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Old    King of PoP (troyl)      Join Date: Feb 2002       07-30-2006, 12:06 PM Reply   
I guess if I knew I could reveiw it and see if this is a good deal. I am trying to spend my amex points.

Deluxe kit includes a battery pack and charger, 55-200mm telephoto lens, interface cables, a neck strap, gadget bag, and a 512MB memory card. 5-3/5" W x 3-9/10" H x 2-9/10" D Reward Code RY1162
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Old    Phantom (phantom5815)      Join Date: Jul 2002       07-30-2006, 1:52 PM Reply   
Looks and sounds like the Rebel
Old    Taylor Jensen (wakeboardertj)      Join Date: May 2005       07-30-2006, 6:58 PM Reply   
ya, looks like a rebel
Old    Rich Dykmans (richd)      Join Date: Oct 2003       07-30-2006, 8:56 PM Reply   
how many points will that cost you?
Old    King of PoP (troyl)      Join Date: Feb 2002       07-30-2006, 9:30 PM Reply   
Rich,

I believe it was something like 225,000!!! I have lots of points so thats not an issue, but I hate to waste them. For some reason they make it hard to figure out what your getting.

I guess this is not the lens (70-200 2.8) you guys are always talking about?
So this is about a $1100 package retail?
Old    Taylor Jensen (wakeboardertj)      Join Date: May 2005       07-31-2006, 1:15 AM Reply   
it looks like a rebel t2/k2 but then why would the accessory kit come with a memory card if it shoots on film?

or is it a 300d?

(Message edited by wakeboardertj on July 31, 2006)

(Message edited by wakeboardertj on July 31, 2006)
Old    Phantom (phantom5815)      Join Date: Jul 2002       07-31-2006, 3:02 AM Reply   
From my understanding the Rebel = 300d
Old    Phantom (phantom5815)      Join Date: Jul 2002       07-31-2006, 3:14 AM Reply   
From my understanding the Rebel = 300d
Looks like they changed overnight.
https://www01.extra.americanexpress.com/SearchResult.aspx?searchstring=canon&categoryid=0& merchantid=0
https://www01.extra.americanexpress.com/Product.aspx?uscshortcode=14781171&usclongcode=353 79395&merchantid=0

https://www01.extra.americanexpress.com/Product.aspx?uscshortcode=22535113&usclongcode=369 45368&merchantid=0

https://www01.extra.americanexpress.com/Product.aspx?uscshortcode=14426127&usclongcode=350 24388&merchantid=0

https://www01.extra.americanexpress.com/Product.aspx?uscshortcode=14426128&usclongcode=350 24389&merchantid=0
Old    Taylor Jensen (wakeboardertj)      Join Date: May 2005       07-31-2006, 12:02 PM Reply   
phantom, yes the rebel is the 300d.

go for the 30d!
Old    Rich Dykmans (richd)      Join Date: Oct 2003       07-31-2006, 12:19 PM Reply   
That's not a very good lens.
Old    King of PoP (troyl)      Join Date: Feb 2002       07-31-2006, 11:07 PM Reply   
Ok so we will skip out on the other unit since that lens is crap.

Does the Rebel XT focus just as fast as the 30d?
Assuming the same lens is used?

I am having trouble justifing the 30d since its unlikely I will ever touch any settings on the camera, and although interesting, I don't see me finding the time to do sequence work on the computer. With the same lens will I really notice a difference? (assuming I just left the 30d in basic mode) Remember I am coming from a P&S kodak.
"For convenience, ease of use and no-compromise SLR performance, look no further than the EOS Digital Rebel XT. Featuring Canon's Digital Trinity - an 8.0 Megapixel CMOS sensor, Canon's own DIGIC II Image Processor"
Old    Rich Dykmans (richd)      Join Date: Oct 2003       08-01-2006, 6:13 AM Reply   
The AF in the 30D will be better then the Rebel but I hear it's not a night and day difference. It's basically the same sensor and same digic II processor. With that many pixels though you will still really see a huge difference between the cheap lenses and the better lenses. You might as well stick with a P&S if you're going with the 55-200 LOL.
Old    Tiffanator (ladyboarder)      Join Date: Feb 2001       08-01-2006, 5:44 PM Reply   
FWIW... that is not like any Canon digital I've seen. I actually don't think that is a digital camera. Also... there is the Rebel, and there is the Digital Rebel, two different cameras. I have a Rebel II film camera (cheap) and used to have the 300D/Digital Rebel.
Difference in AF between the XT and 30D will really depend on what you are shooting. Camera focus speed doesn't really matter unless you are using a lens that can AF as fast or faster than your camera... such as the 70-200 2.8. Another thing... if you are shooting something pretty much stationary you don't need the fast focus. Where the differences come into play are in the AI Servo mode where you are tracking an object that is moving towards and away from you. So for wakeboarding, shooting from the boat you don't need fast AF because the rider never gets any closer or farther away. If you are shooting from a tube or chase boat you'll need faster AF as you track the rider.
Basic rule... in most cases glass is usually more important than camera.
Clear as mud?
Old    Rich Dykmans (richd)      Join Date: Oct 2003       08-01-2006, 7:44 PM Reply   
Some of your statements about AF are a bit too "blanket" IMHO. There is AF speed and then there is AF accuracy, much of which is based on AF sensitivity. As you go up in price in the Canon line you gain both. You might be shooting a stationary object in low light/contrast with a slower lens for example, you'll see some differences in both the hunt time and the final accuracy of focus between the different bodies. Wakeboarding may not always fit that situation but I'm assuming he will be using it for more then just that. I don't use AI servo much now nor have I in the past with the different bodies I have owned but I've seen some serious differences in AF performance even using center point / 1 shot AF between all of those I have owned. Whether it doesn't really matter as you say is really an individual thing as all of these cameras can do the job. I find it really get's down to "keepers" at the end of the day. I've just always got more with the better bodies with less work.
Old    Taylor Jensen (wakeboardertj)      Join Date: May 2005       08-01-2006, 8:22 PM Reply   
if all your going to do is P&S just get a good sony or canon compact camera, otherwise you'll be suckered into buying more lenses to cover more ranges.
Old    King of PoP (troyl)      Join Date: Feb 2002       08-01-2006, 9:50 PM Reply   
I think the Rebel xt/ 300d is the camera for me with a good quality outdoor sunny 70-200 lens.

I need the fast focus (or Hunt as you put it) for boat to boat and also for snow skiing/boarding. Its hard as hell to get a moving image in focus with the P&S cameras I have used.

As i love catching fish...but hate fishing....
I love taking pictures....but hate photography...
LOL...I guess its the ADD.

So I would never use the features of the 30d,
but never be happy with most P&S cameras.
Thanks for all your help...I am going to get the Rebel/300d for 135000 points and then go shopping with cash for the lens.

So now tell me what lens (and where to get it) I need for outdoor sunny, less than say $450.00?
70-200mm
Old    King of PoP (troyl)      Join Date: Feb 2002       08-01-2006, 10:16 PM Reply   
So i guess a good lens choice would be:
Canon EF 70-200mm f/4L USM ???

BH photo at $584

(Message edited by troyl on August 01, 2006)
Old    Rich Dykmans (richd)      Join Date: Oct 2003       08-02-2006, 8:06 AM Reply   
That would be the one.

One comment I'd like to make is that there is nothing wrong with using the auto mode on these DSLR's. Outdoors 90% of the time you'll get perfectly good shots. Auto mode has nothing to do with AF speed or accuracy either, that's a whole different system in the camera. A good/fast lens is going to AF just as well in auto as in manual.

Even a Rebel with GOOD GLASS in auto mode is going to smoke any P&S from an IQ standpoint. The problem starts when you try to shoot in auto in situations where the light fools the metering (like shooting into a sunset) or where you want a nice background blur for example, or when you want to freeze action with high shutter speeds (as in WB shooting). Give the manual modes a chance they are not that difficult to use.
Old    King of PoP (troyl)      Join Date: Feb 2002       08-02-2006, 8:36 AM Reply   
Back in my Cannon AE1 days I would only shoot in Auto because I never wanted to miss a shot and couldn't afford to experiment with film and developing costs. I am sure with digital and a little time I will have fun with the 300d.
I wish I would have had this new camera when i took these shots last week.
http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/4387/351192.html?1154321008
Old    King of PoP (troyl)      Join Date: Feb 2002       08-02-2006, 8:40 AM Reply   
BTW......I fell out of my chair when I read the retail price of some of the lenses!!! I had no idea that recreational photography could be so expensive. $5,000 for a 300mm lens!! I have new found respect.
Old    Rich Dykmans (richd)      Join Date: Oct 2003       08-02-2006, 9:20 AM Reply   
I owned a 300 f2.8L IS for a short while, bought it used for $3600. I sold it because I just couldn't justify owning it because I had no real use for it. It's considered one of the sharpest 300mm lenses in existance at any price. It's really a Pro lowlight sports lens for shooting football, baseball etc. The IQ is breathtaking, as good as it gets. And the IS and AF are so fast it's hard to take a bad picture with one. That's pretty much the case with all of the Canon Super Teles - excellent and very expensive.
Old    Taylor Jensen (wakeboardertj)      Join Date: May 2005       08-02-2006, 11:47 PM Reply   
rich, wow you must have had fun with that for the time u had it.
Old    Rich Dykmans (richd)      Join Date: Oct 2003       08-03-2006, 7:42 AM Reply   
I know the following are non wakeboarding but I wanted to show how good the 300 I had was. This first shot shows my neighbors car at 70mm so in reality the car is actually a little further away from a normal view point.

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Here is a shot HANDHELD with the 300mm, a Canon 2X and 1.4X teleconvertor stacked on that. This is the equivalent of 840mm (over 1000mm if you consider the 1.3 crop factor of the 1D.) Look at the registration sticker - you can read the numbers! Try doing that with your P&S. LOL

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(Message edited by richd on August 03, 2006)
Old    Chris Anthony (cmawsr)      Join Date: Nov 2002       08-05-2006, 8:05 PM Reply   
damn that 300 is amazing

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