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Go Back   WakeWorld > >> Boats, Accessories & Tow Vehicles Archive > Archive through October 28, 2007

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Old    Austin Top (boardridesurf)      Join Date: Aug 2006       08-28-2007, 10:44 AM Reply   
I have a 23' Enzo and I would like to know how the wakeboarding wake would change if I added 300-400lbs in the bow under the seats. I know that a lot of wake boats need weight in the bow, but I don't know if this is true with a deep-V hull like the Enzo. Also what speed and rope lengths are other Enzo riders using?
Thanks for the info.
Old    Ryan (bsebllhglyknit)      Join Date: Jul 2007       08-28-2007, 1:14 PM Reply   
I have an 05 enzo sv230 and we are running stock ballast (two tanks) at 24 at 60-65 ft. It has a wide ass wake. I would also be interested in weight.
Old    WAlove (masonwakerider)      Join Date: May 2003       08-28-2007, 5:22 PM Reply   
You could get 2 or 3 people to sit up their and you'll see. Most boats like weight in the front. My elite v likes a lot. The one time i wakeboarded behind an enzo 230 we had 750#ers in the v drive lockers and a intigrated bow sac (750#) in the bow. The wake was still really steep. I would put another 400#s or so to mellow out the lip a bit. Bow weigth tends to mellow out the peakyness of a wake.
Old    Ken Toby (towboat_222)      Join Date: Feb 2007       08-29-2007, 12:33 PM Reply   
Centurion is putting 400lb. Bags in front for 08
Old    Sam (wake1823)      Join Date: Dec 2005       08-29-2007, 12:48 PM Reply   
Ryan,

24 @ 60-65 feet??? no way.

Is that km per hour? I take it that's not GPS'd.
Old    Ryan (bsebllhglyknit)      Join Date: Jul 2007       08-29-2007, 12:50 PM Reply   
yeah 24mph at 60-65 ft. Not gps. Based on speedo and perfect pass.
Old    Austin Top (boardridesurf)      Join Date: Aug 2006       09-01-2007, 10:36 PM Reply   
I just changed my setup. In the last few days I have been riding at 22mph and 70' and the wake is epic. I had been riding at 60' at 20 mph and was not happy with my setup. Now at 70' and 22 mph and 1400lbs in the rear, I love the Enzo wake. Totally different boat.
Old    Kevin R Baugh (krbaugh)      Join Date: Mar 2002       09-02-2007, 9:07 AM Reply   
"Centurion is putting 400lb. Bags in front for 08"
This is an option, and is available only on the Enzos
Old    Ryan (bsebllhglyknit)      Join Date: Jul 2007       09-02-2007, 2:41 PM Reply   
Austin what ballast set up are you using? Im so confused should i be riding as fast as im going?
Old    Austin Top (boardridesurf)      Join Date: Aug 2006       09-03-2007, 10:21 PM Reply   
Ryan,
I replaced the rear hard tanks in the v-drive lockers and put in 700# sacs on each side. I also have the mid-ship hard tanks that each hold 220#. I also have sacs under the seats in the bow (one on each side), however I have never filled them. Each time I go out I have the intention of filling them up to see how it affect the wake but still haven't tried them.

So to answer your question, I have tried a lot of different combinations of weight in the v-drive lockers and the mid-ship hard tanks. The best wake that I have found has been just filling the sacs in the v-drive lockers mostly full (around 1300-1400lbs) at 22mph (gps verified) with a 70' rope (including the handle). At this speed, rope length and weight the wake is much more narrow and more rampy that peaky. I really want to try my bow sacs this week because it should help my boat to plane quicker.

I would bet if you haven't checked your speedo and Perfect Pass with gps then both are off. Also I would add more rope, if you really are going 24mph, 60-65 ft is VERY short.

Take care.
Old    Patrick Steed (steedracer)      Join Date: Jul 2007       09-03-2007, 10:32 PM Reply   
Austin,

I too replaced my rear hard tanks with 750# fly high's. A couple of questions for you:
1) Which engine do you have?
2) Have you propped down?
3) What are your kdw & NN settings on perfect pass? I'm getting closer to getting all that weight dial in on PP but still not quite right yet (I only have the 350 MAG in my '04 Enzo and have only propped down once, after ruining my first prop last year). With all that weight in the back and none in front, it takes a while to get out of the hole and up to wakeboard speed. I plan to add some weight up there soon. I look forward to our responses. BTW, we had about 10 people on the boat today...AWESOME surf wake at 10.5 mph. Best ever.
Old    Austin Top (boardridesurf)      Join Date: Aug 2006       09-04-2007, 10:56 PM Reply   
Patrick,
I mis-stated which sacs I have, I have the 750# sacs not 700#.

1. I have the 330 hp Black Scorpion engine
2. I have tried many props and the Acme 1464 works the best at my altitude (Littleton, Colorado about 5,800ft) and weight. The 1464 is a right hand rotation prop because I have the counter rotation transmission so we can have a better starboard (goofy-foot) wake for wakesurfing.
3. My kdw setting is 135 and my NN setting is 90. This works well for wakeboarding and wakesurfing. Once at speed, the PP speed usually stays within 1.3 mph at wakeboard speed and .5 at wakesurfing speed and weight. In glassy water it stays closer than these numbers but we don't get glass often.

For surfing, I use the Hyperlite Broadcast - both the 4'8" and 5'6". I love the 4'8" and ride it the most but when the water is really choppy I still use the 5'6" without the center fin. I can still spin 360's on the 5'6" w/o the center fin and its not as much work to keep going in choppy water. With this board we run at 10.7 mph. At your speed (10.5) and my setup, the wake is too washed out but forms perfect at 10.7 and stays good at least to 13 mph. We have surfed the Inland Surfer Blue board at 12 mph because that board is fast. For surfing, I fill the 750# sac in the starboard v-drive locker and the 220# starboard midship hard tank, and have the heaviest 2 people sit on that side behind the driver and usually 1-3 other people in the boat too. We have the Bennett Trim Tab and sometimes I use it up to 25% to shape the wake some.

Let me know what setup is working for you. I will attempt to try out my bow sacs this week to see how it changes the wake and hole shot. I will also try to take some pics of our wakeboarding wake and wakesurfing wake - please do the same if you can.

Take care.
Old    Swatguy (xstarrider)      Join Date: Jun 2007       09-05-2007, 8:06 PM Reply   
1.3mph isn't holding the speed good. That's a ton of fluctuation. I would p[lay with the KDW and NN values. WE had 165kdw and 80nn on the Enzo we used to pull some comps. Within .2 mph Don't recall what prop though.
Old    Kevin R Baugh (krbaugh)      Join Date: Mar 2002       09-05-2007, 8:21 PM Reply   
With that much weight in the back and no weight up front I would think it would be a dawg out of the hole and almost imposible to keep speed for man or machine
Old    ryan jensen (trx1noob)      Join Date: Sep 2006       09-05-2007, 10:09 PM Reply   
Kevin, i'm running the enzo sack on port side, 300 pds lead port side, 50 pds lead weight in the bow and maybe a couple hundred pds in starboard side. my boat rocks out of the hole. i'm surprised, but it works well. we usually run 13.8 mph according to pp for the optimum wake. oh yeah, we usually have 4-8 guys on port side(however many we can round up) as well.
Old    Kevin R Baugh (krbaugh)      Join Date: Mar 2002       09-05-2007, 10:26 PM Reply   
I was thinking more in terms of a wakeboard wake with the 750's in the back and nothing up front. I added 2 500's to the back and nothing (i only had 2 sacks) up front and it was a dawg out of the hole. Of course mine is the 216 not the 230
Old    Ken Toby (towboat_222)      Join Date: Feb 2007       09-06-2007, 11:21 AM Reply   
Kevin drop down to the high alt prop. makes all the difference in the world. I just done it on my 24 Enzo new 08. I have 5 tanks bag under front seats and 2 250 bags. lost a couple of mph top end never go there anyway.
Old    Kevin R Baugh (krbaugh)      Join Date: Mar 2002       09-06-2007, 4:03 PM Reply   
All I am saying is if you have a lot of weight in any boat you should have some up front.

I agree on the prop if I did not barefoot as much as I wakeboard then I would have a different prop. Eric from OJ sent me some props to try

and I pulled this and several other pyramids with the Enzo and one of the props Eric sent prop....can you say hole shot
The problem was I could only get about 40 mph bumping the rev limiter

Upload
Old    Kevin R Baugh (krbaugh)      Join Date: Mar 2002       09-06-2007, 4:04 PM Reply   
Does any one notice anything odd about the pyramid?
Old    Jason Miller (enzostyle)      Join Date: Aug 2006       09-06-2007, 6:40 PM Reply   
I run my 06 230 with the stock tanks full and the 450# pro-x v drive sacs filled in the rear lockers and two 250# side sacs in front. I have the blade as well though.

The weight in the front not only improves hole-shot, but improves the fuel economy. Lowers the r's by about 3-400.

We surf with the pro x bow sac in front and only turn 2900rpm's with a very long wake. I am running the new acme prop, not sure what number but it is best prop I have ever had. It actually lowered my rpm's while giving me better hole shot!
Old    Austin Top (boardridesurf)      Join Date: Aug 2006       09-06-2007, 9:57 PM Reply   
Tried the bow sacs out tonight and I estimate that I could fit about 400#s under the bow seats (bags were almost full). It did help the boat plane better and it kept the PP speed more consistent. I really didn't notice a different in the wake, but I did have 2 less people in the boat than normal so maybe it just offset this difference. For wake surfing, I dumped the port bag (we ride goofy) and after a few rides we ended up dumping the starboard bow sac too because although the wave was a little longer it was noticeably less steep and not as powerful.
Old    Ryan (bsebllhglyknit)      Join Date: Jul 2007       09-08-2007, 3:41 PM Reply   
Austin,
What kind of sacs are you running up front? The space is kinda awkward.

This is probably a stupid question but is every perfect pass off my the same amount compared to a gps. Austin are you running 22 on your perfect pass? What should i do to verify speed?
Old    Kevin R Baugh (krbaugh)      Join Date: Mar 2002       09-08-2007, 3:49 PM Reply   
Use a GPS and set the pp to the speed that Gps says.
Old    Austin Top (boardridesurf)      Join Date: Aug 2006       09-10-2007, 11:02 AM Reply   
Ryan,
I have the Fly High Side Sacs. They are 48x12x12 and can hold 260#s each. These sacs fit well but you won’t be able to fill them completely under the seats, therefore I estimate that each sac weighs between 200-230#s, for a total of 400-460#s.

You definitely want to verify your pp by gps. When I first got my boat, the pp was off by about 2 mph. So to answer your question, I am running at 22 on my pp which is verified by gps.

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