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Old    Ben (soundbox)      Join Date: Oct 2007       05-25-2012, 1:02 PM Reply   
Thought you guys would like the details on the new Sinister Series:

"Wet Sounds Sinister series of marine amplifiers represent the pinnacle in 12 volt amplifier design. The highest power to size amplifiers anywhere in the world for car or marine use. Utilizing advanced full range class D power supplies with a patent pending transformer design to deliver power output formerly unheard of in a small sized sealed amplifier. The Sinister amplifiers share one size full cast aluminum chassis for all models making installation a breeze and the ability to have a clean install. All Sinister amplifiers feature a fully conformal coated 4 layer pcb board, single side power, speaker and input section, and top mounted controls with removable cover. Sinister amplifiers have a back lit Wet Sounds shield logo with selectable illumination for red, white or blue that can be mounted horizontally or vertically for flexible amplifier placement. Other features include high pass/low pass/full range crossovers, flexible inputs source selection for single or multiple RCA channel input, RCA pass through on 4ch and 2ch, and removable speaker plugs that accept large gauge wire. The Sinister amplifiers are not only extremely powerful but also intelligent with a built in microprocessor controller for overvoltage protection, under voltage protection, DC offset and speaker short protection, as well as thermal rollback to ensure consistent play in the harsh marine environment. One of the most amazing aspects of the Sinister amplifiers design is the efficiency rating. All sinister amplifiers achieve their efficiency rating at full 4 ohm rated power, the 6 ch is 82%, the 4ch is 84% and the 2 ch is 86%. This translates into less current draw and less generated heat. Over twice that of a conventional class AB amplifier and more efficiency than any other Class D amplifier."

SD6:
Stereo @ 4 ohms 6 x 185 Watts
Stereo @ 2 ohms 6 x 290 Watts
Bridged @ 4 ohms 3 x 585 Watts

SD4:
Stereo @ 4 ohms 4 x 185 Watts
Stereo @ 2 ohms 4 x 340 Watts
Bridged @ 4 ohms 2 x 685 Watts

SD2:
Stereo @ 4 ohms 2 x 400 Watts
Stereo @ 2 ohms 2 x 620 Watts
Bridged @ 4 ohms 1 x 1250 Watts
Old    Timmy! (timmyb)      Join Date: Apr 2007       05-25-2012, 1:10 PM Reply   
That's a LOT of power!
Old    Brett Yates (polarbill)      Join Date: Jun 2003       05-25-2012, 1:44 PM Reply   
Dang, could you run a full interior, tower and sub setup all on the SD6? 2 channels in 2ohm running the 4 interiors at 145 watts a speaker, 2 channels in 2 ohm running 4 towers at 145 watts a channel and 2 channels at 2ohms running a sub at 580 watts? If so that is sick. I would love the idea of one amp to run everything. Might not be the loudest but should be really, really loud and clean for one amp.

A question. On the setup I mentioned could you run 4 of the channels at 2ohm and then the 5th and 6th channels at 4 ohm bridged if you only had a single 4 ohm VC sub? How much is that SD6 going to cost? $1500 or something.
Old    Shawndoggy (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       05-25-2012, 1:50 PM Reply   
SD2 specs look suspiciously close to the arc ks600.2....? But says class d. Hmmmmmmm.
Old    Earmark Marine (david_e_m)      Join Date: Jul 2008       05-25-2012, 2:16 PM Reply   
No correlation to any Arc Audio product or any Class G/H product. Certainly huge Class D power but there are not many Class AB products that are even in this power bracket.
Here is something that the specs alone do not explain but consider this. Take a meter and test the voltage drop at the typical larger AB amplifier primary terminals when played agrressively. It will be a substantial voltage drop. Now consider the power reduction in an unregulated amplifier with the voltage sag. A two volt sag can easily translate to a 20 percent drop in output power. A self-feeding negative cycle. Now do the same with a Class D amplifier that is at least 60 percent more efficient. Far less voltage sag at the same draw. Less voltage sag, more power! Now, that's positive progress. So in many real world cases the power difference will be far more than the specs would imply. Think these new amplifiers will sound noticably more dynamic? I'll bet on it.
Consider that Krell and Mark Levinson have adopted fullrange switching amplifiers in home amplifiers now. Absolute Sound just featured a roundtable discussion about fullrange Class D which included many of the top (and most conservative) esoteric amplifier designers over the past several decades.
It's time to get past the same old AB technology from 1975. It's a new century.

David
Earmark Marine
Old    Tim White (wetsounds1)      Join Date: Jan 2006       05-25-2012, 3:00 PM Reply   
Secrets out! The sinister amps have been 2 1/2 years in the making. They are a complete ground up design and unlike any amplifier on the market and unlike any amplifier to date. (shawn the arc ks600.2 is a class G/H. Sinister amps are full range class D, they do not share anything with another amp anywhere in the world)

We set out to build not only the most power output, but high power with high end sound quality, small form factor (13.5x9.8x2.5), completely sealed design, extreme efficiency, flexibility, easy installation and set up etc..All amps are the same footprint so makes for a clean amp rack. All amps can be mounted horizontal or vertical as the bakc lit badge un screws and will bolt in either orientation, single side connections, top mounted crossover controls. Side panels that are raised so center of the amp is spaced off allowing the amp to stay cooler and also so you can run wire under it and not have to put rubber spacers or make feet. Plus they are true marine and fully coated boards. The boards are 4 layer boards! Other cool things for the gadget guys is the patent pending transformer design. When we first started designing this amp. The output devices were not causing the heat but the power transformer was, as this is a lot of power in a small size amp. And completely sealed. So the transformer is now woven in a way that increases it’s efficiency so it can create the power but not the heat. Resulting in an increase in overall efficiency on the amplifier. We also take it a step rather and through bolt the transformer to a backing plate into the amp chassis so the amplifier heat sinks works to cool not only the output devices but the transformer as well.

I could go on and on about them! Costs will be in the $1000 to $1200 range

Brett, yes you can run the amp just about anyway you can think of. On the 6 ch, so yes on The way you described with 2 pairs of in boats on chs 1-2, 2 pairs of towers on 3-4 and sub bridged on 5-6. But what is even cooler, you could run 3 or 4 pairs of coaxs on chs 1-2. So don’t limit it to thinking just two pairs. If you series the back two pair and then paralleled the bow together. You would still net out over 50 watts to each coax. I normally don’t like mixing series and parallel as the amplifier splits its power across so many speakers but with the Sinister having so much power, you can do it and still have really good power. You could run the REV 3-Some in 3 ch mode. You could run 3 subs. A pair of REV 410 and a sub. On the 4 ch, tons of power to in boats. Bridged on the REV 410!! Couple subs. 4 REV 8 or ICON 8. On the 2 ch, pair or two pairs of REV 10. XXX sub at 4 ohm mono. And so on.

I will get some pictures up when we can and update on availability. It will be about 60 days or more. Speaking of amplifiers and full range class D. We also have the Hydro Tech amplifiers shipping in about a week. These are all really cool and stuffed with fun tech stuff too. They are too a ground up design. The HT-6 is 110x6, HT-4 is 110x4, HT-2 is 165x2 and HT-1 is a 600x1 mono block. The multi channel amps are also full range class D. They are in the $400 to $550 range. Fully sealed, rubber gasket crossover controls, end cap covers, snap on feet to raise the amps up, horizontal or vertical placement with back lit badge orientation, full conformal coated pcb, removable speaker plugs and power plugs, accent pieces that you could paint with the end caps too, and small size and footprint. You can see pics of these on our main page of our site on the top graphic.

Feel free to hit me up with any questions on the tech.

Tim
Wet Sounds
Old    John Bauer (jonyb)      Join Date: Nov 2008       05-25-2012, 3:00 PM Reply   
Will these be replacing the Syndicate series? They've already discontinued the Syn1 at peak stereo season, with no replacement.
Old    Tim White (wetsounds1)      Join Date: Jan 2006       05-25-2012, 3:09 PM Reply   
john,

NO. we will still have the Syndicate series. Syn-2, SYN-4 and SYN-6. The main use on the SYN-1 was on a XXX. And with the redeisgn of the XXX and new XXX hitting soon and the Sinister amps hitting soon. Didnt make much since to build more SYN-1 right now. as the Sinister SD2 will do 1250x1 at 4 ohms. And for other subs, we have the HT-1. And of course the SYN-2 is a great sub amp at 700x1.

Tim
Wet Sounds
Old    Cobra Rob (CobraRob)      Join Date: Aug 2010       05-25-2012, 7:23 PM Reply   
Well I will be the first to ask.

Should I be thinking 2 SD2s to go with the pair for REV410s instead of a pair or SYN-2?

Sounds like the price and wait may not be worth it though.. a
Old    Jon Hunter (hunter660)      Join Date: Aug 2007       05-25-2012, 8:24 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by CobraRob View Post
Well I will be the first to ask.

Should I be thinking 2 SD2s to go with the pair for REV410s instead of a pair or SYN-2?

Sounds like the price and wait may not be worth it though.. a
A single SD4 looks like it would be a better option to me.
Old    Murphy Smith (murphy_smith)      Join Date: Dec 2005       05-26-2012, 8:04 AM Reply   
Wow - these look great and I can't wait to see some pictures. Congrats to the guys at Wet Sounds....always pushing the envelope!!!!
Old    Harold Hemming (h20king)      Join Date: Dec 2009       05-26-2012, 8:54 AM Reply   
I am so glad I did not run out and buy new amps to power my REV 410's. Looks like it will be an SD4 for me. Any word on a release date?? guess ill just run my KS 300.4 for power until I can get my hands on one of these. Using a single amp for power will sure make things easier.It will just be a plug and play install so I wont have to re do my system.
Old    Tallredrider (talltigeguy)      Join Date: Sep 2003       05-26-2012, 3:59 PM Reply   
I wondered when someone would catch up to Kicker and put the freaking controls in a place where I can see and adjust them. Good job Wetsounds!!!! Anyone who has crawled inside a small boat compartment and tried to manipulate the gain and crossover settings knows exactly what I mean.
Old    Cobra Rob (CobraRob)      Join Date: Aug 2010       05-27-2012, 1:36 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by hunter660 View Post
A single SD4 looks like it would be a better option to me.
These systems are all overkill so I figured lets take it to the max. But if they are going to be in the $1k range another $2k on amp power is not going probably work out. That's another $1k that can go into batteries and gas.

I wish I could justify replacing the RF Power 600.4 amps for the mains but just seems like that might have to wait another season or 2.
Old    John Bauer (jonyb)      Join Date: Nov 2008       05-27-2012, 7:29 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wetsounds1 View Post
john,

NO. we will still have the Syndicate series. Syn-2, SYN-4 and SYN-6. The main use on the SYN-1 was on a XXX. And with the redeisgn of the XXX and new XXX hitting soon and the Sinister amps hitting soon. Didnt make much since to build more SYN-1 right now. as the Sinister SD2 will do 1250x1 at 4 ohms. And for other subs, we have the HT-1. And of course the SYN-2 is a great sub amp at 700x1.

Tim
Wet Sounds
Are the Sinister amps going to match the Syndicate's? If not, it won't be good. Most of my customers want their amps to match and most won't have a budget to go with all Sinister's. I've had to install other brands of amps in the last 3 of my customers boats due to the Syn1 situation
Old    Benjamin (bendow)      Join Date: Sep 2005       05-27-2012, 9:00 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by soundbox View Post
"\more efficiency than any other Class D amplifier."
Is this true?
Old    TJ (Houstonshark)      Join Date: Jan 2011       05-27-2012, 10:22 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by jonyb View Post
Are the Sinister amps going to match the Syndicate's? If not, it won't be good. Most of my customers want their amps to match and most won't have a budget to go with all Sinister's. I've had to install other brands of amps in the last 3 of my customers boats due to the Syn1 situation
No they don't. Completely different design. Much cleaner IMO. From a design standpoint, they are probably one of the cleanest amps out there.

Does anyone who has different amp tiers or series make them all look the same?
Old    John Bauer (jonyb)      Join Date: Nov 2008       05-28-2012, 6:09 AM Reply   
All the Syn series looked the same, now there won't be a sub amp in that line to match the rest of them.
Old    Hate N Pain (hatepain)      Join Date: Aug 2006       05-28-2012, 10:44 AM Reply   
Seems like an odd choice to me to stop making the SYN1 since it has been such a popular amp.
Old    John Bauer (jonyb)      Join Date: Nov 2008       05-28-2012, 11:49 AM Reply   
Exactly my point. Also an odd choice to quit building the XXX during peak sales season without an immediate replacement. To me that knocked them out of the big sub game completely until the replacements are out, which is unknown depending on which salesman you talk to.
Old    jkw (lakesurfer)      Join Date: Jul 2009       05-28-2012, 12:20 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by jonyb View Post
Exactly my point. Also an odd choice to quit building the XXX during peak sales season without an immediate replacement. To me that knocked them out of the big sub game completely until the replacements are out, which is unknown depending on which salesman you talk to.

My guess is that it was the new sub was originally suppose to be available to the market by now and WS has had some delay issues. I can imagine WS being very happy about not having any XXX for boat installs this year.
Old    Earmark Marine (david_e_m)      Join Date: Jul 2008       05-28-2012, 1:26 PM Reply   
Don't forget about the Syn2 as a subwoofer amplifier. That's 700 watts. The RMS rating on the previous XXX was 750 watts. As a power ratio the jump from a bridged Syn2 at 700 watts into a 4-ohm load and a Syn1 driving 1000 watts into a 1-ohm load isn't that overwhelming. If the new XXX gets a 1 dB boost in efficiency then that really helps a Syn2/XXX combo. So I'd wait and see how the revised XXX plays out.

David
Earmark Marine
Old    John Bauer (jonyb)      Join Date: Nov 2008       05-28-2012, 3:15 PM Reply   
I sure hope it does David. I have complete faith in Wet Sounds and their new line, but it's frustrating for this to all happen at this time of the year. This is my busiest time of the year for boats and I try to outfit every single one with Wet Sounds products. Have had to use a DD3512's in the last few.

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