn't a lot of first hand experience out there. Adding PnP bags to the M is as easy as plugging them in and pressing a button. Adding bags to a G requires you to fill bags with pumps that have to be thrown over the side of the boat. I wouldn't really consider that a fair comparison either.

WW polls are built on hype. How many people do you think voted that had experience with all or most of the industry's top wake boats? I would guess very few.

I realize this opinion isn't going to be popular here on WW. If you would have asked me what I thought was the best wakeboard boat in 13, 14 and '15 I would have agreed that it was the G. Now, I think that enough time has passed that other companies have taken that model of the ultra heavy, deep wake boat and taken it a step further. Just an honest opinion from someone who is lucky enough to have experience with all 3 of the boats mentioned.
Old    Mike (BCPMike0663)      Join Date: Apr 2010       03-12-2017, 1:23 PM Reply   
Please get back on track. Looking at the difference between the g21 and g23. Maybe I am a snob but it is going to be one of those two boats. My lake is pretty small and we have a home on the water so I don't need some of the extras of the bigger boat. I would just like opinions on wake, comfort, drivability and maybe resale value of these two boats. If I go 21 there is a chance I will go new. Thanks again, Mike
Old     (simplej)      Join Date: Sep 2011       03-12-2017, 1:42 PM Reply   
Just a giant roller? Has no shape? What are you talking about... unless you want a wake that big that's gonna shoot you straight up then by all means please go buy an x star. And the new 24 mxz is the superior wakeboard boat in the malibu line.

You literally cannot touch the volume behind the wake of the G. No other boat comes close.

The g21 is too sensitive and steep to be truly great wakeboard boat. I would pass and stick to g23's unless you wanted to look at some other boats in the 21.5 size range. There other boats in that class that offer similar size and 90% performance with none of the wake negatives that the g21 has

Last edited by simplej; 03-12-2017 at 1:45 PM.
Old     (CPanner)      Join Date: May 2015       03-12-2017, 1:59 PM Reply   
I think we can agree that Ttime41 is out to lunch here. As far as G21 vs G23 goes, I own a G21, I actually prefer the steeper wake and don't find it to be nearly all that sensitive. That being said my next boat will be a G23.
Old     (simplej)      Join Date: Sep 2011       03-12-2017, 2:26 PM Reply   
I have a ton of trouble setting up the 21. I find that they like to crab and wash. The prop rotation also really rolls the boat over and they are touchy to weight both front to back and side to side. What engine/prop are you running?

The wake is enormous though, and steep. To me, too steep once we're talking a 3 foot wall but that's all preference. Again the most volume in the class

I just think that in that size range you'd be better off in the equivalent Malibu/axis product, maybe even gs22, where the wakes are the same size as the G but with less volume and greater consistency.

Any of these boats will blow your x2 out of the water. The wake on that boat is mediocre at best, even in it's class


Edit: if your x2 is the 205v hull not the p-fork hull you may actually appreciate the g21 wake of you're into the more "old school" type wakes

Last edited by simplej; 03-12-2017 at 2:29 PM.
Old    BELEZA (beleza)      Join Date: Mar 2010       03-12-2017, 3:44 PM Reply   
Ttime 41 may just prefer different wakes than the rest of us. No big deal. As for me, I prefer the stock G23 wake over any other stock wake out there. It is scary massive. I can't imagine what it would be like after adding a few thousand pounds of ballast. I spent all of last season behind a G23 and it was amazing in all areas, including surf. I've never been behind a G21 but I'm sure it's pretty similar. I don't think you will be disappointed.
Old    Mark (FunkyBunch)      Join Date: Jun 2011       03-12-2017, 8:22 PM Reply   
G21 wake is great. You can adjust the side to side wake easily from the dash. The front to back is very flexible.
Attached Images
 
Old    Mike (BCPMike0663)      Join Date: Apr 2010       03-12-2017, 11:26 PM Reply   
Very excited to ride these two wakes. We have over 3k in weight in the X-2 (orginal Xstar hull) and I am amazed that the G is going to have a much larger wake stock. That is a major selling point for me. I now have little kids and would rather not have the weight all over the place in the boat. I am still a relatively advanced rider with a couple mobes so I want a higher profile wake that is easy. I am excited to learn that is the case with these new boats
Old    Chase Tillett (tn_rider)      Join Date: Dec 2009       03-12-2017, 11:47 PM Reply   
TBH, I grew up riding a 04-13 x-star with 3000-4000 pounds of ballast. A buddy of mine just got a G and I haven't been behind it because it was cold. But the stock wake just looked meh to me from the boat. Not what I was expecting at all.
Old     (simplej)      Join Date: Sep 2011       03-13-2017, 3:36 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by FunkyBunch View Post
G21 wake is great. You can adjust the side to side wake easily from the dash. The front to back is very flexible.
What model year considering I have had the complete opposite experience? Control it from the dash? How?

As soon as you drop the NCRS, even 1 click, on the 21 the wake gets funky. I'd say they're as touchy as an old 230, maybe you nautique boys are just used to it.

I also find I have to counter weight them 2:1 to get them level since the prop throws the 21 over so damn far.
Old    David Posey (granddaddy53)      Join Date: Dec 2013       03-13-2017, 5:32 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by BCPMike0663 View Post
Well I have now struck out on two X-stars between 2008 and 2010. I have always been a Mastercraft guy but now I am starting to look at other options. I have posted a couple of threads but I can't seem to find the right fit. We have expanded our budget and search to start looking at used G's. Problem is I have been out of the scene for a while. I used to ride behind early 2000 Super Airs all the time but I have just been riding behind our 2003 X-2 for the last handful of years.

I have started to do some research on G's but I would I like to know what the must haves are for my search and what year is best or better? Looking at 2013 to 2014 I would assume. Budget 80 to 90K.

Thanks, Mike
Unless your putting 8 or more in boat plus full sacs you don't have to worry about tranny ratios so 13 and 14 is also good. I know of a 13 with leaking sacs and almost 1300 hours that a riding/surfing buddy had one repossessed and even with the somewhat dirty interior this boat was more fun than a barrel of monkeys!!! You really can't go wrong and unless your looking for impeccable you don't need 80000 for a heavily used 23 that still will fulfill your needs. I spent 9 months or more 4 weekends a month last year in that 2013 and I never had so much fun! Great wake, great wave, wake is awesome for less seasoned riders and will send you even empty of water. BEST wave transfers in the industry with no comparison to other boats , 2013 NSS 3.5-3.75 seconds from Pressing switch button to full wave formation on other side for transfers with or without counter steering into the new wave!!!!! Best transfers in the industry

Last edited by granddaddy53; 03-13-2017 at 5:38 AM.
Old    Mark (FunkyBunch)      Join Date: Jun 2011       03-13-2017, 6:14 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by simplej View Post
What model year considering I have had the complete opposite experience? Control it from the dash? How?



As soon as you drop the NCRS, even 1 click, on the 21 the wake gets funky. I'd say they're as touchy as an old 230, maybe you nautique boys are just used to it.



I also find I have to counter weight them 2:1 to get them level since the prop throws the 21 over so damn far.


The 16's and up have a ballast shift function. You can move 50lbs a time to balance weight. The only time this is an issue is if you have just a driver in the boat. I keep a bit of lead in the port rear locker for when it is just me and 1 rider.

I would say you just ride Malibu or Mastercraft to much. I came from a Supra and the setup of this boat is much simpler. No bags any where 3 lead wake bags in the biggest locker in the rear. If your talking surf it's not an easy setup but boarding is very easy.

I can move the ncrs to any position and it just changes the shape.

Mike I bought the boat because the stock wake is by far my favorite even over the 23. The 23 has more potential with more weight if that is what your going to do. The 21 will really on take 1500 over stock before it gets troublesome.
Old     (CPanner)      Join Date: May 2015       03-13-2017, 6:27 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by simplej View Post
What model year considering I have had the complete opposite experience? Control it from the dash? How?

As soon as you drop the NCRS, even 1 click, on the 21 the wake gets funky. I'd say they're as touchy as an old 230, maybe you nautique boys are just used to it.

I also find I have to counter weight them 2:1 to get them level since the prop throws the 21 over so damn far.
Model year won't matter for the G21 since the hull hasn't changed. I've got 200lbs of lead and some extra stereo equipment under the observers seat to counteract the prop torque.

Not sure why you have so many issues. It's literally the exact same wakeboard running surface as all current G series boats just with 1.5 feet removed (wakesurf running surface is different)

I regulary ride behind my G21 and my buddies G23, I'd consider my self an intermediate/advanced rider, the only difference I notice is the G21 wake is slightly more abrupt, which I like.
Old     (simplej)      Join Date: Sep 2011       03-13-2017, 8:25 AM Reply   
Yea probably spoiled by how unflappable the axis wake is regardless of how the boat is weighted or the conditions on the lake. I spend about 50 hours a year on the g21 though so I am quite familiar with how it runs

Year matters due to gyro's and powertrains. NCRS 5 or 4 is Fine, just super steep, drop below 4 and it crumbles and crabs over even more. Too much weight in the main cabin and you get a big gnarly 230 like lip

What prop are you running? The thing will literally throw itself over with the 18x18 or whatever it is that my neighbor runs. Need 2 people to counter the driver, I'll see if I can find pics

Anyways. This if why I would go 23 over 21

Edit: video found. Notice the general "strangeness" of the wake. 5 people in the boat. 1 driver 1 center, observer side. 22 mph and NCRS 4



Im all ears if you have reccomendations on cleaning it up, not that it has a huge impact, just a bit frustrating when you have more crowds. Looks just like a 230 wake to me

Again, great boot tons of volume, awesome wake not bashing it just stating why I would go with he bigger boat

Last edited by simplej; 03-13-2017 at 8:31 AM.
Old    Scott (scottb7)      Join Date: Oct 2012       03-13-2017, 5:23 PM Reply   
I don't even understand the comparison your problems with the g21. Generally the bigger the boat is going to require more weight to create the same wake...i.e. the g23 will require more weight then g21 to create the same size wake. And the by product of creating the wake with weight is it being more vertical.

My friend had a 230 and this was certainly true in comparison to my 210.

Could you simply need a bit more weight in the back? You may be weighting a bit too evenly. It may raise the bow a bit but probably not much.

So my friend sold his 230 and has an axis...And yes it is "unflappable" but it is because it has more bow rise and generally runs with more weight in the back. Especially with the wedge. Axis knows this about there "a" boats and even advertises the "t" to be less bow rise...

I am selling my 210 (2008 team edtion, high hours, good price, shameless plug) and i am getting a g21...So I will let you know down the road in a month or so how it compares both with the 210, 230 and a22. I want big wake and low bow rise, and I like it pretty vertical. I am guessing I will get exactly what I want. And I am guessing with all the damn adjustments possible with water, and settings I can simulate whatever.

Prop torque: yeah as the props get bigger the prop torque increases. This is going to be same on all boats regardless of mfgr.

There is an xstar on my lake and it has great wake, but again he weights the holy hell out of it, and it runs thru the water with its nose out up like a snotty ugly girlfriend. whatever. And since i am ranting, the axis line has too wide a wake for my liking.

beat me up...who cares...
Old     (simplej)      Join Date: Sep 2011       03-13-2017, 5:58 PM Reply   
I think you've got a few things backwards but...
Nor am I trying to sell OP on an axis. If your buddy's axis runs nose up he's running too much weight in the back with wedge, this will also widen the wake a loooot. Needs another 300+lbs in the bow. Try that next time and let us know how it goes.


The g21 needs bow weight not rear weight. It's just sensitive in my experience. The wake is like the 230 in a lot of ways.
The g23 has all the performance and none of the drawbacks. No crabbing, no washing, no sensitivity, "just right" shape, usable NCRS etc etc

But like I said for the OP's purposes he may like the 21 more if he enjoys a heavy 205v. 23 wake is more like a pumped up gen 2 xstar hull with more volume
Old    Scott (scottb7)      Join Date: Oct 2012       03-13-2017, 6:30 PM Reply   
You are the first guy since the g21 came out that says it is like the 230...the first guy...virtually every one says the same thing...which is same wake as g23 except more vertical...maybe YOU got things backwards...

i will get my g21 and let you know how it compares to 210, 230, and a22...

p.s. you are probably right about my friend weighing his axis too much in the back...but that does not change my point at all.
Old     (simplej)      Join Date: Sep 2011       03-13-2017, 6:57 PM Reply   
Your point is that you just bought one so you're upset I'm pointing out that oh no- it Has flaws? Who knew. Displacement over weight every time...

Either way I've put I like 100 hours on that boat. 30/40 of which probably behind the wheel. Boats a 2015. But that's fine. Let us know when you take it out. You'll love it. Not many boats capable of putting out a wake with so much volume
Old    Scott (scottb7)      Join Date: Oct 2012       03-13-2017, 7:13 PM Reply   
I can tell you...i am SUPER NOT - DOUBLE NOT - a nautique fan boy...but it flipping better be significantly better than my 2008 210...or i am going to flame g21 like the world has never seen.

IT FLIPPING BETTER NOT BE WASHY....

P.S. I did not buy it new...not that rich...
Old    Ken (kenv)      Join Date: May 2002       03-13-2017, 7:41 PM Reply   
I've got a '15 G21 and love the boat and the wake. As mentioned above...when surfing...not wakeboarding...if I knock NCRS from 5 to 4....my wave kinda goes to crap. So I would call that pretty sensitive. As far as wakeboarding wake, I'm no pro but I couldn't ask for a better shape. That being said...I LOVE my G21...kids and family love driving it and it is the most comfortable boat I've owned. I also have lakefront access, so I don't need the more room that a G23 would bring....so i'm happy with the 21. Most importantly...what other boat can you cruise over to party cove in.....throw out the floats and crank...."Ain't nutin' but a G Thing Ba-bee".......LOL
Old     (CPanner)      Join Date: May 2015       03-14-2017, 6:31 AM Reply   
Okay, so we've got multiple people in this thread that don't think the G21 has any of the drawbacks that SimpleJ continues to mention. Pretty sure you're not setting that boat up right or there's some other issue with it. In the 300+ hours I've put on my G21 it has never crabbed, washed, or been overly sensitive.

I'm going to repeat this again, it has the exact same running surface as the G23. Same shape, same running gear, same gear ratio, same prop, same everything. The only difference is the 1.5 feet that it's shorter, and a lot of that is from the bow which again doesn't affect the running surface. If you find it more sensitive than a G23 it's a user issue, not a boat issue.
Old     (WheelerWake)      Join Date: Mar 2013       03-14-2017, 8:21 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by CPanner View Post
Okay, so we've got multiple people in this thread that don't think the G21 has any of the drawbacks that SimpleJ continues to mention. Pretty sure you're not setting that boat up right or there's some other issue with it. In the 300+ hours I've put on my G21 it has never crabbed, washed, or been overly sensitive.

I'm going to repeat this again, it has the exact same running surface as the G23. Same shape, same running gear, same gear ratio, same prop, same everything. The only difference is the 1.5 feet that it's shorter, and a lot of that is from the bow which again doesn't affect the running surface. If you find it more sensitive than a G23 it's a user issue, not a boat issue.
Who appointed you spokesman, with the ability to decide whose experiences are valid and whose are not?
Old     (simplej)      Join Date: Sep 2011       03-14-2017, 8:41 AM Reply   
G21 owners in attack mode because the 23 is better, and it should be considering the cost and size.. And for the 500th time I think it's an awesome wake, it just doesn't stack up to the 23. The 23 is nearly without flaw in terms of wake performance, while the 21 has drawbacks.

1.5 feet just from the bow?
Assuming that is true, if the whole 1.5 feet is fore of the midline that can make huge changes to the wake, ballast distribution, leverage point for the weight, weight of the bow itself. 200 lbs stacked in very nose goes farther than a walk way sack for example. All of this impacts what portion of the running surface is in the lake. Especially considering the G has a bow tank more than it is a belly tank. Oh and that extra 400 lbs up front.


Anyways what do I know. It's not like I've spent 100+ hours on one. Apparently with stock ballast and a few people I don't know to set it up properly \_(ツ)_/
Old    C Johnson (YYCBoarder)      Join Date: Apr 2013       03-14-2017, 9:28 AM Reply   
I don't know if I would agree that the G23 is better than the G21 - it's just different. As mentioned several times it is more vertical than the G23 (pre-2016) but some prefer that. The hull change in 2016 notched the rear part of the hull for NSS which sinks the back a bit more and makes the wake more vertical.

They're both great wakes......and the IMO the gen2 xstar is just as good (or maybe better).

I haven't spent a ton of time on a 21 but it didn't seem particularly sensitive. One of the best things about those hulls is that they're easy to set up - just run equal weight in all bags and add a few 150-200 lbs port side to counter the the prop rotation (for both boats).
Old     (CPanner)      Join Date: May 2015       03-14-2017, 9:57 AM Reply   
I'm not disputing that the G23 isn't a better boat. I already stated it will be my next boat. All I'm saying is that if you are experiencing the sensitivity issues that not one other person in this thread that owns or has ridden behind a G21 has experienced, well then maybe it's a user issue and not a boat issue.

Done with this thread. Buy a G21, or a G23, or really any of the current monster wake boats and you'll be happy.

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