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Old    Tara (gypsy12)      Join Date: Apr 2004       08-01-2005, 10:56 PM Reply   
Heard a little something about a girl getting hurt out there on the delta this past weekend... hit by a boat? Anyone heard any details? Is she okay?
Old    Tate Viehmann (redv215)      Join Date: Mar 2005       08-02-2005, 8:23 AM Reply   
Yes there was a girl who was run over on the delta this last weekend. She was hurt very badly.
Old    C.I.E..... Evan (guido)      Join Date: Jul 2002       08-02-2005, 8:26 AM Reply   
Apparently she was being pulled when she fell and was left behind. A different boat with some younger kids came around a semi blind corner into the sun and ran her over.

Word is that the people towing her were very intoxicated and didn't know she fell. The person driving the boat that hit her was completely sober, but was blinded by the sun.

Sad story. Hopefully she recovers.
Old    Phil (mmobius2001)      Join Date: Jun 2004       08-02-2005, 10:17 AM Reply   
that sucks, i usually dont drink in the summers at all when im boarding especially, i have tons of fun w/o being drunk.
Old    tommcat            08-02-2005, 10:54 AM Reply   
i agree, no drinking for our drivers!
Old    Clete (domin8)      Join Date: Mar 2004       08-03-2005, 9:35 PM Reply   
She is home from the hospital, many many stitches, (2) boken legs and a head injury is what I know. Very lucky IMO.
Old    Tara (gypsy12)      Join Date: Apr 2004       08-03-2005, 10:07 PM Reply   
Clete, have you found any media on it?
Old    Clete (domin8)      Join Date: Mar 2004       08-03-2005, 10:54 PM Reply   
Tara, No, she goes to the high school here in town and my boys and their friends know her. They have been waiting to visit her at home.
Old    wbhata            08-04-2005, 8:35 AM Reply   
Phil, I'm with ya. I don't drink either. I just smoke some dope and I'm good...
Old    Ty (wakeandsnow27)      Join Date: Jun 2004       08-05-2005, 9:04 AM Reply   
dope aint dope homie and crack is wack, ya heard?!
Old    Kevin McGuirk (ktmwakeboarder)      Join Date: Jun 2004       08-09-2005, 12:37 AM Reply   
As much as I love to drink, and drink a lot I do, one of the rules on the boat is no alcohol. I just dodn't allow it, and we always have the best time. When I'm on other people's boats, I will give myself the liberty of a few drinks, but I don't drive. But yeah, it keeps things much safer and less to worry about. Just how I do things, not trying to tell anyone else what to do...
Old    Bob (bob)      Join Date: Feb 2001       08-09-2005, 5:58 AM Reply   
Isnt that hypocritical, youll drink on others boats but no alcohol on your boat? Hell yea we drink! Lets see, accidents happen: car accidents...will you stop driving a car, plane crashes...will you stop flying? Yes alcohol can, at times, be a contributing factor but what about all those people that do drink every weekend and dont have accidents. Lets eliminate all accidents and in doing so you wont be riding a wakeboard as they are dangerous (just read the warning label) and you wont be in a free country either. This is like blaming the gun for a shooting...uh i think someone was behind the trigger?? Just a guess though. Do we blame the car or boat in an accident when a stupid person causes an accident,hell no?
Old    ben brimer (jbenbri)      Join Date: Jun 2004       08-09-2005, 6:25 AM Reply   
Let's just hope it is not you or your family who gets hurt Bob.
Old    Ric Morgan (wkbdtime)      Join Date: Oct 2004       08-09-2005, 7:24 AM Reply   
Best wishes for the the young wakeboarder girl and her recovery. Whats her name? To the driver who ran her over...There is no excuse..You where not paying attention and you deserve the full proseution by the law.( We will follow this incident and force law enforcement to prosecute to the fullest extent). You as a boat Driver are resposible for everyone on the boat and in the water...That includes downed boarders and skiers...Using the excuse the sun was in my eyes gives no sympathy to the young girl who can see a 5,000 pound boat coming towards her. If you can not see, shut the boat down and reposition your boat... We see more kids driving boats but not following the rules of the water. If your a parent who bought you kids a boat and you havent given them the gift of boat etiquitte, you are 90% of the problem.

To the driver pulling the young wakeboard girl...I want to hear your story before making a comment...Please post here....

Ric Morgan
learn2wakeboard.com
Old    cdm (cdm)      Join Date: Aug 2003       08-09-2005, 9:31 AM Reply   
ahh to late Ric, I think you already hung the kid. This just as easily been a very experienced older driver...
Old    C.I.E..... Evan (guido)      Join Date: Jul 2002       08-09-2005, 9:45 AM Reply   
Yeah Ric... I'm really sorry to hear about this accident, but on a busy weekend there is a ton going on in the Delta. I've spent my life on the water and am still nervous driving on busy weekends. Last weekend alone there were 3-4 times I had to completely stop the boat because of stupidity going on in front of me (people starting riders at the same time next to eachother, driving down the wrong side of the slough, Wakesurfing in a really busy slough, etc, etc). The Delta is a busy place and late in the afternoon depending on where the sun is I have been blinded by it, too. I'm not saying it's ok, but I'm saying it was an accident. I blame the drunk driver of the boat pulling the girl more than the other driver. On a busy weekend you should have everyone in the boat watching the rider. I cant even count the number of times I have take evasive action to put my boat in front of another to protect my downed rider.

I'm just saying: best wishes to the girl and may this be a lesson for everyone to pay attention on the boat.
Old    David D (wakeguru)      Join Date: Feb 2003       08-09-2005, 9:51 AM Reply   
My buddy almost got run over on our lake about a week ago. The guy was pulling a rider and not paying attention. He was only 30-40 yards away and headed straight toward our downed rider and we hadn't enough time to get back. Luckily, his rider fell and he stopped.

This guy was older, but not experienced (we went and had a chat with them). As an experienced driver, I'm always scanning the water.

This is horrible. One minute your having the time of your life and the next your clinging to life. I hope this girl has a full and speedy recovery. Let us know how it plays out, Clete.
Old    David D (wakeguru)      Join Date: Feb 2003       08-09-2005, 9:58 AM Reply   
Word, Evan. However, I don't let the driver who hit her off the hook but I agree that the people pulling her were negligent based on what you've said.

Do you know about how far they continued after she fell?
Old    Kevin McGuirk (ktmwakeboarder)      Join Date: Jun 2004       08-09-2005, 11:18 AM Reply   
ja, maybe a lil hypocritical, but i won't be doing any of the driving, which is a nice change. haha, and drinking on planes is awesome- i'm not flying the plane so i hope you don't have a problem with that :-) Bob, all i'm saying is that i take my wakeboarding seriously when i'm riding on my boat, and no alcohol is ever present. When i'm on close friend's boats and they bring beer, i'll have a few throughout the day as a social thing. They usually don't do hard-core wakeboarding days like my day trips
Old    C.I.E..... Evan (guido)      Join Date: Jul 2002       08-09-2005, 1:24 PM Reply   
David, I'm speaking purely second hand, but I was told that her boat proceded more than a mile down the slough from her. Apparently they went around a corner and never looked back. It was a bad situation. She was left around a blind corner with the sun behind her and no boat around.
Old    Kevin McGuirk (ktmwakeboarder)      Join Date: Jun 2004       08-09-2005, 3:51 PM Reply   
More than a mile! Wow, that's pretty bad, hopefully she'll be alright... a bunch of bad circumstances together forming an awful accident :-(
Old    Matt VdA (mvda)      Join Date: Dec 2002       08-09-2005, 4:29 PM Reply   
If I decided to go swimming in the middle of Vic's slough (especially on a weekend, in spot where oncoming traffic is coming around a corner, and looking into the sun) would it be the fault of the boat driver when I got run over? With no boat in sight, it sounds as if this girl was essentially a made to be swimmer in a very bad spot by the idiot that ditched her. I highly doubt that all those so eager to hang the guy that hit her usually watch for swimmers on the delta. Regardless of who you are, swimmers are hard to spot, especially when there is no indication or reason to be watching for them.

It's the duty of a boat driver is to protect his/her rider, first with the flag and presense of the boat, and then by putting the boat between the rider and oncoming traffic whenever possible. You can't leave the fate of your rider up to the competency of other boaters. The guy towing the girl was grossly negligent which unfortunately resulted some major injuries. It sounds to me like the boat that hit her was, for the most part, unlucky.
Old    mile_high_rider            08-09-2005, 6:16 PM Reply   
sounds to me like we all are empathetic(sp?) to the guy who hit her and of course, her. it is deff. the tow boat drivers fault, at least it seems so to me.
Old    Buzz (buzz_grande)      Join Date: Mar 2004       08-09-2005, 6:41 PM Reply   
Maybe I missed something in all these posts, with the placing blame on both/either drivers. It seems both are to blame to some degree. My question is - where the hell was the OBSERVER, and what the hell were they watching?
Old    Ric Morgan (wkbdtime)      Join Date: Oct 2004       08-09-2005, 10:16 PM Reply   
To all..

Lets face one fact...We as Boat Owners, have sole responsiblity over everyone in the boat and to anyone near the boat. This is how it has always been. This is standard Boat Etiquitte. Unless we keep this standard high. You will continue to see more accidents like this...When this happens then our insurance goes up, Then we turn to regulatory statues. Then the delta becomes a thing of the past..Then its back to the lakes...No Way...

Keep The Standards High...

This accident should of never happened. Let the law make an example out of both of them.

If someone could foward the girls name and hospital she is in so we can send cards and flowers. ricm@learn2wakeboard.com

Ric Morgan
learn2wakeboard.com
Old    mile_high_rider            08-09-2005, 11:01 PM Reply   
I second rick, hook up a third party that could get flowers to her, so she dosent have to put an adress on the internet. I am jobless but would give to that "cause".
Old    doctor octagon (dococ)      Join Date: Mar 2002       08-10-2005, 12:34 AM Reply   
Bob, nothing personal buddy, but your statement made absolutely no sense to me.
I could understand maybe if you were drinking when you typed it, but at 6am on a Tuesday?
Old    Bob (bob)      Join Date: Feb 2001       08-10-2005, 5:40 AM Reply   
It makes clear sense. People blame guns all the time for killing. People are afraid of flying because they hear one plane crashes, when we all know the amount of flight hours compared to automobile hours verses accidents is pure stupidity for people to drive verses fly. People hear about 2 shark attacks when in actuality the amount of people in the coastal waters of FL every day for so many hours, your more likely to be struck by lightning. Now the comparison: Alcohol was not the main factor in this as people are trying to make it seem. STUPID PEOPLE are and hear is my take on responsibility. #1,driver who ran her over- #2,spotter- #3,driver who didnt look back or had lame spotters (you choose) #4, (as much as you may not agree with me here) the girl herself if the boat had actually gone a mile down a narrow channel. Here is why: If its so narrow why didnt she just swim to shore if its so narrow through there and the boat was a mile away. I board in the intracoastal waterway and if i was riding on a busy day or one of my crew and the boat kept going we would surely swim out of the busy portion of the channel. People are always so eager to hang someone on here and we dont know the full story, just heresay that someone posted, so :"Let the law make an example out of both of them." I dont think is appropriate until we know the full details?
JMO
Old    David (whitlock87)      Join Date: Feb 2005       08-10-2005, 6:11 AM Reply   
It has been 9 days since this post started; does any body know how she is doing?
Has any body been able to get an address together for sending stuff?
Thanks David
Old    Rich Dykmans (richd)      Join Date: Oct 2003       08-10-2005, 9:15 AM Reply   
I believe the accident happened on Indian Slough right before the 5 mph zone going into the D-bay boat harbor and where Indian slough forks going to Orwood, at least that's where the emergency vechicles were. As everyone living in D-Bay knows that area is crazy on the weekends between the offshore boats, PWC's, cruisers etc. I don't want to minimize the responsibility or culpability of the driver that ran the poor girl over but there are so many things happening with all the other boats in that area that missing someone just sitting there in the water would be very easy in my mind. It's just insane to even pull anyone through there on a weekend, let alone abondon them if they went down. Other then right in front of ski beach that's probably the most dangerous stretch of water in the south Delta.
Old    mile_high_rider            08-10-2005, 10:03 AM Reply   
alachol seems like the problem to me? Iv never missed a rider fall when sober, maybee I am not one of the stupid ones of which bob spoke, but more than likely its because im not a drunk.
Old    Mike (lehmur)      Join Date: Oct 2001       08-10-2005, 10:43 AM Reply   
Funny that you guys are so quick to start blaming people for an accident that you have received 3rd hand facts about. I don't argue the principals that most of you are discussing (I agree with many of them), but trying to justify blame using 3rd hand information is irresponsible. I was at the dock right after they flew the girl out, watched the Sheriff and Coast Guard interview everyone and I heard one of the folks from the boat that hit her telling the story and it didn't sound the same as what Evan has heard. I'm not disputing what Evan said as I was not in the middle of the conversation I heard, but what I heard from a few feet away sounded drastically different. I won't comment as I can't say for sure, just that it sounded very different.
Either way, a bad situation and I am glad to hear the girl is doing OK. It was a horrible thing.

Mike
Old    Tara (gypsy12)      Join Date: Apr 2004       08-10-2005, 10:55 AM Reply   
Well put, Mike.

(Message edited by gypsy12 on August 10, 2005)
Old    David D (wakeguru)      Join Date: Feb 2003       08-10-2005, 11:11 AM Reply   
Most sensible people understand that we have "3rd hand" information here, Mike. In fact, Evan even said exactly that.

You could just say what it "sounded" like...
Old    doctor octagon (dococ)      Join Date: Mar 2002       08-10-2005, 12:16 PM Reply   
Nevermind, Bob. Your energized defense of alcohol in this equation is interesting, and one wonders what that stems from.
Keep on drinking all you want buddy, and please stay down there on the panhandle because the NorCal delta is plenty dangerous already.
Old    Bob (bob)      Join Date: Feb 2001       08-11-2005, 6:04 AM Reply   
Well your the doc, why dont you tell me what it stems from as you insinuate your right and im wrong? Trust me im smart enough to not come to your overpriced, overpopulated state. From the sound of it im glad i'll not be visiting your precious delta as was stated above :"people starting riders at the same time next to eachother, driving down the wrong side of the slough, Wakesurfing in a really busy slough, etc, etc" Sounds to me like the people that live there have more money then brains. This is all in addition to people trying to hang someone they heard thirdhand info about, this sounds like horse and carriage days???? Im done on this one as it doesnt matter if you have one beer and are completely sober because lame a$$ people will call you a drunk and blame you even if an accident happens and your not at fault????? I just hope no one ever runs into me because they are idiots, oh and I also hope she will get well and make a full speedy recovery.
Old    jetgofish            08-11-2005, 9:47 AM Reply   
I've been lurking on this post all week and though I agree with some and disagree with others, I'll hold my thoughts and give you some more information about what happened.

A family memeber of mine is friends with the person who was driving the boat which the girl that was hurt was being pulled by. Apparently the driver HAD NOT been drinking and the boat that hit her was following close behind. The girl not realizing the boat behind was following so closely threw the rope and the following boat wasn't paying close attention and ran the girl over. This is all the detail that I know, whether or not alcohol played a part in the boat that hit the girl or not I don't know. They were able to save the girls leg, but don't feel that she will have mobility in her ankle upon recovery.
Old    David (whitlock87)      Join Date: Feb 2005       08-11-2005, 12:22 PM Reply   
Based on what Teri said, is why I do not let other boats stay behind me.

I also have hand signals worked out with my riders to tell them when they need to stay behind me and lay off the tricks until I give them the ok.
(We use this if a boat is coming up from behind, or if there is something going on ahead of us)

Old    DRA-Doug (load)      Join Date: Jul 2003       08-11-2005, 12:36 PM Reply   
David, good idea! Rather than re-invent the wheel what are the signals you use--thanks
Old    robertt            08-11-2005, 12:53 PM Reply   
David...great idea! What are the signals you use?

Last weekend I was pulling a buddy into the sun. A boat pulling a tube decided to cross in front of me from my right to the left about 500 yards ahead. Not a huge deal. I noticed he had his flag up (on my lake you are supposed to only have a flag exposed when a rider is IN the water, not being pulled). I thought he was an idiot....but whatever.

He crosses in front of me with tons of time...cruises another 500 yards to my left, then slows down.

I got a funny feeling.....scanned the water and found nothing, but there was a small section in front of me that the sun washed out.

I stopped and my rider dropped. No boat within 500 yards on a nearly empty lake. I told him to hang for a second....and I turned a little to finally see a head bobbing around in front of me.

Turns out there was two riders on one tube..they lost one and didn't realize it for several seconds, then stopped to see where he was.

I was lucky, he was lucky, we all were. Normally I would have kept trucking on...I probably would have seen him in time but maybe not.

having the flag up all the time (if it is not the law) is a very dangerous practice. Since their flag was already up...they had no way of warning me.

Anyway, it was an uneventful situation that only lasted a few seconds but goes to show you that you have to be on your toes all the time. If you have a blind spot in front of you from the sun...stop. Its not worth it, even if you have to drop your rider.

This was a sad story. I hope she recovers soon.
Old    Paul (psudy)      Join Date: Dec 2003       08-11-2005, 1:07 PM Reply   
You are lucky you didn't hit him! That Morgan guy would have been after your head, even though it would have been an accident.

(Message edited by psudy on August 11, 2005)
Old    David (whitlock87)      Join Date: Feb 2005       08-11-2005, 1:12 PM Reply   
Sorry no photos
Here are the four signals we use

1)Thumb up = Faster
2)Thumb down = Slower
3)Closed fist = Stop
4)Open hand fingers pointing up = Stay behind the boat.
(Have your hand flat and open with fingers pointing up and your palm off to the side.
You should be looking at you thumb. As a drive I just raise my hand in this position over my head and the riders knows that I need them to stay inline with me)

When its clear the observer will wave there hand side to side letting the rider know that they are free to do what they want

This has worked out well for us.
I cannot take the credit for this. As when we first got into boating last year, a friend at work gave me a lot of advice, and this was one of them.
Old    Tara (gypsy12)      Join Date: Apr 2004       08-11-2005, 1:25 PM Reply   
Bob,

Quote: "Trust me im smart enough to not come to your overpriced, overpopulated state"

There's no need to insult every human being in the state of California.
Old    doctor octagon (dococ)      Join Date: Mar 2002       08-11-2005, 1:30 PM Reply   
Sounds like we touched a nerve there, doesn't it, B? It doesn't take a doctor to see that there is something going on there. Good luck with that.
Old    doctor octagon (dococ)      Join Date: Mar 2002       08-11-2005, 1:36 PM Reply   
Tara,
Well you know what they say... this IS the land of fruits and nuts!
Old    Bob (bob)      Join Date: Feb 2001       08-12-2005, 6:14 AM Reply   
I thought i was done except for the fact that im being accused of being a fruit or nut? So Doc since your all knowing and powerful am i a fuit or nut? Sorry Tara didnt mean to insult everyone in Ca just the extremist who feel their way is the only way. People take risks every day and for hypocrites to spout off about not drinking when i know everyone on here takes some sort of risk that involves others. Lets see theres speeding in a car(including pulling a trailer over the trlr speed limit), smoking around others, hell even where you choose to live sometimes is risking the lives of your family (seems i choose to live in hurricane alley). Who owns a gun with small children, dont automatically assume you wont have an accident in YOUR home because im sure the last time a regular family had a gun accident they said the same thing. Doc you dont do any of these or the many list of others, DO YOU, check yourself? Now im done
Old    doctor octagon (dococ)      Join Date: Mar 2002       08-12-2005, 7:58 AM Reply   
Bob, simmer down, bud. My father in law (from Atlanta) is always teasing us that CALIFORNIA "is the land of fruits and nuts." I was just trying to lighten up a depressingly hostile line of discussion, and my joke was directed at Tara's comment (who is a friend of mine, as are many participating on this thread). I thought my syntax was clear, but oh well. Nevermind.

I think it's funny when people choose to engage me in argument and then get pissed and accuse me of being a "know it all" and attempting to impose my views upon them. I try to be very careful not to offer advice unsolicited. If you go back, I believe you'll find that I never told you what you should do, except in jest I agreed with your own earlier statement that you should have the "freedom" to drink as you see fit while wakeboarding, boat driving, and what-not (and I suggested maybe that behavior is better staying where it is).

I feel bad for the direction this thread has gone. It was not really my intention to hurt you or aggravate any pre-existing issues, but quite possibly that is what happened. I simply got pulled into the discussion after you came out swinging and you drew first blood. I actually have much more I could write, but I feel this thing will never end, and I don't want to make an enemy of you because there's no benefit to either of us. I've followed your posts over the last couple years and you seem like a decent guy.

So that's it. You can have the last word if you want it.
Old    jetgofish            08-12-2005, 8:10 AM Reply   
Wow - I can't believe that we go from the thoughts of a nearly tragic accident to banter back and forth ...

Doc we've had the chance to ride together once or twice and I think you are a great guy and a bigger person for trying to end the banter; thank you!

Here is an update on the topic at hand, the accident.

I've had a chance to learn more about the accident which we originally started this thread for. Neither parties were drinking when this accident occured, a sobriety check was given to EVERY member of both boats involved. The driver of the boat who hit the girl simply did not see her (why, is still unclear) however his rider did and when the boat hit the girl the rider on the boat that hit her dropped and stopped right where shame came out from under the boat. She lost 10 pints of blood (which if most of you don't know the human body has 18 pints Doc please correct me if I am wrong.) The boat that hit her unbolted her bindings from her board since it was so chewed up, cut up their rope and tied it around her legs to try and stop the bleeding, she was air lifted out and they were able to save both of her legs.

This really is all that I have ... no aclohol was involved.
Old    Bob (bob)      Join Date: Feb 2001       08-12-2005, 8:35 AM Reply   
Were all good. I just dont like it when people try to blame everything on alcohol. Here is how it went:
"Word is that the people towing her were very intoxicated and didn't know she fell."

"that sucks, i usually dont drink in the summers at all when im boarding especially, i have tons of fun w/o being drunk."

"i agree, no drinking for our drivers!"
As much as I love to drink, and drink a lot I do, one of the rules on the boat is no alcohol. I just dodn't allow it""But yeah, it keeps things much safer "

IMO
I wonder if now that alcohol wasnt involved will we : "We will follow this incident and force law enforcement to prosecute to the fullest extent"

I guess its human nature to just go off if you here one person make a misleading statement like was made above and if someone had a beer in their hand and an accident happend they must be/are a drunk and thats automatically the reason the accident happened???


I do also truely hope she recovers fully and this is my last word





Old    Austin Hegarty (thirdgear)      Join Date: Jul 2005       08-12-2005, 9:43 AM Reply   
There was an accident similar to this on a lake in my area (Lake Austin) about a month ago. A kid I went to High-School with was out with friends and learning how to wakeboard behind an I/O. I've heard that they were attempting to do doubles, which automatically raised some red flags for me as the majority of people in the situation were inexperienced and it seemed like a dangerous situation. They had two ropes on the tower or ring or whatever they had on their boat, and one rope came off and fell into the water just behind the boat.

The kid I knew apparently said that he was jumping in to get it and immediately proceeded to do so, but the driver wasn't aware of this. The boat was put into reverse right as this kid jumped in to get the rope, and his leg came in direct contact with the prop. The only reason this guy survived was because his friends/people who saw the accident rushed over and (incorrectly, as in they tell you not to do this yourself) put a tourniquet on his leg. He lost almost all his blood and was clinically dead (and had been for some time) upon entering the hospital. In the end, they had to amputate his leg up to the hip. Amazingly enough, he survived the incident and is already doing PT -- incredibly strong kid. Moral of the story, accidents involving stupid boating and propellers probably occur much more than necessary, and we all need to use our heads out there. Forget about the dangers imposed by other inexperienced boaters, we've got to watch ourselves as well.

Best wishes to this girl. It's great that she didn't lose any limbs, and I hope she has the speediest recovery possible.
Old    Machew (mbrown)      Join Date: May 2005       08-13-2005, 12:41 AM Reply   
Hey, can we all get the word out to the delta riders-
#1 no alcohol for drivers
#2 no following, unless you can come to a complete stop before the rider in front of you(not just go around them in the slough)
#3 Indian slough after 10 am on weekends is crazy and should not be used for riding (it's only about 2 miles of the 1100 mile delta, find some alternate water)
#4 Stop the F@*%ing Power Turning, nothing ruins water and decreases safety than a hugh "james bond" power turn
#5 Power turn only if your intention is to ram another boat to protect your down rider
#6 Follow the right of way rules and drive the right direction down the sloughs (it's just like a road)
#7 Donate blood before every season, someone, maybe you, will ultimately use it.

Thank God she made it! Pray for a fast recovery!
Old    Jeff Moore (jeff359)      Join Date: Jun 2005       08-13-2005, 7:54 AM Reply   
For me lately, #6 is the big one at the railroads, twins, and victoria sloughs.

I almost had the horror of running over someone a week ago last thursday at the railroads after a Malibu waksetter was coming down the wrong way. I had slowed to about 15 MPH, and moved all the way to the right. he was pulling a skier, I wasn't, so I was beeing cool. The guy boarding behind the bu, pulls a piss poor wake to wake and bails about 15 feet of the bow of my boat. Needless to say, I had to shut down, and turn my brand new boat into the rocks. It was so close, that by the time the boarder popped up and he was floating arms length off the side of my boat. I exchanged words, but avoided kick in anyones face, as I was with my wife and daughter and just completely avoided the situation after I had my say. If I had not been a decent driver, following rules, and paying attention, I'd be the one that people here would be hunting for and swearing up and down that I was a drunk fool (despite not drinking.)

This is why we plead with others to learn what's going on, treat the water and others with respect, and use your head. It's crap like this that has ruined the delta for me, and I haven't even attempted to go out on a weekend in over 4 seasons, just because of the problems.

To the three trust fund asses riding in the black and grey late model Bu, your day will come. While I certainly don't advicate violence, I won't stop anyone from doling out a random ass whooping any of the three of ya. hell it would have been me, if it happened a day later when I was out there with Big Ed/shizzle and my buddy Sean. Love to see these clowns try that move in front of one of the drunk, over dosed steroid goons at ski beach.


Old    Jack Murphie (murphie07)      Join Date: Aug 2004       08-13-2005, 8:28 AM Reply   
Is there a map that shows which sloughs are one way on the delta?
Old    Jeff Moore (jeff359)      Join Date: Jun 2005       08-13-2005, 10:56 AM Reply   
Nothing is legally one way. BUT, for the 25 years that I've been on the Delta, if there are two sloughs running parallel, you drive on the right side. Like driving a car, or yielding to other boats. That's why I plead for people to learn their lake, river, whatever. Learn the safety hazards, and common boating "rules" that are followed.

In my situation, the bigger problem was the skier/boader that felt the need to jump in front of my boat for whatever reason. I still can't figure out why. Words can't explain how close this was, wife was so scared see was in tears. I'd say he was trying to show off for us, but he sucked. Plain and simple. While I'm no expert, it takes more than a sloppy wake to wake, with extremely bad technique to impress me or my wife.

I'd love nothing more than for one of these F?*Ksticks to show up here and explain themselves. I really don't wanna run into them out on the water, A - because they are dangerous in a boat and I don't wanna be anywhere near them. AN B - I will open up on them, and I really don't want that with the hassel of being arrested or something.

If anyone knows the jackasses that ride a late model black and grey wakesetter VLX( maybe an lsv), three dudes like 18 to 20, tell them owe me $600 for gell coat repairs to my brand new boat (only 16 hrs.) Tell them to give the bill to Daddy, he bought you the boat, I'm sure he can afford it.
Old    jetgofish            08-13-2005, 5:50 PM Reply   
Jeff - I feel your pain, I've been a delta rider for 30 years now, grown up out here with family bass fishing and now boarding. I've seen my fair share of stupid stuff and still continue to see it.

Jack - As for what Jeff indicated, there really is not map showing slough direction, as he stated it's pure common sense and though some (more than others) seem to lack it, just think of the delta or a slough as the road, stay to the right and when all esle fails, stop and maybe watch a few other boats!
Old    Machew (mbrown)      Join Date: May 2005       08-13-2005, 10:46 PM Reply   
Jeff, just today I experienced the violation of rule #2. this guy in a yellow I/O, or maybe with a Yamaha outboard and a home made garage welded tower (black) decided to put his rider in the water at the beginning of the slough and have a race to see who can get up first, well since I was there about 4 days before him I yelled to my driver and we were going long before he even threw the rope to his rider, but this didn't stop him from gunning it and dragging his rider at skiing speed to try and pass us (we were going 22mph). His rider wasn't skiing, had no characteristics of being an experienced rider, and was all of about 12 years old. I guess daddy wanted him to have first pass at any cost. So he pulls up on my a$$, just before the attempted pass I give him the throat slash signal, you know the one you get fined for in the NFL now. Well he backed off thankfully, came to his senses and realized that boats do not have F@#$ing brakes and if I decided to fall at that time my head would probably crack the last of the yellow gel coat on his piece of crap boat that wasn't oxidized. OK, trust fund kids and hillbillies with garage welded towers learn how to drive, start with #1 through #7 and you'll probably not pi$$ so many people off, get in a fight, or kill some innocent little girl.
I hope she's doing well, are there any updates?
Jack Jeff and Teri, would you be interested in getting together at the tracks some time to maybe hand out some flyers or establish some form of etiquette around there? I'm just so fed up I really want to start getting the word out!!
Maybe us taking action can be the good thing that comes out of this tragedy.
Old     (midwesty)      Join Date: Aug 2003       08-13-2005, 11:44 PM Reply   
wow...i feel for this girl and what happened to her but man...this discussion has went a few different ways!
Old    Jack Murphie (murphie07)      Join Date: Aug 2004       08-14-2005, 4:20 PM Reply   
One idea to get the message is ask Wakeworld to post pics of the Delta from Google Earth. Using the satelite photos with some text overlay could be more effective as this site has a huge number of members.... Just an idea might be a better communication method...Not that I don't want to meet you or help.
Old    Jeff Moore (jeff359)      Join Date: Jun 2005       08-14-2005, 4:32 PM Reply   
I don't think the problems on the delta are the people on wakeworld, IMO.
Old    Rich Dykmans (richd)      Join Date: Oct 2003       08-14-2005, 9:28 PM Reply   
Machew,

One more variation I would like to add to your rule #2.

some of us are pulling riders at 26-28 mph,

2a) If one's rider is in the water and there is a boat with their rider already up (not pulling up at the same time) bearing down on you please err on the side of waiting for them to pass unless you are damn well sure you are going to be up and pulling away from them before they get any where near you. (if it's me you're not going to be pulling away)

2b) If somehow one does end up snaking the above mentioned oncoming boat / rider moving over is greatly appreciated.

Nothing gives anyone the right to endanger a rider no matter how stupid the other guy is but waiting a minute to pull up for the faster boat to get by you just makes it better for all concerned.


Old    jetgofish            08-15-2005, 8:11 AM Reply   
Machew - I think a more effective non confrontational message to get across would be placing fliers on peoples vehicles, not that I'm not willing to go out and pass out fliers; just thinking this might be a lot less confrontational.

I also know the person that you are referring to with the yellow boat and home made tower. You must have been in the back slough on Saturday between Orwood and Holland Tract! Yeah, this guy lives a block away from me in Disco, I can add that he's not a trust fund baby! We witnessed them smoking a fatty bowl between sets late Saturday.
Old    Jeff Moore (jeff359)      Join Date: Jun 2005       08-15-2005, 9:06 AM Reply   
Home made tower, fatty bowls between sets? Sounds like the kinda guy I want to be on the water with. And call me rat, snitch, biotch, whatever, do this in front of me and get the cops called on you (same if I see a drunk driving). Cops may not do anything, but that's how I feel. Boating is my family activity, and I want to preserve it as such. Go home smoke blunts, crack, banana peals, dog don't care, you'll never hear me pass judgement. But keep it at home. I'm a little conservative when it comes to alcohol or drugs. Hell, I don't drink in front of children (my belief that it sends the wrong message.)

As for placing fliers on cars/trucks, you may check on the legality of doing this. In some areas this is illegal, although usually a city ordinance and most of our launches are in county juristiction(SIC?).

Old    Machew (mbrown)      Join Date: May 2005       08-16-2005, 12:58 AM Reply   
Thanks for the response, I think the best approach is to acquire the help of some of my local friends and design a flyer that can be distrubuted at the launch ramps around the south delta. Jeff, I don't have any problem with calling the cops, especially when you're trying to protect your family!!
As for rule #2, the best use of a directional slough in my opinion is to just wait and take turns. I've been both the faster rider and the slower rider, when I pull into some occupied water I try to communicate, not throw my rider in and race to the first pull. Show a little courtesy, if ya pull up and there's a guy already in the water, it is not your turn (unless they're taking an extra long code yellow and they say it's OK).
Any updates on the little girl?
Old    jetgofish            08-16-2005, 8:53 AM Reply   
No more updates on the girl, last report I heard is she has come from the hospital and is starting therapy
Old    C.I.E..... Evan (guido)      Join Date: Jul 2002       08-16-2005, 9:04 AM Reply   
I agree with Rich. Most of our riders are riding 24-27 mph now and its really annoying to have another boat take off pulling its rider at 22 mph in front of us. We usually end up dropping our rider and going back to wait for some clear water.
Old    disco_darkee            08-16-2005, 11:46 AM Reply   
To Rick Morgan,
I understand that you think your the delta king souly on the fact that you started a wakeboard school but for what you lack in intelligence I can tell you never have dropped the rope and tried picking up a book. Fortunatley, the people that decide the law in this country have picked up a book and that is why they are in charge of the application of justice rather than you. They are going to look at it in the aspect of if the 1st boat didn't continue on down the slough without a skier then the 2nd boat wouldnt have struck the girl. As for you saying your going to make sure that quoting you "We will follow this incident and force law enforcement to prosecute to the fullest extent."
Law enforcement really doesn't really care what you have to say about this incident, they deal with the facts not the postings on wakeworld to make a ruling. And let's be honest you would even have clue on how to make sure law enforcement punished those involved in the accident. So Ric for now do me a favor please stop teaching people anything period because you simply don't have any sense. So in essence your only making the human race stupider by teaching.

Howie
Old    Jeff Moore (jeff359)      Join Date: Jun 2005       08-16-2005, 12:28 PM Reply   
Ouch, either you don't like Rick or forgot to take your meds.

"We will follow this incident and force law enforcement to prosecute to the fullest extent." I'll back Rick on this, they do care what you think, for the most part. If you want reaction go to the District Attorney, Robert J. Kochly, who will be the one who decides the faith of this case (or atleast his office will.) The police, or in this case the Contra Costa Sheriff Office (led by Sheriff Warren E. Rupf), only conducts the initial investigation and refers it to the DA. Both Sheriff Warren E. Rupf and DA Robert Kochly are elected officials, so they MAY care about what you think, if you vote in this county. Now I will back Howie a little, from what little i know about this case, no charges will be filed, and the only court room it will see is civil court.
Old    Robert Thorson (thor)      Join Date: Oct 2001       08-16-2005, 1:45 PM Reply   
Wow, that's quite a first post Howie.

I've been following this thread since it began, but I never cared to jump in due to all of the tangents it has spun off on, but after reading Howie's response, I figured what the heck, why not?

First off, I want to say that the only thing that matters is that the young lady is doing well and hopefully she'll have a full recovery.

As for all of the other crap that this thread has spun off, I realize that for those of us who ride at the delta on a regular basis, it would be great if everyone was courteous and drove their boats in the way that we would like them too, but that just isn't reality. People are going to do what they want regardless of what someone posts on Wakeworld. Basically everyone who is complaining about the problems at the delta on Wakeworld is preaching to the choir.

Now while I've only been going to the delta for about 10 years, which is no where near as long as some of the people who have made up the unwritten rules, I've been going long enough to know that nobody on this board owns the water ways nor has any more right to dictate how the water ways should be utilized than some so called "Wally".

If you don't like the traffic on the weekends or the idiots who drive like crap in certain sloughs, then go during the week or find a less popular slough to ride in. Nobody is forcing you to share a slough with anyone who is driving irresponsibly in your opinion. From what so many of the know-it-all's have to say, there is somewhere around 1500 miles of waterways to ride on. Go somewhere else and stop all of your complaining. Your not solving the problem by threatening to kick someone's butt because you don't like how they are abusing "your" water. It's not your water!!! It's everyone's, so chill out and try to enjoy your time on the water versus worrying about what the "other" guy is doing. It many people's perspective, you might be the "other" guy sometime whether you think you are or are not.
Old    mark (speedy)      Join Date: Apr 2002       08-16-2005, 2:00 PM Reply   
Rob, shouldn't you be earning your raise. JK

mark
Old    Robert Thorson (thor)      Join Date: Oct 2001       08-16-2005, 2:26 PM Reply   
I know Mark, I need to get back to work.

I'm supposed to be negotiating a contract with ABC and ESPN to get our client's commercials to air during the Louisville Cardinal football games, but instead I'm wasting time by surfing wakeworld.

It's just that I get so tired of hearing everyone complain about the delta or acting like they are the local authority on how the water should be utilized. Some people just need to relax and enjoy life a little more and appreciate how well we have it. It is a very select group of people who own boats and get to wakeboard every week, and I think that some people forget just how fortunate we are to have the opportunity to spend our weekends on the water with good friends.
Old    jetgofish            08-16-2005, 2:26 PM Reply   
Rob - Great post!!!
Old    Kevin McGuirk (ktmwakeboarder)      Join Date: Jun 2004       08-16-2005, 5:11 PM Reply   
woo hoo! Thor comin in with some wise words :-) Hey Rob, have you been hittin up Folsom or Delta lately? and are you coming to Boardstock?
Old    wickedwakes (sjmedic)      Join Date: May 2004       08-16-2005, 5:27 PM Reply   
Please dont think that the other Howie was this Howie, I am mortified that I got a telephone call from one of my Delta friends thinking it was me!
Old    scott smith (sherman)      Join Date: Feb 2002       08-16-2005, 8:00 PM Reply   
Howie We will be having a party next month for the new house in discovery bay I hope you and the family can come

scott
Old    Machew (mbrown)      Join Date: May 2005       08-17-2005, 12:07 AM Reply   
I don't think there is any argument here. We are all very fortunate to have the delta and get many hours of enjoyment out of it on a weekly basis; but, there exists a lack of courtesy by many driver's who are unaware or intentionally impacting other peoples families, sometimes with horrific consequences.
I fully understand it is not "my water" and try to extend respect to other boats, not threats.
However, not everyone feels that they need to acknowledge other lives around them, thereby dangerously claiming the water for themselves. I just can't see anyone who has had a close call or has lost a friend at the delta just "chilling out" and letting the "other guy" unknowingly place people in danger.
Most of the fun at the delta is because of freedom, not complete social anarchy. We should stay cognizant of that. Seeing LifeFlight land is a good reminder.

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