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Old    Jason Overholser (madlab)      Join Date: Apr 2006       04-12-2006, 11:31 AM Reply   
Ok, I know these boats are very different but I need some input from people who have rode both. I can get either boat for about the same $ (new)with about the same equipment, minus the Supra bling on the X-1. Both dealers are good. I'll be using the boat for wake surfing, wake boarding, and skiing- in that order. I don't really have the chance to wet test them both. I'd appreciate everyone's 2 cents.Thanks-Jason
Old    entrust clothing (entrustclothing)      Join Date: Jul 2005       04-12-2006, 11:38 AM Reply   
ive never boarded behind either, but i would go with supra just cause it's bigger, but that's me, i like having more room on the boat, my last boat was 20' and it got real crowded real quick. also i'm sure the supra will be a bit more loaded with goodies
Old    Dizzy Jenkins (dizzyj)      Join Date: Jul 2003       04-12-2006, 11:45 AM Reply   
both are great boats, and the wake behind each is very nice. I think the mc will hold value better.

Some people have complained that the 22ssv sits too low in the water for their comfort, but I've never had a problem with it.

For me, it would probably come down to the dealer and service departments.
Old    Striker Jensen (jsj)      Join Date: Apr 2006       04-12-2006, 11:51 AM Reply   
Jason, I have dealt with both dealers, and I own a Moomba. Hope that helps. Dealer support is a huge factor.
Old    E Double U (three6ty)      Join Date: Feb 2004       04-12-2006, 11:53 AM Reply   
I had a SSV for 4 years and loved it. It doesn't sit low in the water either. The wakeboard wake is lippy and it has a great shape. Wakesurfing wake is OK. The waterskiing wake is pretty good for a V-drive. The wakeplate on the SSV will help you out in that aspect. The SSV will definately be bigger inside. In the four years I had it I never had one problem with it. NOTHING!
I can't say anything about the X-1. I have only sat it in but never rode behind it. It has a great history from previous years ( x-2, x-Star).
But it is very cramped inside. But it is also very nice inside. If you only go out with 3-4 people it would not be a big deal, but if you have kids or family it will feel small.

By the way I bought a Moomba XLV because I needed the room. Huge boat and throws a mean wake.
Good luck with either boat , you can't go wrong.
Old    Diggs (pdxWAKE) (tyler97217)      Join Date: Aug 2004       04-12-2006, 11:53 AM Reply   
yeah go with dealer and service. both great boats. i am a supra fan and the 22ssv is a very sharp boat. lacking a bit on storage for my needs but is super sleek looking and great wake.
i disagree very highly with the comment about the MC holding its resale value any better. they should depreciate the same and i have sold 2 supras and NEVER had a problem getting the money out of them that i wanted
Old    Aaron Nielsen (lzyboy)      Join Date: Jun 2001       04-12-2006, 12:00 PM Reply   
Hey Jason,

I would also check into the local delaers. Dealers / Service / Staff can make a difference for sure.... I see you are in Reno, if you make a trip down to the Delta I would be happy to take ya for a pull, let u drive, etc... Let me know - cool?

IMO you MUST test drive both boats... I would personally never spend 50K w/o test driving the boat. Tats my .02 cents , but either way good luck.

Lzy
Old    E.J. (deuce)      Join Date: Mar 2002       04-12-2006, 12:01 PM Reply   
I think you are in a win/win situation. Nice to have to make a decision where you can't choose wrong isn't it.
Old    Adam Curtis (acurtis_ttu)      Join Date: May 2004       04-12-2006, 12:02 PM Reply   
For the price and what you can get on a Supra, their hard to beat. My SSV has been great. It does sit a tad low compared to other boats it's size and you'll notice the bow is low when loading and unloading on a steeper ramp. I agree with Diggs, I wish it had more storage....closer to what you get out of a VLX. My profile pic will gove you some idea of ride height in the water...ther is no ballast filled in the pic just people and gear.

(Message edited by acurtis_ttu on April 12, 2006)
Old    Adam Curtis (acurtis_ttu)      Join Date: May 2004       04-12-2006, 12:02 PM Reply   
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Old     (insuranceman)      Join Date: Jun 2005       04-12-2006, 12:11 PM Reply   
Jason, I really don't know much about the x1 from experience. I have a 05 SSV 22 (in profile) and it has been a great boat. It will have a lot more bling than the Moomba you have. I made my decision based on the good customer relations that I have had with Skiers Choice.

Good luck to you in your decision.
Old    Dizzy Jenkins (dizzyj)      Join Date: Jul 2003       04-12-2006, 12:13 PM Reply   
adam,

I like how your lift is a bit nose high. Mine keeps the boat even, and I can never drain all the water out of the bilge. I need to look into that
Old    Adam Curtis (acurtis_ttu)      Join Date: May 2004       04-12-2006, 12:20 PM Reply   
dj,
I never really thought about it untill my dock builder mentioned it. He does it on all lifts he builds (straps or craddle). Looks like your lift is similar to mine, except you have PVC over the chain. Just take a few links out of the chain on the front two cables.
Old    NAW (ripr)      Join Date: Mar 2002       04-12-2006, 12:41 PM Reply   
These two boats go head to head very well. Neither of their seats wrap all the way around behind the drivers seat, the only difference will be the playpen (if the ssv you're looking at has it). The playpen is great for additional storage/ballast capability.

The Supra will be blinged up and will have a tandem axle trailer. I like the helm of the X-1 a bit more than the SSV. Neither have abundant storage...and with alot of weight, both of them will put out pro size wakes.

Just an all around tough decision. I would say if at all possible, get them both on the water. The dealer would make or break this decision I'd think. Good Luck!
Old     (insuranceman)      Join Date: Jun 2005       04-12-2006, 12:42 PM Reply   
Adam, By the way your dock looks great.

Old     (attila916)      Join Date: Oct 2005       04-12-2006, 1:29 PM Reply   
I noticed there are a lot of Supra owners chiming in, as an X1 owner I figured I would drop a line as well. I was looking at a vast variety of boats before making my decision. I not only love the look of my X1, (see MC thread) it handles better than any V-Drive I tested. (I hear it is neck and neck with the Sanger 210 in the handling department) One of the major winning points for me was the feel and appearance of the interior of the X1. In my opinion it definitely does not look like a price point boat by any stretch. Although this boat has been around for MANY years they have continued to improve the fit, finish, and material used and I think it really shows. You stated that the surf wake was important to you; the X1 throws a great surf wake because of its flat bottom, almost square hull. Being that the 205 was originally designed as a ski hull I think it also wins in that department. The tower on the X1 I feel is also nicer looking, I think the Supra tower looks a bit dated. With that said if you plan on riding frequently with a crew larger than 5 or 6 I would probably say go with the Supra as it is a bit roomier.

BTW, check out the Spring Ride CIE pictures.
http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/1/315114.html?1144857370
What hull was pulling the double up contest? Oh yeah, J-Rodís 205 hull! The tournament started out with another boat but by popular demand they switched over to the tried and true 205 hull. I donít think you can go wrong with either boat. Post some pics when you make up your mind.
Old    C.I.E..... Evan (guido)      Join Date: Jul 2002       04-12-2006, 1:46 PM Reply   
Yeah, maybe I've never ridden a Supra properly weighted, but I've got to say that the X1 has just about the best wake at any price. Not to many core riders will argue that. Some may like certain nuances of other wakes better, but the X1 wake will never hold you back. That wake is just sick. Not only that, but they get on plane quickly and are manuverable in tight spots (although they will chine lock if you aren't aware and careful).

BTW Attila, the V210 out handles the X1/X2 hands down. Not to say the MC is bad, I love mine, but the Sanger handles amazingly well.

Like Attila said, we ended up using the older X2 over the new one because: a) the riders adore the wake (pro and semi pro) and b) because the boat got on plane with all the weight quickly and esily. The new X2 was needing a bit more space when fully weighted to get rolling causing some difficulty on the dubs.
Old    Byrd (byrd)      Join Date: Dec 2005       04-12-2006, 2:03 PM Reply   
I also vote for the MC(see profile). I would test drive to make sure either way. If you are spending $45K on a boat, a dealer should let you test it out. Not to argue with anyone, if resale value is what you are looking for, do the research, numbers dont lie. I had 4 adults and 4 kids in my boat last weekend and it did not seem crowded, but more adults with the same amount of kids and it would have. What are your needs/wants in a boat? Either way, it will come down to your personal style, both will do the job, which will you enjoy more?
Old    Diggs (pdxWAKE) (tyler97217)      Join Date: Aug 2004       04-12-2006, 2:30 PM Reply   
I don't want to start a pissing match about re-sale but what do you mean numbers don't lie and re-sale is better on MC. Care to compare losses or gains on your last several MC's? Numbers don't lie.....
Seriously go with your gut and the best choice for you guys instead of letting a bunch of us that are defending our investments (if you can call them that)
Both are flippin awesome boats.....
Old    Diggs (pdxWAKE) (tyler97217)      Join Date: Aug 2004       04-12-2006, 2:36 PM Reply   
although, I will concur that one is an 05' and one is an 06'. That will certainly make a difference in re-sale. Will not argue that point.
Old    Jason Overholser (madlab)      Join Date: Apr 2006       04-12-2006, 2:56 PM Reply   
Thanks for all the great feedback guys-keep it coming. Both boats are great and resale is not my main priority. Our boat will regularly take 2 adults and 2 kids with occasionally 6 adults. I need to find time for wet tests. Thanks
Old     (attila916)      Join Date: Oct 2005       04-12-2006, 5:01 PM Reply   
Evan, let's see a pic of your X2. Was it the red and white one at Spring ride?
Old    discolafinger            04-12-2006, 9:16 PM Reply   
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Old    discolafinger            04-12-2006, 9:20 PM Reply   
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Old    Chad White (cwhite)      Join Date: Mar 2006       04-12-2006, 9:29 PM Reply   
I would have to agree the wake of an x-1 is one of the best and you can weight the hell out of it and it keeps getting better. The bad thing is the x-1 is a small boat. I think the supra would have a good wake and it is a bigger boat. I don't think you could go wrong either way. You just have to decide if you want more space. I know you said only four people but storage also needs to be considered.
Old    discolafinger            04-12-2006, 9:42 PM Reply   
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Old    E Double U (three6ty)      Join Date: Feb 2004       04-12-2006, 10:27 PM Reply   
Disco-

How did you get a clean wakesurfing wake on the Passenger Side? How did you weight it?

I could never get my SSV to get a clean wake on that side, Only on the drivers side. There has been much debate about this as well. SO I am curious.
Thanks For the help

Old    discolafinger            04-12-2006, 10:43 PM Reply   
the rear pass. side has about 600#, a full bag, the front has 3/4 bag=800#, and the wake plate had the nose all the way up, and 5 peeps in the boat, there are some more pics the thread boats first board trip thank you for the compliment, just trying to get it all worked out
Old    discolafinger            04-12-2006, 10:45 PM Reply   
sorry about double pics
Old    B Poser (bbr)      Join Date: Apr 2002       04-13-2006, 7:49 AM Reply   
Jason, I'll chime in here with my opinion. I have a 22SSV, which I am selling to get a 21V. The SSV is a great boat, lots of interior room, kick ass wake. We would put about 3000lbs in it and it would handle even more if you wanted it. The wakeplate really helps out a lot in shaping the wake. I personally think that the tower is the best in the business. It is rock solid. NO creaks, squeaks, and it doesn't move an inch in choppy water or when driving down the road. You also can't beat the different seating configurations either. If you have a bunch of people just pull out the stadium seating, and everyone has a great view. I have never had one issue with my Supra.

The MC, does have one of the best wakes in the business. But I think that the boat is geared toward wakeboarding, much more so than skiing. The one thing that I didn't like, and most people don't, is the small size resulting in little interior room.

Both are good boats, but for what you are wanting to do, it seems like the Supra would be a better choice. Best thing is to ride in and behind both, and go with your gut. Good luck.

P.S.-- I'll sell you my SSV for a great price.
Old    Andrew Loffgren (loffgren)      Join Date: Apr 2006       04-13-2006, 8:11 AM Reply   
X1 of course...
Old    Diggs (pdxWAKE) (tyler97217)      Join Date: Aug 2004       04-13-2006, 8:22 AM Reply   
E double U
Disco's is a 24' SSV. You should still not have a prob cleaning up the wake for surfing. Do about the same thing Disco does.
Most important thing is speed (around 10mph) and have wake plate all the way up. Get a bunch of weight over there and to really clean it up have a person on the side of the boat hanging onto the tower and pulling some weight out. That will make it real nice....
Old    E.J. (deuce)      Join Date: Mar 2002       04-13-2006, 8:38 AM Reply   
I was under the impression that the 205 was also one of the best ski wakes around? I am not SURE of this, but thought it was one of the few certified V-Drives? Maybe someone can confirm.

I will preface this by again stating that I don't think you can go wrong with either boat. But the X-2(X-1 now) made it to my final 2.

Size was not a factor for me. All this talk of small....the X-1 is small if you are regularly going out with more than 5-6. This does not look to be the case with you.
Old    NAW (ripr)      Join Date: Mar 2002       04-13-2006, 8:51 AM Reply   
BTW, the Australian collegiate slalom record was set behind the 22SSV...last year I believe.

I had a '99 205 DD. While the ski wake was good, it wasn't like 1990 Prostar 190 good. I've never skied the 205V/X-1 though.
Old    C.I.E..... Evan (guido)      Join Date: Jul 2002       04-13-2006, 10:54 AM Reply   
A couple of the guys I used to ski with back in the day said the 205 hull really wasn't that great for long line skiing. They said the shorter line the better. That said I don't think they'd admit to liking anything that wasn't a Malibu.

Also, the deal with the X1/X2 is that it's really not that much smaller, but a lot of the room is in the front of the boat. The windshield sits back a ways. During the summer we regularly put 8-10 people on my boat. It's crowded, but do-able and the girls love the space in the front of the boat.

Attila, that was Jarrods boat. Mine is similar, but the colors are oppostie. Here is a pic of mine ready to ride.Upload
Old    Byrd (byrd)      Join Date: Dec 2005       04-13-2006, 11:20 AM Reply   
Diggs, read my post, it says "Not to argue with anyone, if resale value is what you are looking for, do the research, numbers dont lie." No where do I say the MC has a better resale value. Dont be so eager to get riled up to justify what you bought. I'm sure your boat does the job well. In fact, when I bought my MC, I did not even consider Supra because I dont have a local dealer, only MC and Nautique. I could have said it this way "if resale value is important to your purchase, do the research" Do you like that better?
Old    Jeff Vaaler (jcv)      Join Date: Oct 2005       04-13-2006, 11:26 AM Reply   
evan, there's still way too much "X" showing. i thought you guys run a lot of weight
Old    E.J. (deuce)      Join Date: Mar 2002       04-13-2006, 11:45 AM Reply   
That is what I was going to say Jeff....that boat is LOADED!

Though no women in the front Guido... You posted how girls love the front, then I see a pic and only see guys in the back.

FALSE ADVERTISING!
Old    NAW (ripr)      Join Date: Mar 2002       04-13-2006, 12:41 PM Reply   
I think the tires are flat on that there red boat!
Old    Darren Yearsley (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       04-13-2006, 1:45 PM Reply   
I love the look of a slammed boat
Old    C.I.E..... Evan (guido)      Join Date: Jul 2002       04-13-2006, 1:47 PM Reply   
Sorry for the false advertising guys. That was in November. For some reason the girls go into hiding that time of year. I'm not sure why I think the 60 degree water is plenty warm....LOL

Jeff, we were just breaking it in. I'll see what I can do to get it "loaded up" come summer. Ha, ha, it seems to get the job done, plus it sits way higher than my Sanger did.
Old    Diggs (pdxWAKE) (tyler97217)      Join Date: Aug 2004       04-13-2006, 1:57 PM Reply   
Byrd,
sorry man... you can interpret your post either way and in the context I understood it the other way. I understand you now.....
Old    Byrd (byrd)      Join Date: Dec 2005       04-13-2006, 5:45 PM Reply   
Diggs, NP Bro. I'll let you make it up to me by getting a pull behind your Supra if I ever make up to OR. I have never ridden behind one, but the wakes I see posted here look awesome. If you ever get down here to Cent. FL let em know and I pull you in my MC to return the favor.
Old    Paul Hanna (faceplanter69)      Join Date: Mar 2006       04-13-2006, 6:28 PM Reply   
The X-2 is one of my all time favorite boats to ride behind. The SSV not so much. The SSV is bigger inside but I just can't get over the feeling that your sitting on the floor all the time. Personally I'd take the sllightly smaller interior over the seating in the Supra.
Old    Lionel (lionel)      Join Date: Nov 2005       04-13-2006, 7:54 PM Reply   
I second Darren's thoughts, I love CIE's slammed look. How much weight is in that thing? The X1 might be smaller, but isn't that better if you're riding with the ladies? The closer, the better....
Old     (attila916)      Join Date: Oct 2005       04-13-2006, 8:10 PM Reply   
I personally like the 21V over the 22S for the same reason lionel. I don't like sitting down and having the knees in front of me. I don't have that problem in the X1.
Old    NAW (ripr)      Join Date: Mar 2002       04-14-2006, 5:12 AM Reply   
True, the 22SSV is a more sleek design with less depth. That's why the 21V is offered....98" wide, full wrap around seat, seats 13 (girls), all with a deep interior. And, IMO, the wake is a better shape, bigger out of the box and easier to build without taking up all the storage.
Old    Paul Hanna (faceplanter69)      Join Date: Mar 2006       04-14-2006, 8:53 AM Reply   
The problem I see with the 21V NAW is that Jason has chosen two sports car like handling boats. I spent a weekend in a 21V last year and yes it does have a nice wake. Tons of interior room and is very deep. However, the thing was a pig for lack of a better adjective. I don't think I'd ever driven a boat that handled as poorly and got up to speed like the 21V. That's saying a lot as I had a 05 VLX for a while with the stock engine and with the wedge down and it still performed better.

If the way it handles isn't a factor then ya, I'd look at a 21V. However, I do like a boat that is fun to drive everyone once in a while. The SSV and X-1 will be far better there for sure.
Old    entrust clothing (entrustclothing)      Join Date: Jul 2005       04-14-2006, 8:57 AM Reply   
people always say that the 21v handles bad, ive never driven one so i can't say. but you are buying a wakeboard boat. what do you except? if i want a boat that was fast and handled great i would get a sea doo jet boat. my 23' XLV is no sportscar but it doesn't need to be
Old    Diggs (pdxWAKE) (tyler97217)      Join Date: Aug 2004       04-14-2006, 9:47 AM Reply   
Byrd, was just in central FL and would have taken you up on it. Spent many hours sitting at the pool and pummelling beers.... good times...

I have to agree with many of the sentiments that the 21V is definitley not a sports car. Definitely not a terrible handling boat though. Who drives a wakeboard boat around for handling? We load them up and pull people. They all handle crappy. I had an 05 21V and now an 06 21V and it is night and day on handling. The hull and everything is the same yes, but they have done something with the steering and it honestly now handles with the best of them. Honestly...

Entrust you can drive mine next outing and form your own opinion (just don't hit anything) ha ha
No it is not a ferrari and never will be, but huge improvement.....
Old    entrust clothing (entrustclothing)      Join Date: Jul 2005       04-14-2006, 9:51 AM Reply   
diggs i'm scared to drive my own boat now :-( let alone drive yours :-)

i can't really compare much, i've only driven 2 tournament boats really, my old outback and my XLV and the outback was a sportscar, it had the same motor as my xlv but was 800lbs less and 3 feet shorter! it deffinitely handled better but like i said it's a wakeboard boat handleding is at the bottom of the list for me
Old    KG (iagainsti)      Join Date: Apr 2004       04-14-2006, 11:03 AM Reply   
I recently test drove a 06' 21V and an 06 VLX and just sold a 01 X-star. Trust me a good wakeboard boat doesnt have to handle like a pig. The VLX handles like a race car-the MC also handles great but not quite as nice as the VLX and the 21V handles like a tugboat. All three boats have awesome wakes. Never been in a SSV.
Old    NAW (ripr)      Join Date: Mar 2002       04-14-2006, 11:46 AM Reply   
...it doesn't have to cost 50-60K either

Old    Byrd (byrd)      Join Date: Dec 2005       04-14-2006, 12:04 PM Reply   
Damn Diggs, we whould have disagreed sooner... Then I would have joined you for a few, or many, cold ones. Where were you staying when you were in Cent FL?

(Message edited by byrd on April 14, 2006)
Old    Diggs (pdxWAKE) (tyler97217)      Join Date: Aug 2004       04-14-2006, 12:07 PM Reply   
I agree Supra sucks.... you should stay away... pay 60K for another brand cause it helps our boat values stay higher...

The SSV definitely handles more like the previously mentioned boats like the VLX. I have driven the VLX and the SSV and both handle better than the 21V.
Old    Diggs (pdxWAKE) (tyler97217)      Join Date: Aug 2004       04-14-2006, 12:08 PM Reply   
oh yeah the first line was a joke.....
Byrd,
was at the Gaylord Palms in Orlando
Old    Paul Hanna (faceplanter69)      Join Date: Mar 2006       04-14-2006, 12:53 PM Reply   
Hey, didn't want to offend the 21V owners out there. I did really like the boat and wake. Tug boat is a nicer way to put it I guess.

If handling isn't important than the 21v would be a nice choice. Like I said before, every once in while I like to put the boat through the paces. Driving in a straight line gets pretty boring hour after hour. LIke KG said, a great wakeboard boat can handle well too.

I still say the X-1. Nobody wants 10 people in their boat anyways. You never get to ride, even in a 23 foot LSV I still wouldn't want more than 5 people in the boat. Bigger is not always better, especially when gas his 3 bucks per gallon this summer. I wonder if some of these larger boat owners are going to be thinking they'd like a boat that doesn't need 3000 pounds to throw a wake.

I'll be using a SANTE for the first couple of months this year. There's another boat that doesn't need a lot of weight to produce a great wake.
Old    C.I.E..... Evan (guido)      Join Date: Jul 2002       04-14-2006, 1:50 PM Reply   
hmmm, I've always thought 3000lbs was a good starting point for any boat
Old    Paul Hanna (faceplanter69)      Join Date: Mar 2006       04-16-2006, 6:01 PM Reply   
The difference being CIE you're putting 3000 lbs in your boat and it still handles better than some. Put 3k in a 23 foot LSV or 21V and a poor handling boat gets worse. Almost like it's exponential.

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