Underwater LED Test Pick's

LAKE PICK #1 Camera on Manual settings
http://picasaweb.google.com/grantwest/LightTestManualSettings#
Pool Pick's Used to measure LUX
http://picasaweb.google.com/grantwest/LEDLightsInAPool#
LAKE PICK #2 "Camera setting's were set on automatic
http://picasaweb.google.com/grantwest/LightTestCameraSettingSWereSetOnAutomatic#

Great job Grant. Thanks

Man Grant you spent alot of time on this project!! thanks for doing it

Awesome job Grant!

The prices are backwards on the Abyss 800 and 600. The 800 should cost around $320 and the 600 would be around $210.

If anyone has a way or idea of how we could post up picks of the lights or some way to show them side by side or against each other that would be great. I had tryed a bunch of diffrent thing's but gave up because I had all ready taken way to long. So if someone has the skills or is willing to take it to the next level that would be awesome but for now this is all I can come up with.

Tall yea your right: Could someone make the correction? the price on the s600 is switched with the s800

Thank's to Ken @ bullet, Robert Mitchel, Jeff @ Shawdow Casters, Johan @ Abyss, Ryan at Chucktronics, David @ Earmark, Guy's Technique,
Mike Ski and Kenny McCray for taking picks and doing light reading's.

Ill box up all the lights and send them back next week.
Thank's Grant

I can see now why it took so long to put these together. Great work!

Just a clarification piece: when you use the word "Pick" that means "Picture" and not 'Pick' as in 'Grant's #1 pick' ?

What's the story on the 'Technique' lights? How much and where do you buy them? They really performed quite well.

The Shadow Casters are REALLY impressive...and equally expensive.

Nicely done. Thanks all for putting that together!

So the Abyss & Shadowcasters being as bright as they are is no big surprise. But one thing that jumps out at me is the Technique. No website? No price? Yet they seem to be pretty bright.

And the huge difference in the results between the automatic & manual settings really shows off how much effort you guys put into this.

* Photos credit to Grant, Mike and company.
* Content credit to Grant, Mike and company.
* I did nothing more than create the above presentation.

This might be a little easier to see the results side-by-side. Refer to Grant's original post for full sized images.

(Message edited by yosquire on June 02, 2009)

Hi all,

This was a fun project. I wish there was a way where we could have done it in front of a group of judges and provided subjective results from a greater number of people. I learned a great deal about under water lights and got a big reminder of how difficult it is to take pictures of lights that show anything that resembles what your eyes see.

The lux readings were taken while the lights were in my pool, the light is what was reflected back off the wall on the far side. In this orientation the narrow beam lights do not perform nearly as well as the wide beam lights because most of the light stays below the water surface and does not reach the wall above. That's why we added the brightness column to the chart. This is our attemp to put a value on what we saw versus what the meter measured. For example the Bullet X8000 looks significantly brighter than the Bullet X6000 but it does not measure that way because the X8000 is a much tighter beam (like a spot light). You can see the beam patterns as they light up the rock wall behind my pool and the step below the surface. For a reference standpoint, my pool is 16' wide where the light is shining.

The Shadowcasters and the Abyss 1515's are both very bright lights, they get 5 out of 5 with our brightness score. This would work well where you have less than clear waters and little bottom reflection (delta?). At the other end of the brightness spectrum is the RGB Baller light but it would still be a cool light to use if you boat in clear shallow waters with a highly reflective bottom. The multi-color possibilities would be very cool to sequence.

After doing this test I think there are lots of options depending on your budget. We wanted to include electrical load measurements but ran out of time. Maybe we can run that quickly before we send them back? I do know that my supply voltmeter didn't move much with most lights but it did drop a bit when I hooked up the shadowcasters. If you are planning on running these for hours off a single stock battery that may be of some consideration? Most of the lights drew very little power, likely less than a couple of the little interior accent lights or the anchor light.

For my boat and my budget I will probably use a single Baller #3, Bullet X8000 or Abyss S800. It will be mounted opposite the exhaust exit on my Nautique. These are not the brightest lights but they are bright enough for my needs.

Craig, Thanks for the nice table!

G and Mski. thanks for all your time and effort.

Ditto

G and Mikeski thanks again!! I know it was a lot of work but we sure do appreciate it.

Now when are we going to try and get the group buys together?

Thanks!

Looks good, worth the wait. If anybody is interested in the Baller lights send me an email we'll get the group buy on.

Agree, what is the Techniques?

Craig: Thank's for putting that together, Looks great.
I was sent the Techniques. I have the box they came in the return address but no other information. Im sorry it was not included in the test contact section. If someone know's more about them please post it up.

So G, what lights did you end going with?

I havent picked a light yet. I think I'm gonna go with the Shadow Casters. They lit the hell out of the water. The same is true for the Abyss 1515 both lights were very bright and very well built So for me the Abyss and the Shadow Casters lights were pretty equal as far as the amount of light and build quality. The Shadow Casters are very thin, and not very tall better suited for my application. Even though my boat has RED led's I think I want to use Blue underwater lights. The blue looks so cool.

I want light to be projected all the way around the back of the boat Not just 2 narrow beams comming off the back. The Shadow Casters and the Abyss 1515 have a big wide beam. I want to make a Light bar out of Aluminum that will hold the 3 Shadow casters and angle this so called underwater light bar so the beams don't overlap and the lights project all the way around the boat. This light bar will mount to the swim platform and or swim platform brakets and can be adjusted to shoot the light down and into the water. With the shape of my transome I don't have the room for all 3 Shadow Casters across the back the Light bar will give me the ability to get all 3 spread across the back. Im hopeing to have light spread in a 180 degree or more pattern all the way around the back of the boat. This will also make it so I don't have to drill into the back of the boat for all 3 lights. Just one hole for the power and ground.
Cant wait to get this project started and see what it looks like. I just don't want light's back there I want alot of light back there. This test was alot of work and I guess this is what it took to get the answers to my questions.

^^^ I was thinking the same thing. I don't have much room to mount on the transom and the FAE might be in the way of the lights as well if I sell my boat in a couple of years I want my lights back. So I was also thinking I would try and make some mounts that go on the swim platform which would make the whole project reversable if desired.

I just want the lights so bad.lol.

i have a question, so in your opinions grant and mike, is it safe to say that a guy could quite possibly get away with just 1 light in some cases? my boat's beam is narrow and i don't have a lot of room on the transom. i'll have to look closer, but if i could get away with just one light (as long as it was centered), i'd probably be a happy camper. second question is if there are angles to be dealt with on the transom from the shape of the glass/gel, are there products that can be used inbetween the lights themselves and the hull to correctly orientate the direction of the light(s)?

Bruce: Even the cheapest light is going to give you light back there. So you can't go wrong with any of the lights in the test. The second question comes how much light do you want? Followed closely with how much can you afford? Knowing this is Wake World where everyone want’s everything for next to free I’m pretty sure I know what lights most people are going to go with. LOL. IMO some people don't care about quality they just want whatever that does the job. If that's the case there are lights in the test that are right up your alley. The Bullet and the Baller lights are straight up Copy's of the Abyss.
The Abyss is made from Navel bronze and the Bullet and Baller lights are made from Stainless. The Bullet and the Baller lights are the same light. Other than that the bullet Baller and Abyss look and feel exactly the same. I can't tell you how the lights differ in build quality because I haven’t pulled either one of them apart or how or if one would last longer than the other. I can tell you I would feel better about buying from a company here in the US that has been building and selling underwater lights for some time rather than someone new in the market. For some people this is not a big deal for others it is. Another way of looking at it is. No way is a guy with a multi million dollar boat going to install a light that's not test proven and has not been around for some time. For us our boats come in and out of the water real easy and replacing a light is no big deal. Example If I had a large boat and I was going to be crossing the Atlantic I for sure wouldn't be looking for the cheapest light. I guess what I’m trying to say is all the lights put out light. Some just do it in a much nicer way and in a much better light fixture. Would I bolt the A6 to the back of my boat? NO. Would I put it on my fishing boat? YES. Is the A6 a bad light? NO. IMO it's a great light it's light weight plastic and kind of inexpensive feeling. When your boat's in the water most people are not going to know the difference but you. So I guess my advice buy the best light you can afford. IMO it’s a great add on to you boat. They are quite the conversation piece

Go with the drain plug light... it's obviously the best light on the market! Get the halogen too.

^^^ Problem with that is some boats have wakeplates and/or TAPS plates back there that will interfere with the light and not allow the plate to fully extend up. $.02

\/\/ Hurley will work

(Message edited by dabell on June 03, 2009)

Drain Plug Lights

Two to choose from...

Hurley Marine

Liquid Light

Gents,

Would making a bracket to hold one light and a reduction to fit in the drain plug work? Better light and removable.

Matt,
Isn't that what I posted?

As budget is a limiting factor for me and many others. What would you reccomend in the Baller or Bullet line series? Would you run 2 of the bullet x6000 or baller 2's or would you run one of the bullet x8000's or baller 3's?

The shadow casters are amazing and well worth the price but $1200 for two is out of my price range and your going to run 3? We well be able to see your boat from outer space!

I guess the question is if your on a limited budget of $300 or less to add some bling to your boat how would you go? It seems if money was no object we all would go with shadow casters.

Also as a follow up question, in the pics the shadowcaster in white seems considerbly brighter then the same shadowcaster in blue, is that deceiving in the pics or does the water seem to absorb more of the blue light? Is it your opinion if you are looking for a color other then white you might want to get the brightest highest lumens because the water well absorb some of the light?

Thanks to everyone for all the hard work in doing this, I know it took alot of time out of your work and family time.

It sums up what I felt about the Shadow-Casters from day one when I first contacted them!

Robert ^^
White will always show better in the water. Blue is still bright but the light doesn't get bounced around as much so it doesn't reflect as well as straight white light. Apparently blue and green are still quite bright but once you go to a red it won't show as much. It would be like going from white to a blue.

So I've been told.

Robert: The RGB in the Baller line is the only one I wouldn't run. We didn't have the RGB cotroler so mabey it would have worked better and brighter with a controler. But that light would be awesome in the bottom of a cooler changing from red to blue to green. The Baller 2 a copy of the Abyss 600 or the same as the Bullet X6000. IMO that's the cheepest brightest lite in the test. $300 budjet IMO = 3 Baller 2's plenty of light. IMO 3 baller 2's are gonna work better than 2 Baller 3's. The Shadow Caster Blue IMO was just as bright as the White. My eyes would say the beam went back just as far as the White. The white however light up things the blue wouldn't like the shore from 30 feet way. Serious you could read a Newspaper underwater 30 feet away with the 1515 and the Shadow Caster.
Take a look at the picks in the 3rd set the set where the cammera was set ou automatic. Inlarge the picks and look at how far the beam extends or what it does to the shoreline. The jet ski port is 30 feet away from the shore.

Hey Guys,
Grant nice work on the test. To answer Rob's questions above, yes the white Shadow-Caster is brighter than the blue. But honestly I like the blue better for ambiance and style if that's what you're after. On the other hand if you want to identify a fish or object in the water the white would be better. I have whites on the side of my boat and blues on the back, honestly I turn off the whites when its really dark, the blue is just much nicer on the eyes IMO.

Jeff
www.shadow-caster.com

Nice job guys, very nice. I like the chart with the beam width and all the info.
Did you happen to get the amp draw on the different lights?

I'd love to order 2 Baller 3s in blue please! When do you expect to place the order?

Thanks for all the research!

Steve

Hey if you guys are intrested in the TecNiq (Techniques) underwater LED lights. You can buy them under the brand name of Attwood LED lights. I was told you can buy them @ First choice Marine for $169.99 and at amazon for $187.96 with no shipping fee.

HERE they are on Amazon.

The TecNiq lights were what I would call the light weight division. It comes in 2 pieces. A sealed plastic light with the power and ground wires comming off of it and then a chrome cover/ bezel that covers the plastic light. Sort of the same catagory as the Ocean LED A6. A compact light weight light. I thought that the Baller 3's or the Bullet-X8000 or Abyss 1206's put off more light than the TecNiq's even though the picks don't show it that well.

Grant thanks for all your work putting these test results together for everybody! Where are all the people that complained when the didn't get there results instantly now that you've done all this work. I can't believe there isn't 100 new posts on here thanking you for all your hard work!

Thanks buddy!

Update with current draw readings (amps)

Like Robert said great job. Grant and Mike really supplied some great information and pics on the side-by-side test. I know a lot of people were asking about the info and when is it coming. Sometimes people forget that you guys didn’t get paid to do this and are not connected to any of the lamp suppliers and that it took a great deal out of your own “family time” especially Mike with his newborns. What they did was above and beyond what some manufactures of these lights would even do. Thanks again guys.

Nice work Grant !

based on the info provided by G and Mski, (and their recomendations) I ordered mine this week from Robert's group buy, super stoked !!! a lil nervous about the whole drilling into my boat thing, but many thanks again G and Mski and Robert !!

Nedge I got some ballers coming too. No worries on drilling the holes in the boat they are small ones. I am just praying there is a chance that we get them by the 4th. I would love to cruise the lake to the fire works shows with them on. Thanks again Robert.......

Yup, ordered mine too from Robert, cant wait to put em on....nervous bout drilling too but gotta learn sometime lol...Thanks again Robert for offering this and Grant, thanks for doing this test and showing all the results...

Here's some advice about drilling ...

Run the drill in REVERSE at first, until you've
penetrated the gelcoat and are into the glass.

IF you don't do that, you are VERY likely to get
chips and cracks in the gel.

Since the glass guy told me about this, I have
not had a single chip on any holes I have drilled.

Todd

Todd is spot on. I have drilled many holes in gelcote and never had an issue doing it that way. I also taper the holes back after drilling them with a countersink bit. That way it will help prevent cracks from forming. I use the little stone bits that go in dremel style tools.

Thats some good advice Todd.

I wonder what everyones thought of attaching them is? I understand we have to drill a hole for wiring but what screws should we attach them with and I imagine we should pre-drill the holes to get them started. What about the tape trick? Cover what your going to drill with tape? Does that work or is that just an old wifes tale?

Tape works great we use it all the time. Don't apply lots of force let the drill do ALL the work, force = chips. Make sure you use a nice shape bit, not a old pcs of junk.

I was planning on installing with 3/4" stainless pan head screws but I guess I'll have to look at them... I think that is what I used for my transducer. Oh yeah, predrill the holes and dip the screws and cover the back where the wire runs through the hull with 5200 or 4200 to make sure there are no leaks... Should be fine...

Was the Abyss S1515 in the test the BLUE or the WHITE?

It looks like the white. Abyss puts a b at the end of the item number so it would have been the S 1515B if it were blue.

Not sure about the model numbers... The Abyss 1515 we tested was white. The only blue lights we had were the Shadowcaster and the Ocean LED

Were the Shadowcasters used the bimini blue, or the ultra blue? Diggin the test results. I just picked up a single SC 10 ultra blue for the back of my x star.

They look bimini blue to me as the ultra blue appear more purple.