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Old    blue_malibu            02-22-2005, 6:23 PM Reply   
I am trying to decide between the Malibu 25LSV or the Mastercraft X-star. Which one is going to handle better, going to have the least amount of problems, and last longer? Which one is truly the better boat? Which one is going to have the better re-sale value? Who makes a better boat?
Old    Mikeski (mikeski)      Join Date: Aug 2003       02-22-2005, 6:46 PM Reply   
1 vote for Malibu, stick with what you know.
Old    Wkerat (wkerat)      Join Date: Sep 2002       02-22-2005, 7:03 PM Reply   
go with the bu. You aren't really comparingocmparable boats since the vlx/lsv compare better to the x-star, but the 25 is a great boat and you are getting a lot more for your money with one.
Old    hyperlitenerd (hyperlitenrd)      Join Date: Jan 2003       02-22-2005, 7:09 PM Reply   
I posted this in another thread

Well with both boats you are going to get pro wakes. They are both in the big 3 (malibu mastercraft and correct craft)So you know the quality is not an issue. In my opinion is comes down to useablity of the boat, things such as, inside space and layout, storage space, and rough water handling. Turning on both these boats do not seem to be a problem, ive never done a comparison though. Both have spinner racks avaliable also.

now pro and cons for both boats

malibu:

pros: larger rear seating. more tower choices (titan, illision, cf blade, and swoop(i think)) The wedge ( i view it more as a wake shaper, so you can have rampy wake, or a steeper wake) Digital ballast monitoring system. the ballast tanks are now all below the floor. It also has bow ballast stock. It will handle rough water better I belive. We got our lsv(04) with a tower, spinner racks, bimini, basic stero, and turn down exaust(for a quiter ride) all for around 50k

Cons: It does not have quite as much storage as the x-star. no pop up carpet(just a carpet cover)

Mastercraft:

Pros: ALOT of storage. huge bow. more horse power.

cons: I know this is debateable, but i dont like having the batwing shaped bow, taking water over that would bring alot of water into the boat. Smaller rear seating area. will be atleast 60k (that is a rough guess, correct me if im wrong)

It will also come down to your dealer. who has better service, who treats you nicer, and maybe who is closer. Both are kick butt boats, cant go wrong either way. good luck!
Old    fatboy1            02-22-2005, 7:36 PM Reply   
Go with the Nautique. Na just kidding, if I were to chose between the two and couldn't get a Nautique I would chose the BU.
Old    stillstandin            02-22-2005, 9:59 PM Reply   
I dont own either one, I just looked at both at the last boat show I went to. IMO malibu just seemed like a better quality, nicer boat...Not trying to start a war, just saying it was my observation....
Old    Big Ed (big_ed_x2)      Join Date: Jul 2004       02-22-2005, 10:22 PM Reply   
ARE YOU GUYS SERIOUS????
Old    Ben Holman (riverside)      Join Date: Mar 2002       02-22-2005, 11:48 PM Reply   
i,ve had a Mastercraft for 5 years,and now own Malibu.I think there isn,t much difference anymore between these boats.
so IMO MasterCrafts are overprized.
Old    Clubmyke (clubmyke)      Join Date: Aug 2004       02-23-2005, 12:02 AM Reply   
kinda have to agree with big ed....

but imo the x-star is the most pimp boat out there and i am a nautie owner
Old    Nick Heckerson (kstateskier)      Join Date: May 2002       02-23-2005, 12:44 AM Reply   
As a person with an outside view and has been in both brands a lot (probably 70+ hours a year in both), the MasterCraft quality is no better than the Malibu no matter how much those with MC colored glasses want to believe. The gap is gone. I love the MCs, great boats, I'll probably buy one, but the quality difference just isn't there. Now choosing between those two boats, it's just what you prefer. The 25LSV and the X-Star are totally different boats aimed at totally different people.

(Message edited by kstateskier on February 23, 2005)

(Message edited by kstateskier on February 23, 2005)
Old    jzwake            02-23-2005, 6:00 AM Reply   
Yeah, I don't see anyway to compare a Xstar to a 25 LSV (it has a bathroom for gods sake). BU vs. MC, thats really it. Boat for boat the 25LSV matches up with the X45 or X80. (25LSV has more interior room then both).

The 21VLX or 23 LSV would be the the same class as the Xstar.

Price to performance, I prefer BU.
Old    bambamski            02-23-2005, 7:55 AM Reply   
I'm with Ed, are you serious? Have you ever heard anybody say a MC is "just as good as a Malibu"? You hear it the other way around all the time though. Leads me to believe there is still a "leader" and a "follower". Look at the V-ride, that's all the proof you should need.
Old    zboomer            02-23-2005, 9:08 AM Reply   
If you compare the two side by side, it's obvious which one is the leader, and that's the Bu. The MC's interior quality isn't even in the same league. The MC's vinyl work looks like an '04 Supra (not that that's bad, the '05 Supra is ABOVE the MC), whereas the Bu is far above it. It's very obvious.

At our recent boat show I was stunned to see the X2 cost the same as the VLX, and it's nowhere near the boat. A foot shorter, 8" narrower, interior not even in the same league.

For $5k less maybe, but same price? Not.

This is coming from an ex-MC owner, btw. If you think otherwise, your MC ownership goggles are way too thick.
Old    Clubmyke (clubmyke)      Join Date: Aug 2004       02-23-2005, 9:15 AM Reply   
uhhhm my buddy has a x-star and it has the nicest interior i have seen on a boat yet (i own a 05 nautie 211....)

btw, the new x30 is a very, very nice ride ( like the center transom)
Old    Joe (joe_788)      Join Date: Aug 2003       02-23-2005, 9:21 AM Reply   
Build quality and styling, I'd agree that's a toss up.

But interior quality? Are you kidding me? I guess if you think big thick plastic-like vinyl is high quality, then the Malibu would certainly be your choice!
Old    Nick Heckerson (kstateskier)      Join Date: May 2002       02-23-2005, 10:35 AM Reply   
The V-Ride is a price point boat, and in that category, a very nice one. If we want to talk about price point boats, MC has had some horrible ones in the past if we want to go down that road.

Vinyl work and craftmanship I would give to Malibu, as I think their work looks a lot better. Quality is a toss up. Malibu has had some vinyl problems in the past, but I think it is done. Just with quality and durability of small items though, I would go with the Malibu. In the four promo boats I am familiar with (2 197, 2 RLXi), the Responses little things have held up way better, where some of the MasterCraft stuff didn't take the abuse. Like I said, I'm not really saying one is better, just saying I believe they are equal, though you will never believe that if you paid $60k+ for the X-Star or other MC boats. I'd like to see how much experience the people talking up MasterCraft have in boating, at least tournament boats. MasterCraft has a bigger name outside of the market, so most people come in thinking they are the top product. I've been involved in competitive skiing all my life and have seen the evolution of different boat makers. I have seen MasterCraft really down (late 90s) and have seen Malibu grow from a regional manufacturer like Sanger, into one of the top ski/wake builders in the world. My parents had a '92 Malibu Skier, right as Malibu was making the move toward more of a national market. That boat was a tank. I still wish I had it. We put over 1200 hours on it without one single proglem.

(Message edited by kstateskier on February 23, 2005)
Old    Jason Pribyl (skibum69)      Join Date: Aug 2004       02-23-2005, 10:54 AM Reply   
We can debate on quality all we want, but I talked to an engineer at the Minneapolis boat show from Malibu, because I was disscussing trading in my MC. He said that they have closed the gap with MC on quality, which I thought so too, looking at the boats. So I would take that out of the equation. As far as resale, imo the x-star will have a higher resale, just from the fact it is more well known and not as big. I see a lot of the larger 25ft+ boats sit at the dealships because they are so big. As far as drivability, you will have to decide that on your own, I personally have not driven either of them and can not comment. I am anxious though to drive an 05 VLX when the ice melts to compare to an X2.
Old    bambamski            02-23-2005, 10:56 AM Reply   
What Price point is the V-ride in? At the boat show it was 3 grand less then what I paid for an X-2.

Styling is subjective. Build quality and finishing. Sorry but you didn't look very hard if you think they're equal. One quick example, how much weight can you put on the floor of the BU in the I ride model in the back without it voiding the warranty of the gas tank? When I went boat shopping this year I ripped apart every one of these boats, with the exception of the Tige. IMO BU was the lowest out of Tige, MC, CC and Supra. I've owned both brands as well.

The original question was for the 25 LSV vs the X-star. The only catagory the LSV wins in is for interior room. X-star wins everything else.
Old    TNM (troublesnomore)      Join Date: Feb 2005       02-23-2005, 11:39 AM Reply   
Ryan
I’m looking for some information on the 25LSV also. Examine it at the boat show and it look great.
Does anyone have first hand experience with this boat?
Have you or has anyone drive or skied behind this boat?
I know this is a big boat, does anyone have information on the MPG or GPH ?
Old    blue_malibu            02-23-2005, 3:02 PM Reply   
I took the Malibu 25LSV for a test drive a few weeks ago and it drove great! I am 99.9% sure that is the boat I am going to get. I just want to make sure I am making the right decision by getting the 25LSV. Does anyone know how the wake is behind the Malibu 25LSV?

The .1% problem I am having with this decision is that I have been talking to a MasterCraft dealer, and all they keep trying to do is convince me that their boats are SOOO much better! When I went to go check out the MasterCraft’s they pulled this poster board and it showed how there boats were made and then there competitors boats. They have some valid agreements from what I can see. I wanted to test drive the boat, but they would not let me because they knew I was going to be test-driving a Malibu after words…

Am I going to go wrong with this Malibu or should I highly consider the MasterCraft?
Old    Joe (joe_788)      Join Date: Aug 2003       02-23-2005, 3:26 PM Reply   
I wouldn't worry too much about how the boats are built, they are both great.

Is there any reason why you are set on the 25LSV versus the 23LSV?

Personally, if I were set on purchasing a boat above 60K, the X Star would be my first choice. followed closely by the 23LSV.

You definitely need to drive, and ride behind both of the boats before making a choice.
Old    April Atkins (aprgriggs)      Join Date: Feb 2005       02-23-2005, 3:30 PM Reply   
I have to say Mastercraft. The X-Star great boat
Old    blue_malibu            02-23-2005, 3:31 PM Reply   
The reason why I am looking at the 25lsv is that it will handle better in the “chop” because it is a bigger boat.
Old    CBrown (powdrhound)      Join Date: Nov 2002       02-23-2005, 3:37 PM Reply   
Thats simple then if thats what your after go for the one with the deepest V
what size "chop" are we talking about here
Old    Big Ed (big_ed_x2)      Join Date: Jul 2004       02-23-2005, 3:39 PM Reply   
Look you can't go wrong with the Malibu!

All I'm saying is there is different opinions on everything and mine is definetly on MC in every way that's why I'm shocked that so many people are saying BU,BU,BU cuzz I decided to take my MC goggles off(LOL) and look at every boat inside out at the boat show and took my brother with me and he said that noone was near,now I'm not saying that but I am saing that there is a differents and MC is definetly on TOP that's why they charge 70k+ for the x-star and people buy it!!!Why......Cuzz It is the cleanest towboat on the water.2nd to none!!

If they sold the X-Star for the 60k range loaded.Nobody else would be able to sell a boat!!

(Message edited by Big_Ed_X2 on February 23, 2005)
Old    blue_malibu            02-23-2005, 4:15 PM Reply   
I would have to say about 3-5 foot "chop."
Old    CBrown (powdrhound)      Join Date: Nov 2002       02-23-2005, 5:05 PM Reply   
Daaamnn buy an off shore fishingboat and mount a tower to it
dude why are you even launching if it is that
Old    hyperlitenerd (hyperlitenrd)      Join Date: Jan 2003       02-23-2005, 6:35 PM Reply   
Where will you be ridding in maryland where your getting 3-5 chop? the ocean??
Old    mark (mhsb1029)      Join Date: Jan 2004       02-23-2005, 7:33 PM Reply   
I am with Big Ed on this one!
Old    blue_malibu            02-23-2005, 7:51 PM Reply   
well.. i am going to use it in FL and bring it to the keys
Old    Nick Heckerson (kstateskier)      Join Date: May 2002       02-24-2005, 12:33 AM Reply   
I worked for a MC dealer last year. They are very negative toward other brands. I am not going to even start on the comment that the Tige looked higher quality than the Malibu. I will also call you on the opinion that no one would sell a boat if MC sold the X-Star for $60k loaded. I really don't think the sales numbers would be that different. Many people have different objectives and needs when buying a boat, and the X-Star just doesn't fill the needs of all those people. I'm sure you were generalizing, but you will still get a very solid CC fan base here on this board that would probably not take an X-Star for free over their SAN. MasterCraft is slowly climbing out of a hole they put themselves in. In the past 5-6 years they have been known to kind of bring things to the table before they were really ready. The first example was the '98 Pro Star 190 that later had to have fiberglass pieces retrofitted to the hull because the boats wake wasn't near tournament quality. The next example was the '01 EVO hull PS190 that was beached at the USAWS boat approval tests because of a chine lock problem, hence the weird rudder set-up that is now on that boat. The last example would be how long it took the X-Star to actually hit dealers. It is well documented what a lot of people thought of MC on this site if you look over your search engine during the spring of '03. I guess my point with this is if you are a true industry leader in technology and boat building and are really checking every process at the factory, these problems don't exist. If your R and D team let's a boat with a dangerous problem get sent to the important USAWS tests, what are they letting out to the everyday customer.

(Message edited by kstateskier on February 24, 2005)
Old    Zedz Dead (ktm250)      Join Date: Jan 2003       02-24-2005, 7:20 AM Reply   
"If your R and D team let's a boat with a dangerous problem get sent to the important USAWS tests, what are they letting out to the everyday customer."

Can you back any of that up with facts or are you just spouting what you have heard via the internet and word of mouth? Just a little factual information for you...the winged rudder does the same thing as the "hook" in the transom of 2002TT and later boats...lift the rear and push the bow down for softer wakes. It has nothing to do with chine lock, nor could it since chine lock isn’t caused by the rudder!

By your logic there is no room for improvement to anything…other than those building mouse traps shouldn’t a manufacturer strive to constantly make improvements?

Since you obviously buy into the “MasterCraft = Evil Empire” I guess MasterCraft must also be covering up the numbers of hapless souls/families that have been killed, maimed and injured by these boats with “dangerous problems”.

And while I’m at it pick a side of the fence and stick to it! The delays in X-Star production were due to the boat needing further tweaks and refinements…now your saying MasterCraft should have just gone ahead and shipped it and then made changes in later model years? WOW.
Old    Zedz Dead (ktm250)      Join Date: Jan 2003       02-24-2005, 7:54 AM Reply   
PS. Nice X7 how many times have you beached it?

PSS. The winged rudder went away when MC hooked the transom...back in 2002.
Old    blue_malibu            02-24-2005, 8:52 AM Reply   
So... it looks like malibu is the way to go
Old    Jason Pribyl (skibum69)      Join Date: Aug 2004       02-24-2005, 9:02 AM Reply   
Ryan,
if you read the posts by civilized people you will see they all say both are great boats and if you are fortunate enough to buy one, go with which dealer is better, and what looks and options you prefer. I own a '96 MC and would take it hands down over a Bu from that time, but now the gap has closed termendously
Old    blue_malibu            02-24-2005, 9:20 AM Reply   
I was reading another discussion in another thread and someone said...

"I remember shopping for boats years ago and we were talking to the cobalt dealer and he said something that I've always remembered. "Just because a boat has a nice interior don't take for granted that the rest of the boat is built the same. He also said "too many boat companies throw most of the cost of building their boats into what you can see and not enough into what you can't."

Have you ever really looked at the manufactures brochures? Most of the companies have really pretty DRAWINGS of how their boats are made. Maybe one page, max two. MC has about 8 pages of actual pictures of how their boats are made. Their website goes thought the build process as well with actual pictures. They want you to know the stuff you can't see is as well built as the stuff you can see. Is there a reason Malibu doesn't do that? I don't know.

Malibu made it's name by building good affordable boats. Someone in a prior post said when talking with a Malibu engineer they said they've closed that gap in recent years. There's still a gap. Do they mold their seats in yet or are they still bolted in? The most popular saying from all the rival sales guys is the way their motor mounts are bolted through their hollow stringers. When I asked the Malibu sales guy that question he said they've never had a problem with the motor mounts. Ok, so is that the best way to do it or just the cheapest?

You can't "look" at a boat at a boat show. There's no way, and if you look under the seats, I'm sorry but that doesn't constitute a once over in my books. Maybe that's what you think digging into things means, I'm a little more thorough."

This is the only reason why I have not gotten this Malibu yet is because I keep hearing stuff about the construction… Should I be worried about?
Old    Jason Pribyl (skibum69)      Join Date: Aug 2004       02-24-2005, 9:48 AM Reply   
honestly I would worry about it, and this is coming from a MC owner. You said you were worried about resale, no one can predict it but I would say the x-star will have better resale. Other than that like I said before go with what looks and options you like.
Old    bigj            02-24-2005, 10:11 AM Reply   
Wow, The M/C dealer wouldnt demo you because he knew you were going to demo the Malibu afterwards. That alone should tell you something, doesnt have much confidence in his product does he?
Old    Jason Pribyl (skibum69)      Join Date: Aug 2004       02-24-2005, 10:17 AM Reply   
Ryan,
I missed you saying the MC dealer wouldn't let you take a demo ride. If I were you I would go to the MC dealer, tell him that you are deciding between 25LSV and the xstar but you want the one that rides and drives better. If he still won't let you take one out, walk away and go to the Bu dealer. Remember your dealer provides all the service after the sale as well.
Old    bigj            02-24-2005, 10:32 AM Reply   
I would like to know why are'nt you looking at the 21VLX or the 23LSV. Both are going to be bigger and better riding than the X-Star. At the pro tour stop last year, I saw the X-star take water over the bow more than once. Get it in some nasty water and you be the judge.
Old    blue_malibu            02-24-2005, 11:53 AM Reply   
I have had a lot of people tell me the X-Star will take waker over the bow. Like i said before, i am looking the the 25LSV because I am going to be taking the boat places where there will be a "chop" and want a boat that will handle well.
Old    bambamski            02-24-2005, 12:03 PM Reply   
Bill I've been at the pro tour stop in Kelowna the last two years. It has the worst conditions bar none of any tour stop and I never once saw the X-star take water over the bow. It did break down on the Saturday which I thought was very funny and they didn't have a back up boat.

Ryan you need to ride behind them both and decide. The next door neighbors at the cabin we rented last year had one (LSV) and the wake was not a wakeboarding wake. The 25 foot LSV wasn't designed for wakeboarding. If crusing around and pulling kids in Tubes is your thing the LSV is probably a better boat. If you're looking at them both for boarding there isn't much of a comparison. Look at it from the stand point of sponsorship. How many pros sponsored by MC ride behind either the X-2 or the X-star. For Malibu how many ride behind the 25 foot LSV? I'm thinking none, they're choosing the VLX for a reason.
Old    blue_malibu            02-24-2005, 12:26 PM Reply   
Comparing the 25LSV to the Watersetter LSV, is there going to be a big difference in performing in chop? I know the 25LSV is a bigger boat, but only by 2 feet. I am keeping the boat in Maryland during the summer, using it in the Chesapeake Bay. I am not too worried about using the boat in Maryland though. During the winter, the boat will be kept in Florida (Naples), and I would like to be able to take the boat to the Florida Keys.

The only MasterCraft I like is the X-Star. I was not that impressed with the X-80. It was excessively big, and I did not like the fact that the boat would be underpowered with a single engine and I definitely do not want to ride behind a boat with twin engines. The problem with the new X-45 is that it does not have fins on the bottom, which takes away from the performance. The Malibu’s will out perform the X-80 and the X-45. I cannot honestly say they will outperform the X-star though.

The 25LSV wake is not that bad. It throws out a decent wake. Nothing compared to the wakesetter LSV, but definitely good enough to ride behind. Would anyone disagree?
Old    bigj            02-24-2005, 2:57 PM Reply   
The wake on the 25 LSV is very good. I have heard through the grapevine at the Malibu photo shoots they cant't keep Sharpiro and Nunn out of it. If you liked the handling of the 25, you will love the 23, although the 25 is a bit better in the real nasty stuff. The x-star doesnt drive as well as either of them.
Old    blue_malibu            02-24-2005, 3:22 PM Reply   
What do you mean by... "I have heard through the grapevine at the Malibu photo shoots they cant't keep Sharpiro and Nunn out of it."
Old    Joe (joe_788)      Join Date: Aug 2003       02-24-2005, 3:34 PM Reply   
As I read these opinions about which will drive better, perform better in chop, take water over the bow, have a better wake, LSV outperforms X45, etc. etc.... I just have to wonder, where are these opinions coming from? How many people here have actually ridden behind, AND driven a 23LSV, 25LSV, X45, and X Star? How many have also driven ALL of those boats in big chop?

The wake is the one factor that is not even debatable between the X Star and 25LSV. As for everything else, speculate all you want. Those two boats aren't even in the same category.

The size of the boat also has very little to do with the rough water ride. The X10 and VLX are similar size, and the X10 is MUCH better in rough water than the VLX, because of the hull shape. (VLX has a much better wake though). I've been in a 17 foot Four Winns that glides through 2 foot chop like a knife, while an X2 will burst your kidneys during a double up. Looking at numbers or listening to unfounded opinions is not a good way to make a boat choice.

The most important thing is going and test driving the boats to see what you like. If the MC dealer won't give you a test drive, buy the Malibu.

Old    Big Ed (big_ed_x2)      Join Date: Jul 2004       02-24-2005, 3:37 PM Reply   
Ryan ~ Check the thread I posted of the x-80 and you might change your mind about not wanting to wakeboard behind twin powered boat,also with 2 engines it will outperform any wakeboard boat and definetly don't have to worry about taking water over the bow!!

If I was crafty with the computer I would post the hyperlink to the thread x-80 but it's in wakeboard discussion
Old    Wkerat (wkerat)      Join Date: Sep 2002       02-24-2005, 3:51 PM Reply   
The new vlx actually takes the rough quite well. I have one and would say it is one of the best boarding boats I have been in in the rough. Also, the 25 has a great wake although it is wider than most due to the size of the hull.

Personally I like the x-2's wake more than the x-star and my buddies x-star is very prone to dipping the nose. He likes the look of the picklefork and as such it getting an x-45, but the one we demoed also dipped the nose and the performance was lacking compared to the Malibu's. I am a performance guy and as such weigh that in my choice, where as he likes the looks and room in the bow of the mastercrafts and that is where he made his.

As for the x-80, we got to board behind an early one this fall and i thought the wake was large, but not good. It had a lot of turbulence from the twins, and a nasty lip a lot like some cobalts I have been behind.

As for quality, I have owned both and ride in both now. A few years ago mastercraft was ahead, but with being in and out of both brands I must say they are close and imo the Malibu's are slightly better. They show neater wireing, cleaner finish (in/ under things) and less rough edges... I have seen this since I help out a local dealer with installs and have taken apart both and seen the ins and outs. Would i buy a mastercraft? Yes, if i found one i prefered, like back when I had my x-star (current x-2).
Old    blue_malibu            02-24-2005, 4:30 PM Reply   
Here is a whole other issue… I will be using this boat in Florida in the salt water. Mastercraft now has a Salt Water Series boats that they claim will hold up MUCH better then Malibu’s will in salt water. Need some opinions…

I get the vibe that the X-Stat will take water over the bow, which cancels that boat out. What are your opinions of the X-80 then? It is a HUGE boat… Is it too big? How is the wake? In addition, how will it perform? Performance is important!

So... It looks like I have narrowed this down to three boats, the 25LSV, X-80, and Wakersetter LSV. Will the Wakersetter LSV take water over the bow in 2-4 foot “chop?”

If you had to choose between the 25LSV or a twin engine X-80, what would you choose?
Old    wallyworld (wallyworld)      Join Date: Jan 2003       02-24-2005, 4:58 PM Reply   
hollow stringer + rough water = not a good rough water ride
Old    Wkerat (wkerat)      Join Date: Sep 2002       02-24-2005, 4:59 PM Reply   
For rough water I would go 25 lsv with closed cooling. That will make it hold up in the salt.

the 23 is a great boat, but is still lower and in heavy chop would not be as good as the 25. Also the x-80 i was in still dipped low. We were on an inland lake and did not dip it, but came a lot closer than one would think. I also saw a video of water coming over the bow of that boat.
Old    blue_malibu            02-24-2005, 6:25 PM Reply   
Does the 25LSV have a nice wake?
Old    Wkerat (wkerat)      Join Date: Sep 2002       02-24-2005, 6:37 PM Reply   
I never got ot weigh one down, but the one i was behind had a decent wake. really wide so I had to shorten the rope a length. It was also more rampy, but we just had stock ballast, no wedge, and based on my rides in other bu's the wedge adds a nice lip. I wouldn't put it up there with the 23, or the vlx, but for a 25 foot boat it was nice, and i pulled all the same tricks...Try to get a demo and ride behind it, thats the best way to find out because a decent wake to one person may suck to another.
Old    Jason Pribyl (skibum69)      Join Date: Aug 2004       02-25-2005, 5:36 AM Reply   
Ryan,
I wouldn't not consider a boat because people say they have seen water go over the bow. I have seen 30+ footers nose dive, its all about how you drive them. If you weight any boat correctly and don't pull the throttle back quickly you shouldn't have a problem with water going over the bow. I can't remeber if MC's salt water series is closed loop but I do know it's all stainless steel components which won't rust, closed loop systems are a pain to winterize and clean
Old    Whit (whit)      Join Date: Feb 2001       02-25-2005, 5:52 AM Reply   
People going back and forth on this thread... Are the wakes between the two boats comparable? Does anyone know any of any videos showing wake to wake 900's or how big fokls can go on the double ups?

How much you dip the bow depends on how well you pay attention. Put your nose into the wake when your tunring around and chances are you'll take some water over the bow. The X-Star takes no more water over the bow than my older X-2 used to take. All a matter of how well your drive the boat.

If you are going to be using the boat in salt water--I'd definately be more worried about the boats resiliancey to salt then things like fins on the bottom. The fins mattered in the ski boats when very little of the boat was in the water. Not so important when you sink your boat with extra ballast...
Old    bambamski            02-25-2005, 9:32 AM Reply   
I agree with Jason, you can take water over the bow in almost every boat out there if you try. I was boarding last year behind a 23 foot LSV and the person driving was power turning everytime someone wiped out. I informed him about the evils of powerturning and told him to stop and turn around slowly. He took water over the bow 5 time in a row until I told him he had to give it a little throttle when going through his wake. After that he didn't take on any more water.

To the person who said the BU will handle better. What? That was the first time I drove a BU with a wedge down. That was the WORST handling boat I've ever driven. BU with the wedge down = crap handling.

Any one of the boats mentioned when on plane will not take water over the bow. If you take water over the bow in an X-star doing 20 mph you're going to take water over every other bow in an inboard boat class. period...
Old    Nick Heckerson (kstateskier)      Join Date: May 2002       02-25-2005, 10:12 AM Reply   
Zedz,

First, I don't buy into the "MasterCraft=Evil Empire" thoughts. If you read my posts, I state that I think MC is a quality boat, and I would put them at the top of the list with Malibu when I go looking for a new boat. I just am not buying the "MC is so much better than Malibu" talk. I'm sorry on the hull/rudder issue, I was really not clear on that. But are you denying the issues at the boat tests, because I have had some reliable sources tell me this happen. And you have to agree that the '98 boat was an embarassment to MC. On the X-Star issue I was just trying to tie it in with MC isn't perfect like some of these people seem to think. I guess what I'm trying to get at is these are all hand built boats with some problems here and there from human error and that Malibu has closed the gap over the years. Both are really good boats either way. Didn't mean to step on your toes Zedz.
Old    Joe (joe_788)      Join Date: Aug 2003       02-25-2005, 11:12 AM Reply   
I only have two "handling" concerns when it comes to wakeboard boats:

#1- How much weight it can "handle" and still make a clean wake at a reasonable speed.

#2- How well it turns at idle, for turning around and picking up downed riders.

In the case of lake or ocean boating, the rough water ride should be a concern too. Other than those 3, is there anything anybody else should really look for in a wakeboard boat?

Old    blue_malibu            02-25-2005, 6:16 PM Reply   
malibu or mastercraft
Old    Kevin aka Chino (big_xstar)      Join Date: Nov 2004       02-25-2005, 6:17 PM Reply   
X-80 LINK FROM BIG ED.

http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/1/211983.html?1108809293

P.S.-I own a 04 x-star and as long as your careful in the turn arounds and keep the nose up, you wont take water over the nose, even when running 3,000 lbs of ballast its good, although in rough water I wouldnt reccomend it, but who wakeboards in 2 ft swells. Anyways that all I am gonna say in this thread. Keep all my opinions to myself.
Old    blue_malibu            02-25-2005, 6:27 PM Reply   
thank you! I am going to go test drive the X-Star, X-45, and the X-80 tomorrow.
Old    Big Ed (big_ed_x2)      Join Date: Jul 2004       02-25-2005, 7:35 PM Reply   
Mastercraft = Evil Empire????
Old    blue_malibu            02-25-2005, 8:14 PM Reply   
Don't you own a mastercraft? Do you not like it?
Old    Big Ed (big_ed_x2)      Join Date: Jul 2004       02-25-2005, 8:30 PM Reply   
Ryan,I love my boat and after a full year and almost 150hrs I couldn't have made a better choice.If you want me to tell you more about it off the thread pm me.

And as far as my comment....That's why I have question marks after the comment because if you look at earlier post somebody posted that mastercraft = evil empire!
Old    blue_malibu            02-26-2005, 3:37 PM Reply   
I just test drove the X-star and the X-80. Both are AWESOME BOATS! i think i might end up with a X-Star.
Old    TNM (troublesnomore)      Join Date: Feb 2005       02-26-2005, 3:43 PM Reply   
Ryan,info on the 25LSV below.....Powerboat Mag, 2004..
http://www.boats.com/content/default_detail.jsp?contentid=17417
Old    travis moye (driving)      Join Date: Jan 2003       02-26-2005, 5:27 PM Reply   
Good choice. I just turned in my 04' today and will be picking up my new one on Tuesday. I may be a little biased, but I don't think you can get a better boat. I put almost 600 hours on mine in less than a year and truly put it thru all the test. If you have any questions please let me know.
Old    Big Ed (big_ed_x2)      Join Date: Jul 2004       02-26-2005, 5:48 PM Reply   
Can't beat it!!If you can afford one...It's the nicest boat out there!!
Old    blue_malibu            02-27-2005, 8:02 AM Reply   
Now I can't decide which one to get.. X-Star or X-80
Old    airwarrior04 (airwarrior04)      Join Date: Aug 2004       03-04-2005, 9:14 PM Reply   
MASTERCRAFT X-STAR ALL THE WAY
Old    blue_malibu            03-04-2005, 10:00 PM Reply   
i just ordered a X-Star 2 days ago
Old    Kevin aka Chino (big_xstar)      Join Date: Nov 2004       03-04-2005, 10:06 PM Reply   
Alright Ryan..way to go dude!!!!!!!!

Nice choice...not a biased opinion from me at all..

What colors did you decide with? Metal flake I hope.
Old    blue_malibu            03-04-2005, 10:12 PM Reply   
thanks! I am going with the metal flake!
Old    blue_malibu            03-05-2005, 5:26 PM Reply   
I receive an E-Mail from someone wanting to know why I went with the Mastercraft instead of Malibu. Well this is why…

FACT 1 Malibu has 3 factories Ca, Tenn, Australia.
#1 boat manufacture in 03 or 04... Big deal 3 factories. They better make more boats than MC. Just Maybe they built a few extra just to beat them out. Think of that!

#2 The Wedge... Great idea how come none of the PRO RIDERS use it. It distorts the wake. 1200 lbs of extra pressure on the stern. Seen many a photo with the stern torn out of the boat. NO FOAM BOAT SINKS GOOD BYE !!!

#3 HOLLOW STINGERS with no steel backing any where in the boat. Stringers fill with water it does not evaporate. MC has a SERIOUS backing plate system. Every item in the boat has a backing plate pre-laminated in the deck or hull for support.

#4 RESALE RESALE RESALE A MasterCraft resale will yield a 20-30 less depreciation than a Malibu NADA does not lie... look it up for yourself. A boat that is 2-4 years old.. that’s 4-7K back in your pocket making up more than the difference in initial purchase price. NO SPIN ZONE HERE

#5 A MC is built to a more exact standard than a Malibu. Cutting a hole with a saw in the bottom of the boat leaving RAW exposed fiberglass so you don't need to align the shaft to the transmission...who came up with this ingenious idea? Why no HYDROPHONIC DAMPENING box the Malibu's V DRIVE BOATS...any takers

#6 What the heck do you need a 5 1/2 gauge for anyway. If you cant read a 3 1/2 in gauge you shouldn’t be driving a boat in the first place.

#7 GORILLA FINS.. Why doesn’t a Malibu turn without these things? Compare a X-2 with full ballast in a hard turn with hard throttle...the boat turns. A Wakesetter rocks and rolls even with the over sized fins. Those things are a PATCH job on something that does not work. Why are they screwed into the bottom vs. though bolted. Why are there 6 screws in the strut vs 8 on a MC that are though BOLTED...ANSWER IT COSTS LESS

#8 A Mastercraft is built to more exact standards. It does cost more to hand lay glass 100% in every part. It cost more to have a different deck on a open bow boat vs a closed bow. Did you know that a Malibu OPEN bow Response LX is the SAME hull...Malibu takes a stencil and cuts a HOLE in the closed bow boat to make it a OPEN bow then ads the interior. Less expensive yes!

Old    Wkerat (wkerat)      Join Date: Sep 2002       03-05-2005, 9:05 PM Reply   
Just to clarify a few things about your last post that I have found from some research:
#1 The numbers in the US are done by counting the boats sold on a retail level in the US and do not count numbers from the Aussie plant, only the tn and ca.
#2 The Wedge... Shapiro and Nunn use it, I know because I asked them when I met them at some tourneys and was trying to figure out how to weigh my boat. Also, from personal experience and over 500 hours on my last boat, there were no stress cracks or problems from the wedge.

#3 Stingers...They all use different types and until one proves superior or bad, who knows. As for backing, my bu had it on the things I saw (cleats, tower, and bow rails, i saw when installing the stereo), but i do not know about elsewhere.

#4 RESALE RESALE RESALE. Sold my last boat for what I paid, and the one before it for 2000 less. Sold my mastercraft for 3000 less. All these were after one year with high hours, but the boats are immaculate and kept like new.

#5 I don't like the hydrophonic dampening idea either, but it is (to the best of my knowledge) only on the direct drives.

#6 Once you get used to the guages they are great, and are just an added perk, but it is just something they do, you can live with either so you can't fault any manufacturer here.

#7 GORILLA FINS.. My 03 bu turned fine, the 04 felt like a direct drive. Most inboards need fins as they help tracking and performance, which is why direct drives have them. My x-star (x-2) turned well, but not as well as my 04 Malibu with the gorilla fins, also I never noticed a rock and roll. Also I did bend one of my fins on my 03 when we had a storm and my dock swung into shore. The fins slammed on a rock and got bent, and when I was having my boat repaired I was waiting for it and the mechanic asked me to hold the wrench on the inside so he could remove the bolt, I would assume this was through bolted...

#8 For the cutting out, I thought it was a great thing when i first skied one in a tournament since I was used to a ski nautique where the open bow had the motor moved 5 inches toward the stern and changed the wake. Since it had the same hull and balance the lx was an open bow that skied great. My friend still has one and it is an amazing ski boat. Another has a lxi which is great with the walkthrough, just as is the nautiqe we have at the club...

Anyway, all I am saying is that things can be spun both ways. I like both brands, and love boats. I just think you can make a list of negatives on any one of them if needed. I justify my purchase because I like my dealer and like the performance offered that I did not find elsewhere. As long as people are happy with there boats good, no need to trash another line to justify the one you chose.
Old    TK (swab791)      Join Date: Mar 2005       03-06-2005, 7:14 AM Reply   
Without seemingly "TRASHING" the competition. A MasterCraft has NOTHING to hide. My comments are not to trash the competition but possilby educate a few to the quality and finish of a MC. It is tough not to make statements in this regard w/o so called TRASHING them. A educated buyer is a informed buyer, so to each there own. I think that RYAN went through this edcation phase. He analized the 2 products, for quite along time, rode in the boats that he was able to ride in then came to the realization that the MC was more to his needs and liking. Yes the MC is MORE expensive. What other inboard manufactuer has anything to compare it to? NO ONE ! That alone does NOT make it better. I am sure Ryan listened to different sale pitches TRUE AND FALSE, did his home work and determined that the MC is a better built product and will fit his needs

CONGRATS RYAN on your NEW MC Purchase I am sure you will enjoy it for years to come !!!

SWAB 791
Old    April Atkins (aprgriggs)      Join Date: Feb 2005       03-06-2005, 10:29 AM Reply   
MC is a great boat...look at how many 80's & 90's year models are still on the lake.
Old    Kevin K (supra)      Join Date: Aug 2002       03-06-2005, 1:02 PM Reply   
I think Ryan_Mailbu needs to get into sales. At age 19 and has that kind of termology about MC is impressive.I can tell you that even with years of selling one brand of boat most people would not even know how to say all of the above in a sales pitch and Ryan has it down in less than 10 days (WOW) Ryan you can come work for me anytime. If your able to remember all that from a sales pitch because I know that this is not described in that detail in a brochure ,I am impressed. Congrats on your MC. By the way did you own a Malibu before?
Old    shane (auto)      Join Date: Aug 2002       03-06-2005, 2:20 PM Reply   
Ryan can't work for me or any reputable dealer if he has to bash the competition. How do I know I am getting a software/services deal? When the competition starts bashing, that means they have nothing positive to say.
Old    backdoc            03-06-2005, 8:04 PM Reply   
Good choice I was going thru the same LSV or X-Star I personally chose the X-Star. Looks and quality had a lot to do with it. As for performance I gave a slight edge to malibu on turning only but not the hole shot. The malibu dealer tried showing me a comparison between the 2 from the waterski mag boat buyers guide but he forgot to tell me the LSV was tested with the 8.1 vs. 350hp MC until I went home and look at mine. SNEAKY! WEll Just got mine on SAT we bought a x-star with black bottom and cap with RED Metallic center LOOKS Great. Boat handled great in rougher water none over the bow. Good Luck with yours what color did you choose?

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