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Go Back   WakeWorld > >> Wakeboarding Discussion Archives > Archive through April 03, 2009

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Old    Evan Miller (mtownrydr)      Join Date: Apr 2008       02-28-2009, 12:15 PM Reply   
http://keithlyman.com/blog/

This is video of Lyman riding with the Vandall behind the new A22. Looks like he's goin big but the wake still looks kinda small to me. I think it would be pretty kickass if Lyman rode for Axis as well...
Old    Bill Montanye (bill)      Join Date: Feb 2001       02-28-2009, 12:29 PM Reply   
hahah here we go again

Keith doesnt look like hes going as big ,boat must suck ,wake is small,Malibu was crazy for building this boat,Lyman is sorry for being sponsored by axis now ..



didi i get all the responses correct this time..

Old    Mark (mvl)      Join Date: May 2004       02-28-2009, 12:53 PM Reply   
The wake does look pretty small though....
Old    Carl Ladd (vlxwakeboarder)      Join Date: Jun 2008       02-28-2009, 1:13 PM Reply   
Definitely smaller than what you normally see Lyman riding behind. But then again he would be going large behind a bass boat.
Old    Jeremy (wake77)      Join Date: Jan 2009       02-28-2009, 4:25 PM Reply   
That boat could be putting out a ten foot high wake and there would still be the guys that say "the wake behind that boat looks pretty small".

I rode with Keith last June in Georgia behind the Ambush Xstar with 10 people in the boat fully loaded, and there wasn't much difference between then and the video behind the Axis.

One more thing...Randall is legit no matter what boat he is riding behind. I don't think he has one regret. Even if Axis folds, Randall will ride for another company and still get paid.
Old    Nick Tomsyck (sidekicknicholas)      Join Date: Mar 2007       02-28-2009, 5:17 PM Reply   
^ I call shananagans.
Old    jeremy hebert (jhebert)      Join Date: May 2007       02-28-2009, 5:32 PM Reply   
do i see boardshorts over the wetsuit ??
Old    Ray M (wakeborder5)      Join Date: Jun 2002       02-28-2009, 5:39 PM Reply   
^Yes, Keith has respect for his fellow man

(Message edited by wakeborder5 on February 28, 2009)
Old    michaelspsp (michaelspsp)      Join Date: Sep 2007       02-28-2009, 5:42 PM Reply   
yes, boardshorts over wetsuit, what is this world coming to?
and i own an x-star.. there is no way the wakes are even close.
but we have no idea how much ballast is randalls. so unless we do a side by side comparison, we will never know
Old    Jeremy (wake77)      Join Date: Jan 2009       02-28-2009, 8:55 PM Reply   
Nick, whatever. Go to Keith's blog and go to the June archives. You'll see the clinic he did in
GA.

The wakes are close. It was the Ambush Xstar 08. And you're right without a side by side we might never know.
Old    Stephen Higgins (srh00z)      Join Date: Jun 2003       02-28-2009, 10:20 PM Reply   
I think it is ludicrous that Lyman doesn't have a boat sponsorship. I know he has had a few issues in the past, but I am surprised he has gone as long as he has without being picked back up. I wonder if he will wind up being on the Axis team. I know if I were Epic or Axis, I would try to sign him up.
Old     (nautiquetrevo)      Join Date: Jul 2008       02-28-2009, 10:48 PM Reply   
I mostly agree with Jeremy but can't you all just enjoy the video and cut Randall, Keith and Axis a break.

Competition is a good thing and i think having a new boat company come into the sport is great.

Most importantly its not how BIG the wake is, it's how well it rides and that the rider enjoys it. Not everyone likes to ride on 10 foot high rollers
Old     (hsryan33)      Join Date: Jan 2009       03-01-2009, 10:35 AM Reply   
I wonder if the reason they only had one extra fat sac in the boat was because thier breaking it in. Do you guys with boats normally fully weight them when breaking in the motor?
Old    Joe Burbo (jburbo)      Join Date: Sep 2007       03-01-2009, 11:06 AM Reply   
plus I think I remember Keith saying he is mostly riding W2W right now until his knee is 100% ready to rock......
Old     (hsryan33)      Join Date: Jan 2009       03-01-2009, 11:14 AM Reply   
that would be pretty cool if keith also rode for axis and him and randall were on the same team.
Old    Nick Tomsyck (sidekicknicholas)      Join Date: Mar 2007       03-01-2009, 11:44 AM Reply   
This is for Jeremy
Axis - LOADED like Randall does
Upload

X-star - 2 people (one is a girl who weighs a whole 100lbs) - stock ballast + PT (half-full)
Upload

You're saying that 8 more people in the Star (which is already better than axis) will be the same....

unless a wake size-to-weight ratio like a sine wave I don't understand...no weight = lil wake, medium weight = HUGE, lots of weight = lil wake again.... or am I wrong?
Old     (hsryan33)      Join Date: Jan 2009       03-01-2009, 11:49 AM Reply   
Nick I don't think randall's boat is LOADED right there. I read somewhere he only had one extra fat sac besides the stock ballast which isn't much. I believe he normally puts around 4k plus in his boats.
Old    Nick Tomsyck (sidekicknicholas)      Join Date: Mar 2007       03-01-2009, 12:00 PM Reply   
the other axis vid it clearly states "we've weighted it out the Randall likes to weight it"
...and since there was no in the boat shots of the wake I will assume they didn't change much for his set wtih Keith... it is his boat, so I don't know why he would.

I am going off two assumptions:
1. Axis isn't lying
2. They ride with near the same setups most of the time when they go out.
Old    Evan Miller (mtownrydr)      Join Date: Apr 2008       03-01-2009, 12:41 PM Reply   
I know this topic is getting old but my take on the whole situation is if axis was truly rider centered (and not about creating a flashy boat at a lower price so people can look like they have an x star) I think their main focus would be the wake and bragging about how awesome it is. I guess it is true though not all people are about riding the largest wake.
Old    George (raftisland)      Join Date: Aug 2006       03-01-2009, 12:47 PM Reply   
the x star takes a ton of weight to get a decent wake that includes adding additional weight to the stock ballast.

go out and test the axis boat for yourself and see if the wake is good. malibus produce an awesome wake im sure axis does too considering there made by the same people.
Old    Tom Adams (gunnertom4593)      Join Date: Sep 2008       03-01-2009, 1:14 PM Reply   
If you read the blog under the video it says "randall had just gotten his new axis boat so we were breaking her in" that leads me to believe that they didn't load it up like randall usually does because they don't have enough hours on the engine to do so. They were probably just running stock ballast.

So I say wait a little longer before you make your final decisions on if the wake sucks or not.
Old    Ewing (johnsvt)      Join Date: Dec 2006       03-01-2009, 1:23 PM Reply   
Lyman looked rusty...wake seemed fine
Old    Ewing (johnsvt)      Join Date: Dec 2006       03-01-2009, 1:24 PM Reply   
and thank god keith was kind enough to do boardshorts over wetsuit
Old    Jason Howard (green_johnson)      Join Date: Jul 2005       03-01-2009, 1:33 PM Reply   
lets not forget how fast randall and lyman ride, not to mention the massive rope they are riding. Plus they were getting mad air off the "little" wake. lets compare that wake to a ski wake then we can talk about little.
Old    wiz            03-01-2009, 1:46 PM Reply   
the axis hull is supposed to be an older vlx hull. if i'm not mistaken, those are pretty legit.
Old    B Poser (bbr)      Join Date: Apr 2002       03-01-2009, 2:39 PM Reply   
Chuck what up?! I have to correct you on this, it's actually an LSV hull that has been shortened a bit. Still, it is capable of producing a massive wake.

I have one question for those of you that are commenting about the size of the Axis wake: Have ANY of you actually ridden behind one?? I'm going to go out on a limb and say NO. So because you haven't maybe your comments about how small it is, aren't really valid. We all know that until you have actually ridden behind the boat that your comments aren't valid.

If I remember right, there was a guy that posted his demo experience about the Axis, and the wake was quite large from what I remember. We'll be getting one before too long and I'll be doing to same.

Cut them a break, video doesn't really do the wake justice, and until you have ridden behind it yourself, then you'll never actually know just how it rides.
Old    Is it summer yet? (trentj6930)      Join Date: Oct 2007       03-01-2009, 3:04 PM Reply   
Well put BadBoyRipper. First hand experience will be the real tale of the tape, so to speak.

Nick, I think we all get your point! All you have been saying in the 2 posts about Randall and Lyman behind the Axis is how small it is. We get it, the first time, the second time, the third time and I am sure many more times to come. It's a new boat, there will be lots more people riding behind it with their opinions as well.
Old    michaelspsp (michaelspsp)      Join Date: Sep 2007       03-01-2009, 3:15 PM Reply   
i know someone who consults for axis. the hull is brand new based on tons of research. speed is a factor no one mentioned until a few posts ago. i agree. even my x-star w the pro ballast at 26 mph and up, the wake gets much smaller....
Old    Al - Pal (watson_134_lf)      Join Date: Nov 2007       03-01-2009, 3:29 PM Reply   
when you ride at 30 mph, thats like a waterski wake.... it doesnt matter how much weight is in the boat
Old    C.I.E. J-Rod (jarrod)      Join Date: May 2003       03-01-2009, 4:07 PM Reply   
"the x star takes a ton of weight to get a decent wake that includes adding additional weight to the stock ballast. "

They all do. Unless you count Epic, which conveniently comes stock with the amount of weight you end up with after adding sacks anyway.

Which motor is Malibu putting in those Axis boats? If it's that little 340 hp monsoon, then maybe that's the problem.
Old    Jeremy (wake77)      Join Date: Jan 2009       03-01-2009, 4:45 PM Reply   
application/octet-streamUpload
6_23_083.jpg (52.4 k)
Nick, all I'm trying to say that the tricks Keith is doing is this video are close to the height and distance he got when I watched him ride in June behind the X-star. With your reasoning, he should have been getting 12 ft high and landing 40 ft into the flats behind the Xstar.

This is the day I rode w/ Keith. Unfortunately, I did not have my camera with me so I did not get riding photos.
Old    Nick Tomsyck (sidekicknicholas)      Join Date: Mar 2007       03-01-2009, 5:53 PM Reply   
he knee is still iffy.... the wake could be better on the axis and we wouldn't know from just his height from a jump....

a picture is worth 1000 words.... I posted two above.
Old     (hsryan33)      Join Date: Jan 2009       03-01-2009, 6:24 PM Reply   
If you've ever been behind an lsv with only the stock ballest, that picture with keith coming into the wake is exactly what it looks like. they should drop the wedge but i think thats bad for the motor when breaking it in too.
Old    Alpha_Beast (socalwakepunk)      Join Date: Dec 2002       03-01-2009, 7:29 PM Reply   
"a picture is worth 1000 words.... I posted two above"

I will never make a purchase, or assumption based on picture only. Those pictures are only worth about 7 words each....Have to ride behind it to see...
Old    B Poser (bbr)      Join Date: Apr 2002       03-01-2009, 9:21 PM Reply   
Ok then, looking at both of those pics above, you'll notice that the wake of the Axis is still knee high, and maybe even just a bit bigger. That's pretty big for any boat, no matter what the name.

The shape is a bit different, but I'm also willing to bet that the Axis is going almost 30mph.

Your picture theory proves nothing.
Old    Small Light (stephan)      Join Date: Nov 2002       03-01-2009, 11:28 PM Reply   
A picture may be worth a thousand words but if it's a picture of a wakeboard wake it's worth dookie. I thought CC's new 210 looked like crap from the pictures, rode it in a contest and was a huge fan.

Brandon, keep me informed. I'm swamped with my license test but want to try out the boat.
Old    Eyekahn (eyekahn)      Join Date: Aug 2007       03-02-2009, 6:55 AM Reply   
J-Rod, the monsoon can handle 4500lbs of weight in ballast on the VLX w/ an acme 1235. Before you start saying that might be the reason for the small wake. Check your facts. They put in a 335hp motor. Which is plenty enough to pull 4k in ballast. Unless, the axis weight more than 4500lbs. Which I highly doubt.

(Message edited by eyekahn on March 02, 2009)
Old    Eyekahn (eyekahn)      Join Date: Aug 2007       03-02-2009, 11:41 AM Reply   
Also, maybe they are pushing randall to ride with just the stock upgraded ballast.
Old    wiz            03-02-2009, 2:13 PM Reply   
brandon!!! hope u & chuck are doing well! i'm just waiting for the season to start.
Old    C.I.E. J-Rod (jarrod)      Join Date: May 2003       03-02-2009, 4:41 PM Reply   
335 hp in an LSV hull sounds under powered to me.

No matter how you sum it up, a big block will allow for more weight.
Old    Scooter (czap)      Join Date: Oct 2007       03-02-2009, 9:32 PM Reply   
Good to see keith is chargin again!

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