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Old    bigair21            08-16-2006, 4:40 PM Reply   
ok, I need the help of all of the experts here. What would you think would be a fair selling price for this set-up.

2005 CORRECT CRAFT SUPER AIR 210 TEAM EDITION, 22' " NATIQUE " W/ EXTRAS. THIS IS THE ONE!! BEST WAKE EVER! PCM EXCALIBUR 5.7L 330HP ENGINE. 35 HOURS. COLLAPSABLE FLIGHT CONTROL TOWER, 3 BALLASTS, PERFECT PASS, 4 DEAFCON III TOWER SPEAKERS, 2 BOW, 4 HELM SPEAKERS (10 TOTAL), POLK/MOMO W/CROSSOVER, 320 WATT AMP, 10" SUBWOOFER, JUMP SEAT, EXTRA COOL LIGHT BARS FACING FRONT AND REAR, CUSTOM MATCHING BIMINI, 4 CLEATS, AUDIO INPUT JACKS W/HOT PLUGS, MP3, DEPTH FINDER, HEATER, SHOWER, DUAL BATTERIES, DIGITAL GAUGES, CUSTOM CODED KEYLESS IGNITION and SOFT TOUCH SWITCHES, TOWER MOUNTED REAR VIEW MIRROR, FLIP-UP DRIVER SEAT, 12 VOLT RECEPTACLES FOR FOR CHARGING PHONES ECT, WAKEBOARD RACKS, REAR AND TOWER PYLON TO TOW FROM, BOW WALK THRU FILLER CUSHION, WALK THRU AIR CURTAIN, INTERIOR GRAB RAILS, REAR PLATFORM, AIR/TEAM GRAPHICS, GREAT STORAGE, 3 UNDER SEAT COOLERS, ALL SAFETY EQUIPMENT, INCLUDING LIFE JACKETS, SKI ROPE, 3 DOCKING BUMPERS, U.S. COAST GAURD STICKER,CUSTOM UPGRADED TRAILERING COVER, RYAN TANDOM AXLE TRAILER.

Thanks in advance.

There is also a 2003 with the same specs but it has the black powder coated tower and the 375 hp engine that I could pick up for 43K.

(Message edited by bigair21 on August 16, 2006)
Old    Jim Aikins (ccryder)      Join Date: Apr 2002       08-16-2006, 5:12 PM Reply   
Try www.nadaguides.com

Where are you located? I also have one for sale in the for sale section.

Good luck with your search and purchase.
Old    zakman (zacky)      Join Date: Apr 2003       08-16-2006, 6:41 PM Reply   
Do a search on www.boattraderonline.com

I am sure you will be able to find similar boats and see what the asking price is...
Old    Tom Barnard (tlb)      Join Date: Feb 2003       08-16-2006, 7:17 PM Reply   
Most people agree the '03 was/is the best year for a SAN..
With the 6 litre motor I would be more interested in that.
Old    bigair21            08-16-2006, 7:38 PM Reply   
so now we have that the 03 is a better boat. Why is it better than the 05? Jim, what is the story on your SAN? I would really appreciate knowing what you guys would feel comfortable paying for either of these boats.
Old    ntron            08-16-2006, 8:20 PM Reply   
How many hours on the 03? Does it have all the same extras? I do think that the bigger engine in the 03 Does have some pull at least for me. Good Luck on your decision.
Old    bigair21            08-16-2006, 9:02 PM Reply   
03 and 05 have the same hours. They both have someething like 35 hours.
Old    bocephus            08-16-2006, 9:30 PM Reply   
Personally I would avoid an '03 with 35 hours. WTF, didn't they use it? I have 86 on my '06.
Old    bigair21            08-16-2006, 9:32 PM Reply   
It was purchased by a guy who ended up not using it at all as his kids left for school and didn't have any interest. Why is it that people say the 03 was the best year? Any other boats other than the x-star, x-2, VLX that people would recommend?
Old    Markj (markj)      Join Date: Apr 2005       08-16-2006, 9:48 PM Reply   
Hey Tom, what makes the 03 better than the 05?---Just curious.
Old    Clubmyke (clubmyke)      Join Date: Aug 2004       08-16-2006, 9:52 PM Reply   
03 - can transfer what is left of the 5 year warranty.

05 - i dont know if if is limited to 3 years..
Old    Markj (markj)      Join Date: Apr 2005       08-16-2006, 10:01 PM Reply   
No really. What is better about the boat? (sorry to hijack).
Old    NautiqueJeff (planetnautique)      Join Date: Oct 2003       08-17-2006, 6:37 AM Reply   
2003 is considered a good year for the SAN for the following reasons:

* first year of the Faria gauges

* has redesigned interior with lower floor (started in '02)

* last year of the cool push-button hatch releases (started in '02)

* last year of the classic AIR logo

* still has the classic FCT

* Excalibur/ZR-6/Python engine options (started late '02)

* last year of the colored deck option

* first year of helm control ballast valves
Old    E.J. (deuce)      Join Date: Mar 2002       08-17-2006, 7:33 AM Reply   
Nautique Jeff answered the question perfect. Since '03 CC has slowly but surely started changing stuff and those changes, though mostly aesthetic....are not for the better.

Biggest thing for me are the knee breakers on the sundeck. The terrible graphics. Tower.

So it has all the benefits of the redesign '02, the new gauges....but none of the disappointing changes.

So in conclusion....the '03 has everything that people liked and none of the changes that made people cringe.

Hope that answers your question.

I WOULD JUMP ON THAT '03.....but offer them 41K, which if listed at 43 K....he would probably jump on. I don't have the engine upgrade and I wouldn't take 40K from you tomorrow(300 hours). Not because that wouldn't be a fair offer, but because I couldn't replace it......
Old    E.J. (deuce)      Join Date: Mar 2002       08-17-2006, 7:35 AM Reply   
Add....the 35 hours wouldn't scare me at all....ZERO.

I would guess the guy has used it a few times a year at best, but did regular service(Summer/Winter) just like he was putting 100 hours a year on..... No worries at all.
Old    Tom Barnard (tlb)      Join Date: Feb 2003       08-17-2006, 8:34 AM Reply   
Looks like Nautique Jeff covered why the '03 is the most desirable SAN.. I had to sell ours last year and have been bummed ever since.. I will probably be able to buy another boat this winter/spring, and if I decide to go with a Nautique again it'll be an '03..
Old    bigair21            08-17-2006, 8:38 AM Reply   
ok so here is the 05 red/white and the 03 is the red / black. Original asking price for the 03 is 46.5 and they would be willing to take 43. Asking on the 05 is 49.5 and they are willing to take 47K both have like 35 hours. Which one is the winner guys?Upload
Upload
Old    Tom Barnard (tlb)      Join Date: Feb 2003       08-17-2006, 8:48 AM Reply   
Wow, tough choice.. The '05 looks sweet! The upgraged motor on the '03 would make me lean that way though.
Old    E.J. (deuce)      Join Date: Mar 2002       08-17-2006, 9:00 AM Reply   
Oh...forgot one more option that the '03 has that the '05 doesn't.... Covered(recessed) speakers....

The '05 pictured has better wheels on the trailer, for whatever that is worth. Someone may be able to give input about the Ranken(SP?) trailer vs the DHM. Looks to have a tower mount mirror and tower speakers. Bimini is nice.

Just noticed one thing that I like about the '05...it has the anchor light on top of the tower... Small thing, but nice all the same.

Truthfully, I really like the look of that '05... Though I would take the AIR sticker off all together....it would give it a super clean look. Some of that may be due to the lighting in the pic(meaning the boat looking better)... The pic of the '03 is not super flattering(noisy?).

That said....I like the ZR6 that the '03 comes with, though I don't think it is necessary....just cool to have.

In closing... Walk through them with a fine tooth comb. 4 K is not a huge difference. Assuming that you know that you want a SAN....it should be easy to decide between these 2 boat on the showroom floor.
Old    Anodyne (anodyne)      Join Date: Feb 2006       08-17-2006, 9:05 AM Reply   
I vote '05.
Old    S Dub (sdub)      Join Date: Jan 2003       08-17-2006, 9:06 AM Reply   
I like the looks of the '05 a lot better. I'd go that route.
Old    bocephus            08-17-2006, 9:06 AM Reply   
'05 all day long for so many reasons it's not even a contest...'05 has cleats too.
Old    Josh B (joshugan)      Join Date: Apr 2005       08-17-2006, 9:09 AM Reply   
I'd take the 03 but that's just based on what NautiqueJeff said above and I like the colors better. In about 4 years I'll be in the market and an 02-03 is all I want.
Old    E.J. (deuce)      Join Date: Mar 2002       08-17-2006, 9:12 AM Reply   
Good eye Bocephus.... That is HUGE IMO. Then again, I don't know if the '03 pic is just so poor we are not seeing 'um.......almost looks like it may also have them, but they are blurred...

Aren't they standard on a Team???? Maybe I am wrong on that.......
Old    E.J. (deuce)      Join Date: Mar 2002       08-17-2006, 9:25 AM Reply   
In the end, the ’05 is going to have some resale value on the ’03 down the road.

Things I prefer about the ‘03
-push button releases for the sun deck(back storage).
-recessed speakers
-better graphics(though this is a wash, because I like the gelcoat scheme on the ’05 and I’d just take the AIR graphic off).
-engine upgrade

Things I prefer about the ‘05
-2 years newer(resale)
-anchor light
-trailer
-gelcoat scheme
-bimini


Because I cannot see clearly, you have to tell if the ’03 has cleats, tower speakers(at least as good as the ’05) and the tower mount mirror.

Off that list….the only thing that is REALLY big to me is the engine upgrade and 2 years.

What type of warranty is coming with each boat?

Tough decision…….. I think in the end I would REALLY try to work a better deal on the ’03 and if that just wasn’t going to happen, “probably” go with the ’05…..not for sure….
Old    E.J. (deuce)      Join Date: Mar 2002       08-17-2006, 9:29 AM Reply   
Looks like the '05 has not been registered(no bow numbers)....and if that is the case and it is being sold as a "new" boat and the warranty starts the day you take delivery....that is a BIG factor.

Is it a dealer demo? Or is the pic from when the original owner took delivery....???
Old    Tom Barnard (tlb)      Join Date: Feb 2003       08-17-2006, 9:32 AM Reply   
Bocephus, why is it not even a contest?? Please enlighten us
Old    bocephus            08-17-2006, 9:54 AM Reply   
Well Tom, this is how I see it, for the money I would go with the newest boat possible.

That being said, beyond the obvious reasons, i.e. the '05 looks so much better to me, the warranty will last longer, the '05 looks like a brand new boat, etc... I would personally steer clear of a three year old boat with 35 hours on it. To me that means it was purchased by someone as an after thought. It was most likely purchased by someone who didn't really care about the boat since they didn't use it. If I am not using a boat I probably wouldn't worry too much about it in the way of service, etc...After all it only has 35 hours on it. Why do an annual or anything at all to it, especially if it doesn’t freeze where you are at or it was stored in doors. Therefore the rings, valve guides, seals, bearings, valve springs, gaskets, etc... have just been setting there rusting into the cylinder walls, drying out, cracking, glazing over, stiffening, gumming up, etc.. Of course everyone and their brother is a mechanic on this site and knows all about everything and not one thing I mentioned above is something to worry about so what's it matter. For me, I like to have as few problems as possible in my boating experiences so I go with the newest, best boat I can afford, but once again it is my OPINION! All the stuff about the ’03 being the best 210 out there is a crazy reason to buy an older boat for about the same money in my opinion.
Old    bigair21            08-17-2006, 10:30 AM Reply   
Upload
Old    Brian Carrillo (timber)      Join Date: May 2004       08-17-2006, 10:41 AM Reply   
05 all the way!
Old    Flux (flux)      Join Date: Jun 2003       08-17-2006, 11:01 AM Reply   
As an owner of an 02 and I also consider the 03 the best year for the SAN, I would still go after that 05 for numerous reasons:

Bimini, Tower Speakers, better HU, Great color scheme, nicer trailer with aluminum rims, polished FCT, that thing is a beautiful boat. The upgraded motor is not all that from what I have heard, the excalibur is plenty of engine and you can get a prop to offset any holeshot problems when weighted. If the 03 had a colored deck, then I would maybe lean that way because 03 was the last year for that and that is a big factor in how the boat looks, that 05 has it right though with the white stripe to match the deck.

In the long run you will spend the extra money to upgrade the boat to match the 05 anyway, especially if you want tower speakers, a bimini, a better head unit, etc. That 05 has a ton of class.

Now buy it and tear out the hard tanks and get some 750 lb sacs in the lockers and another for the bow and have some serious fun.
Old    Flux (flux)      Join Date: Jun 2003       08-17-2006, 11:02 AM Reply   
Neither has a teak deck.
Old    bigair21            08-17-2006, 11:17 AM Reply   
tell me about this teak deck thing. I really like the fiberglass with rubber deck. I seem to always slip on teak. Boards get slippery when standing on teak as well. FLUX, I had a question about tearing out the hard tanks. can't you just put bags on top of those tanks for additional ballasts?
Old    E.J. (deuce)      Join Date: Mar 2002       08-17-2006, 11:22 AM Reply   
Teak is for skiers Flux....

I agree with your comments by the way. Though if he could get the dealer down to 40ish for that '03....I may lean the other way. Looks like it may have tower speakers....and I am not sure that photo is doing it justice. The quality of the 2 photographs is very different, thus making the '05 look MUCH cleaner.

I would like to hear answers as to the cleats, tower speakers, tower mirror...and if it is being sold as new(still unclear if that is a dealer demo, no reg. numbers). If the '05 has all those over the '03, "I" would be willing to pay 5-7 K more for that "new" '05 than the '03....

The pic of that '05 looks NEW....not even 35 hours. That prop doesn't look like it has seen water.....or he is polishing it up after every use.
Old    bigair21            08-17-2006, 11:27 AM Reply   
The 05 is owned by a guy who bought it and basically didn't use it. He has money and his girlfriend is totaly into wakeboarding but when he injured his shoulder they stopped using their brand new boat. The 03 does have tower speakers and the lowest they are willing to go is 43 on that boat. Is the 05 at 45 or 47.5 a good buy? I have not seen iether boat in erson but am going to see the 05 tonight.
Old    E.J. (deuce)      Join Date: Mar 2002       08-17-2006, 11:42 AM Reply   
45 YES!....IMO.

Though I am now under the impression that those photos are when it was picked up. So it will be interesting to see how it looks today. People have different ideas of what "taking care of a boat" means.

You could call on these as well......????


http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/8/338483.html?1151544956

http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/8/344944.html?1155172816

Of course if that boat is local....it makes things MUCH easier.
Old    D. Cooper (dcooper)      Join Date: Mar 2005       08-17-2006, 11:50 AM Reply   
Go 2005...
Old    bigair21            08-17-2006, 11:50 AM Reply   
it is local and yes, much easier. the other total off the wall option I have is a 1999 x-star with 635 hours very well cared for for 27K. I think that is still a bit high in price for a boat of that year. Basically that is what it has come to. I don't think anything can compare to that 05 210 team.
Old    bigair21            08-17-2006, 11:50 AM Reply   
Has anyone worked with the redwood credit union in cali. They seem to have the best rates.
Old    Flux (flux)      Join Date: Jun 2003       08-17-2006, 12:07 PM Reply   
I just love the way teak looks, that's my preference, that is all. Teak does get slick and you have to maintain it. A fiberglass platform would in now way prevent me from buying a kick azz boat though and I would happily take either.

You can definately put bags over the hard tanks, both boats will have hard tanks. I had some extra bags plumbed in using the overflow from the hard tanks. Only problem is they do not drain on their own. My boat is an 02 with Aerator pumps, so keep that in mind. I took out the hard tanks, reinforced the motor divider wall and added 750's. I figure I get about 600 in each now, still have room for vests on top of them and can put boards in the hatches when trailering and the bags are empty. It rules.


The warranty alone on the 05 could be worth a 1k-2k depending on how many factory quirks need to be worked out. The trailer is a good upgrade as well. At 45-47.5 on the red 05 is pretty good. It really depends on your intent, are you gonna keep this boat a long time?? Then the 05 will be a better choice in the long run. If money is tight, then don't give up on the 03.

Also, both boats have such low hours that I doubt they have all the factory bugs worked out of them. That warranty may come in handy. Both are only 15 hrs over break-in and have probably never been fully loaded down.

The red 05 is the nicest looking of all the one's you have posted, IMO. Cleanest and most simple color scheme.
Old    Flux (flux)      Join Date: Jun 2003       08-17-2006, 12:16 PM Reply   
As a side note, I bought an 02 in January of 05. I have done a few things to it and had to replace some things on the trailer, probably about 2k spent thus far. I would do it again in a heart beat:

Trailer got new calipers, pads, and actuator, spare tire too as It did not have one.

Replaced HU and amp, amp was dead on one channel.

Took out hard tanks and replaced with bags, rewired the ballast for seperate tank control as the 02 only had one fill/empty button, 03 on they had seperate controls though.

Still have no tower speakers, poor me, I am accepting Paypal donations for some NVS Tyrants if anyone cares to help a brutha out.
Old    bigair21            08-18-2006, 7:42 AM Reply   
ok so here is an update. I went out in the 05 last night and WOW, perfect condition. Nothing, an d I repeat noting other than the ballast tanks not filling exactly according to plan was apparent. No rips, tears, anything. Guy is set firm on 47K for it and it has 32.5 hours on it. Drove strong, lights front and back looked good, sound system is the factory team which rocks for fatory.

So 210 owners, tell me about the ballast. Isn't it supposed to just be touch one of the buttons for which ever one you want to fill and when it's full turn it off? You don't have to go twisting the valves underneath on an off do you? I would not think it to be any different than any of the other high end boats. Is it when the lights are solid they are filling and when they are flashing they are being drained? Other than that small issue everything looks good. Thanks in advance for the info!
Old    Jim Aikins (ccryder)      Join Date: Apr 2002       08-18-2006, 7:58 AM Reply   
The ballast tanks have the helm control valves up under the dash which are cable operated like on older car heater control. They might not have been open or the cable could have been messed up. You are correct on the pump switch operation. There are also brass shut off valves for all the tanks which may have not been completely open. If it is a concern, you could have the guy take it in for repair at the dealer then pick it up after the issue is resolved. Sounds like a great deal to me. Good luck.
Old    E.J. (deuce)      Join Date: Mar 2002       08-18-2006, 8:42 AM Reply   
Nautiques and the ballast.....

He might not have had the valves open, or the "other" valves open....or they might just have needed a little "nudging" by driving forward a bit....

That is just filling, no need to worry about opening and closing the valves when the tanks are full.

And yes, light on....filling. Light flashing....draining.
Old    bigair21            08-18-2006, 10:01 AM Reply   
nice, thanks guys. Any other things to look for on that boat. I am beyond psyched to pick it up today. What is the optimal speed for boarding on the boat? Line length? I have two extra pro x v-drive sacks that I am going to put in the back and one up front. The thing should be a monster!
Old    bigair21            08-18-2006, 11:49 AM Reply   
so I just got off the phone with local service and I am spooked. They were telling me that if you don't shut off the valce back under the engine compartment that through just normal driving around the tanks will fill up after halkf a day of driving even if the pumps are not on and set to fill. does that seem weird to you guys? I am going to have a pretty hard time buying an expensive boat where I have to go and manually shut off my ballast tanks fill line if Idon't want them to fill.
Old    TR (biz)      Join Date: Mar 2004       08-18-2006, 12:13 PM Reply   
Aerator pumps will pass water even when they are not turned on. Other than closing the "other valves" I believe a simple solution would be to hit the empty switch a few times during the day. I hear ya... spending that much money on a boat and having to worry about ballast autofilling is a little lackluster. You would think on a $50k boat that would be worked out without having to mess with it. Above and beyond that; if you can live with it, and most people do, that boat will put out an awesome wake!

(Message edited by BIZ on August 18, 2006)
Old    Flux (flux)      Join Date: Jun 2003       08-18-2006, 1:15 PM Reply   
George,

CC has a flowrite valve behind the seacock on the ballast intakes. They are known to leak a bit and there is no inexpensive solution to automatic or remote valves. Some folks have retrofitted solenoid valves. It's a known issue and there are some fixes, the dealer should know what to do after you transfer the warranty.

It's not a big deal to close the seacocks if you are not boarding and don't need ballast.
Old    cam warren (cam892001)      Join Date: Sep 2004       08-19-2006, 7:53 AM Reply   
this isn't a problem with my 05. There are the 3 valves under the dash to the left that I twist open when I want to fill, and close once I'm done. I think it actually works well, b/c I can open them right as I launch and by time I get to my cove, the tanks are already full without even turning the pumps on, and once I'm done riding, just close the valves and empty the tanks which may take 5-7 min. I have 40hrs on my 05 which I bought new in March and I haven't had a single issue with it. I can tell you that I was looking at an 03 SANTE b/f I found this 05 and for the extra $$, it was well worth it...The only difference in mine and yours is mine came with Defcom I's, which don't sound all that great, and you can't hear when riding, so I'm upgrading to the III's later..go 2005 and don't look back!!!
Old    Brian Carrillo (timber)      Join Date: May 2004       08-19-2006, 12:45 PM Reply   
I also have an 05, and I do not have any problems with my helm control's. My tanks work great.
I'm glad I bought an 05 instead of the older models I was looking at.

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