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Old    Reed Youngblood (ilovelake)      Join Date: Oct 2006       08-26-2007, 5:15 PM Reply   
I am looking to get an HD camcorder in the next few days and I was wondering if anyone could answer some of my questions or has any recommendations. I would like to get one with a hard drive so I don't have to mess with media, which pretty much narrows it down to the JVC GZ-HD7 and a few Sony models (without getting into the $3k+ pro models). I have been told that the JVC is the only one that shoots in 1080p as opposed to 1080, but their website isn't very clear about it, can anyone confirm that? It seems to me that would make a pretty significant difference in video quality, no? I think they both have a form of image stabilization built in but their respective websites say the JVC uses 1/5" CCD's and the Sonys use 1/3" CCD's, how much of a difference does that make? What software to people use to edit these videos? The Fry's website has the Sony HDR-SR7 on special right now for $1300 (reg. $1400), and my local Fry's has the JVC on special for 2 more days at $1450 (reg. $1700). If anyone has any experience with these cameras or any other input or recommendations at all I would love to hear it before dropping that kind of cash. Also if anyone knows of a good place to get waterproof enclosures for these things speak up. Thanks y'all.
Old    mobster            08-26-2007, 7:22 PM Reply   
stay away from hard drive camcorders also avchd camcorders look for the single chip HD models from Canon or Sony in that price range check out this site it can answer your questions www.dvinfo.net/conf/
Old    Eric Silva (getssum)      Join Date: Jul 2005       08-26-2007, 8:55 PM Reply   
We just got a Canon HV-20....

It's tape, but when the tapes' full, put in another one.

Hard to put in another HD.....

plus it's usually about 1k-1100$ ish....
Old    Jeff Rich (noboat)      Join Date: Oct 2006       09-04-2007, 12:23 PM Reply   
Other than not being able to put in a new HD if full, are there other reasons for not getting a HD? I always bring my laptop with me so I cab transfer the days shots. More then enough room for a day or two of shooting on the camcorder itself.
Old    Eric Silva (getssum)      Join Date: Jul 2005       09-04-2007, 1:27 PM Reply   
HD drawbacks for me
- Once it's full, it's full
- Most are compression based to get good quality/tape length
- more moving parts (floating read/write head) that may or may not do well in a marine enviroment
Old    Travis V (cali_rider)      Join Date: Feb 2004       09-05-2007, 1:14 PM Reply   
Are yall talking about HDV? Because their is a difference, i havent shopped for a HD camera really for under 6 G's (nor do i shop for any HD camera at all) so i dont know their even was any. I know thier are HDV cameras and its HD but not Real HD.
Old    Rich Dykmans (richd)      Join Date: Oct 2003       09-05-2007, 2:13 PM Reply   
HDV is real HD it's just more compressed then some of the higher end HD formats like Panasonic's DVCPro HD. Harddrive hd formats are usually AVCHD (ACVHD? well I'll get the letters straight one of these days!) and while slighltly more compressed then HDV is supposedly more efficient codec. Both of those aren't the best for high motion due to their GOP compression scheme vs an I frame codec like the Panasonic's but if shot right can give you a quality picture (just don't expect pristine slomo like you get from 720p via the HVX200).

I really like the Canon HV10/20 as I have mentioned before, full raster 1920X1080 sensor with a decent lens for a consumer cam along with the best AF and IS in the business (and trust me AF is critical if you're shooting HD!) Manual controls are very lacking but there are enough there to get by.

If you do buy a HDD based unit make sure your favorite editing SW supports ACVHD not all of them do yet.
Old    mobster            09-05-2007, 5:10 PM Reply   
Here are some photos of the new Sony EX HD Cam Tapeless HD Upload
Upload
Upload
Upload
Upload
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Old    Travis V (cali_rider)      Join Date: Feb 2004       09-05-2007, 10:08 PM Reply   
I hear a lot of good things about that sony camera... havent seen anything from it though. I just do not like HDV because i have said it before that its copied lines and well i dont like the work flow.
Old    Rich Dykmans (richd)      Join Date: Oct 2003       09-06-2007, 5:19 AM Reply   
That sony is pretty nice looking although it's obviously not a $1000 unit!

Travis is right about the editing workflow with HDV (or any GOP based codec) it's terrible as the computer has to rebuild all of the P frames when applying any sort of FX making RT editing with any kind of preview quality tough, but that's the cost of inexpensive entry level HD these days.

(Message edited by richd on September 06, 2007)
Old    Travis V (cali_rider)      Join Date: Feb 2004       09-06-2007, 10:02 AM Reply   
When my buddy pitched that sony camera to me he said it was the HVX killer......now is that true? Like i said i havent seen anything from it but i heard you can use express cards to record and pop them into the newer macbooks, if thats true then thats pretty cool.
Old    mobster            09-06-2007, 1:24 PM Reply   
This camera won't record the HDPro codec that panasonic has but it will record up to 35 MB in the long GOP with 1920x 1080 Cmos sensors I don't know if its a Panasonic 200HVX Killer but it shows that sony is watching To the publics response to better HD and express cards it should run between $6000 to $8000 usd
Old    Travis V (cali_rider)      Join Date: Feb 2004       09-06-2007, 3:04 PM Reply   
Yeah the DVCPRO is a Panasonic codec so it wont shoot that for sure. i just like the fact that it will download through the express card, i have to see what the image looks like, the frame size is big but normal for HD. Ill just have to wait and see what it looks like and watch the price go down, my buddy just got his HVX for 4 G's.
Old    Rich Dykmans (richd)      Join Date: Oct 2003       09-06-2007, 4:00 PM Reply   
Well a 35 mb max data rate is better then the 25mb of the HDV spec but long GOP doesn't sound good, the more I frames you have the better it will handle motion. There is just nothing like 720p with an I frame codec for any kind of sports shooting. A larger sensor (if that's what it really has, Sony hasn't used a true 1920X1080 sensor in any of their prosumer models yet) would be great for a 3 chip model.
Old    mobster            09-06-2007, 7:23 PM Reply   
It has the 1/2" sensors 1920x1080 at least sony has stepped into the water with Panasonic its not the 200VSX but it has some features that that make another choice. I'm trying to decide on my HD purchase both have their good points we will have to see the Sony's picture to to see if they are in the ball park and what Panasonic has coming out. What's the next step the Red cam ? I just want to shoot crisp video and burn to Blu Ray without going broke
Old    Rich Dykmans (richd)      Join Date: Oct 2003       09-06-2007, 7:41 PM Reply   
I just checked that new Sony out, it's using Sony's hdcam codec and you're right those are full 1920X1080 native chips, should be a great cam - how much is it?
Old    mobster            09-06-2007, 8:42 PM Reply   
Between $6000 & $8000 great specs & cheaper media than P2 cards It has a lot of features of the Panasonic so I'm sure that was Sony's target. It should be out around Dec
Old    SAffer (balti)      Join Date: Feb 2005       09-08-2007, 3:15 PM Reply   
SONY HC7E+TAPE(FOR QUALITY) HARD DISKS CAN BE RISKY

this sony is great as u can buy a waterproof housing for cheap.

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