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Old    Britt Hogland (bhog)      Join Date: Jul 2006       12-11-2006, 12:27 PM Reply   
Im just looking over some of these post and Everybody is stuck on mastercraft and supra. I have ridden behind many boats but the super air 210 BY FAR IS THE NICEST WAKE. The X-1, X star are nice wakes but not what these post are making them out to be. Give me some feed back
Old    K.B.C.            12-11-2006, 12:30 PM Reply   
uh oh, you just opened the can
Old    Billy (woreout)      Join Date: Aug 2006       12-11-2006, 12:41 PM Reply   
Too bad they dont build it anymore. (the one your talking about anyway.)
Old    Cliff Griffin (seattle)      Join Date: Mar 2002       12-11-2006, 1:00 PM Reply   
Britt,

Most 210 owners don't get too wrapped up those conversations. Why you ask... we don't really need to validate what everyone else has known for the last ten or so years. The 210 puts out the hardest, and most vertical wake you can find in a wake boat. You will hear those that say they don't like the wakes characteristics, but
you will never hear anyone say the wake is lacking in it's ability to put you in the air.

As far as build quality... again, you will be hard pressed to find anyone that would argue that Nautique is one of if not the best in the business.
Old    Britt Hogland (bhog)      Join Date: Jul 2006       12-11-2006, 1:01 PM Reply   
Even there cross over boat 211 puts out a FAT WAKE. I have no relation with correct craft I just dont see why more people on WW dont post up about them.
Old    Billy (woreout)      Join Date: Aug 2006       12-11-2006, 1:07 PM Reply   
Cuz CC doesnt build as many boats as other Mfgs. So I guess there is fewer people to post. The 211 wake is very sub par compared to the 210 wake.
Old    PLR (dbdb)      Join Date: Oct 2005       12-11-2006, 1:42 PM Reply   
where is red when you need him
Old    san210dude            12-11-2006, 1:44 PM Reply   
I lost my password...
Old    PLR (dbdb)      Join Date: Oct 2005       12-11-2006, 1:48 PM Reply   
Red...is that you?
Old    Billy (woreout)      Join Date: Aug 2006       12-11-2006, 1:56 PM Reply   
Robert Earl Keen sounds like a name off of Americas Most Wanted. If you've seen Robert Earl Keen contact authorities immediatly!! He has a tatoo of Walt Maloon on his lower back and usually is seen wearing CC goggles. He is harmless but a great con man. Help us take this punk off the streets before he strikes again.
Old    san210dude            12-11-2006, 1:58 PM Reply   
Yup, it's me. I deleted the cache on my computer and can't remember the password to that account, I have so many...LOL
Old    Jon (jon4pres)      Join Date: May 2004       12-11-2006, 1:59 PM Reply   
If you want correct craft love check out.
planetnautique.com
correctcraftfan.com
the2001.com
superairnautiquesarethegreatestboatsevermade.com
godcreatednautiquesjustbeforetheperfectionthingend ed.com

Red was such a cool name now you have to be Robert Earl. That sucks
Old    redsan210            12-11-2006, 2:04 PM Reply   
Happy?
Old    redsan210            12-11-2006, 2:25 PM Reply   
The people who don't like the wake characteristics usually have piss-poor form and they pay for it behind the CC SAN 210 and get away with behind most other boats.

Ya, some people who can actually ride don't like the wake because it boots them to far out in the flats and others will complain about the trough, but for a small crew it's still the best boat out there. Real rider's don't need anything bigger either, it just means more time to wait in between riders and more gas money.

I will try out the new 210 on January 2, 2007 for myself to decide if someone at CC needs to have their head examined or what.
Old    travis moye (driving)      Join Date: Jan 2003       12-11-2006, 2:58 PM Reply   
So almost every single professional rider on the planet has piss-poor form?
Old    redsan210            12-11-2006, 2:59 PM Reply   
Hey Travis,
I have one question for you, can you read?

If the answer is no, I really don't have any other way of communicating with you on this forum, sorry.

You are just mad because you forked out all that cash on the X-Star, but still can't go pro...

(Message edited by redsan210 on December 11, 2006)
Old    redsan210            12-11-2006, 3:05 PM Reply   
You could always just buy an Epic. Then go wakeboarding after a Nautique jump starts it.

Upload
Old    TK (swab791)      Join Date: Mar 2005       12-11-2006, 3:13 PM Reply   
Hey Britt,

If the CC wake is SO GREAT. Then why don't you own one. Maybe a NEW thread on MOOMBA vs CC wake is in order. Never heard that one before.
Old    mendo247            12-11-2006, 3:15 PM Reply   
that is the perfect example of why people dont talk about corect crafts...
Old    walt            12-11-2006, 3:33 PM Reply   

quote:

Hey Travis,
I have one question for you, can you read?




I'g going to go out on a limb here and say that Red Foxx has no idea who Travis is.
Old    redsan210            12-11-2006, 3:38 PM Reply   
Ya, I do. I still have to ask the question if he can read or not. I did say "usually", didn't I? The pros will ride in what ever is given to them as my above picture shows.
Old    redsan210            12-11-2006, 3:48 PM Reply   
Also, he works for Mastercraft.

Also, why can't he post his professional opinion about the boat?
Upload
Old    walt            12-11-2006, 3:57 PM Reply   

quote:

Also, he works for Mastercraft.




How is that relevant ?


quote:

Also, why can't he post his professional opinion about the boat?




I guess he didn't feel like it.
Old    redsan210            12-11-2006, 4:02 PM Reply   
It's relevant because it shows that he may have an ulterior motive to bash. He does R&D for MC, not CC. To prepare for a pro event it would make sense to train behind the boat that pays to pull those events, right? Train on a crappy wake to compete on a crappy wake, train on a great wake to compete on a great wake, go wakeboarding on what ever you can, when ever you can.


NSS, ya, I guess he didn't feel like it.
Old    walt            12-11-2006, 4:07 PM Reply   
You got all of that from (So almost every single professional rider on the planet has piss-poor form?) ?

I read that as a question to you about your comment and in no way a bash on CC or anyone else.
Old    Cliff Griffin (seattle)      Join Date: Mar 2002       12-11-2006, 4:13 PM Reply   
For clarification,

I said most 210 owners don't get wrapped up in these types of conversations.
Old    Mike (ponyh8r)      Join Date: Dec 2004       12-11-2006, 4:39 PM Reply   
I don't like to do this, but I am going to go out on a limb here and hang with red. Sorry Travis, but I think you are wrong in your statement.

Most boarders (not pros) that don't like the 210 (at least those that have ridden behind mine) complain that the boat throws them funny. The wake throws them funny because most of the time they have weak form or a soft progressive edge. Almost every rider that has never ridden behind one, that does not ride well, are those that hit it wrong. Now, for the most part, the transition is easy. I do believe that the 210's wake will exaggerate any flaw in a cut into the wake.

Also, plenty of pros love the 210. Many own one.
Old    mendo247            12-11-2006, 4:39 PM Reply   

quote:

I said most 210 owners don't get wrapped up in these types of conversations




LMAO!!
Old    Manny (mrm2083)      Join Date: Nov 2005       12-11-2006, 5:00 PM Reply   
The 210 is a great wake, boat they're are definitely other boats up there with it, x1, xstar, vlx, etc. I don't get why people always have to bash other boats to show that there's is good, like red foxx's post bashing epic
Old    Tyler McCurdy (tyboarder03)      Join Date: Nov 2003       12-11-2006, 5:33 PM Reply   
Amen
Old    Darren Yearsley (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       12-11-2006, 5:49 PM Reply   
Well I love Red but I totally disagree with him and totally concur with Trav. I don't have access to speak to the pro's like Travis does but the few that I know they prefer a rampier wake with more transition that the SAN puts out. Generally the sub-pro rider prefers the SAN wake because the steepness allows them to get great pop without loading and releasing to the same degree.
Old     (bwog21)      Join Date: Aug 2006       12-11-2006, 5:55 PM Reply   
i just like to wakeboard i could care less how the wake is, I ride behind an X7 and love it. A small wake will teach good form to go big. Try land a HS Front Flip in the flats off a 2ft wake. Just so some respect for the sport not who has the best boat. My .02
Old    Josh B (joshugan)      Join Date: Apr 2005       12-11-2006, 6:09 PM Reply   
I think the moral is that there are possible pros and cons to the wake just like there are possible pros and cons to any boat's wake. I personally prefer the SAN but can have a good time on just about any wake.
Old    Bill (gangster_wake)      Join Date: Aug 2005       12-11-2006, 6:17 PM Reply   
Upload





perfect wake...
Old    Mike G (mike_gilbert)      Join Date: Sep 2004       12-11-2006, 6:30 PM Reply   
who likes pie?
Old    Dave (captain_542)      Join Date: Oct 2006       12-11-2006, 6:47 PM Reply   
apple or cherry?
Old    Sparky Jay (wake_upppp)      Join Date: Nov 2003       12-11-2006, 7:04 PM Reply   
ala-mode here please.
Old    Red Sovine (san210nut)      Join Date: Sep 2006       12-11-2006, 8:49 PM Reply   
Hey now, I know copying or something like that is the best form of flattery but there is only one Red on here and you ain't it. Way to argue though...
Old    travis moye (driving)      Join Date: Jan 2003       12-12-2006, 3:29 AM Reply   
Sorry man, I was just kinda kidding. That's why I don't say a lot on here. I'm mainly just a lurker. But, my boy Red must have some hostility he needs to get rid of. If I'm the guy he needs to do it on...let it out brother.
Old    Britt Hogland (bhog)      Join Date: Jul 2006       12-12-2006, 5:44 AM Reply   
guys didnt mean to start a huge argunment. here is the real reason. Picked her up on SaturdayUpload
Upload
Old    Ian Brown (wakereviews)      Join Date: Sep 2006       12-12-2006, 6:23 AM Reply   
You better have some good form or else you'll hate it! haha.
Old    E.J. (deuce)      Join Date: Mar 2002       12-12-2006, 6:32 AM Reply   
Wake is terrible, design in general is terrible. Closer to a bass boat than a dedicated tow boat. In fact, so bad....they scrapped them totally for 2007......

Word is that Tracker boats are currently in negotiations with Correct Craft to purchase the Super Sport Hull molds. You throw a foot activated trolling motor on the front, a few live wells and a seat in the bow and you have the Tracker Team Jimmy Houston. Look for them at your local boat show in 2008.
Old    Billy (woreout)      Join Date: Aug 2006       12-12-2006, 6:57 AM Reply   
Way to come back RED. When you realized you put your foot in your mouth about Travis, you claim it was someone else. Funny how there has been no posts from you til now or at least under Red Sovine.
Travis spends more time behind the wheel of Wakeboard boats than most, he drives all brands for competitions. Yes he is a MC guy and he doesnt pay for a boat because he is such a great driver. Sooo good other Mfgs ask him to drive for their sponsored events. Oh yeah, he can read. I have never heard him bash other brands, and I'm sure he could give a little criticism of all brands including MC. At least he has the knuts to post under his real name.
Old    E.J. (deuce)      Join Date: Mar 2002       12-12-2006, 7:07 AM Reply   
Oh...and sorry, Britt congrats on the boat. It looks VERY clean. I am sure you are going to love it.
Old    Mike G (mike_gilbert)      Join Date: Sep 2004       12-12-2006, 7:46 AM Reply   
Britt, love the boat, black and white looks so clean, I have always been a fan of the 99 SAN graphics. Enjoy it
Old    "G" (grant_west)      Join Date: Jun 2005       12-12-2006, 10:22 AM Reply   
Travis is a cool guy and has lots of exp with lots of boats I donít feel like he has any hidden agenda as Red suggested. And I have never seen him state anything other than his opinion.

Hey Red I donít pay to much attention to your post's infact I try to steer clear from you because any thread your involved in seems to have a weird vibe. I have talked with several Planet Nautique and Wake World people off line and everyone seems to have the same feeling about you. Lets just say that itís not a good one. I donít know if you care what people think about you but you might want to take a look at how you are conducting yourself online. Unless your going to change your screen name every five min's people have a long memory when it comes to how you conduct yourself here. I tried to send this to you e-mail but it bounced back.
Old    Flux (flux)      Join Date: Jun 2003       12-12-2006, 10:36 AM Reply   
Hey Bill, that boat have a tan stripe?? Possibly nicest looking SANTE ever??
Old    GD (greatdane)      Join Date: Feb 2001       12-12-2006, 2:46 PM Reply   
Wakes are a matter of personal preference.

My preference is for a boat that makes a nice vert wake without having to sack the crap out of it. This is why the SAN has always been my favorite hull. I occasionally get the chance to ride behind Wes's SAN and I got to say that I love the wake for boarding and surfing and gas consumption. So, for me, CC is currently "the company that previously built the best wake building hull".
Old    travis moye (driving)      Join Date: Jan 2003       12-12-2006, 8:46 PM Reply   
Greatdane, that's what I tell people all the time. I was just mainly joking before, but to me, if you like the wake, I don't care if it's a 18 foot Cobalt, then it's the best boat for you.

And, Britt, that is a nice looking boat. Looks extremely clean. That boat brings back some memories. I had a couple of buddies with those back in the day. Enjoy.
Old    David Mason (rocketman)      Join Date: Feb 2003       12-12-2006, 10:02 PM Reply   
Britt,

I'm with AZwakeboarder540 also. 99 SAN graphics are definitely the coolest. I also like the full wrap around seating that they had back then. You're looks really clean.

Hopefully I can afford one someday.
Old    Josh B (joshugan)      Join Date: Apr 2005       12-12-2006, 11:57 PM Reply   
The first Super Air I ever set foot in was the 99 and it still has a special place in my heart. I still remember when the owner told me to start it for him as he'd backed it in. Ya, it was pretty much one of the best feeling I've ever had to hold the wheel, turn the key, and watch a SAN come to life. I also think the 99 dash is better than anything that has come since. (especially 07 )

Britt, yours looks great. I'm sure you'll have a blast.

I'm with David. Someday, if I'm really lucky, I'll be able to afford my own SAN.
Old    Kevin Hoye (wakebrdr38)      Join Date: Sep 2006       12-13-2006, 9:52 AM Reply   
i thought the pic of the nautique jumpin the epic was hillarious! and not cus i own a nautique, as a pr major and wanting to work with brand awareness i can say that isnt a pic epic really wants circulating around when a lot of people arent sure about them to begin with. i liked it purely for the pr aspect.
Old    Train (ttrigo)      Join Date: Dec 2004       12-13-2006, 9:57 AM Reply   
I dont think a dead battery in a boat, has anything to do with the quality of a boat. my friends mom left the dome light on in her corvette for two days. the battery was dead when she went to start it. does that mean the corvette is a bad car?? c'mon....
Old    Paul (psudy)      Join Date: Dec 2003       12-13-2006, 10:00 AM Reply   
I don't get it? Because it has a dead battery, it is bad PR for Epic? I doubt they give a crap.
Old    Kevin Hoye (wakebrdr38)      Join Date: Sep 2006       12-13-2006, 10:04 AM Reply   
well if you guys actually study it like i do you would understand. its weird how that works, im not sayin they are bad boats because of it, im saying there is not a doubt in my mind that someone will see that pic and think something negative. come on guys look what people argue about on here. it doesnt make sense to us but it occurs.
Old    Kevin Hoye (wakebrdr38)      Join Date: Sep 2006       12-13-2006, 10:07 AM Reply   
its all about brand image, especially when you are just starting out. i know ill get flamed for what i wrote, but at least i can back up my statements. something the rest of this forum cant do with whos boat/ wake is better, that crap is just opinions and egos.
Old    Diggs (pdxWAKE) (tyler97217)      Join Date: Aug 2004       12-13-2006, 10:09 AM Reply   
I am not dissing on either boat (love them both), but not sure that jumping a boat should create any bad stigma about a boat manufacturer. Maybe the operator of the boat or person that left a power drawing item on, but not the boat.

Maybe there is more to the story than I know....
Old    Kevin Hoye (wakebrdr38)      Join Date: Sep 2006       12-13-2006, 10:29 AM Reply   
see, you and i think about that stuff, you and i both know that it has nothing to do with the boat, however, like i said, others perceive it differently, and i dont think those others are any way near a majority, but just take for example how the pic was used on here in the first place. its all so damn silly i feel like im wasting my life away when i read these things. the only reason i do is just to see if anyone mentions the old school nautiques, its always cool to read about old school nautique projects, but they usually dont end up on these bull $#it topics...im out yall have fun arguin about whose boat is better..whos stick is bigger or whatever else appeases yall.
Old    Brad (spoonman)      Join Date: Aug 2005       12-13-2006, 11:05 AM Reply   
how do we know that the cc was not the one getting jumpstarted?
Old    Byrd (byrd)      Join Date: Dec 2005       12-13-2006, 11:13 AM Reply   
Good observation, Brad, I was thinking the same thing but didnt want to get caught up in all the BS that is bound to come from the Nautique fans...
Old    Eric (wakeboardin2k4)      Join Date: Sep 2006       12-13-2006, 1:45 PM Reply   
I love my 86 nautique 2001, but when you see these pictures you wonder why there is not as much love for CC. They have not really changed up their design at all. Yes the 2001's make a sick wake, but mastercraft and malibus changes in the hull have really caused the buzz and the increased sales over CC. Not trying to hate on Nautiques but thats my opinionUpload
Upload
Old    kevin mcginty (kmcginty)      Join Date: Sep 2005       12-13-2006, 3:03 PM Reply   
I still ride behind a fishing boat with a 90 merc. Only ballast is 180# and 12oz.
Old    supra for me (supra24ssv)      Join Date: Mar 2006       12-13-2006, 3:21 PM Reply   
wow, those pics say alot
Old    stillstandin            12-13-2006, 4:41 PM Reply   
I try not to bash boat brands, and get into stupid arguments, but I will never own a CC due to my experiences with them. One friend had his 210 lemoned because of all the problems with it, and its replacement is not much better. He showed me different colored screws in the same area, stripped out screws, and just some bad workmenship. The only other 210 ive been besides that one had some of the same things. Before everyone starts yelling, this is my only experience with CC, and because of this, I never understood why they were one of the "Big 3".
Old    K.B.C.            12-13-2006, 4:41 PM Reply   
yeah it says the 2001 is one hell of a wake boat.

as the saying goes, if it ain't broke don't fix it.

that old ass 2001 puts out a better wake than a lot of the newer dd "wake boats". So much for newer is better.
Old    Mike G (mike_gilbert)      Join Date: Sep 2004       12-13-2006, 4:47 PM Reply   
Craig, if you werent trying to bash or get into an argument why post what you did? Different colored screws? bad workmanship?? We have owned CCs since 99, and are on on 2nd CC now and I must say the quality on both has been second to none.
Old    Train (ttrigo)      Join Date: Dec 2004       12-13-2006, 5:19 PM Reply   
was the 2001 not built to put out a small wake? just curious, not bashing in any way. seems weird how most tournament boats back then were designed to put out the smallest wake possible.
Old    supra for me (supra24ssv)      Join Date: Mar 2006       12-13-2006, 5:30 PM Reply   
thomas, my point exactly
it was either a bad ski boat which it was designed to be, or is a bad wakeboard boat

i have to say, i have never been behind one, so i honestly don't know

(Message edited by supra24ssv on December 13, 2006)
Old    walt            12-13-2006, 5:43 PM Reply   

quote:

seems weird how most tournament boats back then were designed to put out the smallest wake possible.




It was designed to be a waterskiing boat so there's nothing weird about designing it to produce a small ski wake.

On the other hand it has a really narrow beam so it makes a great wake with weight.
Old    andrew fillers (atf8611)      Join Date: Nov 2006       12-13-2006, 6:05 PM Reply   
i just bought a 2001. so your saying that i shouldnt expect much of a wake untill i put in a ballast system? i was thinking the same thing about it being a ski boat. cant wait to get it on the water. i still havent heard a single negative comment about it.
Old    Eric (wakeboardin2k4)      Join Date: Sep 2006       12-13-2006, 6:10 PM Reply   
The 2001 puts out a great ski wake when you are pulling at 34mph or higher, especially if you have the ford 351 engine. If you are going at 23mph, with 1500lbs, and you have the PCM 454 then your going to produce a big wake.
Old    GD (greatdane)      Join Date: Feb 2001       12-13-2006, 6:14 PM Reply   
The SAN was not built for wakeboarding. It was designed as a family (v-drive) ski boat.

Go figure -- for some reason, most "wakeboard specific" hulls have been flops.
Old    andrew fillers (atf8611)      Join Date: Nov 2006       12-13-2006, 6:20 PM Reply   
i have the 351. does the engine make that much of a difference at wakeboarding speeds?
Old    Eric (wakeboardin2k4)      Join Date: Sep 2006       12-13-2006, 6:44 PM Reply   
only the added weight of the 454 helps with wakeboarding. Its just a little extra fat to help sink the boat. I wonder what the actual weight difference is between the two.
Old    Josh B (joshugan)      Join Date: Apr 2005       12-14-2006, 12:18 AM Reply   
andrew, I have the 351 in my 88 2001 and it's fine. I run with two side sacks and love the wake! (I try to keep weight nearer to the middle and front, otherwise it's too vert for me.)

Craig, I agree with Az completely. I've towed in three different broken down Mastercrafts, so should I form my opinion on that? It's a bummer that your friend's boat was a lemon and I could see what that would turn him and you off to their boats. But I'd say about 99.9% of CC owners have had different results.

As for whether the 2001 throws a good slalom wake or a good wakeboard wake, my Dad was a three event skier in the 80s and had his choice of any slalom boat but went with the Ski Nautique 2001. A lot of other boats relied (still rely?) on spray pockets to make the wake washier but CC did not. Like has been said, at 34 it's a killer slalom wake and at 23, if you like a vert wake, then only the (pre 07)SAN will give you a better one.
Old    D_dogg (outlaw_78)      Join Date: Nov 2006       12-14-2006, 1:50 AM Reply   
im a big 210 fan. was obsessed with them for years before i ever owned one. honestly i am abit dissapointed with some quality aspects and i had major reliability issues on a new boat that took way to long to get sorted out (i thought i got a lemon).

as for the wake, if you are riding well there is nothing better (i can only compare to heavily loaded vlx, 220 or ssv) and it dosent even need much weight.

and it looks like what a boat should look like, not some big barge ass thing
Old    Eric (wakeboardin2k4)      Join Date: Sep 2006       12-14-2006, 3:36 AM Reply   
This is an assumption, but we all know what happens when someone ass-u-me-s something. I have only skied behind a 2001 with the big block 454, but at like 30-32mph trying to learn the slalom course its kinda difficult cause the wake is still kinda peaky and hard up until you hit like 34 mph. Maybe that is not the case with the 351? I don't know? Im just thinkin that might be the case?
Old    Byrd (byrd)      Join Date: Dec 2005       12-14-2006, 6:48 AM Reply   
Josh, broken down boats of any manufacturer are most likely a result of poor upkeep after teh sale not manufacturer defect. Comparing that to a brand new boat off the line is not the same thing.... The facts are that boats are not mass produced like autos, and as such human interference or error is usually the cause for something like this. CC's are built well, but evidently they had an upset or inexperienced employee.
Old     matt c (curtisco24)      Join Date: Dec 2005       12-14-2006, 7:10 AM Reply   
It was my understanding that the 2001 did not produce the ski wake correct craft was looking for in the 80's. That is the story I get from skiers in my area. Pretty neat how 20 years later it is a great wakeboard boat.
Old    stillstandin            12-14-2006, 9:16 AM Reply   
I agree with what is said, most CC owners are very happy with their boat. It is unfortunate, within a small group of friends these experiences happened twice, and it turned off a group of young guys to every buying a CC product. I in no way meant to say "CC's are crap" I know every boat manufacture can have a bad apple know and again. I was just posting my expierence so far with their product.

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