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Old    Sam Ingram (wakeboardsam)      Join Date: Jun 2008       01-04-2010, 1:21 PM Reply   
Awesome picture!
Upload
Old    Paul (psudy)      Join Date: Dec 2003       01-04-2010, 1:57 PM Reply   
On a side note, what exactly does it tell the Afgans when they see our troops flying a flag other than the American flag?
Old    Big D (bigdtx)      Join Date: Feb 2005       01-04-2010, 2:10 PM Reply   
If we put 1/10th the money & effort into enforcing all the laws and crap we already have in place we wouldn't have to be in Afghanistan in the first place. We have a entire friggin' department of homeland security but they can't keep a known terrorist off a commercial flight out of Amsterdam. Pretty pathetic.
Old    Sam Ingram (wakeboardsam)      Join Date: Jun 2008       01-04-2010, 2:22 PM Reply   

quote:

By Paul (psudy) on Monday, January 04, 2010 - 1:57 pm:
On a side note, what exactly does it tell the Afgans when they see our troops flying a flag other than the American flag?




IMO, I don't think any flag is more American than the 3% flag except maybe the Gadsden_flag!

I can also assure you that the guys flying the 3% flag don't want to be in there anymore than the second poster...
Old    John Anderson (fly135)      Join Date: Jun 2004       01-04-2010, 2:25 PM Reply   
$1 Million per troop per year. If we never invaded Iraq I bet we would have already figured out what to do with Afghanistan by now.
Old    Jeff Baker (innov8)      Join Date: May 2005       01-04-2010, 2:36 PM Reply   
That pic is Awesome!!
Old    Paul Bernier (wakeriderixi)      Join Date: Jan 2004       01-04-2010, 2:46 PM Reply   
OH-58D Kiowa Warrior. My dad used to fly those helicopters. Pretty sweet looking!
Old    Paul Bernier (wakeriderixi)      Join Date: Jan 2004       01-04-2010, 2:48 PM Reply   
Someone explain this 3% thing to me. I read the post but am still a little confused about how it relates to the picture above.
Old    Sam Ingram (wakeboardsam)      Join Date: Jun 2008       01-04-2010, 2:48 PM Reply   
The original picture is even better! I cropped it so that I could post here...
Old    David Williams (wakeworld)      Join Date: Jan 1997       01-04-2010, 4:12 PM Reply   
Here are a couple more badass shots from Afghanistan...

Upload
Upload
Old    Sam Ingram (wakeboardsam)      Join Date: Jun 2008       01-04-2010, 4:56 PM Reply   
Paul,
Do a search in google for three percenter or follow the above link to the Sipsey Street blog post...

The flag being flown outside the helicopter is the Nyberg Battle Flag which has the "threeper" logo on it.
Old    A-dub (behindtheboat)      Join Date: Aug 2006       01-04-2010, 5:16 PM Reply   
ahhh it's in the green print along the right side. I was google-ing the crud out of 3% Flag and didn't get much
Old    Sam Ingram (wakeboardsam)      Join Date: Jun 2008       01-04-2010, 6:40 PM Reply   
If you watch the news footage of pretty much any tea party or political demonstration you will see the 3% flag flying.
Old     (fogey)      Join Date: Mar 2002       01-04-2010, 7:39 PM Reply   
I support citizens' right to keep arms and to defend themselves. However, as a career Army officer, I know that my oath to defend the Constitution does NOT include the right to decide what laws I'll obey, or to honor only constitutional concepts I agree with.

If ordered liberty is the goal, this is really scarey stuff:

"The Doctrine of the Three Percent.
We will not disarm.
You cannot convince us. [Of what, one wonders?]
You cannot intimidate us.
You can try to kill us, if you think you can.
But remember, we'll shoot back.
And we are not going away.
Your move."

That's a credo written for alienated losers, for anarchists, for outlaw paramilitary organizations spoiling for a fight. The Ku Klux Klan would be proud to join up.

Now, I'm not saying that all who claim to be Three Percenters fit into these categories. But honorable men and women ought to carefully consider what this is all about. And in that regard, here's the kicker at the end of the statement of principles:

"As things begin to spin out of control, remember this: 'All politics in this country now is just dress rehearsal for civil war.' -- Billy Beck, August 2009."

Civil war? That's what Three Percenters are spoiling for? That's not defending the Constitution, it's trashing it.

The idea of someone flying the banner of an organization with these principles from a U.S. military aircraft is repulsive. It is a violation of the professionalism that makes the U.S. military the best in the world.
Old    wickedwakes (sjmedic)      Join Date: May 2004       01-05-2010, 6:33 AM Reply   
"However, as a career Army officer, I know that my oath to defend the Constitution does NOT include the right to decide what laws I'll obey, or to honor only constitutional concepts I agree with".

Which, in 1776 makes you a Redcoat....

"That's a credo written for alienated losers, for anarchists, for outlaw paramilitary organizations spoiling for a fight"


Which, in 1776 makes you a Loyalist or "Tory"..

I think that this is an attempted display of Patriotism, however misguided, in order to bring back some pride in our country and its past history of overcoming the rule of tyrants and usurpers. I believe it is to give hope to those countries facing the same challenges as we have in the past, and to show what is possible when a few well-armed militia men, backed by supporting countries.
I might be wrong, but I think that is the gist of the photo and premise of the 3% crowd.
Old    Sam Ingram (wakeboardsam)      Join Date: Jun 2008       01-05-2010, 8:08 AM Reply   
LOL!

I wonder you what guys think about Oathkeepers...

BTW, if you think we are following the Constitution as it was intended to be followed as set forth in the writings of its authors you are delusional. I suppose the founding fathers intended Interpol to have complete immunity from US Law, while acting within the US boarders...

Also, at least one of the quotes that you took comes directly from a fictional work that the author of that blog is writing called Absolved.

If you do a littler research on the author of the Sipsey Street blog you will find some interesting facts...

I hope this picture makes you mad too!

Upload

Hey, I got my name mentioned on the Sipsey Street site...
Old     (fogey)      Join Date: Mar 2002       01-05-2010, 9:21 AM Reply   
sjmedic, I'm sorry about your deficits in reading comprehension.

Sam, the pic doesn't make me mad. However, if that troop were in my unit, we'd be having a little chat about AR 670-1 and particularly para. 1-4a.

The last thing this country needs is a military comprised of undisciplined soldiers who feel they can violate orders and oaths whenever they feel like it. I saw that in the 70's, and it wasn't pretty.
Old    Jim Young (jyoungusa)      Join Date: Sep 2009       01-05-2010, 9:39 AM Reply   
I agree as a recently retired Army Officer, I to have a problem with soldiers displaying or wearing this stuff - they took an oath which says that they will follow the orders of the President, regulations and the UCMJ -
"I, _____, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God." (This is the enlisted oath) Does not say when they feel like it or only for specific reasons. If you want to be a 3 percenter then find a state with state militia and join that just don't call yourself a Soldier
Old    Paul (psudy)      Join Date: Dec 2003       01-05-2010, 9:44 AM Reply   
sometimes I am glad I can't see youtube at work.
Old    Sam Ingram (wakeboardsam)      Join Date: Jun 2008       01-05-2010, 9:47 AM Reply   

quote:

By Jim (jyoungusa) on Tuesday, January 05, 2010 - 9:39 am:
I agree as a recently retired Army Officer, I to have a problem with soldiers displaying or wearing this stuff - they took an oath which says that they will follow the orders of the President, regulations and the UCMJ




Keeping the Oath!

BTW, I have one son at Annapolis and another at Bragg.
Old    Jim Young (jyoungusa)      Join Date: Sep 2009       01-05-2010, 10:54 AM Reply   
Do they wear this stuff on their uniform? Are they committed to following the orders of the President, obeying the regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. Many don't realize that when you put on the uniform of the United States, you give up certain rights that civilians enjoy - one being free speech.
Old    Manzo (zo1)      Join Date: Aug 2002       01-05-2010, 11:03 AM Reply   
I would not be that suprised to find that the pics you are seeing are actually contractors et al and not active duty servicemen.

Thx for your service Jim and Sam's kids...
Old    Jim Young (jyoungusa)      Join Date: Sep 2009       01-05-2010, 11:06 AM Reply   
Manzo, thanks and you are probably right...
Old    wickedwakes (sjmedic)      Join Date: May 2004       01-05-2010, 11:15 AM Reply   
Deficits in reading comprehension? I even copied and quoted what you said AFTER I read it. I comprehend my American History just fine Commander.
Old    Sam Ingram (wakeboardsam)      Join Date: Jun 2008       01-05-2010, 12:05 PM Reply   

quote:

By wickedwakes (sjmedic) on Tuesday, January 05, 2010 - 11:15 am:
Deficits in reading comprehension? I even copied and quoted what you said AFTER I read it. I comprehend my American History just fine Commander.




Wicked,
You know as well as I do, that you are not suppose to know that stuff. Above all else do as you are told, follow orders when given no matter how absurd, and be a good little sheep! Don't question things like Obama giving immunity to Interpol to do anything they please within US boarders, don't question the right of the state to take away your 2nd Amendment right even though it was incorporated by the 14th, don't question why someone chooses to hide his college transcripts and medical records, don't question ANYTHING.

And when the answers start piling up and point to the fact that the Constitution has been usurped in every way don't organize and try to change things back, JUST DO AS YOU ARE TOLD! AND DON'T DO ANYTHING!! We must have order!

Upload


Hey Jeff,
Have you ever heard of the The Good Soldier Schweik??



quote:

By Adolf Hitler (The Fuhrer) on Tuesday, December 12, 1939 - 10:09 am:

How fortunate for governments that the people they administer don't think.


Old    Jim Young (jyoungusa)      Join Date: Sep 2009       01-05-2010, 12:40 PM Reply   
The mechanism for effect change or undoing all that has been done by the administration is by voting out or voting in representatives and senators that represent the views of their constituency not their own personal agenda. I did not vote for the change the been pushed through in the last year, but unless the Pelosi's and Rieds are voted out or dealt with through the electoral process we will be playing pinball bouncing around from one lame idea to the next.
Old    Sam Ingram (wakeboardsam)      Join Date: Jun 2008       01-05-2010, 12:55 PM Reply   

quote:

By Jim (jyoungusa) on Tuesday, January 05, 2010 - 12:40 pm:
The mechanism for effect change or undoing all that has been done by the administration is by voting out or voting in representatives and senators that represent the views of their constituency not their own personal agenda. I did not vote for the change the been pushed through in the last year, but unless the Pelosi's and Rieds are voted out or dealt with through the electoral process we will be playing pinball bouncing around from one lame idea to the next.




Yes, that works well... Let's talk about the Minnesota Senate Race we had the following:

-Electorate manipulation
-Gerrymandering
-Manipulation of demography
-Disenfranchisement
-Intimidation
-Vote buying
-Misinformation
-Misleading or confusing ballot papers
-Ballot stuffing
-Misrecording of votes
-Misuse of proxy votes
-Destruction or invalidation of ballots

Now lets fund Acorn..

Funding for Acorn

Upload
Upload

I think Iran just had an official election too!
Old    Jim Young (jyoungusa)      Join Date: Sep 2009       01-05-2010, 1:25 PM Reply   
Your speaking to the choir on all of this - I didn't say it was going to be easy, I was happy to hear my newly elected governor say that he was opting out of the new healthcare plan (prior to what the senate actually passed) as being too expensive for the State of VA. Would like to know if healthcare reform (I mean Health Insurance Reform) is such a good thing why did 14 Senators make their states exempt from the programs?
Old    Jason (black_ops_09)      Join Date: May 2009       01-05-2010, 3:51 PM Reply   
Because of people like myself and millions like me before, we can have posts like this. Its just to bad that we do!

"All gave some,some gave all!"
Old    Sam Ingram (wakeboardsam)      Join Date: Jun 2008       01-05-2010, 4:01 PM Reply   

quote:

By Jason Ollom (black_ops_09) on Tuesday, January 05, 2010 - 3:51 pm:
Because of people like myself and millions like me before, we can have posts like this. Its just to bad that we do!

"All gave some,some gave all!"




Please explain what you are trying to say...
Old    David Williams (wakeworld)      Join Date: Jan 1997       01-05-2010, 4:17 PM Reply   
^^^Billy Ray Cyrus tune...and a damn good one at that! A tribute to the troops!
Old    Sam Ingram (wakeboardsam)      Join Date: Jun 2008       01-05-2010, 4:42 PM Reply   
I know the song, but I was asking what "Its just to bad that we do!"....
Old    Sam Ingram (wakeboardsam)      Join Date: Jun 2008       01-05-2010, 6:08 PM Reply   
http://bit.ly/6snhGB
Old    wickedwakes (sjmedic)      Join Date: May 2004       01-05-2010, 6:08 PM Reply   
Dont assume you are the only one who served Jason...and dont be so arrogant to think no one else on this board served with distinction, honor and the thought that they were doing the right thing at the time. Besides, the "all gave some, some gave all" quote should be reserved for the NYC Firefighters who climbed the towers before they collapsed. THEY are MY Heroes....not some chest-thumping Military Officers talking the talk and not walking it.
Old     (fogey)      Join Date: Mar 2002       01-05-2010, 6:29 PM Reply   
The only chest-thumping I've seen appears on the Three Percenter site. "You cannot convince us." LOL. And these guys are your heros? Good grief.

"...not walking the walk." Any you know this to be true ..... how, exactly? Oh, wait. Never mind; the answer likely would be another illogical rant.
Old    Sam Ingram (wakeboardsam)      Join Date: Jun 2008       01-05-2010, 6:37 PM Reply   

quote:

By*Jeff (fogey)*on*Tuesday, January 05, 2010 - 6:29 pm: **
The only chest-thumping I've seen appears on the Three Percenter site. "You cannot convince us." LOL. And these guys are your heros? Good grief.

"...not walking the walk." Any you know this to be true ..... how, exactly? Oh, wait. Never mind; the answer likely would be another illogical rant.




who has the deficit in the English language now? What are you trying to say/ask??
*
Old    wickedwakes (sjmedic)      Join Date: May 2004       01-05-2010, 7:09 PM Reply   
"And these guys are your heros? Good grief".
Jeff, I'm sorry about your deficits in reading comprehension. Plus your spelling sux.
Old     (fogey)      Join Date: Mar 2002       01-05-2010, 7:35 PM Reply   
How original.....
Old    Sam Ingram (wakeboardsam)      Join Date: Jun 2008       01-05-2010, 7:58 PM Reply   
When you used it, wicked used it, or when I used it?
Old    wickedwakes (sjmedic)      Join Date: May 2004       01-05-2010, 8:24 PM Reply   
What is original, that you got caught being a hypocrite? No, not real original at all...
Old     (fogey)      Join Date: Mar 2002       01-06-2010, 4:34 AM Reply   
I don't think I'm going to waste time trying explaining logic to folks who proudly proclaim "We cannot be convinced" as they direct people to sites that glorify civil war.

The irony is that we have shared political perspectives. I, too, am very frustrated, concerned, and at times infuriated by what's happening in Washington.

But what I realize is that analogies to 1776 and a call to arms are way off the mark. Unlike the Colonists, we have peaceful means within the structure to remove those who currently are in power. My goal is to be part of the democratic process that's working toward that result.


In the meantime, I hope and pray that our armed forces and our law enforcement personnel do not decide that they have the right to remove government officials who hold office as the result of demoratic elections. That would be an utter disaster.

Edit: last paragraph added.

(Message edited by fogey on January 06, 2010)
Old    Jim Young (jyoungusa)      Join Date: Sep 2009       01-06-2010, 5:40 AM Reply   
From the news reports, at least 4 dem senators have taken themselves out for 2010, unfortunately, with their annoucements, they no longer represent nor answer to the people but their own self interests
Old    Timothy (timmy)      Join Date: Jul 2001       01-06-2010, 7:10 AM Reply   
How can we elect good people, if the only people on the ballot are career politicians?
Old    Jason G (jason_ssr)      Join Date: Apr 2001       01-06-2010, 8:32 AM Reply   
I'm all for kickassity, but Im with Jeff on this one. The founding fathers who wrote that constitution set it up so that the people always had the power. We should take up arms when we no longer have the power to control the government, not just because we are too lazy to excerise that power.

We will not stand up and excerise our democratic power until it starts affecting us on a survival level. Its hard to care about the inefficency and wastefulness of government from the comfort of our homes, in the safety of our neighborhoods, and in the bounty of our lifestyles. The only time we will excercise our right to make drastic changes is when the very foundations of our existence is challenged. We will act when food starts becoming hard to get, and the power grid becomes inconsistent, and transportation becomes difficult. Sure it would be nice to be proactive and avoid the struggles ahead, but we have grown so apathetic in our prosperity that nothing will happen until we are forced off the couch and into the game.
Old    Manzo (zo1)      Join Date: Aug 2002       01-06-2010, 8:53 AM Reply   
I am not so sure that it is only that we are too lazy...

Actually, let me rephrase that. Most are too lazy at this point, BUT I also feel that we are so far down the path of political corruption and greed that it will be very hard to change the direction of the country/world without massive crisis.
Old    John Anderson (fly135)      Join Date: Jun 2004       01-06-2010, 9:17 AM Reply   
We are divided in our viewpoints as a nation. There is still a rule of law and the people are being represented. The people are not against the govt as much as they are against each other.

Out of 280 yes votes for the healthcare reform bills in the House and Senate only one was a Republican. That should demonstrate how sharply divided we are as a nation.
Old    Paul (psudy)      Join Date: Dec 2003       01-06-2010, 10:23 AM Reply   
One bad apple spoils the bunch.
Old    Sam Ingram (wakeboardsam)      Join Date: Jun 2008       01-06-2010, 10:45 AM Reply   
Actually Joseph Cao has said that he will not vote for the healthcare bill again if it funds abortion which the senate version does...

The problem with the current "system" is that no one is actually following what the constitution says, instead they have lawyers who twist the language into whatever they want. Many organizations, as a result, have started to pop-up like Oathkeepers and the 3 Percenters..
Old    John Anderson (fly135)      Join Date: Jun 2004       01-06-2010, 12:29 PM Reply   
The Constitution is like the Bible. Everyone knows what they it says, but it says something different to everyone.
Old    Paul (psudy)      Join Date: Dec 2003       01-06-2010, 12:39 PM Reply   
Here is a good quick vid.

http://downloads.cbn.com/cbnnewsplayer/cbnPlayer.swf?aid=11991

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