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Old    Brad S (wakeskierbrad)      Join Date: Dec 2009       06-29-2014, 7:35 PM Reply   
Saw Phil was DQ'ed from Stop 1 in Actworth, and didn't attend Stop 2 in Cali this weekend... What the deal?
Old    Adrock (Moose99)      Join Date: Jun 2011       06-30-2014, 8:20 AM Reply   
He probably got DQ'd for complaining about the X-Star wake so much. I'm pretty sure he's been fined by the PWT before for the same reason.
Old    C.I.E. J-Rod (jarrod)      Join Date: May 2003       06-30-2014, 9:26 AM Reply   
Bummer. He handed the PWT season win to the next guy in line.
Old    Joe Burbo (jburbo)      Join Date: Sep 2007       06-30-2014, 9:52 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moose99 View Post
He probably got DQ'd for complaining about the X-Star wake so much. I'm pretty sure he's been fined by the PWT before for the same reason.
pretty sure you nailed it.

on a side note, Deans comments on Instagram are priceless
Old    Connor (iShredSAN)      Join Date: Apr 2012       06-30-2014, 10:01 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by jburbo View Post
pretty sure you nailed it.

on a side note, Deans comments on Instagram are priceless
Post a link! I need a good laugh...
Old    Tom (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       06-30-2014, 10:13 AM Reply   
Old    Joe Burbo (jburbo)      Join Date: Sep 2007       06-30-2014, 11:05 AM Reply   
i cant post it from my work computer for some reason, but his post card from California was also hilarious.
Old    Brad S (wakeskierbrad)      Join Date: Dec 2009       06-30-2014, 11:54 AM Reply   
Postcard one
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Old    Orion (chillinoj)      Join Date: May 2009       07-01-2014, 10:54 AM Reply   
Haha those are pretty funny
Old    Clubjoe (clubjoe)      Join Date: Sep 2005       07-10-2014, 1:20 PM Reply   
Any further information out there about this besides speculation?..... Reports? Reliable insider gossip? I can't find anything confirming what the causes are, or if the two events are even related.

I'm actually surprised this got let go so fast on here.......
Old    Kyle Linsey (kyle_L)      Join Date: Mar 2010       07-12-2014, 8:41 AM Reply   
what's wrong with the wake?
Old    Mase (superair502)      Join Date: Mar 2010       07-12-2014, 11:10 AM Reply   
I had heard he complained about the washing of the star wake in a public manner somehow. I was pretty drunk when I heard the story though can't remember details.
Old    J (Jmorlan)      Join Date: May 2013       07-12-2014, 11:44 AM Reply   
Phil is a dilbert. I've seen wake brothers, I know what's up.
Old     (Bam6961)      Join Date: Apr 2011       07-12-2014, 7:02 PM Reply   
back in the game and taking first!
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Old    Sander (tripsw)      Join Date: May 2006       07-12-2014, 10:40 PM Reply   
Wonder what happened in Harley's run.
And cool to see the Brad stickers on all their boards.
Old    Adam Balon (adam_balon)      Join Date: Jul 2003       07-13-2014, 2:23 AM Reply   
im not a phil fan....but if he did complain about the wake...... im sure its deserved... some of the pwt video the wake does look washy and horrible. would have loved to see rusty take it today.
Old    Corey North (HighWater)      Join Date: Apr 2012       07-14-2014, 8:31 AM Reply   
I can vouch for the ****ty wake at the first tour stop in Acworth. Totally washed out!
Old    M-Dizzle (liquidmx)      Join Date: Jun 2005       07-14-2014, 8:51 AM Reply   
The wake at Lathrop looked a little washy and the boat was porpoising as well. It seemed odd to me.
Old    Andy Nintzel (andy_nintzel)      Join Date: Sep 2004       07-14-2014, 9:00 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by adam_balon View Post
im not a phil fan....but if he did complain about the wake...... im sure its deserved... some of the pwt video the wake does look washy and horrible. would have loved to see rusty take it today.
If the wake behind the X-Star is washy and he doesnt like it, he should learn to ride a bit faster, or use a shorter rope. God knows there are plenty of X-Stars for him to ride in Orlando to get his rope lengthy and boat speed perfectly dialed in. Fairly lame excuse.
Old    C.I.E. J-Rod (jarrod)      Join Date: May 2003       07-14-2014, 4:43 PM Reply   
Boats perform differently in different lakes. A new X-Star in the Delta is very difficult to dial in I hear. I know of one former MC rider that spent dozens of hours trying to figure it out. Another example is our MXZ. The weight config that the guys run in Florida is different than what we run at the Delta. But the MXZ wake is ALWAYS good. :-)

Mossdale is also tricky. The dense mineral content makes the boat more buoyant or ride higher in the water I guess, much like brackish or salt would. Our Malibu took an insane amount of weight at SpringRide. On the Delta,or on a lake, the boat would have never come close to getting on plane.

Ive ridden in the PWT boat during qualifying. The wake is massive and has great shape, but I've seen it give some riders problems. For beasts like Rusty, it doesn't matter. For others it does.

Also, just my opinion, but if Phil wants to voice his opinion of the wake, I think he should be able to do so.
Old    L W (501s)      Join Date: Feb 2010       07-15-2014, 8:27 AM Reply   
It seems like this is something that is not just a feeling from the rider, but would be very evident in videos. If you watch the riders run and the wake IS washing over, than the rider should at least be able to voice their opinion.

Having rode in contests behind boats with a washy wake (ahem Tige), it's no fun.
Old    Chase Tillett (tn_rider)      Join Date: Dec 2009       07-15-2014, 9:29 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by 501s View Post
It seems like this is something that is not just a feeling from the rider, but would be very evident in videos. If you watch the riders run and the wake IS washing over, than the rider should at least be able to voice their opinion.

Having rode in contests behind boats with a washy wake (ahem Tige), it's no fun.

Notice on the clips where the wake does wash out, and the rider is making a hard cut at the wake, they end up doing a backside 180. Or a 540, so they have SOME points and not just a wake to wake air because the wake was messed up.
Old     (WakeWise)      Join Date: Jun 2014       07-15-2014, 12:02 PM Reply   
You bite the hand that feeds you and you pay for it. He has a right and the organization has a right to suspend or fine. Think NBA or NFL.
Old    LEE DANEILS (hyperlite)      Join Date: May 2009       07-16-2014, 10:29 AM Reply   
That new x-star is garbage, its no secret that a lot of guys are not fond of it. They completely ruined it with the new design. Is it possible that another manufacture could take over the PWT or is MC's strangle hold on that series unbreakable.
Old    C.I.E. J-Rod (jarrod)      Join Date: May 2003       07-16-2014, 10:43 AM Reply   
Mastercraft owns the pro tour name I believe.
Old    Andy Nintzel (andy_nintzel)      Join Date: Sep 2004       07-16-2014, 1:09 PM Reply   
J-Rod is Right.
Old    Miguel (migs)      Join Date: Aug 2006       07-16-2014, 1:16 PM Reply   
Nautique now has 4 tour stops(Wake games, Masters, Nationals, & the new one this year), which is just 1 under the 5 of the Pro Tour I believe.
Old    A-dub (behindtheboat)      Join Date: Aug 2006       07-16-2014, 2:48 PM Reply   
I think that contract is coming up for expiration..... It would be good if it was a different boat manufacturer every stop, then they would seem to over influence at all.
Old    Chase Tillett (tn_rider)      Join Date: Dec 2009       07-16-2014, 5:54 PM Reply   
Or they have multiple manuf. and let each rider decide the boat and wake they ride. Have them out on a sheet. Say harley is up and he wants X-Star, then harf is up and he wants G23. End of Harley's run, G23 takes harf and x-star goes and waits. Obviously the boat sponsored riders will be expected to ride behind the manuf. they are sponsored by. But it could be interesting to see.
Old    Scotty Mo (AlbertaSurfer)      Join Date: May 2014       07-16-2014, 6:11 PM Reply   
A contest like that, everyone has the same boat for a reason. One rider choosing a G25 and winning over a rider who chose a Star would open up too much room for controversy. I get where you are going, but standardizing the boat makes the riders make the best of what's available. Think of how the ASP runs surf contests. They get whatever waves show during the 14 day waiting period. It's up to the rider's ability to use what's given.

That said, Soven fan or not, he's got enough credentials to complain for sure. It's supposed to be the Pro Wakeboard Tour, not the "John Doe can't get his wake dialed right tour"
Old    Tim (dezul)      Join Date: Jul 2012       07-16-2014, 6:38 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlbertaSurfer View Post
A contest like that, everyone has the same boat for a reason. One rider choosing a G25 and winning over a rider who chose a Star would open up too much room for controversy. I get where you are going, but standardizing the boat makes the riders make the best of what's available. Think of how the ASP runs surf contests. They get whatever waves show during the 14 day waiting period. It's up to the rider's ability to use what's given.

That said, Soven fan or not, he's got enough credentials to complain for sure. It's supposed to be the Pro Wakeboard Tour, not the "John Doe can't get his wake dialed right tour"
The problem you have is not all wakes are alike and not all riders like the same wake. These tour events are for fun and shows a rider's talent but when you see a rider outside of the tour, on a familiar was wake, they always seem to ride better.
Old     (hotrod508)      Join Date: Oct 2013       07-16-2014, 7:04 PM Reply   
Fascinating stuff, especially the different water different loads stuff.....knew it was the same for shallow vs deep, never heard the water one....someone who rides all over should chime in on fresh vs salt vs gravel pit? Or some other scenario that I haven't thought of.
Old    Scotty Mo (AlbertaSurfer)      Join Date: May 2014       07-16-2014, 8:33 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by dezul View Post
The problem you have is not all wakes are alike and not all riders like the same wake. These tour events are for fun and shows a rider's talent but when you see a rider outside of the tour, on a familiar was wake, they always seem to ride better.
I get that, but the boat is a brand new XStar. It's MasterCraft's flagship wakeboard tug. It should produce a wake well within the standards of the tour riders preference no? It's not like they pull with a Moomba Mondo and the riders are complaining they can't use their own G23 instead.

The XStar produces a wake that a contest can be standardized on for sure. Towing 15 different boats with different tweaks to a tour stop isn't even feasable, nevermind an even playing field...
Old    Tim (dezul)      Join Date: Jul 2012       07-17-2014, 6:03 AM Reply   
These are some pictures of the video posted on the front page. The wake looks like it lips over and starts to wash. I don't see how the PWT riders could enjoy the "premium wake" behind the xstar.
Attached Images
  
Old    Connor (iShredSAN)      Join Date: Apr 2012       07-17-2014, 6:29 AM Reply   
http://www.wakeboardingmag.com/video...winning-run-2/

Watch his run and be the judge. Doesn't look amazing to me at all (the wake that is, riding is awesome)...
Old    Tom (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       07-17-2014, 7:28 AM Reply   
Phil was clearly blasting through white wash several times. Looked like at some points the weight in the boat could have been uneven. Most of his switch toeside hits on the port side were clean. He had a healside hit on the port side that looked like a big crash-through though.

Of course, a lot comes down to how many people are in the boat, where they are sitting at that time, wind conditions, speed and rope length, etc...

I am sure that there is a recipe that most people can find, where the X-Star is a big clean wake, just doesn't seem that the way they set it up for PWT works for Phil.

It was clean for Harley when he laid down his winning run at Stop 1, http://www.wakeboardingmag.com/video...1-winning-run/

Last edited by boardjnky4; 07-17-2014 at 7:32 AM.
Old    Scotty Mo (AlbertaSurfer)      Join Date: May 2014       07-17-2014, 7:42 AM Reply   
Tim, you and I are making the same point. The wake isn't near what it's supposed to be. That boat is definitely capable of a clean, big wake, and Soven had a right to complain that it was garbage. Hell, my 205v XStar has a better wake than that.

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