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Old     (schuey)      Join Date: Apr 2005       07-27-2011, 6:15 AM Reply   
Is part filling fat sacs dangerous? I was wondering if the ability for the water to slosh around inside the sac might adversely affect the handling of the boat and make it really unsettled as opposed to having a nice solid mass of water when they are full. Or is it fine to half fill them to tune the wake for different riders? And i'm talking about external fat sacs to put on the floor of the boat rather than internal ballast tanks.

Thanks
Old     (mc_x15)      Join Date: Jul 2008       07-27-2011, 6:26 AM Reply   
Nope do it all the time.
Old     (behindtheboat)      Join Date: Aug 2006       07-27-2011, 6:35 AM Reply   
take all the air out when only filling half full, that will alleviate your concern. Definitely better than too full
Old     (gotsumgas)      Join Date: Jul 2008       07-27-2011, 2:56 PM Reply   
no problem at all. Do that every time we are out
Old     (sidekicknicholas)      Join Date: Mar 2007       07-27-2011, 3:30 PM Reply   
I would only worry if you had the bag in a v-drive compartment next to the engine without a divider and it rolled into a belt/moving part... but otherwise I don't think its a problem at all
Old     (chexi)      Join Date: Jul 2009       07-27-2011, 5:32 PM Reply   
I don't see how taking the air out would make any difference. The water can still shift in a half-empty bag, whether there is air in there or not. That said, it's not a huge problem, but I don't see taking the air out changing anything.

I do second the v-drive compartment thing with no dividers. I was working on my boat the other day with empty sacs back there and no dividers. I soon hear a shout from my friend who was watching back there as my brand new 750 got torn up by the water pump belt. Hopefully my Tear-Aid repair will hold.
Old     (calaman)      Join Date: Apr 2007       08-05-2011, 7:28 AM Reply   
good question - i was thinking the same thing. i may try to secure it/tie somehow. any laws on securing it with a portion of it on the sundeck? I'm not sure.
Old     (hco)      Join Date: Jun 2006       08-05-2011, 7:48 AM Reply   
Maybe if you are in a 16 ft. boat rated for 1200 lbs. A boat rated for 3200 lbs is not going to be affected much by a couple hundred pounds rolling around.
Old     (Cipher)      Join Date: Jun 2011       08-05-2011, 8:35 AM Reply   
Yes.

This is very dangerous!

That is why the Coast Guard requires that you never use your boat when your gas tank is only half full.

All that gas sloshing around in the tank can adversely affect handling...
Old     (Bumpass1)      Join Date: Oct 2010       08-05-2011, 9:10 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cipher View Post
Yes.

This is very dangerous!

That is why the Coast Guard requires that you never use your boat when your gas tank is only half full.

All that gas sloshing around in the tank can adversely affect handling...
How are you suppose to use your boat if you can't run with 1/2 tank of fuel? I am not running to the pump every hour to top off. Same thing for your vehicles. The reason boats have big tanks is so you can go all day. If gas moving in the tank was a safety issue the manufactures would address it to pass whatever the regulations requirements would be.
Old     (Cipher)      Join Date: Jun 2011       08-05-2011, 9:20 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bumpass1 View Post
How are you suppose to use your boat if you can't run with 1/2 tank of fuel? I am not running to the pump every hour to top off. Same thing for your vehicles. The reason boats have big tanks is so you can go all day. If gas moving in the tank was a safety issue the manufactures would address it to pass whatever the regulations requirements would be.
Wow.
Old     (Bumpass1)      Join Date: Oct 2010       08-05-2011, 10:09 AM Reply   
Just saying.
Old     (bcrider)      Join Date: Apr 2006       08-05-2011, 10:48 AM Reply   
Nice Cipher Nice.lol.
Old     (srock)      Join Date: Mar 2002       08-05-2011, 11:29 AM Reply   
The question is not without merit. I remember a leaking hose filling my bilge with water. When I took a turn the boat slumped to one side and stayed leaning until I turned the other direction and it dumped the other direction. You could claim some validity to the argument but because the water is self contained in smaller areas and distributed in the hull it is not really an issue.
Old     (younguns44)      Join Date: Jan 2010       08-05-2011, 12:01 PM Reply   
Most tanks have a cylinder in the center to help prevent the gas from sloushing around.
Old     (docdrs)      Join Date: Aug 2004       08-05-2011, 12:47 PM Reply   
LMAO I guess no one should ever change seat position in the boat...........WTF?
Old     (srock)      Join Date: Mar 2002       08-05-2011, 2:38 PM Reply   
Not if that person weights 560# and sloshes from one side to the other.
Old     (srock)      Join Date: Mar 2002       08-05-2011, 2:44 PM Reply   
I think it's a legit question for someone without ballast experience who is wondering what happens when they put a bunch of sac's in their boat. Distributed water ballast is not a problem but perhaps the real warning should be about weight in the bow and chili dipping the nose.
Old     (Donski)      Join Date: Mar 2010       08-05-2011, 4:55 PM Reply   
What a dumb question.
Old     (otown_dave)      Join Date: Dec 2007       08-05-2011, 5:03 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by srock View Post
Not if that person weights 560# and sloshes from one side to the other.
Slouched passengers make it more interesting....
Old     (talltigeguy)      Join Date: Sep 2003       08-05-2011, 9:07 PM Reply   
Many ballast tanks on large tankers have internal baffles to stop the water from sloshing around and shifting. The baffles are essentially dividers within the tank that have holes in them, so the water can equalize throughout the tank, but cannot shift suddently from front to back or side to side. The question has merit and those making fun of the OP are oversimplifying.

In our boats, the sacks are too small, and the weight shifting from the front to back within the contained space of the sack is not going to make any difference, or it shifting from left to right within the sack is not going to make any difference.

If I recall correctly, Epic ballast tanks actually do have baffles in them to keep the ballast stable when the tanks are not full. At least I seem to recall some conversation about it when Chris Anthony was designing the boats.
Old     (Cipher)      Join Date: Jun 2011       08-05-2011, 9:16 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by talltigeguy View Post
The question has merit and those making fun of the OP are oversimplifying.

In our boats, the sacks are too small, and the weight shifting from the front to back within the contained space of the sack is not going to make any difference, or it shifting from left to right within the sack is not going to make any difference.
Oversimplifying? When you contradict yourself from one sentence to the next? Huh?

How does the question "have merit" yet the "problem" that is the basis of the question is "not going to make a difference"?

p.s. We ALWAYS empty the cooler when the ice melts because we don't want that water ballast sloshing around and affecting handling.
Old     (docdrs)      Join Date: Aug 2004       08-05-2011, 9:25 PM Reply   
hmmm wonder if my 56 gallon 525lb gas tank has any baffles in it. I have an 1100 lb ballast bag and it does not matter how full I fill it , the water, whether it is in a bag or a tank(yet to see a 1100 lb hardtank on a wakeboard boat) is contained in a space as mentioned previous, will have very little if any at all change on the driving characteristics of the boat as it so called sloshes around. Will the weight in general affect the handling of the boat.....definitely.......will it change as it moves in the confined space sfa imo. If your letting the bag roll around all over the place then it may change the characteristics . But not sure why you would do this
Old     (docdrs)      Join Date: Aug 2004       08-05-2011, 9:33 PM Reply   
whoa , had to read the original post......NO, no problem and not dangerous at all to fine tune your wake that way. They will not affect the handling unless they are allowed to roll around in your boat. But if they rae for fine tuning then I cant see them being much more than 1-200lbs which will not affect things too much .......unless your boarding behind a powered canoe
Old     (talltigeguy)      Join Date: Sep 2003       08-06-2011, 4:25 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cipher View Post
Oversimplifying? When you contradict yourself from one sentence to the next? Huh?

How does the question "have merit" yet the "problem" that is the basis of the question is "not going to make a difference"?

p.s. We ALWAYS empty the cooler when the ice melts because we don't want that water ballast sloshing around and affecting handling.
So if I understand you correctly, any time that someone asks a question and the answer is no, it was a dumb question to begin with?? It is not a contradiction to say it was a good question, and the answer to his question is no.

His question has merit, and the answer is that it does not make a difference. So cut the guy some slack.

Here is some discussion of the Baffles in Epic boats' ballast tanks:

http://www.wakeworld.com/forum/showt...t=epic+baffles
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       08-06-2011, 7:06 PM Reply   
IMO yes it can be dangerous and can make a difference if the boat is loaded to the limit. I have seen some scary sketchyness with a dumped pre 06 SAN with a 1/2 filled triangle sack in the nose, every time the boat came off the plane the water would run to the very front of the nose and it would start scooping water, also when turning sharp the water would run to one corner and the boat would lurch. If the sac was 1/2 the size and full then this would not occur.
Old     (Cipher)      Join Date: Jun 2011       08-06-2011, 7:43 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by talltigeguy View Post
So if I understand you correctly
You don't but that's ok.
Old     (schuey)      Join Date: Apr 2005       08-07-2011, 12:10 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by docdrs View Post
hmmm wonder if my 56 gallon 525lb gas tank has any baffles in it.
That is one hell of a gas tank! We have an older boat, and our tank is about 100L and that would cost us about 130 to fill up from empty, 56 gallons would cost about 360 (nearly $600) over here to fill up.

The gas tank 1/2 full in our boat is about 50L, which is about 80lb of liquid. However I thought having 600lbs in bags designed for 1100lbs might be a bit different to 80lb sloshing around, seeing as it is 8 times the weight... But I'm glad to know it isn't and have ran with them filled like that now and it is fine. Comparing 80 lbs of gas to 600lbs of water is not really the same in my view.

When you are playing with boats its better to be safe and know, I'd rather ask a question than not be sure and end up sinking my boat but that's just me. Thanks to the people who answered sensibly.
Old     (mike2001)      Join Date: Feb 2008       08-07-2011, 7:52 PM Reply   
Shuey - safety isn't an issue. Your profile says you have a SN2001...if so, being a very narrow boat, it could affect the wake. I know from experience (owned a 2001 for 5 yrs) that just cutting out to either side would noticeably rock the boat to that side. Moving a person from one side to the other could be the difference between clean or washed out wake so a couple hundred lbs of water might have the same affect.
Old     (srock)      Join Date: Mar 2002       08-09-2011, 8:27 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by otown_dave View Post
Slouched passengers make it more interesting....
That made me giggle.

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