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Old    Face Planter (mastercraft1995)      Join Date: Nov 2002       05-17-2007, 2:17 PM Reply   
I'm going to sell my Ford F-350 PSD and get a Ford F-350, V-10 with 4:10 to 4:30 gears to pull my boat and haul my camper. I would like to get a 06 or so if I can find one. Does anyone know of any known problems that the truck has? From what I read on them the motor is bullet proof.

Yes, I know the Deisel is the way to go to pull but I don't drive it enough to make up for the high cost of the motor.
Old    Flux (flux)      Join Date: Jun 2003       05-17-2007, 2:28 PM Reply   
What year is your PSD??

I don't pull enough either with my PSD but I will be keeping it, I love the thing, it's a beast.

High motor cost?? Initially yes, and the Oil changes are more expensive, but I think the maintenance costs are offset by the fuel economy, plus you get a bit more power.

If it's running out of warranty then you have a good reason. If it's been reliable then maybe you should hold onto it.

I hear lot's of great things about the V-10 though and few bad things, very good motor, but you will pay at the pump for it.
Old    Face Planter (mastercraft1995)      Join Date: Nov 2002       05-17-2007, 2:45 PM Reply   
It tows like a beast but I need toget out of it. Fuel milage is only going to be about 2MPG difference. It has a full vehicle warranty until 5 years or 75k miles with a $100 decuctable. It only has 41k on the clock right now.

I only drive it about 10k per year.

It's a 2004 CC
Old    C.I.E... AL Bischofbee (allen)      Join Date: Apr 2005       05-17-2007, 2:51 PM Reply   
might want too check that MPG with CIE J-Rod he has a V-10 and loves it but I think his gas mileage is way worse then Evans PS. Don't quote me on that I may not have a clue.
Old    shane (auto)      Join Date: Aug 2002       05-17-2007, 3:11 PM Reply   
You could not give me a V-10, everyone I know got rid of them and bought diesels, very little market for a V-10 in Tejas
Old    Robert Thorson (thor)      Join Date: Oct 2001       05-17-2007, 3:28 PM Reply   
I've got the V-10 motor in my F-350, and I'm lucky to get 9-10 miles per gallon on the freeway when pulling the boat. I love my truck, but I hate the gas mileage when prices are $3.30 per gallon.
Old    Peter_C (peter_c)      Join Date: Sep 2001       05-17-2007, 4:29 PM Reply   
Why wouldn't you just pay off what you got and park it, then drive it when you need it? Taking on a payment for something that sits does not make sense to me.
Old    JimmyF (fulltilt429)      Join Date: Apr 2007       05-17-2007, 5:58 PM Reply   
The 6.0 is a bit of a scary motor, especially out of warranty. Im a Ford Tech and I see alot of 6.0's, however I dont hardly see any 6.8l (v-10) maybe cause they didnt sell that many. The gas mileage does suck, and you dont have a 5 speed trans. Also the exhaust manifolds warp (especially when towing alot), and the coil on plugs fail on cyl's 4 and 5 ( why those cyl's?? Neither ford nor I know.) If you want face PM me with what year v10 you are looking for and I can get a full Technical service bulletin printout for ya. My advice though is stick with the Diesel... youll miss it.
Old    Randy Scagliotti (wakedad33)      Join Date: Oct 2005       05-17-2007, 8:04 PM Reply   
I have the V-10 Dodge, love the towing power, hate the mileage. 9-10 when towing.
Old    Hate N Pain (hatepain)      Join Date: Aug 2006       05-17-2007, 8:21 PM Reply   
Hey Jimmy I sell em and I'm almost positive the V10 is still 5spd just not the Torqeshift. I know us sales guys aren't as smart as you tech's lol
Old    Peter T (deltawake)      Join Date: Sep 2004       05-17-2007, 8:27 PM Reply   
We have a 2000 Excursion with the V-10. 14 MPG on the highway not towing. 11 MPG towing a boat. the engine has 131,000 mikes on it and it hasn't even hiccupped yet. I mean absolutely nothing other than routine maintenance. It's a great engine.

We also have a 2006 F-250 with the PSD. I love that truck! At 65 MPH not towing, it gets 21 MPG. Push it harder, and the mileage drops off. in the city it doesn't do nearly as well. Probably about 13MPG. Towing a boat and keeping it at about 62 it gets about 16 MPG. The truck has power to spare! I've yet to be on any grade where the cruise control can't hold the speed, and that includes towing the boat. The turbo just kicks in and there you go. I am slightly worried about the reliability. The turbo had to be rebuilt at 30 K. Time will tell.
Old    JimmyF (fulltilt429)      Join Date: Apr 2007       05-17-2007, 8:30 PM Reply   
Hatepain actually... I looked it up on FMCdealer.com, were both wrong/right pre04 was the 4r100 for gas motors, 05 was the 1st year they put the Torqueshifts in the gas motors too. Like I said I dont see many of the v-10's.

(Message edited by fulltilt429 on May 17, 2007)
Old    mrbigwake (mrbigwake)      Join Date: Aug 2006       05-17-2007, 8:30 PM Reply   
I have a friend with a 02 250 with the v-10 and he loves it. But the automatic tranny i guess is no good, its on its like third one or something. They have 92,000 and the only problem it had with the motor was it blew a spark plug rite out of the head threads and all! don't now how but i guess the tech said it was common.
Old    Peter T (deltawake)      Join Date: Sep 2004       05-17-2007, 8:31 PM Reply   
"The 6.0 is a bit of a scary motor, especially out of warranty. Im a Ford Tech and I see alot of 6.0's"

Jimmy- Are some years better than others? Are the 2008 improvements going to be better?
Old    JimmyF (fulltilt429)      Join Date: Apr 2007       05-17-2007, 8:42 PM Reply   
Peter the 08's so far as I have seen are sweet, but they dont have a 6.0, they have the new 6.4L. So far has been so good on these. They are very pricey but well worth it in my opinion. In about 6 months they have only had one recall...the well known "flamethrower" problem... kinda cool if you youtube it. http://youtube.com/watch?v=-dKLKm5i2ic
Old    Peter_C (peter_c)      Join Date: Sep 2001       05-17-2007, 11:31 PM Reply   
"the only problem it had with the motor was it blew a spark plug rite out of the head threads and all! don't now how but i guess the tech said it was common."

I know multiple people that have had that problem, including a couple that post on this board. Has Ford completely resolved that issue yet? The best one I heard was the dealership telling one owner it was the fault of whomever put the plugs in and he was going to have to pay...his reply, "The factory, as they are 100K plugs". DOH!
Old    JimmyF (fulltilt429)      Join Date: Apr 2007       05-17-2007, 11:55 PM Reply   
The 5.4's in the F150's do it too. Especially the supercharged ones i.e. lightning, harley. They have a fix for it, basically just a helicoil with thicker /deeper threads.
Old    Peter_C (peter_c)      Join Date: Sep 2001       05-18-2007, 12:54 AM Reply   
Time-sert's not Heli-coil's. Heli-coil's are crap, never use them. The V-10's have had the same problem, but there are less of them. This is the kit that covers them all http://www.timesert.com/html/triton_repair.html

Here is why the problem exists
http://www.timesert.com/images/sparkplug/triton_repair/Tritonstyle.jpg

Have they changed the design and plugs yet? I don't follow every manufacturers changes anymore.
Old    Face Planter (mastercraft1995)      Join Date: Nov 2002       05-18-2007, 3:55 PM Reply   
My PSD has had multiple problems as of late and my wife and I don't trust it. Other than the motor it has been a great truck when it's out of the shop. I was able to get an exteneded warranty out of Ford for free but it still cost $100 per issue and I've had 3 issues since the 3/36 and I'm only at 41k on it. I don't think I should have to pay $100 every 6 weeks to keep it running on a vechicle that only has 41k on it. Plus I only get about 14 mpg unloaded and 11.5 pulling at 70 MPH.

The 6.4 motor scares the heck out of me since it's so new.

Jimmy I'll take you up on that once I sell mine and find one to buy.
Old    Flux (flux)      Join Date: Jun 2003       05-18-2007, 4:08 PM Reply   
That sucks Faceplanter. Seems you got one of the 03-04 models that has/had bugs, it's not uncommon. I only bought my 06 because I read alot about it and there were much much less problems as they had upgraded faulty parts and redid the tuning. I am sorry to hear about all that and don't blame you one bit for wanting to get out of it.

I have been keeping an eye on the 6.4l forums and have heard very little thus far about bad performance. A few things on the regen process (flamethrower or losing power briefly), but that is about it and no meltdowns or problematic ones thus far, it seems solid and more and more folks are jumping into them. I am very happy with my 06 and I will keep it for a long time if all keeps going well with it, 5000 and one small hiccup fixed for free.

I honestly think I would be looking to ditch that truck too. I suspect you have had EGR problems, maybe injectors, or turbo issues.
Old    JTW (sangerlover)      Join Date: Sep 2005       05-18-2007, 5:23 PM Reply   
I got rid of my 03 6.0l psd for the same reasons. I had lost confidence in it. Bought a new 07 chevy gasser but mileage is miserable at this point. 10MPG city driving.
Old    Hate N Pain (hatepain)      Join Date: Aug 2006       05-18-2007, 7:31 PM Reply   
I'll second Jimmy on the 08's their super nice and extremely capable. One nice thing they did on those of many was that they tested real world just as they did the 7.3 so you can trust them some more. We just today had a guy trade in a really nice Chevy 4500 with all of 700 miles on it for our new F450. I think that truck is and is going to be a homerun for us.
Old    Rob (lowdrag)      Join Date: Jan 2006       05-18-2007, 9:11 PM Reply   
I guess I'm one of the guys with an '03 or '04 that has a lot of faith in them. '04 with 100K on the clock and not so much as a hiccup from the motor. My dad owned the truck prior to me. He has a construction company and I know that truck never spent a day without at least 2000 pounds or more of tools and equipment fuel in the bed and it often was pulling a piece of equipment behind it as well. I guess I'm one of the lucky ones. That or I have to believe what I heard a PSD tech say once. His opinion was that most of the problems he saw were because people didn't run them hard enough.
Old    rick ator (mkperceptions)      Join Date: Jan 2007       05-19-2007, 6:25 PM Reply   
I use to work on the 6 cyl cummins turbo diesels our whole fleet at fedex had them and never had any problems.
Old    JimmyF (fulltilt429)      Join Date: Apr 2007       05-19-2007, 9:30 PM Reply   
Your tech is absolutley right Rob, The main problem is people dont REALLY drive them. They are the first Ford with the variable vane turbos, and the problem is if you just use your truck for short trips you get alot of mouisture and coking build up in the turbos, that moisuture eventually rusts and siezes the variable vanes. However if you really beat on the truck and use it for its intended purpose, and not grocery getter or soccer mom truck, the moisture and coking doesnt build up and they seem to be lasting alot longer and have better performance overall.
Old    Face Planter (mastercraft1995)      Join Date: Nov 2002       05-19-2007, 11:32 PM Reply   
I went and drove the Dodge 6.7, 3500 today it was nice but I don't think I'll get one. When I asked the salesman what people where getting for mileage he said 20 around town 25 on the freeway and 16 to 19 loaded. He is so full of poo.

I also drove a 2008 Ford F-250, V-10 with 4.10 gears none of the places had any 350's with the V-10. It was ok but I thought it wold be faster. I still think I'm going to go with a 05 or 06 V-10.

Flux, I've had EGR's, injectors, turbo and oil cooler, bed plate oil leak, multiple other oil leaks, rear main, oil pressure switch and a few other things that I can't hink of right now. I also think my front hub's/ball joints or something in the stearing is going out.
Old    Augustus McCrae (whtlghtn49)      Join Date: May 2007       05-19-2007, 11:43 PM Reply   
Face planter, if you really want to trade the PSD, at least go for a Cummins or Duramax, I would highly recommend against a big gas engine in a truck. We were forced to take my friend's '01 Chevy w/ 6.0L gas engine on a canoe trip to Big Bend last year. We were pulling an extremely light weight home-made trailer with only 2 canoes on it, yet we managed only 8 miles per gallon for the entire trip. It was sickening. I finally began driving, and up every hill I kicked the cruise control off of 65 just to avoid downshifting, which resulted in a slight improvement in mileage, but not much.

I have a 2001 Duramax with a chip, and made the same trip later that year, same trailer, etc. I averaged 17.5 mpg for the trip, and never once did the truck downshift. I guess I'm partial to Duramax's because I own one, but if you pull your boat enough, I don't think you could go wrong with the Cummins. They are literally built for towing. However, if you seldomly tow, yet want to use the diesel as your daily driver, the Duramax's are the best road trucks. I've known of too many folks that have had problems with the Ford 6.0L PSD to recommend them to anyone, although I would still take it versus the V-10.

You've still got a lot of trade-in value on that PSD...use it and try out another diesel! I really think you would eventually regret the V-10 purchase. Just my 2 cents!
Old    Tyler McCurdy (tyboarder03)      Join Date: Nov 2003       05-20-2007, 10:48 AM Reply   
Giant gasser trucks will most definitely take a HUGE hit on resale especially where gas is heading. Faceplanter so do you think by getting a gasser you'll get better mileage than 16-19 loaded even unloaded? I don't
Old    Peter_C (peter_c)      Join Date: Sep 2001       05-20-2007, 11:04 AM Reply   
"01 Chevy w/ 6.0L gas engine on a canoe trip to Big Bend last year. We were pulling an extremely light weight home-made trailer with only 2 canoes on it, yet we managed only 8 miles per gallon for the entire trip."

Big blocks getter better milage than the smaller motors when even slightly loaded. Not even close to as much downshifting either, due to having 100 ft pounds more torque than the 6.0L.
Old    Augustus McCrae (whtlghtn49)      Join Date: May 2007       05-20-2007, 4:59 PM Reply   
I agree Peter. Ya know, when I bought my Duramax, I was really contemplating getting the same exact 2500HD with just the 6.0L V-8, and saving a couple thousand bucks. Though I pull trailers only occasionally, I am so glad I opted for the diesel...
Old    Face Planter (mastercraft1995)      Join Date: Nov 2002       05-21-2007, 9:04 AM Reply   
I probably wont buy a Dodge unless I can get a smokin deal on one. 07, 5.9, SLT's are going 33,300 or so around here. My wife didn't like the Dodge at all though. I drove a D-Max and the 6.0 yesterday. D-Max was nice but it only has a pay load of 3500 pounds and I need more than that. The Dodge has 4400 and the Ford has 4300. I need a dually if I get a Chevy and I'm not going to buy a dually.

The thing that I'm running into is I have allot of 7-11 trips so to say and the truck doesn't get hot during the trip. I only pull in the summer about 3k miles and we take the camper to the Mt's in the winter. It's not good for deisels to have all of those short trips like that.

When the PSD runs and I think I just got a bad one it runs very strong. I do have friends with them and they haven't had any problems with them. I was just the lucky one that got the piece of crap.

Tyler the salesmans was full of crap in the mileage thing. If you search the internet most people are getting about 13 to 15 unloaded and 11-13 loaded with the 6.7's. 5.9 are about 1.5 miles tot he gallon better both loaded and unloaded.
Old    Face Planter (mastercraft1995)      Join Date: Nov 2002       05-21-2007, 9:11 AM Reply   
I re did the figures and this is what I came up with.


Miles Gas Price Gallons
12000 3.4 11 mpg $3,706 1090

12000 3.09 14 mpg $2,746 888

$942 more for gas

Motor Cost
$6,900
$600
$6,300
6 years
Old    C.I.E..... Evan (guido)      Join Date: Jul 2002       05-21-2007, 9:13 AM Reply   
My '06 PSD has 13.5k miles on it now. Not even a hickup. I changed over to Redline Synthetic oil at 10k and I drive it like I stole it. It's just kinda the way I drive. I love hearing the turbo spool. I also avoid short trips where it wont get up to temp. We'll see how it plays out. I've been planning on holding onto this truck almost indefinitely.

Diesel at $2.89/gallon and 16MPG beats the heck out of my old truck at $3.59/gallon and 10MPG.
Old     matt c (curtisco24)      Join Date: Dec 2005       05-21-2007, 9:35 AM Reply   
Those diesels should be getting close to 20 unloaded highway, and mid teens heavily loaded. That v-10 will probably get 8-10 around town and 5-7 towing. That is a big difference. I think getting another diesel is the best idea. It will be awful hard to get anything out of the v-10 if you don't like it.
Old    Flux (flux)      Join Date: Jun 2003       05-21-2007, 9:38 AM Reply   
Faceplanter, it sounds like you had every problem and then some with your 6.0l, and I am sorry to hear it. It seems that most get a good one, but there were some serious lemons in there. I won't defend Ford on that, they screwed more than a few people.

Like Evan though, my PSD has been flawless and a real joy. I park it rather than short trip it, i have an around town vehicle and keep the PSD for hauling and road trips. I make sure to boost it and beat on it a little bit to clean out the turbo and EGR loop.

I also agree on the MPG thing. Maybe 20 if you cruise empty and 1800 RPM's with a tailwind. Good luck though, I often find myself doing 85 without noticing and have to let off, that kills your fuel economy. I know there are some programmers that will get you some extra fuel economy, but I like my warranty so I don't mess with that stuff.


Have you ever thought about getting an around town truck and keeping the PSD for long hauls?? Maybe the around town stuff is killing your ball joints, brakes, EGR etc. Maybe hold off a year on the new Ford PSD and let them work it out. By all accounts, everyone is pretty thrilled with the ride, comfort, and power.

The V-10 is a nice engine and has a good amount of power, but it will never have that feeling when the diesel spools up and the truck takes off like a rocket.
Old    C.I.E. J-Rod (jarrod)      Join Date: May 2003       05-21-2007, 10:09 AM Reply   
I bought a V10 F350 Crew, long bed. Its a beast.

The same truck, used, was 7-10,000K more money. Even with the gas savings on deisel, it would have taken a LONG time to get my return on that kind of money, considering I only frive one day a week to dirt bike or pull a boat.

If you're driving every day, the V10 will break the bank. It is fricken EXPENSIVE to drive.

"We have a 2000 Excursion with the V-10. 14 MPG on the highway not towing. 11 MPG towing a boat."

That's impressive considering my 99 Chevy 1/2 produced very similar numbers. I have never seen anything even close to that out of my V10.
Old    shane (auto)      Join Date: Aug 2002       05-21-2007, 10:11 AM Reply   
Jarrod, I have realized that most people calcualte mileage like they drive, poorly.
Old    C.I.E..... Evan (guido)      Join Date: Jul 2002       05-21-2007, 11:56 AM Reply   
I did the MPG vs. Cost of Purchase analysis when I bought my truck and figured that the diesel paid for itself in the first 4 years of ownership. I do drive it around 20k/year so the cost of fuel adds up. Not only that, but the resale is soo much better on the diesel I wasn't concerned with the initial cost.
Old    Rick H (blastmaster)      Join Date: Aug 2001       05-21-2007, 3:03 PM Reply   
I have 06 250SD with v10 & 430 ratio Off Road package. Drive it pretty hard @ 70-80 on freeway and cruise around town. I get 10-11 pretty much all the time. What is really weird is I was in Carson City NV a few weeks ago and filled up @ Am/PM and got like 15-16. Do you think it's the Ca blend gas? Seems to make no difference if use reg gas or premium. I did not get the PS because i only drive 1 mile to work in the morning and it wouldn't even heat up. Ford use to have on its website a operating cost spread sheet that showed the you had to run 80K miles before you started to see the $$ difference between the diesel and gas due to the higher price or the motor. Here in Sacto until just recently diesel was 15-40 per gallon more than gas. I love my truck and it serves us well except for paying the price at the pump.
Rick

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