Backroll fear!

i know i have enough air enough everything tramp practice i just cant bring myself to do it on the water. any help?!?

go big or go home brah

i've been trying rolls since easter,
really hurting myself on about 10% of attempts.
but i've just landed my 1st two in the last 2 weeks.

all i'd say is, go for it, you haven't got a clue if its gonna hurt till u try, so really u don't know what ure afraid of!!!!
its well worth it.

try a tantrum. backrolls are more awckward to learn on a tramp than tantrums. I learned tantrums, scarecrows and threes before the backroll. I still don't like the rotation. edge hard,ride up the wake, pop and throw your head back while looking over your left shoulder if you are regular. try holding on with both hands until you come out of the roll.

thanx

Wade this is his personal quote...
Personal Quote: go big or dont go at all

LOL

good catch mango! maybe we should practice what we preach...

sorry wake....but with a quote like that you should have known you'd get called out.

I did the tantrum first too. Too freaked out by the diggers on the backroll.

same here. Tantrums, then Toeside backrolls for me. Never even tried a HS backroll.

Glad to hear I'm not the only one. I've gotten my A$$ kicked by backrolls enough times that I'm kinda scurred. I keep saying I'm gonna learn them one of these days though. I kinda feel like it's an important building block. Tantrums just kinda made more sense to me, plus the falls never hurt. I guess you never know though because one of my friends broke his leg on a tantrum and another blew out his knee.

The older I get, the more I like to spin.

Just go for it man. My experience with trying new inverts/spins is that the first one doesnt hurt....its the the 10th and 11th ones where you almost land it then take a massive fall that hurt the most. Its water, it doesnt hurt as much as cement.

just go for it, make sure that you commit your it will hurt....

Go at it like you KNOW you are going to stomp it on your first try. Doubt increases you chances for a hard fall.

Like Evan, I've never taken a super hard fall on a Tantrum. And it took me a lot of attempts to learn them.

so for the tantrum how do i get the pop? you have to come in sideways yet still be moving across the wake? do i just come in then then flaten out?

Exactly. Come in hard like you're going for a big jump into the flats, because you're going to loose speed when you flaten out. Let go with your rear hand and turn your back on the wake right before you pop. Then just stand tall and look back. You'll see the landing half way through it. It's a natural flip.

J-ROD...

When you flat do you need to have the board parallel to the boat and get the wake in that direction?

What do you mean by:
"turn your back on the wake right before you pop"

Do you throw your self backwards?

too many questions ... lol I really want to land this trick

I just want to say that you should be doing what you feel is more natural for you. Some people feel the tantrum is easier than the backroll or vice-versa. I myself learned the backroll first and still have trouble with the tantrum. When I was learning the backroll, I would let go of the handle completely until I was comfortable with the rotation and certain I was coming all the way around. Honestly I have never had a bad crash from a backroll and I must have tried it like 50 times to learn it. But the key for me to get comfortable was to let go of the handle. If that doesnt work, get drunk. It takes the edge off. On second thought, ignore that last statement.

just landed my 3rd backroll in a week, i'm stoked.

I too put in aroun d 30-50 attempts, and didn't get it for about 3 months. Occasionally i'd get a slapped head, but after about 10mins that wears off, put it this way, if u were doing any other sport, to get good you have to take the blows.........
at least with this you don't have to get physically drained, just a bit beaten!!!

Backroll crashes are not that bad unless you come in way too fast. keep it slow like a normal wake to wake, cut hard on the wake, keep the handle low and your eyes open. If you have awareness of where you are at, you will be prepared for the fall and the nose diggers will not hurt.

Ponchevez, don't "throw" yourself backwards on the tantrum. When you pop off the wake you want to throw your head back and keep your shoulders back, but do not "throw" your entire body. Basically what you do is edge in with a progressive edge. You want to make sure you ride all the way up the wake before you initiate the flip to get maximum pop. About the time you are riding up the wake, drop your back hand off the handle. This will help to "turn your back to the wake." I have found that keeping my front arm bent a little bit instead of extending it completely out helps with control and the landing. Anyway, you will find that once you pop off the wake and get your head and shoulders back a little bit, you will do the backflip with ease. On the way down, spot your landing and bring that front arm in a little bit. When I learned tantrums that was the best tip I got which helped me stick it pretty quick- bringing my front arm in. Good luck!

as you approach the wake you definatley want to get the pop right or you will be plagued till you smack the water. I like to ride up the wake like a normal wake jump while I let go off the handle with my back hand and rotate my upper body so my back is almost parallel w/ the wake. remember your board is still riding up the wake and popping while your upper body is shifting back, getting you in position for a straight back over the top back flip. keep your arm bent as you go up the wake and on takeoff. extend it as you are upside down and then bring it back in again to help you get all the way around. It is far better to overrotate than to underrotate and kill your ankles. that is the most painful thing about this trick is possibly landing on your toes and killing your ankles.

so wait your saying tantrum is easier?

The board doesn't have to be completely parallel to the wake/boat, but it's better form if you can do it that way.

Here's my very first one, in slow motion too.

http://www.wakepics.com/img/10114

I don't totally square up the board to the wake. At the bottom of the wake you start flattening off.

for some, it all depends. you need to do the flip that you can see yourself doing in your mind, the one that feels the most comfortable. do not think about these tricks as being overlycomplex and unachievable. they should flow simply and come to you easily if you are ready for either. don't put the trick on a pedastool rahter just go out and do a simple back flip whatever way feels the most comfortable.

if u follow the detention backroll instructions, murray says to edge harder towards the top of the wake. ie edge away from the boat.

I've been trying the backroll since easter and think i've been flattening off, i watched detention and now cut away from the boat, and have landed 3 in the past week.

sorry, think i'm getting confused whether we're talking bout the backroll or tantrum now. lol

Jrod, thats a sweet tantrum, just wanna ask cause i'm about to start them.

on ure first tantrum what was the emphasis put on? people talk about playing around with teh edges but it seems like its more of a flatten off and just do a backflip at the top of the wake

I'll try it this weekend hope this info works and I don't break my self lol

try this DONT THINK ABOUT FALLING OR IF IT GOING TO HURT! JUST DO DONT THINK

I always am a little scared the first time I throw my backroll each day but after the first attempt I remember it doesnt hurt that bad.

k thANX

I saw someone mention to take a progressive cut on the tantrum. Actually, it's a trip flip, so that's not the case. Instead, you want cut out as far as possible, edge as hard as you can to build speed, then lay off the edge right before the wake and square your shoulders to the wake. If you wait to initiate the flip until the top of the wake you will get plenty of pop and the trick will be super easy. Once you get Tantrums it's probably the easiest trick you can do.

The back roll is where you take a progressive cut. Just stand tall at the wake while still staying on edge, hold the rope in tight to your waist, wait until your board edges through the wake and then look back over your leading shoulder (I also dip my trailing shoulder to the wake). If you do all this you will get around no problem, and shouldn't get hurt at all.

Both of these flips are pretty basic and it's just a matter of giving them a shot! Good luck.

Try 3 raleys in a row,
then the backroll want scare you anymore.

hey i can do one behind a ski boat so just put your fear behidyou and just rotate

ok you guys! i've been working on my HS backrolls the last 2 times i've gone out--i'm about 6inches away, just need a bit more pop. i haven't tried a tantrum yet, but the way you BOYZ are talking, maybe i should try that one next.---shoot-i'm even a girl!

here are some little things I might ad to help you land those 2 basic tricks... I know it may sound like alot to think about when attempting the trick but try to bring it down to small words that will make you think about the key movements... I'll put some sugestion in red after all important things for each tricks but you can find something else... those are just suggestions...

tantrum...
like porter said, you don't wanna take a progressive cut... go out pretty far and then cut agressively to gain speed(far then cut)... not to much cuz everything will happen too fast and since it's all about timing... so take an agressive cut to the wake... flaten and let go your rear hand before the through of the wake(flat)... at the top of the wake, stand tall, bring both elbows to your hips(elbows) and try to touch your shoulderblade bone together in the middle of your back and look to the sky(up)... kinda like pushing your chest upward... you don't wanna throw your head backward cuz you wont get the height... when in the air bring your knees in(knees) so it'll accelerate de flip and be easier to grab later... keep your leading elbow to your front hip during the entire trick, if you don't you'll pop the handle on the landing... spot your landing coming down and stomp it... I used to land this trick perfect every time... maybe missed 1/10... now I can't quite stomp it since knee surgery but that's only cuz I'm scared... don't know why though...
so think about: far, cut, flat, elbows, up, knees and stomp...

as for backrolls...
like it's been said, take a progressive approach (progressive this one is longer but you have time to think about it) at the wake like you do for a simple wakejump(not from far out in the flats)... stand tall at the wake and keep edging through de wake(hard)... when you feel the pop under the board look over you leading shoulder lifting your chin and push your hips up(chips, like a combo of chin and hips)... when coming down you'll feel a small yank in the rope, this means bring the handle to your front hips(pull)... bend your knees to absorb the landing and keep edging away from the wake...
think about: progressive, hard, chips, pull and stomp

concentrate on only one new trick per session... so you wont get confused... when you stop your first... go ahead a try it a couple of time more so that you can get the sequence stained into your head... don't start to try a new trick at the end of a session... when you get on the water, warm up with grabs, 180, easy, consistent stuff then go right ahead and start trying the trick...

really sorry about the long post but hope it'll help some of you...



(Message edited by tantrum20 on August 01, 2004)

i finally tried it! got almost right around but fell... but im still stoked

(Message edited by p_b_parks on August 11, 2004)