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Old    Duffy Mahoney (duffymahoney)      Join Date: Sep 2008       01-05-2009, 8:18 PM Reply   
Does anyone have any video or links to videos of a ski centurion avalanche weighted down? I have seen the 2003 wakesurf championship video, but I was wondering about if there are anymore.

Duffy
Old    Show (bigshow)      Join Date: Feb 2005       01-05-2009, 8:24 PM Reply   
This is all I have. Sorry Jeff:-)

http://www.wakeboardmidwest.com/membergalleriesDefault.aspx?galleryid=163&p=6&s=#m edia
Old    Jeff Walker (surfdad)      Join Date: Sep 2004       01-06-2009, 5:23 AM Reply   
LOL - great video Ed! That was a very nice contest you put together Ed.
Old    Duffy Mahoney (duffymahoney)      Join Date: Sep 2008       01-06-2009, 10:09 AM Reply   
Thanks jeff! I am looking for video's to narrow down my decision between a 22v or an avy. I love my buds 22v(enzo type surf sack plus 500#'s of lead), but the surfable wake seems short. I also love the built in cooler location on the avy. I know that sounds stupid, but I hate having to ask people to get up so I can have a beer! I really like the avy wake that the 2003 wakesurf championship video is throwing. The goofy wake on that video looks kinda dirty, but that could be the terrible angle it was filmed.

Here is that video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HRkZif5I5n4
Old    Jeff Walker (surfdad)      Join Date: Sep 2004       01-06-2009, 12:31 PM Reply   
I was at the '03 WWSC and I don't remember the darkside wake being an issue, but honestly that's been ages ago...I'm not sure my memory is that good! We've used Avy's at Nationals and I think both sides are good, within 80% of each other, I'd estimate. I wonder if Ed has any video from '07 or '08 Nat's of the darkside wake?
Old    Duffy Mahoney (duffymahoney)      Join Date: Sep 2008       01-06-2009, 2:22 PM Reply   
I got a 09 Walker bullet for christmas, but I have 4 feet of snow in my yard, so no wakesurfing for a while! But I am getting ready to sell and buy a newer boat. Are you involved with The Walker Project? Or do you just share the last name? Did the avy's at nationals have switchblades? Did they use enzo type sacks? Thanks Jeff
Duffy
Old    Jeff Walker (surfdad)      Join Date: Sep 2004       01-06-2009, 2:38 PM Reply   
The Bullet is a nice board, Mike does a good job. No affiliation, just share the same last name. My son James rides for Mike, though. Funny story. I was looking for shapers to make James a board - shoot 5 or so years ago. As I was calling around asking for a 4'5" board all these folks hung up or laughed at me. :-) Mike was the ony one that didn't and I think that was his intro to the wakesurf market.

I honesty don't think that either of the Avy's at Nationals had the SB. The Snyder's and Joe B, I do believe provided the boats. We'd need to get Ed back in here to give accurate details.

Neither of those boats had the custom Enzo sacks, that I remember, instead they used smaller universal sacks.
Old    Duffy Mahoney (duffymahoney)      Join Date: Sep 2008       01-06-2009, 2:51 PM Reply   
Yeah, I am excited to ride the board, and thanks for the help. WW is a great site!

Duffy
Old    Dennis (dennish)      Join Date: May 2005       01-06-2009, 3:43 PM Reply   
Hey Duffy,
Check out Jeff's son James on his Signature Model.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GdvAyaRL89s
Really should look at the Sanger V237.
Old    Duffy Mahoney (duffymahoney)      Join Date: Sep 2008       01-06-2009, 3:50 PM Reply   
I would love too! But that is too big of a boat, I would need to get a new slip and it's a 5+ year waiting period. That wakes looks awesome.

Duffy
Old    Rob (wakesurf_ohio)      Join Date: Jun 2007       01-06-2009, 3:52 PM Reply   
I don't have access to video here, but here are two pictures of the wakes from Corey's (regular) and Jim's (goofy) boats from nationals this year. Neither of which had a switchblade at the time.
UploadUpload
Old    Joe B (sailing216)      Join Date: Oct 2007       01-06-2009, 5:28 PM Reply   
The pics above are of of Jim's goofy Avy with no blade (Yellow Avy if you pull pics up from the archives).

My boat pulled Ohio surf event and had the blade but really I would say Jim's was the best we've seen at the local events. The goofy wake behind my boat is washy until we engaged the blade. ---FYI, Jim's boat had much more weight in the rear corner than you would on the regular side. So if you get the Avy, I would say Enzo sacs on both sides but you'll need more in the back corner of the Goofy side. (make a shelf and throw another 750 on it.

Good news is you don't have to have a blade to get a great goofy wake on the Avy.

My boat now has a 750 and Enzo plumbed under the port seats. No bags out in the open.

This spring we are going to test a larger fixed wakeplate like DJJames with the switchblade to get maybe more height on the wave. Good luck--love the 22v, but none around us.
Old    Dennis (dennish)      Join Date: May 2005       01-06-2009, 5:30 PM Reply   
The Sanger V215 is a great boat only smaller same hull as the 237.
Here is a picture of James behind my V215.
Upload
Old    Show (bigshow)      Join Date: Feb 2005       01-06-2009, 7:41 PM Reply   
I've had a few opportunities to surf the Avy Wake. It's really very good. Jim really, really had the goofy wake dialed.

That's a nice wake Dennis.
Old    Show (bigshow)      Join Date: Feb 2005       01-06-2009, 7:45 PM Reply   
The 2007 Wakefest was pulled by Malibu and Centurion. Here a little video from that comp. The Avy pulled the regular wake riders.

http://www.wakeboardmidwest.com/membergalleriesDefault.aspx?galleryid=157&p=6&s=#m edia
Old    Hate N Pain (hatepain)      Join Date: Aug 2006       01-07-2009, 9:06 AM Reply   
And the beautiful thing about the Sanger is it does it the same on both sides!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rhr7GOJgc4c&feature=channel
Old     (packrat)      Join Date: Mar 2005       01-07-2009, 9:18 AM Reply   
Hey bigshow, at the 2007 Wakefest listed in the above video, on the Avy did it have a blade or was this the one without?

Happen to remember roughly what the weight distribution was?
Old    Duffy Mahoney (duffymahoney)      Join Date: Sep 2008       01-07-2009, 10:42 AM Reply   
Hey thanks guys! I plan on having custom sacs made(roughly enzo type), they will take every inch of space(both under seats and rear compartment), hopefully I can stuff huge sacs in there. Has anyone done this? What was the finial dimensions and estimated weight? My current surf sacs actually are taller than the compartment so you can over-fill them and leave one of the hatches partly open. Looks kind of dumb, but the wave is awesome! My plan is buy an Avy with stock 3 tank ballast and remove both rear tanks and install custom sacs and install better pumps, plus some pop bags to fine tune. I also plan on installing a switchblade at a later date. Does anyone have an Avy with custom sacs and a switchblade?
Old    Anthonyv911 (tonyv420)      Join Date: Jul 2007       01-07-2009, 1:06 PM Reply   
you wont need the switch blade on an Avy. You can get a clean wake on both sides ( reg. & dark)Duffy sounds like you have a good plan. By the way the malibu salesman asked us at the boat show what we primarily do behind the boat, answer is surfing , his response was buy a Enzo. Avy's are more affordable though, so my suggestion is buy the Avy, play with the weight configuration dial it in and remember what you have tried. Make a ongoing log , because it is easy to get confused trying to remember what you did the last time out.Well it is for me anyway. I have weighed down my 04 Avy maybe 10 to 12 different ways and am still looking for the perfect wave. (almost there)
Old    Anthonyv911 (tonyv420)      Join Date: Jul 2007       01-07-2009, 1:12 PM Reply   
By the way Sanger is also a great choice. Just going to have to be a preference on your side. If you can demo both boats, do it. Don't buy from a dealer that wont let you demo a surf wake.
Old    Duffy Mahoney (duffymahoney)      Join Date: Sep 2008       01-07-2009, 1:24 PM Reply   
What is the best weight distribution you have used?

Duffy
Old    Duffy Mahoney (duffymahoney)      Join Date: Sep 2008       01-07-2009, 1:34 PM Reply   
I was thinking of a switchblade, to make the wake bigger and also clean. From what I read, a switchblade will add some height and length to the wave. I have never seen a sanger, and there is a local centurion dealer, which gives me a little peace of mind.
Duffy
Old    Show (bigshow)      Join Date: Feb 2005       01-07-2009, 7:05 PM Reply   
No Switch Blade was used in 2007. We did use Joe's boat and SB at the 2008 Ohio Championship.

Joe has done a lot with ballast and the SB on his Avy. I need to talk my way in to getting a set behind his boat next year.
Old    Duffy Mahoney (duffymahoney)      Join Date: Sep 2008       01-07-2009, 8:12 PM Reply   
Does anyone have pictures or videos from this event? Thanks
Duffy
Old    Rob (wakesurf_ohio)      Join Date: Jun 2007       01-07-2009, 8:24 PM Reply   
Here are some, I'll see if i can dig up some more of the goofy wake tomorrow for you.
Old    Show (bigshow)      Join Date: Feb 2005       01-07-2009, 8:30 PM Reply   
Robby, classes haven't started yet?

Joe didn't get his full set up going until after the Ohio Championship. I think he lifted the floor and installed sacks beneath?
Old    Duffy Mahoney (duffymahoney)      Join Date: Sep 2008       01-07-2009, 9:20 PM Reply   
Dennis,
How much ballast did you run on top of stock for that photo? Sweet looking wave, but I have never seen a sanger in real life. I really want all my ballast to be at a flip of a switch. Does the sanger use sacs or hard tanks? Do the rear compartment run forward under the seats? Thanks
Duffy
Old    Joe B (sailing216)      Join Date: Oct 2007       01-08-2009, 7:49 AM Reply   
Duffy- Here is a link showing how I put an Enzo sac and 750lb under the port seats and now just flip the switches. Mind you I never seem to have more than one adult on board so these pics are 150lb driver and 170-110lb spotter and the rest just those 2 sacs. http://www.centurioncrew.com/Avalanche-Sac-t385.html

For a bigger wave I just need more peeps in the boat.

For the pics of Ohio and my boat with SB pulling Goofy. There was a 750 on walkthrough, 250lb under walkthrough, 750 behind driver, and a 200lb in the bow seats, and 250 stock center tank. ---Wake was washy until blade was turned on so not ideal setup if you don't have a blade. Jim's boat proves it can be done without blade but more weight in that back goofy corner. A custom sac in a C4 will probably be over 2K lbs and a great starting point.

Wakeboarding wake: scroll to bottom for pics when I got my blade back on (no SB installed pics first). Without blade, wake is sensitive to weight but very nice. http://www.centurioncrew.com/People-Doggin-Older-Cent-t394.html
Old    Joe B (sailing216)      Join Date: Oct 2007       01-08-2009, 8:10 AM Reply   
With my sacs under the seats and just my spotter and myself, we are still 4" below the rubrail. I feel safe when others are driving with this weight and other boats around us. Tournaments had the waterline just about touching the rubrail. This spring I plan on extending my wakeplate and having my peeps bring their sacs and slamming the boat to see if we can get a barrel to ride

Note: if you click on the links above to view the pics, don't comment and get this thread off topic. thx
Old    Duffy Mahoney (duffymahoney)      Join Date: Sep 2008       01-08-2009, 10:09 AM Reply   
So your are you fully happy with your blade? Any complaints? How come you didn't have a custom sac made? They are pretty slick, because you can pick your fill and drain locations, so put the drains in the back, so draining underway will be fast and should get most of the water out. How fast are the stock pumps? How big is the stock center ballast tank? Thanks again guys
Duffy
Old    Rob (wakesurf_ohio)      Join Date: Jun 2007       01-08-2009, 2:02 PM Reply   
Here are a few..apparently we didn't have many goofy riders at the OH contest.
Upload
Upload
And yes, I started school up this week unfortunately hah
Old    Joe B (sailing216)      Join Date: Oct 2007       01-08-2009, 3:07 PM Reply   
Love my blade. I went a few weeks without it and I missed it.
Pros: Wakeboarding is really where it shines. My 3rd is usually a kid so we need ballast or something. With blade I can have about 200lbs on the wrong side and the boat still gets an even wake. Surfing just cleans it up if my ballast and peeps are not ideal and adds a few inches in height.
Cons: PRICE. And you're supposed to take it off for longer trailering. Backing up is less responsive but I'm used to it now.
Sacs: I thought I just needed a 750 and just keep going. My Enzo was an Ebay score at $127. Until my list is complete, the wife/boss won't let me get custom sacs. Makes you get creative with ballast. (ie. I may put a Y-connector to my small starboard sac, add my center tank back in, check valves on the vent lines and put the drain pump on there, all electric spliced to the one switch.) 06' Avy's have 250lb tanks, I think the 07's went to 300lbs. Fill-time on the enzo sac is low teens for me. Take a swim...
They have a fixed blade now and it's a good option since boarding at '4' is perfect (my pics are at 4), surfing is '2'-'4' setting on the blade. Buy a fixed blade, save a grand, leave it in the '4' position. Good luck I'm outta here. Sanger has great boats and the pics I see they have a taller wave but I'm not sure how slammed they are. I require everything under the seats--or maybe that's the wife...
Old    Dennis (dennish)      Join Date: May 2005       01-08-2009, 3:25 PM Reply   
The Sanger pictured above has everything under cover nothing on seats or floor. The setup for both sides is the same. I think my goofy side is better than the regular side. Stock ballast on side and front ( total 750# ) 500# lead under 300# bag in locker.
Old    Duffy Mahoney (duffymahoney)      Join Date: Sep 2008       01-08-2009, 5:05 PM Reply   
So could you remove the stock ballast and install bigger sacs on the sanger? I really want everything at a flip of a switch. The sanger has a ski locker? I just upgraded my marina slip to a 24! So I have way more options, but this is still a super hard decision. I think I will wait and find a deal and make my decision that way. I have it narrowed down to Tige 22 or 24v, Sanger 215, 230 or 237, Enzo sv240 or an Avalanche. Thanks

Duffy
Old    Duffy Mahoney (duffymahoney)      Join Date: Sep 2008       01-08-2009, 5:06 PM Reply   
Joe,
If you had the money, would you buy custom surf sacs for your avy? I wish my snow would go away, DJ James is making me jealous posting all those surf pics.

Duffy
Old    Dennis (dennish)      Join Date: May 2005       01-08-2009, 5:17 PM Reply   
The V215 locker is not big enough to weight only with water IMO. The V237 on the other hand has a larger locker and could be fitted with a custom sac and remove the stock tank. That sac would be about 1100#. That wake would be really good on both sides. Come down to Sacramento and I will get a V237 for you to ride behind.
Old    Joe B (sailing216)      Join Date: Oct 2007       01-08-2009, 5:35 PM Reply   
DJJames has set the bar very high, not to mention surfing year round.

If I had a C4 Avy, then I would definitely have custom sacs.
On Port side I would have a reverse enzo sac in the storage hold and connect it with the equivilent of two 750's on top of one another. 2 fill and drain lines would be needed. The boat would be so slammed if you filled all the way up. Water would probably be up to the vent.

Starboard/goofy side I would still do the equivilent of two stacked 750s in the locker then what ever room left under the seats have a arm attached (not as long as an enzo arm). Maybe try a Y-connector to see if you could salvage the center tank. FYI-you can't fit too much larger sac where the center tank goes. Some pop bags might be needed on that side of the bow or peeps to move around.
FYI, the FH 750s fit great in the lockers. They push a bit on my blower tubes but I twist tied them up higher and could fit two 750s and still close the hatch.
I'd say all the boats are a toss up. Does a local dealer work well with you?
Old    Duffy Mahoney (duffymahoney)      Join Date: Sep 2008       01-08-2009, 5:54 PM Reply   
Well the closest dealer is about an hour. Does the Sanger V230 have big lockers? My current problem is none of my boards fit in the lockers, so I have to take all my boards out when I park it at the marina. I would love to get a boat that the lockers lock and the lockers are large enough to hold a couple of wakeboards and one or two wakesurfs. Also, the cooler location on the Avy is awesome! The avy wake from the 2003 championship looks great, and it's what I am looking for. What makes the enzo wake so great? It looks long and kinda tall. But not nearly as tall as the tige, avy, or sanger.
Duffy
Old    Show (bigshow)      Join Date: Feb 2005       01-08-2009, 6:04 PM Reply   
The Avy wake is really good. But the port Enzo is better. The pocket is deeper. It doesn't take that much weight, an Enzo Sack is probably about perfect for it. If your surfing both sides it sounds like the Bennett Trim Tab is a must.

Other wakesurfing boaters pull up and asked me how it that weíre able to surf so far back from the transom. Itís the Enzo hull. Iíve seen a number of wake surfer that look like they are right on top of the swim platform. Thatís the only place they can get enough push or they perhaps havenít figured out how to dial in the wake.
Old    Duffy Mahoney (duffymahoney)      Join Date: Sep 2008       01-08-2009, 6:28 PM Reply   
Does anyone have a hydraulic wake plate on a 23 foot enzo? I would be curios if they get the same results as the wakeoutlaws on their 24 foot enzo? The enzo is a sweet looking boat, but it might be outside my price range. But hopefully there are some great deals in the next few months.
Duffy
Old     (packrat)      Join Date: Mar 2005       01-08-2009, 8:02 PM Reply   
I have a 2008 Enzo SV230 and plan to do a lot of experimenting this spring.

Currently I have a factory bennett trim tab on it and it is plumbed with an Enzo Sack on the port rear and 215 hard tank on the starboard mid with a 750 fly high plumbed on the starboard rear as well as a fly high bow sack.

I also have extra 750s to try removing the Enzo sack and putting a 750 in the port rear and 750 in the port center. I also plan to try putting a 750 in both the starboard rear and mid area.

Of course I am not going to run the port and starboard at the same time but I too am in search of the elusive goofy wake for my friends.

I used to be a goofy rider but worked at it and switched over.

I also plan to seriously consider the switchblade as long as I can get a qualified person to do the install.
Old    Duffy Mahoney (duffymahoney)      Join Date: Sep 2008       01-08-2009, 8:07 PM Reply   
So you have had no real luck with your goofy wake? I wonder if a longer adjustable trim tab would do it? Does your bennet trim tab reservoir get in the way of your sacs?
Old    Dennis (dennish)      Join Date: May 2005       01-08-2009, 9:37 PM Reply   
The V215 locker is not big enough to weight only with water IMO. The V237 on the other hand has a larger locker and could be fitted with a custom sac and remove the stock tank. That sac would be about 1100#. That wake would be really good on both sides. Come down to Sacramento and I will get a V237 for you to ride behind.
Old     (packrat)      Join Date: Mar 2005       01-08-2009, 11:56 PM Reply   
I have not had a chance to play with the bennett tab. Bought the boat and had the options put on it and then tucked it away for the winter. Yes the Bennett Tab reservoir although not in the way in the starboard rear I felt the hose to it might get pinched or popped off so I had the dealer point the unit away from the fly high sack to be on the safe side.
Old    Duffy Mahoney (duffymahoney)      Join Date: Sep 2008       01-09-2009, 10:10 AM Reply   
I am hoping I will find a boat that just has a fixed plate and then install a lenco electric trim tab, that way I don't have to mess with fluids and a large pump. I can also pick any length plate. I understand the winter effect, good thing skiing-snowboarding is fun! To bad you didn't get a chance to test that trim tab, if it cleans the goofy wake up I would really look for an enzo! I have a crew of about 15 that I ride with 5-6 days a week and I am the only regular footed person. They must put something in the water up here:-)
Duffy
Old    Show (bigshow)      Join Date: Feb 2005       01-09-2009, 5:37 PM Reply   
Ya, A bunch of my crew and most of my family is goofy. I've got some unique ideas that I'm dying to try.
Old    Duffy Mahoney (duffymahoney)      Join Date: Sep 2008       01-11-2009, 4:10 PM Reply   
Can anyone give me an idea of the goofy wake on Wakeoutlaws sv240 enzo compared to an Avalanche or ? Which is better, or do you prefer?
Duffy

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