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Old    Jim T (wkbrd)      Join Date: Mar 2006       08-09-2006, 2:53 PM Reply   
Well USA Wakeboard drops the ball again. Their highly rated "Cow Pasture Nationals" and now the PAN AM Games. Way to go USA Wakeboard. Looks like more poor planing on someones part.


http://www.usawakeboard.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=171&Item id=2
Old    Byrd (byrd)      Join Date: Dec 2005       08-09-2006, 3:07 PM Reply   
"Please send me your thoughts, comment and input."

Dan Levine
Chairman PanAm Wakeboard Council

All that S___ should have been taken care of before the event was announced...
Old    Matt VdA (mvda)      Join Date: Dec 2002       08-09-2006, 3:24 PM Reply   
What exactly is USA Wakeboarding and why are they not coordinated with the WWA?
Old    Jim T (wkbrd)      Join Date: Mar 2006       08-09-2006, 3:32 PM Reply   
WWA is strictly in it "to make a profit" and USA Wakeboard is"Building a better ship" is what everyone was told at there USA Wakeboard members meeting on July 22 at USA Waterski Headquarters. After two failed events in a row I definately want my boarding pass for that better ship. SIGN ME UP NOW!!!!!
Old    goodnews (goodnews)      Join Date: Jun 2006       08-09-2006, 8:20 PM Reply   
Out of curiosity, what went wrong during the National tournament?
Old    Jim T (wkbrd)      Join Date: Mar 2006       08-09-2006, 8:41 PM Reply   
It was in the middle of a cow pasture, pulled judges out of the crowd on Friday, no publicity, no venders, changed running order where many people missed there finals, changed dates of the tournament after published, you don't have to ride in finals and still get 3rd place, do I need to go on?
Old    the not so naked chef (electricsnow)      Join Date: May 2002       08-10-2006, 12:57 PM Reply   
I think it's worthy of note that USA wakeboard is under the waterski association, while the WWA is the original wakeboarding association evolved from the original "skurfing association" (I'm sure that's not the original name, but I"m not in the mood to look it up). It also seems relevant to take into consideration that the WWA has been putting on the worlds comps for years (again, since the beginning), while USA wakeboard/the IWSF put on their first wakeboarding worlds comp in 2000. I thought they were even trying to claim it as the "official wakeboard worlds."

I would just do your research on what's what, and who's been around since the beginning and who's really pointing fingers at whom when it comes to "making a profit." Both put on grass roots comps and what not, and seem to contribute in their own way, but...I'd rather not see the original governing body of wakeboarding be pushed out, much like the original governing body of snowboarding, the ISF (international SNOWBOARD federation), was pushed out by the FIS (international ski-->and snowboard federation, though it did not always contain the word/meaning "snowboard" in the abbreviation). But that's just me and my political blah blah blahs, related strictly to the ideas of said associations and not necessarily the people behind them.

(Message edited by electricsnow on August 10, 2006)
Old    Roger Hornsby (hoosairboy)      Join Date: Aug 2005       08-10-2006, 2:27 PM Reply   
March??? Yes- open it up to all competitors since March is prime time riding. It gives you all of Jan and Feb to train. There you go IL, IN, MI, Carolinas. That is what you get for supporting USAWakeboard all these years. What is with watersports organizations? They all have water on the brain. WWA and World Pub are also just as incompetent. PLease, Please. someone take over wakeboarding that can actually do something right. Rollerblading has a better shot at getting successful events than all of these clowns. Give me what good any of these guys do besides provide insurance.
Old    Byrd (byrd)      Join Date: Dec 2005       08-10-2006, 2:40 PM Reply   
Yes, March is "Prime Time"....I believe that they have it then so it does not interfere with their Pro Skiing events. It's funny to see that all the skiers hated wakeboarding when it first came out, now everyone is trying to get a piece of the pie.
Old    goodnews (goodnews)      Join Date: Jun 2006       08-10-2006, 3:15 PM Reply   
Question about the comment -- "who's really pointing fingers at whom when it comes to "making a profit."

Today I read in a USA Wakeboard article that they are seeking volunteers -- does anyone know if those in charge of USA Wakeboard are on the payroll, or are they all volunteers?
Old    David Hair (kneeboarddad)      Join Date: Sep 2005       08-10-2006, 4:52 PM Reply   
They are volunteers. The full time employess are employees of USA Waterski. Janifer Ellis, Dan Levine, Marcus and Andrea Plough are all volunteers.
Old    goodnews (goodnews)      Join Date: Jun 2006       08-10-2006, 5:05 PM Reply   
Then I would think instead of complaining that Jim T (wkbrd), Byrd (byrd), Jim T (wkbrd), Roger Hornsby (hoosairboy) should step to the plate and volunteer their time to help make USA Wakeboard a better organization. Just a thought.......By the way, the article that I just read offered the e-mail address of the President of USA Wakeboard to those who want to help, it is:
qpi-andrea@sbcglobal.net
Old    Jed (gehennaengine)      Join Date: Jun 2005       08-10-2006, 5:28 PM Reply   
Hmmm... should I go organize the Worlds event or go play some more Halo? Halo, definately Halo. Why do today what can be put off until March 2007?
Old    Byrd (byrd)      Join Date: Dec 2005       08-11-2006, 7:47 AM Reply   
goodnews, I dont have a problem with that. FYI, I do volenteer a lot in my community and I am currently working on information on getting INT started in my area. I also volenteer by coaching little league and youth soccer. How about you? Are you interrested in volenteering as well?
Old    goodnews (goodnews)      Join Date: Jun 2006       08-11-2006, 9:06 AM Reply   
Byrd: Never did I question if (or who) you volunteer your time with, my only thought was that instead of bashing those at USA Wakeboard, you should consider offering your assistance to help make them a organization that others, who share your thoughts and feelings, would be more happy with. What I have found is that most people who grip about something are not willing to take their negative energies to make a situation a better one. Therefore, it is good to hear that you don't "have a problem with" offerring your time and energy to USA Wakeboard. I am sure that Andrea Plough will be glad to hear that you will be contacting her to volunteer your time to USA Wakeboard. As for your question to me -- I have already spoken with Andrea about how I can help out.
Old    Matt VdA (mvda)      Join Date: Dec 2002       08-11-2006, 10:30 AM Reply   
So help me out here...
USA Wakeboard is really just a division of USA Waterski and they held their first "World Competition" in 2000? Am I right here?

It seems to me like USA Waterski jumped on the bandwagon a little too late. It annoys me that anybody so late to the game is billing certain events as the "official" national and world championships when our sport already has a widely recognized national and world championships.

While I'm all for any organizaition that wants to promote our sport, it seems that USA Waterski is making an attempt to take legitimacy from WWA. So that begs the question, is helping USA Wakeboard really helping the sport? On a local level, I definitely think so. But beyond that, I have doubts.

I'm not trying to bash, I'd just like some clarification. Let me know what I'm missing.
Old    goodnews (goodnews)      Join Date: Jun 2006       08-11-2006, 12:16 PM Reply   
This is how I interpret what is occurring:

USA Wakeboard (USAW)is a sports discipline under USA Waterski (USA-WS) -- as is eight other watersports disciplines:
* Kneeboard (AKA)
* Barefoot (ABC)
* Hydrofoil (HYD)
* Show Ski (NSS)
* Ski Race (NWR)
* 3 event (AWS) also known as Slalom, Trick, & Jump
* Collegiate (NCW)
* Disabled (WSD)

USA-WS, also known as headquarters, handles the membership of the various disciplines, the sanctioning of the tournaments recognized by these disciplines, as well as supports the grass roots efforts of the National Ski League (NSL) and the National Wakeboard League (NWL). When you purchase membership, you are becoming a USA Waterski member, for insurance coverage, as well as a member to your specific sports division (such as USA Wakeboard). Interested parties can form local clubs: such as The Northern Wisconsin Wakeboard Club at USA Waterski, which would open then up to being able to get sanctioning (insurance coverage) for tournaments, which I think cost $25 per tournament for a "F" rated -- Fun tournament. What I was told is that an "F" rated tournament means that you set your own rules -- this would be for a more grass roots level tournament. Wakeboard clubs would be sanctioned under the sports discipline of USA Wakeboard, while Barefooting clubs would be sanctioned under the ABC, etc..

As a sports discipline, USA Wakeboard (a not for profit organization -- run by volunteers) has three divisions:
* Boat
* Cable
* Collegiate (Note: USA Wakeboard has keep its collegiate portion seperate from the Collegiate sports discipline (NCW).
* It is worth noting that they have attempted to generate volunteers to form a wakeskate committee and that they have attempted to generate interest in Jr. Development Clinics-- but so far, all of this is still in the works.

USA Waterski (headquarters), is really a group of people on the payroll that represent the interest of all the sports disciplines mentioned above. Last year when the board of directors met, they explored the option of a name change to USA Watersports, but it was ultimately put on the back burner for consideration at the 2007 board of directors meeting.

The USA falls under the Pan Am Region of the International Waterski Federation (I.W.S.F.)www.iwsf.com/ . To qualify for I.W.S.F. tournaments, you have to be in good standing with your ski federation, which in this case is the USA Waterski Federation, which is handled out of the USA Waterski office (headquarters). They handle all the membership of the various disciplines and can verify membership status.

The various disciplines have regional and national tournaments to choose their athletes to compete in the I.W.S.F. tournaments, of which the World Cup Series is part of. The athletes are actually given a world rating based off of their Regions National tournament and their placement in the Worlds, which on the wakeboarding side is currently alternating years between boat and cable -- this year the cable world championships was in Austria while the 2007 boat world championships will be held in China.

World Pub is a sports and marketing company that handles the promotion and occurences of the Pro Series. Presently, they are sanctioned (have insurance through) the WWA -- meaning that to compete in their tournament you have to be a member of the WWA (viewed as a club) for insurance purposes.

The WWA is a not for profit group like USA Waterski that sanctions tournaments; they also promote a WWA Nationals and a WWA Worlds that World Pub, has organized in the past.

So the two insurance providers WWA and USA Waterski are not for profit organizations that have people on the payroll sanctioning events. The difference is that WWA accepts membership to the WWA, while USA Waterski (headquarters)accepts and handles the membership for nine different sports disciplines.

Then you have the INT -- a grass roots organization for skiers and wakeboarders. Some view it as being in competition with the NSL & NWL. My understanding is that they (INT)have their own insurance.

There is no doubt that so many organizations are directly competing in sponsorship efforts for their events, which cannot be good for the competitors.

It seems to me that it comes down to the definition and interpretation of what a National title is and what it qualifies you for.

USA Wakeboard seems to be connected with the USA Waterski Federation, the International Waterski Federation and the United States Olympic Council which is a hard act to beat. Too, they are making strides to implement drug testing through the USOC for all the world team athletes that represent the interest of the USA and USA Wakeboard -- too me this is pretty impressive.

}
Old    Jim T (wkbrd)      Join Date: Mar 2006       08-12-2006, 6:01 AM Reply   
Goodnews- not tryn to hate but if you were at the meeting on July 22, you would see that Andrea wants your help and ideas only if SHE likes them. There was a dad that had a very legitimate idea and Andrea basically said that give her time & she could do it without any blue prints. I'm sorry but if you would have attended this event, I think you would have a sour taste also. Then for the Board of Directors, you draw people out of the crowd to fill this position? If you are going to help the sport then I'm all for it but this is not. And also FYI I did volunteer and sign up for several comitiees
Old    Roger Hornsby (hoosairboy)      Join Date: Aug 2005       08-12-2006, 7:56 AM Reply   
One of the major problems with USAWakeboard is it is under the control of waterskiers. Go th their HQ in FL and it will speak volumes of what is going on. First thing you notice is their new lake. Strictly a 3 event lake with no wakeboarding. Next, go into the hall of fame. About 1% has anything to do with wakeboarding. Next, look at their magazine. Wakeboarding gets as much coverage as disabled skiing and race skiing. The full time staff and people who run USAwaterski are for the most part skiers. IMO There is still a lot of animosity towards wakeboarding.

I spoke with the lady who was in charge of grass roots events. Here is a statement she made. "You must remember that wakeboard is on of many watersports disciplines under the USAWaterski umbrella and they all require equal treatment". Now this is a long time waterskier whose family is waterskiers. What she should have said was "There is 3 event waterskkiing and then there are all the other disciplines including this piece of s... sport that has ruined watersking with their drugs and rock and roll and big wakes and has taken the fans and the sponsors money with them."

Is there hope? Yes. Fortunately some of the people on USAWakeboard are wakeboad oriented such as Dan Levine and Marcus. The new president of USAWaterski doesn't come from waterskiing. Look- USAWaterski isn't going away. As "Goodnews" mentioned they have some good things they are doing. If anything you can write the new president and let him now what the wakeboarding community thinks about all this.

USAWaterski, The WWA and INT- If you are reading this please do this one thing. Ask what is best for the sport and the people in it. Not what is best for the president, not preferential treatment for board members kids and not your own egos. If you do that and come together as a unified group in promoting and benefiting the sport then you will have done something great for the sport.
Old    Roger Hornsby (hoosairboy)      Join Date: Aug 2005       08-12-2006, 7:58 AM Reply   
I left off World Pub. I haven't heard one good thing about them from any of the three above. They have killed the pro events and the only hope of those getting beter is when someone else takes over. Just look at the biggest and best events. None are World Pub. INT runs a bigger event than Worlsd Pub.
Old    goodnews (goodnews)      Join Date: Jun 2006       08-12-2006, 8:32 AM Reply   
I do agree with everything that you all are saying. My only concern is that there are no other answers -- what do you all suggest to build the sport? Things are not going so well with the dropping of wakeboard from the X Games and the dropping of prizes/funds given to podium placers. There is no doubt that there are some negative issues within the structure of USA Wakeboard. Does anyone know the complete list of who is sitting on the board of directors for USA Wakeboard, their background, and why they are involved (children who wakeboard, something to prove, etc.)?
Old    Jim T (wkbrd)      Join Date: Mar 2006       08-14-2006, 8:19 AM Reply   
as stated above USA Wake just selected someone to their board of directors that has never been wkbrn that comes from a skiing background. 1st good for that person for stepn up!!!! no slam to them however we need more wakeboard oriented people
Old    Melanie G (melanie_g)      Join Date: Jul 2002       08-14-2006, 9:21 AM Reply   
goodnews, just to clarify, World Publications produces the magazines and World Sports and Marketing is the marketing side to the magazine. They put on the events that go along with the magazines and they do more than just the Pro Tour.

Just clearing that part up, carrying on...
Old    goodnews (goodnews)      Join Date: Jun 2006       08-15-2006, 7:53 AM Reply   
Thanks for the clarification. Knowledge is a great thing to have. It took me a few years just to somewhat figure out the formatting of the different wakeboard organizations. Personally, I do not like the way that USA Wakeboard bashes the WWA and the "World Pub/World Sports and Marketing." For a fact, World Sports and Marketing puts on a great event. From what I have gathered, USA Wakeboard has inferior tournaments: I heard this about the Board Up Miami tournament and the USA Wakeboard Nationals. My concern for the sport is the fact that there are to many organizations out there. One has got to fold -- with USA Wakeboard having the support of the USA Waterski Federation, the I.W.S.F, and the U.S.O.C. I don't think that it will be them. (Just my opinion).
Old    Karl De Looff (boarditup)      Join Date: Jan 2004       08-15-2006, 8:16 AM Reply   
USA Waterski is a membership organization. You have to vote to make changes. Because of the history, it will take a while to change. You also have to look at the numbers. The vast majority of the members are 3-event skiers - slalom skiers specifically. Change cannot be imposed by barking - you have to do it from within.

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