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Go Back   WakeWorld > >> Boats, Accessories & Tow Vehicles Archive > Archive through January 12, 2008

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Old    Dave K. (dave_k)      Join Date: Sep 2007       11-06-2007, 2:29 PM Reply   
On a '99 Sunsetter VLX could a person install a taps system or even a manual adjustable wake plate, or does it have to be the "Malibu Wedge"??
Old    George Aslinger (mobv)      Join Date: Jun 2002       11-06-2007, 2:47 PM Reply   
The wedge helps build a bigger wake in place of ballast. A wake plate only helps shape the wake and reduce porposing at high speeds. If you want a bigger wake you need either the wedge or ballast system.
Old    Jason Callen (westsidarider)      Join Date: Feb 2003       11-06-2007, 3:57 PM Reply   
yea the wake plate was really designed to clean up and make the wake smaller for water skiing. theres nothing to clean up on a malibu. perfect clean lip everytime.
Old    Art (rallyart)      Join Date: Nov 2006       11-06-2007, 4:27 PM Reply   
Yes, you can install a hydraulic wake plate. Bennett makes four sizes for wake boats, plus factory ones for several manufacturers. It lets you change the attitude of the boat to shape the wake and helps running in a storm, on starts, and towing slow if you've got kids. It does not make a big difference in the maximum size of the wake. A manual adjustable plate is a pain and does not give you the best benefits.
A hydrofoil like the wedge or switchblade sucks the boat down and makes the wake physically larger. You could install a manual wedge or a Switchblade.
Just decide what you're trying to do.
Old    Ewing (johnsvt)      Join Date: Dec 2006       11-06-2007, 4:43 PM Reply   
I ended up just getting some fatsacks for my boat and haven't used the wedge since. The wedge was great when the boat was lightly loaded, but I never liked how the boat would track with the wedge down.
Old    Big E. (wakesetter101)      Join Date: Oct 2005       11-07-2007, 3:05 PM Reply   
All boats should come with a wake plate.
Old    Sam (wake1823)      Join Date: Dec 2005       11-08-2007, 6:08 AM Reply   
A wakeplate can only make the wake smaller, not increase the size. It is impossible.
Old    mike (houdini)      Join Date: Aug 2005       11-08-2007, 6:19 AM Reply   
I agree with sam. Isn't it a big misconception that a wakeplate makes the wake bigger? I am not a big physics guy but it would seem that when you put the plate "down", the angle of the plate would help the bottom of the boat sink LESS in the water - actually pushing the back of the boat up. When the plate is up, it may then "Drop" the boat from that point, but really it wouldn't be any different if you didn't have it at all.

This 'shifting' of the bottom of the boat up or down slighly will affect the shape of the wake, but you can't make it any bigger than what it would be without it, just the optimal shape.

The wedge is made to hang below the boat and drag in the water, creating pressure that sucks the boat further down into the water - this makes handling much worse, but the wake bigger. Since ballast doesn't create actual drag in the water, the handling is much better than with the wedge. Malibu created the "free floating" wedge so on turns it would float up a bit, with less drag and better handling - i don't think it really helps that much, but that is the idea.
Old    Art (rallyart)      Join Date: Nov 2006       11-08-2007, 7:50 AM Reply   
"Drag" in the water is minimal from the shape of the hydrofoil and that drag does not pull the boat down. The pressure differential across the upper and lower surfaces creates the force to suck the boat down. That force creates additional drag loads and those loads being behind the rudder make it harder to steer through corners. The difference in wording is small but it is a difference. If you dragged a wedge like thing behind the boat without any wing or foil effect it would not put the boat lower or affect the handling significantly.

Now to restate arguments not commonly bought into on this site.
A wakeplate can increase the size of the wake. Nowhere near as much as ballast or a foil, but it does lift water to follow the plate until the surface tension has too much load and air starts to get under the plate. Water that flows smoothly along a slightly raised plate gets raised and the downforce is equal to the weight of the water that is raised under the plate and behind the plate until it reaches the water level of the rest of the hull's displaced surface. So maybe a few gallons at best. The importance of that weight is that it's right at the transom so there is more leverage pulling the stern.
If you want a bigger wake adding weight or using a negative force hydrofoil will be the most effective by far. But I agree with Big E because there are many benefits to a plate.
Old    Montgomery (lovin_the_wake)      Join Date: Jul 2007       11-08-2007, 7:56 AM Reply   
The Plate is pretty much a trim tab but the company's that sell WakePlates say it can make the wake bigger or smaller which is true but the wake will still only be as big as it would be without having the plate at all . . . does that make since ? I have a Wake Plate on my Supra and I really like it because with a lot of weight you can set it to where you can still plain out fast

(Message edited by lovin_the_wake on November 08, 2007)
Old    mike (houdini)      Join Date: Aug 2005       11-08-2007, 8:31 AM Reply   
Art - thanks for the explaination. I know what you mean about the "drag" - I just don't have the vocabulary in this science to explain. But I mean dragging that plate, not just something dragging in the water. I think we can agree that even if the wakeplate does add "a few gallons at best" it is not really enough to tell someone that you are making the wake "bigger". Certainly not that noticable in size, just shape.

..that was a great explaination though. I had a wakeplate (Supra) and it was great, you can plane out much faster when using it correctly and get a very smooth ride. I now have a malibu with wakeplate, and it is great when you don't have many people loaded in. Love adding size to a wake in about 3 seconds.
Old    Supra Man (kdsuprassv)      Join Date: Dec 2006       11-08-2007, 9:09 AM Reply   
I agree that the wakeplate being up will allow the boat to sit deeper in the water and produce a slightly larger wake than if the plate is all the way down. I mainly use mine to get planed off quicker and it helps keep the bow down so I can see where I am going without standing up.
Old    Mike B (mlb75)      Join Date: Aug 2007       11-08-2007, 9:21 AM Reply   
Out of curiosity why don't more wakeboard boats have actual trim tabs? I would think that by adding them you could if nothing else seriously help the boat plain out when it's loaded down. Especially on the larger boats.

As for the wedge I hate to say it but the ones I've seen are not foils, they don't have the shape to actually produce differing pressures between top and bottom by the wedge itself, it looked to me the only way they worked is by being at an angle that acted more as a sea anchor pulling the aft end of the boat down.
Old    Mike B (mlb75)      Join Date: Aug 2007       11-08-2007, 9:25 AM Reply   
When I say trim tabs above I mean tabs on both side of the stern not just the plate in the middle. That way you could actually not only effect the overall shape you could also tune each side individually or compensate for torque steer as well as get on plane faster.
Old    Show (bigshow)      Join Date: Feb 2005       11-08-2007, 9:44 AM Reply   
The trim tab is only half of what TAPS is supposed to be. The other half is the convex Tige' hull. The very end of most inboard hulls have a slight curl. The curl help provide lift at the aft of the boat. You don't want lift on a wake bo0atd boat. The Tige' hull curls up not down, hence convex. The TAPS wakeplate let's you regain some of the lift lost with the convex hull. Other boats have wedges. I always run mine all the way up fore wakeboarding. Setting it down makes the wake mellow. I do use my wake plate to tweak my surfing wake, especially on the goofy side.
Old    JR (luvsanger)      Join Date: Sep 2007       11-08-2007, 9:58 AM Reply   
If you have manuel wakeplate how should it be angled? I know it helps the boat not porpose but I also don't want a ski wake.
Old    Art (rallyart)      Join Date: Nov 2006       11-08-2007, 10:16 AM Reply   
JR, I had the fixed plate on my D215 and changed it for the adjustable. They mount in the same location but not in the same holes. You could take it off, or cut it off without removing the mounting portion. It's not likely that a Sanger will porpoise with a normal load.
If you want to try adjusting it from the factory setting just record the number of turns you make on the turnbuckles. As you shorten them you slowly curve the plate up to let the stern settle in more. If you turn one side up a bit more than the other you make a small difference in the balance. I don't know if it would be enough to balance how clean the wake is on one side or the other but it might help.
Old    Montgomery (lovin_the_wake)      Join Date: Jul 2007       11-08-2007, 10:18 AM Reply   
JR, On mine if I'm going riding I leave it almost even with the bottom of the boat or just little below (about 1"-1 1/2") and it seems to work just fine but I'm running 1500lbs of ballast with 4 people so what works for me might not work for you . . . When we're going out to just chill on the water all day I put it a little above the bottom of the boat (about 1"-1 1/2") both ways keep me from porposing
Old    Jason (azpowerhouse)      Join Date: Jul 2007       11-08-2007, 7:33 PM Reply   
You have a Malibu, and Malibu=Wedge. You can find used ones, or even get a new one installed. If Malibus were designed for plates they would have plates... A plate would be kind of like putting a for d 351 into a chevy... Can be done, but why when you could get a 350.

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