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Old     (jason_ssr)      Join Date: Apr 2001       07-08-2010, 3:54 PM Reply   
If you could only own one firearm to do all the things you want one to do, what would it be? That was the question I had to answer, as some of you may remember. I mainly wanted a gun that I could have fun plinking with, shoot some hogs, and if I had to, defend my house. I thought about a nice long bolt gun. Great for hunting, but I dont think I would have as much fun plinking nor would it be good in defense. I thought about an AR which would be fun to plink with and a short one would be servicable at home if need be. However, the 5.56 is a little light for shooting any animal of size. I thought about a pistol calibur carbine, which would be decent at everything except hunting. I decided on the Keltec RFB. Shorter than an short AR, still has 18" barrel and shoots 7.62NATO.

Short enough not to be clumsy indoors. Long enough barrel to be accurate at distance. Big enough calibur to hunt with. Fun to shoot at the range or plinking out on ranch land.
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Old     (dtrain125)      Join Date: Feb 2006       07-08-2010, 9:00 PM Reply   
Nice. FAL mags? What did you have give for it?
Old     (stu929)      Join Date: Jun 2010       07-08-2010, 9:40 PM Reply   
AR in 6.8 would be a good choice. Like yours as well though!
Old     (jason_ssr)      Join Date: Apr 2001       07-09-2010, 6:29 AM Reply   
Yep, metric FAL mags; easy to find. There are less than 500 in the wild right now, so they are going at a premium on GB for $1700-$2000. I paid a couple hundred less than that. MSRP is $1880 but as soon as they ramp up production and get more out there, I bet you will be able to get em for $1350-$1500 easy.

I did look hard a 6.8 but rounds are not as easy to find around here as 7.62/.308, and what I did find was slightly more expensive. I also really dig the whole bullpup concept and nobody makes one in 6.8 yet. If there was an AUG out there in 6.8 it would have been a tough call.
Old     (stu929)      Join Date: Jun 2010       07-09-2010, 6:41 AM Reply   
Very nice Jason hope you enjoy it!
Old     (wakeboardingdad)      Join Date: Aug 2008       07-09-2010, 6:41 AM Reply   
Nice HD choice! Stop the threat before it's a threat, I always say!
Old     (chris4x4gill2)      Join Date: Sep 2009       07-09-2010, 8:16 AM Reply   
excellent addition. About the only thing it wouldnt do well would be birds, wich when I first read the question had me thinking of a shotgun with multiple barrels (smoothbore, rifled for slugs, interchangable choke, )
Old     (sangerlover)      Join Date: Sep 2005       07-09-2010, 8:30 AM Reply   
Very nice Jason. I just picked up an M4 Carbine in .223/ 5.56. I can actually still afford ammo in .223 / 5.56
Old     (stu929)      Join Date: Jun 2010       07-09-2010, 9:35 AM Reply   
For anyone considering an M4gery..... Building one either from scratch or for kits that you can order is actually quite a bit of fun and you learn a lot about the weapon...Speaking from experience
Old     (jason_ssr)      Join Date: Apr 2001       07-09-2010, 1:16 PM Reply   
Yeah, M4 is really the smartest choice, as parts will always be readily available.
Old     (jason_ssr)      Join Date: Apr 2001       07-09-2010, 1:18 PM Reply   
Yeah, this is my first experience with Eotech and I have to say I'm impressed!
Old    deltahoosier            07-09-2010, 2:18 PM Reply   
I would be interested in how the bullpup design works. Nice thing about the AR series, is the recoil spring goes directly back into your shoulder. I have held your weapon before and the design takes a little to get used to. It seems nose lite. Not sure if that 308 is going to beat you up or not. I would love to build a AR10 (7.62).
Old     (jason_ssr)      Join Date: Apr 2001       07-09-2010, 5:09 PM Reply   
They are actually really cool! They are much more balanced than a traditional config. However most of us are accustom to shooting nose-heavy, so an AR or FAL feels more like what we are used to. Doesn't take long to get used to the balance. Recoil is not as light as a 5.56. You still know your shooting 7.62, but not as much as an M1A.

Bullpup's have traditionally had two things against them, training and trigger. Alot of people who shoot alot or for a living dont want to relearn decades of muscle memory, and rightfully so. Obviously with the firing mechanism being moved so far from the handle, the triggers are sloppy connecting back. Keltec re-thought the trigger design and left the trigger assembly intact in the traditional spot. Got rid of the slop.
Old    deltahoosier            07-09-2010, 7:41 PM Reply   
Cool. Of course here in Cali, the choices are more limited on rifles. They have your rifle down in Tracy (at least the 5.56) at a new gun store for the locals to the bay area. Does that rifle have a chrome lined barrel? Can you change trigger kits easily?
Old     (sangerlover)      Join Date: Sep 2005       07-09-2010, 8:06 PM Reply   
I am debating with myself on scopes right now. I want some good magnification but on the other hand , I do like the Red Dots. Seems like with the M4 carbine the smaller red dots fill the space much better. I figure if I want to shoot long I would just use one of my other long guns with good down range scopes.
Old     (stu929)      Join Date: Jun 2010       07-09-2010, 8:20 PM Reply   
you can find acogs every once in a while for a good deal what would you be using the rifle for JTW?
Old     (sangerlover)      Join Date: Sep 2005       07-09-2010, 8:34 PM Reply   
The M4 is just a toy for me. My handguns and long guns have more use to me but so far the M4 has just seen the 100 yd range and hopefully some varmits soon .
Old     (stu929)      Join Date: Jun 2010       07-09-2010, 9:55 PM Reply   
M4 great for home defense as well!
Old     (jason_ssr)      Join Date: Apr 2001       07-10-2010, 6:31 AM Reply   
Yeah, it's a chrome lined barrel. Currently the RFB is only available in 7.62 but other cal are rumored to be coming down the pipe. Removing the trigger assembly is easy so I would assume changing one out wouldn't be a problem.

My reasoning for the Eotech EXPS was that my primary usages will be 100yds and in with quick aquisition being a plus. However if I do want to stretch her legs they make flip magnifiers for it for 4X power. Anything longer than that and I would need a proper scope anyway.

My wife, who has forbid guns since the beginning, approached me about allowing me to own ONE gun. Typically they don't care until a child is born, then they want you to get rid of them. Mine didn't want any until the child was born. I guess in her eyes the home now had precious cargo worth protecting. Add the current concerns about economy and government and she was on board for one firearm. If I was given permission for an arsenal, there are better choices for home defense, hunting, and plinking individually. However for one gun that can do all of them serviceably, the RFB is a solid choice.
Old     (sangerlover)      Join Date: Sep 2005       07-10-2010, 6:42 AM Reply   
Owning 1 gun is NOT possible. You will be back with another soon.
Old     (jason_ssr)      Join Date: Apr 2001       07-10-2010, 6:59 AM Reply   
Oh I know! I grew up shooting. Hopefully an example of safety, security, and responsibility will make her more comfy. She actually wanted a shotgun (since all she really cared about was HD) so she isn't thrilled with my choice. Nor is she happy with all the nickel and dime stuff after the initial gun purchase (case, optics, cleaning supplies, cases of ammo, etc). About to hit her up for a small safe (Which will also facilitate future purchases). So, it may be a while, lol.
Old    deltahoosier            07-10-2010, 8:49 AM Reply   
Should have to a 5.56. That way she could shoot with comfort and learn to enjoy shooting as much as the rest of us. I know my girls got a huge smile when they got to shoot the AR.
Old     (jason_ssr)      Join Date: Apr 2001       07-10-2010, 9:01 AM Reply   
...or creates a necessity to get a smaller cal for her! I was thinking of a PS90. Only thing is the 5.7 rounds are kind of boutique. Pretty easy to get now, but wouldn't really be much good if things got tough in the ammo world. Probably more my bias for wanting something fun, but oh well. From here on out I'm just letting the game come to me. I got what I need.
Old     (sangerlover)      Join Date: Sep 2005       07-10-2010, 4:01 PM Reply   
my kids shoot all calibers when at the range but the .223 and .243 are the most enjoyable to them. The .243 is not a popular round so they are a bit more pricey.
Old     (mendo247)      Join Date: Mar 2005       07-10-2010, 8:55 PM Reply   
Nice!! Always wanted to play with one of those. Now you just need to convince her that she was right and a shotgun is what you need for home defense!! Mention how that rifle round puts the rest of the family and your neighbors in harms way when you start poppin off rounds chasing a would be intruder through the house lol
Old     (stu929)      Join Date: Jun 2010       07-10-2010, 8:57 PM Reply   
I'm still sticking with my statement M4 great weapon for home defense!
Old     (mendo247)      Join Date: Mar 2005       07-12-2010, 4:20 PM Reply   
Why is the M4 so good for home defense? Say vs. a shotgun?
Old     (alanp)      Join Date: Apr 2001       07-12-2010, 5:26 PM Reply   
shotgun is perfect for home defense.

the lwrc is what i shoot when i need to reach somthing at distance. i shoot the 16in barrel regularly but i should be getting a 12in shortly to be used in specific applications.

for those of you that do a bit of shooting i would highly recommend getting a chrono and ballistics calculator. takes all the guess work out of your scope and makes getting a baseline DOPE much easier.

i also shoot a lwrc m6 i havent been too happy with the m6 tho. here is the repr.
Old     (stu929)      Join Date: Jun 2010       07-12-2010, 5:53 PM Reply   
The .223 round is a good defense round it will do plenty of damage against a soft target but will not travel through multiple walls and hit a neighbor/family member. Also it will not have the deflection tendencies of a shotgun within a house, bird shot you have to be conscious of what is around you you could hit or could deflect the pellets. If you go with buck shot or slut you have to worry about over penetration. That can also be said about handguns while the most convenient to use in a house in confined spaces a pistol round will plow through drywall with ease. Also minimum legal length for a shot gun is 18inches plus you have the longer stock to account for. The M4 has a collapsible stock which not only makes it more compact but also will allow it to fit smaller users for example my wife and kids. Yes I know there are scatter guns that have this now too most do not though. Not saying a shotgun is a terrible choice just not my first choice.

Probably my biggest reason for saying this is it is a very easily modifiable system that can fit anyone from a 6 year old to a 60 y/o. And it is a very comfortable round to shoot. While not as economical as it once was it is still fairly affordable as well. Now why is this important? If someone is afraid of a weapon how likely are they to practice with it or get comfortable with it? Probably not very much. Does that mean that if all I had was a shotgun and my wife had to pick it up to defend herself I would say no I hope she doesn't of course not but in a fight or flight situation I want as few things to go wrong as possible and if I'm not there to be looking down the sights I want whoever is to be comfortable with what they are carrying.

Plus there are a number a ways to mount lights and other accessories to AR's that can aid in low light situations. These have become more available for other types of weapons as well mainly handguns.

Just my opinion but most people do not even consider it and it is a very capable option. IMHO
Old     (jason_ssr)      Join Date: Apr 2001       07-12-2010, 6:05 PM Reply   
Nice!!! Is that similar to the AR-10 SuperSASS? That thing looks mean! Tell me more about the chrono and ballistics calc. This RFB is unique in that it has an 18" barrel but only 27" overall length; sorta long and short at the same time.
Old     (mendo247)      Join Date: Mar 2005       07-12-2010, 6:12 PM Reply   
Its very capable but IMO (and most others) a Shotgun is your best defense. But then again its what ever you feel comfortable with.


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