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Old    scott firman (mucktoerider)      Join Date: Jan 2007       10-09-2009, 9:03 PM Reply   
how do I know this......I am leading the charge. I will keep everyone updated. along side we will have a tow boat course as well. And a nice proshop and snack bar. With a famous pizza Co. to supply some of the grub. Sound interesting. Goal is July 2010
Old    Ray Markham (wakeborder5)      Join Date: Jun 2002       10-09-2009, 9:49 PM Reply   
What side of the state is the proposed park on?
Old    Jim Spearing (spearing)      Join Date: Sep 2005       10-09-2009, 10:15 PM Reply   
iiiiii LIKE it.
Old    scott firman (mucktoerider)      Join Date: Jan 2007       10-10-2009, 7:23 AM Reply   
The cable park will be located not far from Lansing. Nice centrally located spot for all Michiganders. It will be the most modern set up you can find. Plus a new innovation that I am working with Intamin (they build roller coasters) that will get you massive air. We are also working on a heated pond so we can dome it during the winter months. Maybe all this will not happen all at once. But we will continue to shoot big with focus on innovation. stay tuned!
Old    Jeff Baker (innov8)      Join Date: May 2005       10-10-2009, 7:28 AM Reply   
Cool deal, congrats.
Old    Chris Walker (redsupralaunch)      Join Date: Aug 2002       10-10-2009, 8:24 AM Reply   
Rexin?
Old    Chasin7 T (chaser)      Join Date: Sep 2006       10-10-2009, 8:51 AM Reply   
dome and heated pond would be amazing!
Old    Itch (fullonsalesgrp)      Join Date: Jan 2004       10-10-2009, 8:56 AM Reply   
Scott nice to know if you need help from the Battle Creek Crew you know who to count on.
Give me call when you can talk.
Old    Itch (fullonsalesgrp)      Join Date: Jan 2004       10-10-2009, 8:59 AM Reply   
A long skinny winch park or a system 2.0 would be golden and easlier to cover no wake during the winter would not be bad if you can atleast get pulled and hit some sliders !!!
Old    Ben Wilcox (benjaminp)      Join Date: Nov 2008       10-10-2009, 12:25 PM Reply   
A park in Michigan would be awesome, close enough to Canada for me. Winter riding would also be awesome. Would it be a standard cable system for the most part, and will I get lucky with a clockwise turn?
Old    Robot (k9fxr)      Join Date: Jul 2005       10-10-2009, 2:06 PM Reply   
Yup, sign me up
90mi away
Old    Al - Pal (watson_134_lf)      Join Date: Nov 2007       10-10-2009, 3:28 PM Reply   
ya theres another one that isnt too far off.
karl at placid waters is about to get a system 2.0 for one of his lakes and put up a slider park.
big things are happening in the Grand Rapids area.
www.placidwaters.com
Old    Josh Rice (joshrice)      Join Date: Jan 2009       10-10-2009, 4:21 PM Reply   
Chris, Chris, Chris. Again, it's RIXEN. Not REXIN. Google it please.
Old    d_fresh            10-11-2009, 5:08 AM Reply   
There has been alot of talk of putting up a cable park on the East side of MI. I have talked to Pat at the Projects to get an idea of the cost for a cable park. The big thing is ROI. I just do not see how it can be profitable, unless you are already using the property for other things and you are just adding a Sesitec 2.0. Like the facility in Wisconsin. They expanded there pond for snow making in the winter, so all they had to do is shell out 30K for the cable. It is an addition to an existing business. If any one has as idea for something or somewhere on the EAST SIDE, let me know!
Old    Andy (michridr69)      Join Date: Dec 2008       10-11-2009, 9:39 AM Reply   
are u serious??????????? CLARKSTON MI for sure, just keep it far away from detroit plz!!

(Message edited by michridr69 on October 11, 2009)
Old    gangstar (joe_crawley)      Join Date: Jan 2007       10-11-2009, 10:19 PM Reply   
if there was a cable park in GR and Lansing next year that would pretty much be the sickest
Old    Jim Spearing (spearing)      Join Date: Sep 2005       10-12-2009, 7:24 AM Reply   
Scott,

If you don't mind a few tips, i have been to 5 different cables (ski rixen, OWC, TSR, wakenation and Pfullendorf Germany) and the ones that bring me back have the following.
1.) They have a island in the middle to break up chop
2.) Good handles not the cut off broom sticks that abuse your hands and by day two you can't ride, meaning you loose money on day two from one or two riders licking they're wounds :-(.
3.) Lots of sliders and kickers.

It is good to see a leaders like Scott and Doug (wlwake), thanks guys hope all goes well with your individual plans.
Old    d_fresh            10-12-2009, 9:12 AM Reply   
I am always looking to see if there is property that could be leased that already has a pond on it. Recently I have been looking at the Holly area. There are a couple of gavel pits that have large bodies of water from excavating. If anyone on the east side of the state knows of a prime spot, let me know!
Old    ajmac            10-12-2009, 11:17 AM Reply   
There are a few older gravel pits in Macomb county-Shelby Twp. area. It's a little more of a developed area so I dont know if that's what you are looking for...
Old    Andy (michridr69)      Join Date: Dec 2008       10-12-2009, 1:02 PM Reply   
it would be super cool if it was the gravel pit next to MT. Holly!!
Old    d_fresh            10-12-2009, 2:38 PM Reply   
Please, if anyone knows of a good location, please post or PM me. Would like to get a Sesitec 2.0 system going and try to build interest. The best way is as I mentioned earlier, rent property with an existing body of water. If you have contacts or specific info, let me know.
Old    d_fresh            10-12-2009, 3:00 PM Reply   
I have been also looking in the Wixom area there are a few gravel pits South of I-96. Would be great to get things going this winter, so we can possibly get something going for spring of 2010.
Old    Chris Walker (redsupralaunch)      Join Date: Aug 2002       10-12-2009, 3:11 PM Reply   
Josh - I think I screwed up Google by all the postings on 09 Nats.
Rixen Rixen Rixen
Old    d_fresh            10-13-2009, 2:33 PM Reply   
Does anyone know the rate ($/hr) at the projects for using the Sesitec 2.0
Old    Mateo (wkbrdr)      Join Date: Jan 2006       10-13-2009, 4:31 PM Reply   
Doug, it will run you about 20-40 dollars a day to run one, also you will need a three stage power system...

I have been trying to get some investors around a wake park in the grand rapids area, but if one is in Lansing...more power to you!!!

If you need help with anything let me know I have done a lot of the leg work already for many things!
Old    Nick Tomsyck (sidekicknicholas)      Join Date: Mar 2007       10-13-2009, 5:58 PM Reply   
The one in Wisco's prices go as follows:
*all per hour

Cable Pass - $25
Board rent - 12
slider board - 20
helmet - 5
vest - 8

or you can do
6 pack $100
12 pack $185
20 pack $250


They let 4 per hour on the cable... I think... they installed it this summer and I heard they plan to break even by the end of next year.
So it seems like it did pretty well, and it is honestly close to the middle of nowhere
Old    d_fresh            10-14-2009, 3:43 AM Reply   
I guess I am trying to understand how you make enough money to sustain a business. If you charge $25/hr for rate. How do you pay for everything? If 4 people can ride per hour, are you realy only riding fot 15 minutes within a 1 hour period?
Old    Benjamin (bendow)      Join Date: Sep 2005       10-14-2009, 5:22 AM Reply   
A WHOLE lot more than 4 people can ride an hour. Most cables have 6 carriers and people fall and a new person gets on.

Cables have been used for snow skiing and snowboarding before...nothing new. You could consider doing that somehow in the winter.
Old    Ray Markham (wakeborder5)      Join Date: Jun 2002       10-14-2009, 6:07 AM Reply   
Benjamin, they're talking about a Sessitec 2.0, which, if you didn't know, is a 2 tower system opposed to a full-blown 5 or 6 tower system and only pulls one rider at a time
Old    Jim Spearing (spearing)      Join Date: Sep 2005       10-14-2009, 8:01 AM Reply   
Scott - is the July 2010 break ground date? or are you thinking open for Business?
Old    Nick Tomsyck (sidekicknicholas)      Join Date: Mar 2007       10-14-2009, 9:38 AM Reply   
Yes, it is a system 2... and honestly 4 is a pretty good number... you think, ahhh only 15 min but its 15 min of NON STOP RIDING. One thing after another, you fall it picks you up in like 15 sec and you're going again.

I hate riding with only 1 or 2 (you get to tired to quick).... 3 is the perfect number... enough rest and time to ride.

I thought the same thing when I showed up and wanted to ride, and 2 others were there but I didn't make it the hour.
Old    Chad Nyenhuis (wkbrdrchad)      Join Date: Feb 2007       10-16-2009, 10:21 AM Reply   
I sure hope you mean you'll be up and running by July 2010 because that would be Amazing! Did my first cable this summer and loved it! This would be a whole lot closer and I would definitely hit it up a ton!
Old    Benjamin (bendow)      Join Date: Sep 2005       10-16-2009, 11:16 AM Reply   
Ray, thanks for the correction. I thought they were talking about the big brother. I've ridden a sessitec many times. It's a lot of fun.
Old    Ray Markham (wakeborder5)      Join Date: Jun 2002       10-16-2009, 4:53 PM Reply   
Yeah, I figured you were just mistaken, but you worded it funny, so I had to make sure you knew
Old    scott firman (mucktoerider)      Join Date: Jan 2007       10-17-2009, 9:59 PM Reply   
Ill try keep everyone update as things move forward. 4 courses so far are planned. One of them could possibly be domed and heated during the winter. We are working with the DEQ for permits to do so. July2010 I would like to open. Just a lil hint...they use to use this property years ago for National water ski comps. It's a perfect place. Yhea I have not finalized the system. But I do have most contractors ready for installation. Intamin is sending me some REALLY cool designs...for sliders rails and neat kickers that will twist you up for a knarly rotation. a wake machine......hmmm....well we will just save that for another time. We will have a proshop on site. We will have a food bar with a famous brand of pizza pie and beverage leader on hand. It will be amazing.
Old    Roddyrod (wakeslife)      Join Date: Jul 2005       10-17-2009, 11:07 PM Reply   
nothin like a good pizza pie after a wake sesh
Old    Jeremy Byrom (wakerider111)      Join Date: Jul 2006       10-18-2009, 9:49 AM Reply   

quote:

One of them could possibly be domed and heated during the winter.




the indoor-wake-park seeds are in hand.
nice.
Old    Jim Spearing (spearing)      Join Date: Sep 2005       10-19-2009, 9:47 AM Reply   
does anyone know of this lake i got nothing :-)
Old    Jason Delmage (delmage171)      Join Date: Mar 2008       10-19-2009, 10:40 AM Reply   
that sounds wicked! close to South Western Ontario too for us canadians......
Old    Karl De Looff (boarditup)      Join Date: Jan 2004       10-19-2009, 11:42 AM Reply   
the old G&L ski school off of I-69, south of Lansing, most likely. Shallow, but that works for cable.
Old    Jim Spearing (spearing)      Join Date: Sep 2005       10-20-2009, 9:48 AM Reply   
yup i know it, great cable park lake. i hope there is plans for an Island to help break up rider wave traffic.

looking forward to updates :-)
Old    Mateo (wkbrdr)      Join Date: Jan 2006       11-16-2009, 7:13 AM Reply   
Any updates on this?
Old    Kevin Zoodsma (zoodsmak)      Join Date: Feb 2009       11-17-2009, 8:17 AM Reply   
Making progress on the west side... Don't know much on the east side.
Old    Mateo (wkbrdr)      Join Date: Jan 2006       11-17-2009, 8:27 AM Reply   
Where on the west side?
Old    Karl De Looff (boarditup)      Join Date: Jan 2004       11-18-2009, 5:41 AM Reply   
www.placidwaters.com
Old    Mateo (wkbrdr)      Join Date: Jan 2006       11-18-2009, 5:58 AM Reply   
cable park or a system 2.0?

If you need help with sliders and kickers, let m know...Im in hudsonville...
Old    dust3313            11-19-2009, 4:42 PM Reply   
Wait i thought it was a cable park? Boarditup posted something about a community on a water sports lake. Did the plans for the cable park get canceled?
Old    scott firman (mucktoerider)      Join Date: Jan 2007       11-19-2009, 7:44 PM Reply   
plans are still in motion. Lots of planning and permits etc. etc. One snag so far.....I told a few people that know people. And now they want me to consider another location as well. So still going forward with the current location. But started survey on the other. The new location all I can is huge....and very ideal and located right off I 96 between Detroit and Lansing. It is a possibility, but a lot of work has gone into the planning on the current location. Stay tuned. I will need help and will be taking applications after Christmas.
Old    Jim Spearing (spearing)      Join Date: Sep 2005       11-23-2009, 12:11 PM Reply   
Thanks for the update.
Old    Norbi Vasko (norbiv)      Join Date: May 2009       11-23-2009, 12:51 PM Reply   
STOKED TO SEE IT !
Old    Al - Pal (watson_134_lf)      Join Date: Nov 2007       11-23-2009, 3:17 PM Reply   
i know Karl said something about doing a system 2.0, and that could be at his place sometime next summer.
Old    Bruce Jesionowski (cwb121)      Join Date: Feb 2004       12-03-2009, 6:19 PM Reply   
Scott,

If you are doing this park then why did you act like you had no idea about this so called park when you were in the shop the other night? I would love to see a cable park in Michigan but i just don't think that its realistic here. Just my 2cents
Old    ajmac            12-03-2009, 7:37 PM Reply   
Hey Bruce, what shop do you work at? Where is it located? Just curious cause I see you live in Auburn Hills
Old    Jim Spearing (spearing)      Join Date: Sep 2005       12-04-2009, 7:21 AM Reply   
AJ - I see your profile says you reside in Rochester and Wakeboard on Lakeville Lake. Do you know Steve Hosner on Lakeville? He has the same year boat as yours but it is black were your color scheme is yellow. What other lakes do you ride on?
Old    Jim Spearing (spearing)      Join Date: Sep 2005       12-04-2009, 7:40 AM Reply   
Bruce whats up? I think I met you at Wakenation this summer? I was with Joe Cabiness and his son Joey, you work at Watersports right?
Old    d_fresh            12-04-2009, 7:50 AM Reply   
Bruce = Action Water Sports

So now that this thread is rejuvenated, how popular would a cable park in MI be?
Old    Jordan Podsiad (jpods22)      Join Date: Sep 2008       12-04-2009, 8:00 AM Reply   
Not sure how popular......but I know it will be for me and about 10 guys that ride The Detroit River.
Old    Jim Spearing (spearing)      Join Date: Sep 2005       12-04-2009, 8:15 AM Reply   
Jordy - i would love to come ride the Detwah river. hard core.
Old    alex fata (bakenwake)      Join Date: Aug 2007       12-04-2009, 8:16 AM Reply   
it would be very popular
Old    Roddyrod (wakeslife)      Join Date: Jul 2005       12-04-2009, 3:42 PM Reply   
I wanted to do a section for a video riding the detroit river in front of the ren cen and the joe, push process style except in the D instead of NYC. No way in hell dad was going to let me take the boat down there though!
Old    dust3313            12-04-2009, 4:19 PM Reply   
if u brought it closer to chicago (instead of close to detroit) i think it would be even more popular. but i am biased cuz that would make it closer to me in chi town! =)
Old    ajmac            12-05-2009, 8:06 AM Reply   
Jim-yeah i met Steve this past summer. I'll go out to lake orion on occasion, but its usually hard for us to find good water
Old    Jim Spearing (spearing)      Join Date: Sep 2005       12-05-2009, 5:08 PM Reply   
AJ - yeah I grew up on lake Orion it is a great party lake but that is it. My Parents still live on the lake and I wakeboard once a year there early spring and that's it for LO.

We did the polar bear ski thing on loon lake today in Waterford it was 28 deg. And light snow. The boards had ice on them in the board racks. I rode the new Axis nice boat factory ballast and 5 guys wake was a little small but I was able to put a nice sequence back roll, scarecrow, hs 3 and wipe out on ts 3 and I was out lol.
Old    Kevin Zoodsma (zoodsmak)      Join Date: Feb 2009       12-05-2009, 5:15 PM Reply   
I think after Wake Nation has a few seasons under their belt it will seem more feasible for more cables in the north. Living in Grand Rapids, I made the 5 hour drive to Cincy 3 times last year so I'm all about more cables going in. But the problem is they cost as much as a ski resort. Look how many people go to the small hills in Michigan on any given weekend. You need to draw alot of people to make it work.
Think about where the money comes from. Is it the 100 people on wakeworld in Michigan that buy a season pass or is it the guy who never rides who pays for a day pass, rents a life jacket, helmet, and board. You say it would be popular but in reality if all the diehard riders like me buy a season pass and bring our own equipment, there isn't enough profit to justify building a park that only runs half a year.
That's why I think after Wake Nation has a couple years to model a business plan after you might see a few more.
Side note: props to Pete and Nick and the crew at WN for steping out and not only getting it done, but executing a park that competes with anything else found in the states! See you Guys in the spring.
Old    Ray Markham (wakeborder5)      Join Date: Jun 2002       12-05-2009, 5:33 PM Reply   
I think a cable park here could be more successful here than in Ohio insofar as in-state customers because I think there might be more people who are involved with watersports or have been exposed to them or even snowboarding/snowskiing, especially in Oakland county.
Old    scott firman (mucktoerider)      Join Date: Jan 2007       12-05-2009, 6:21 PM Reply   
Bruce all apologies. Felt kinda weird because I am going to have a. Pro shop as well. Plus I've had a few inquire to merge a partnership. I've mentioned this a few times in the past to businesses and got the...it won't work. So I went the go it alone approach.
Old    Bruce Jesionowski (cwb121)      Join Date: Feb 2004       12-06-2009, 6:39 PM Reply   
Jim - Yes we meet down a wake nation.

AJ - Yes i work for Action Water Sports in Fenton. I use to live in Auburn Hills, my wife and i just bought a house on Watkins Lake in Waterford.

Scott - no worries at all, just excited. i hope all works and we will have a park here in Michigan

(Message edited by cwb121 on December 06, 2009)
Old    Jim Spearing (spearing)      Join Date: Sep 2005       12-07-2009, 4:52 AM Reply   
Scott - Yeah that seems to be the answer I hear from every proshop "it won't work" I don't blame there response I just don't mention the word cable park around them. It seems every proshop is attached to a boat dealer and I assume they feel sales will slip to this machine. In fact I think boat sales will increase due to exposer of the sport. You can't replace the feel of a boat and friends on the lake :-) but the covience of the cable and rails is so awesome I can't waite to hit your park up atleast once a week next summer.
Old    Jordan Podsiad (jpods22)      Join Date: Sep 2008       12-07-2009, 8:10 AM Reply   
jim-

absolutely....its prefect for me and my buddies...we are the only ones riding it...come on down this summer.....bring your boat.....$5 all day launch. and ...i got a buddy who lives on lake orion...or did..his parents still do..He keeps telling me theres some v-drives out there and some good parties....
Old    Spencer (spinner_x)      Join Date: Jun 2008       12-07-2009, 8:19 AM Reply   
I love it. I'm only 40 mins from lansing so I could be out there all the time. I'll definitely be interested in going and checking on progress when you guys start to build.
Old    Jim Spearing (spearing)      Join Date: Sep 2005       12-07-2009, 9:12 AM Reply   
Jordy - yeah we will have to make a trip for sure sounds like fun.

Bruce - We rode on Saturday on Loon Lake for the polar bear charity event 28 deg. man was that cold.... one fall and I was out of the water lol.

Scott - How is the surveying for site 2 coming? Is there a determination for sites or is it still up in the air?
Old    Bruce Jesionowski (cwb121)      Join Date: Feb 2004       12-09-2009, 5:39 PM Reply   
Jim - Its not that us dealers don't want a cable park nor is it going to hurt our business. We just know the state know how hard its is to make money or even break even in the water sports industry. The money is just not there as it use to be. Not saying that it wont be back. Its just been a few hard years. A cable park could help bring new people to our sport that we love!
Old    Jim Spearing (spearing)      Join Date: Sep 2005       12-10-2009, 8:39 AM Reply   
Bruce - good to hear :-)

everything is cyclical, before long we will be hemorrhaging cash like we did in the late 90's :-)
Old    scott firman (mucktoerider)      Join Date: Jan 2007       12-10-2009, 5:58 PM Reply   
down in cinnci right now. got a meeting with the guys that helped design that park. still waiting on the survey. things seem to still be heading in the right direction. with a twist. i let you in once i sew up that ideA
Old    dust3313            12-10-2009, 6:49 PM Reply   
Is it still gonna be finished in 2010?
Old    scott firman (mucktoerider)      Join Date: Jan 2007       12-14-2009, 6:53 PM Reply   
http://www.nationalcenter.org/NPA567.html. got a snag. EPA is putting the breaks on approving permitgs. DEQ said yes...EPA is saying no. Fight has just begun. This clean water act didn't mean much before. But the new powers EPA got in july has spun outta control. Now I have to deal with barbera boxer inCA. Whata pain. Stay tuned.
Old    Peter T (deltawake)      Join Date: Sep 2004       12-14-2009, 8:35 PM Reply   
This is why I don't know if a cable park will ever get built in California. Why would anyone spend time and money, knowing that some government bureaucrat somewhere along the chain will shut it down. God bless those who try, but the chances that you will beat your head against a wall with no luck in the end are too great.
Old    Stereo Wakeski Company (stereoskier)      Join Date: Jun 2009       12-15-2009, 2:59 AM Reply   
Hey guys, look to Germany. They have 80mill people and 75 cable parks. I visited 10 of them last summer and they were all packed with people, on the water and in the restaurants. If you really stretch the season, it is 6months long, but it is more like 3 months for beginners, so I don't see why there should not be possible to make money on a ton of cable parks in the US. The best thing about a cable park, is that it opens up the sport to a whole new group of people. Most people dont have access to a boat, so I think more cable parks in the US will help grow the sport.

About the 2.0, it is a great system and really fun, but I don't see how you can generate enough income to pay of investment and the people to run it. As an addition to cable park or in connection to a boat lake or a pro shop, I think it can attract more business to the whole place, and justify the investment.

Excited to hear about so many plans. Keep it up!
Old    Peter T (deltawake)      Join Date: Sep 2004       12-15-2009, 7:05 AM Reply   
Stereo- I think we all agree that cable parks are a great idea. I would love to see one cable park per million people like in Germany. The ridiculous regulation in this country, and specifically California will not allow it. Scott is finding this out the hard way.
Old    Karl De Looff (boarditup)      Join Date: Jan 2004       12-15-2009, 7:45 AM Reply   
A cable park is a business decision. With the large number of boats available and cheap gas, there is not the demand for cable as there is in Europe. It is hard to make money with the expenses, investment, TAXES, and regulations.

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