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Go Back   WakeWorld > >> Boats, Accessories & Tow Vehicles Archive > Archive through May 25, 2007

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Old    Ross Atkins (greenspirit_hydro)      Join Date: May 2007       05-24-2007, 9:08 AM Reply   
I am pricing new boats (mainly Mastercraft) and was wandering if anyone knew of a way to find out exactly what the dealer payed. I bought a new Toyota 4 runner last year, but before I bought the truck my dad showed me a website that broke down the dealers actual cost for the truck and every available option. I can't remember the website, but will ask my dad if anybody is interested, it was like $20 to get on the site and I was able to get the truck at a great price.
Old    Timmy! (timmyb)      Join Date: Apr 2007       05-24-2007, 9:28 AM Reply   
I haven't found one but I have read that there is a lot of markup in them because the dealers have to foot the bill for warranty items - doesn't sound right and I don't know if it's true or not.
Old    Diggs (pdxWAKE) (tyler97217)      Join Date: Aug 2004       05-24-2007, 9:34 AM Reply   
you will not find that anywhere.... that info is kept very close... you do have to realize there is more profit on these boats, but at the same time they sell so many fewer boats than a car dealership sells cars. I am all for a good deal, but you also want them to stay in business to service your boat later....
Old    Dave (millerda31)      Join Date: Dec 2004       05-24-2007, 9:38 AM Reply   
I dont know about boats but with cars you can save yourself $20 by going here.

http://www.kbb.com/

You can see dealer cost here and also add options. Then keep in mind that there is typically a 2 or 3 point credit back to the dealer after the vehicle is sold.
Old    Ross Atkins (greenspirit_hydro)      Join Date: May 2007       05-24-2007, 9:44 AM Reply   
Thanks Dave..I think that site is the site my dad and I used for my Toyota. Auto dealers make most of their money in repairs and part sales, not new car sales. I wander if this holds true for boat dealers. My 06 4-runner sticker price was $33K, but I paid $27,300. Thats 17% off sticker price. Do you think this would be possible for a new boat?
Old    Joe B (jbwaken)      Join Date: Dec 2005       05-24-2007, 9:55 AM Reply   
Keep in mind this is a (80%)seasonal business and like mentioned above boat dealerships sell no where near what a reasonable car dealership sells....Don't get me wrong, nothing clever about paying full price, but you have to compare apples to apples...:-)
Old    E.J. (deuce)      Join Date: Mar 2002       05-24-2007, 10:04 AM Reply   
Yes, 17% off MSRP is possible on a boat. I think 15% is a good area to shoot for.
Old    Ross Atkins (greenspirit_hydro)      Join Date: May 2007       05-24-2007, 10:43 AM Reply   
Thanks for all the insight. Has anyone ever traded in an auto when buying a new boat? I have a cherry 1976 Ford Bronco Ranger, and I can't afford to keep it and buy a new boat. Do you think this would complicate a boat deal too much?
Old    E.J. (deuce)      Join Date: Mar 2002       05-24-2007, 10:49 AM Reply   
I have never even heard of someone trying to get trade value with a vehicle on their boat purchase.
Old    rick ator (mkperceptions)      Join Date: Jan 2007       05-24-2007, 10:53 AM Reply   
trust me they keep the facts on what they pay for a boat very close. it would be nice if someone could break through tho
Old    Shawn (helinut)      Join Date: Apr 2007       05-24-2007, 12:17 PM Reply   
I'd say 10% is probably doable. That all depends on if it's on the floor price or some boat show special you're looking at.
Old    Kevin R Baugh (krbaugh)      Join Date: Mar 2002       05-24-2007, 1:38 PM Reply   
IT also depends on what the dealer is quoting you. If he is quoting you MSRP then you can expect to be able to get the price down. If they are quoting the margin that they need to make to stay in business. Then the amount they will move is MUCH smaller. Much of this will depend on the product line the area you are in and the dealer
Old    Karl De Looff (boarditup)      Join Date: Jan 2004       05-24-2007, 2:10 PM Reply   
I'm a dealer and I won't give numbers, but general rules.

Boats do not have the big holdbacks that cars do. Usually there is an advertising allowance, but that is not that much and you have to spend it to get it back. Figure about $1,000 a boat.

As for margin, that changes from boat to boat. A base boat, for example a base X-1, there is very little margin. If you max out the options, there is more margin on the options.

Boat dealers have very few units to cover the cost of overhead, so they can't give the skinny deals that the auto dealers do. The volume is simply not there. If they did, the value of the boats would then plummet on the used boat market. Look at what Ford did with the Tarus - they sold it for a song to the rental fleets and the resale value took a big hit. Toyota saw Ford's mistake and pushed the Camry as the car with the "highest resale value in its class." Ford has to dump the Tarus and the Camry still lives.

Bottom line - every dealer has the "walk away" price. This is the price where the will let the deal walk away because there is not enough margin to cover overhead and earn a profit. That figure is also dependant upon how much they think you will cost to "service." For best pricing:

Be nice.
Be specific on what you want - exact options.
Be generous with your boat. Dealers like people who will drive for INT tournaments, demos, etc.
Ask for the lowest price and offer 90% of that. Leave your name and phone number and walk away. Wait for the follow up phone call. If the number is decent, take the deal.

Finally, the price of the boat, as long as you can comfortably afford it, is irrevelent. The goot times you have with the boat are priceless. The most miserable people I know are the ones who go around chasing the "deal." They always feel as if they were shafted and someone else got over on them - even if they brag about the "deal" they got. I don't even bother with them - send them down the road. They "cost" too much.
Old    Timmy! (timmyb)      Join Date: Apr 2007       05-24-2007, 2:19 PM Reply   
Thanks for the insight Karl!
Old    Nu Bu (05mobiuslsv)      Join Date: Apr 2006       05-24-2007, 6:07 PM Reply   
Excellent write up Karl.
Old    Chasin7 T (chaser)      Join Date: Sep 2006       05-24-2007, 7:51 PM Reply   
Good info Karl. I like your last point. I think some people seem so concerned about getting the best deal possible. I know someone who is like that in almost everything they buy. I think they get as much enjoyment out of working at getting the best possible price as they will get out of the actual item they are purchasing. In reality, if you can afford to buy a 45-75k+ boat, I wouldn't think you should let 3 or 4K be a deal breaker.
Old    jeffsv211 (jeffsv211)      Join Date: Aug 2006       05-25-2007, 7:25 AM Reply   
WOW! You implying that I should go to a local dealer I trust and develop a relationship with them that results in a mutally satisfactory deal that benifits both me and the dealer. I thought I should spend three to four months of time and energy, drive several hours to different dealers haggle them against each other then threaten to walk if they don't give away the store because after all they are making 50-60K out of me so they should bend over and take it up the ***! PEOPLE! Dealers have overhead, employees, FF&E inventory and flooring cost that they need to recover thru the transaction of you purchasing a product from them. Also keep in mind the internet guys that sell boards, ropes etc. etc. They don't have the overhead they don't generally have the inventory cost, they don't have people coming in and breaking product on the floor. They wait for you to place your order, then order from distrubitors then receive it then ship it to you. BTW the dealer does not keep all of the money from a deal, only the profit. Out of that they need to generate enough cash flow to stay in business during the off season. Support local business or else Wal Mart will be the only place to buy anything.
Old    Brit Rider (brit_rider)      Join Date: May 2004       05-25-2007, 8:51 AM Reply   
Well said Jeff..

Even if you could find what dealers were buying boats for it would be useless.. they still have so many costs on top that you could never know what their true 'cost' is of the boat.

I have always found that building a rapour with the dealership and being a return customer is what gets the best deals long term.
Old    Ross Atkins (greenspirit_hydro)      Join Date: May 2007       05-25-2007, 9:05 AM Reply   
Thanks for the insight Karl , in case you can't see I am giving you a standing ovation! What about my idea of trading in my classic Bronco? Is that really unheard of in the boat biz? Reason I ask I have seen a few boat dealerships, that had a few motorcycles, cars and even planes for sale also. Thanks for sharing.
Old    Bazel (bazel)      Join Date: Oct 2001       05-25-2007, 9:12 AM Reply   
I think the trade would be very subjective to the dealership. Most are not in the business of selling vehicles. You may get lucky and the owner may be looking for the truck.

Just like any trade deal your best bang for the buck would be to sell it privately. Then take the cash to the dealership.
Old    Jim Bogden (bog)      Join Date: Sep 2002       05-25-2007, 9:12 AM Reply   
the only time a boat dealer will take an auto, snowmobiles, etc on trade is if the owner wants it for personal use. It is worth asking though!

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