Articles
   
       
Pics/Video
       
Wake 101
   
       
       
Shop
Search
 
 
 
 
 
Home   Articles   Pics/Video   Gear   Wake 101   Events   Community   Forums   Classifieds   Contests   Shop   Search
WakeWorld Home
Email Password
Go Back   WakeWorld > >> Wakeboarding Discussion Archives > Archive through June 16, 2003

Share 
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old     (wakewilly)      Join Date: Aug 2001       05-31-2003, 12:22 AM Reply   
After reading Dave's awesome article on the new Xstar, I thought that there were some very good things and some bad things about the boat. After reading most of the article and comming to the conclusions part, I saw that the boat tested was MSRPed at close to $79,000?!?!?!?! Now, I understand that the boat prices have gone up since 1997 when I custom ordered my "LOADED" VLX for around 30k. I also understand that over a period of time prices for vehicles go up with the rise in technology. What I don't understand is, where do they get off thinking that the boat is worth close to 80k. Sure that's after it's loaded. 64k is still unreasonable. After riding day after day at the delta and seeing many "Dot Com" families take out their brand new 50k and now 60k boats, and completly ruine them by running them into docks etc...due to lack of experience, I understand that many of the newer customers (Dot COMers (at least in my area) )to the market and will buy a boat for that much. If I were Mastercraft, I would raise the prices too, due to the fact that people will buy the boat for that much. I've watched the prices of boat rise year after year at the boat show and stuff, but when is it going to stop? It should go only to a certain point. I'm sorry, but $682 for a Clarion 6 Disk changer is a bit much!!! I think that we got my JVC 12 Disk changer for around $200 and it works fine. No problems with skiping or anything! The resale value of a 79k boat has to be horrible. I see a lot that's different between the new Xstar on my 97' Malibu VLX, but I don't see the differences adding up to nearly 40k? Is it me or is this a bit much? If it is me, feel free to bash, but me along with many family and friends find it hard to believe that a boat like mine is a 40k difference from a six year newer Xstar.

-Chris
Old     (greatdane)      Join Date: Feb 2001       05-31-2003, 12:28 AM Reply   
I think the new xstar is a FLOP at $79K!

I already OWN a great ROOMY boat with awesome storage and a rampy wake. It is called the wakesetter VLX and it sells for $40 something thousand.

Oh boy, if BU can just VERT the wake a bit, the wakesetter will be the boat of all boats.

That is my just MHO.
Old     (paulsmith)      Join Date: Mar 2002       05-31-2003, 8:53 AM Reply   
I am in full agreement. If the boat were sold for between $50k and $60k fully loaded (out the door) I would look hard at it. As far as I am concerned, the X-2 remains the MC boat that interests me, along with the SANTE. I would look hard at a VLX but our local dealer is horrible.
Old     (delta_glass)      Join Date: Aug 2001       05-31-2003, 9:37 AM Reply   
Chris,

Your silly.
Old    wake08            05-31-2003, 10:51 AM Reply   
Oh great another thread complaining about the price of the new X-star. I think we have seen enough of this discussion already. Can we move past this?
Old     (thane_dogg)      Join Date: Jun 2002       05-31-2003, 12:46 PM Reply   
Chris - I think you hit the nail on the head. It is a nice boat, but it would have to do some revolutionary things to sell for almost $80k. Not worth it. I don't think there is anything really too spectacular about except it has a little more seating room in the bow and it looks cool.

Dane - You're right on too, I just think malibu needs to make their boat drive better with the wedge down and they would dominate the market.

Evan - what about his "silly"?

Adam - this is a discussion board bro. People will discuss.
Old    wake08            05-31-2003, 1:05 PM Reply   
No doubt its a discussion board, but it seems every topic about the New X-star is people complaining about how expensive it is and how its not worth the money. Which I must add is each person's own opinion. What is not worth it to one maybe worth it to another. Everytime I see a new thread on the new X-star i get excited hoping to see a new comparison or new pics, yet instead I keep seeing new threads on the pricing problems of the new x-stars I would like to see people posting their opinions of the wake and comparisons based on other boats they have road on and not there take on MC's pricing of their new boat. Afterall this board is about wakeboarding and not about money. Provide information on the boats wake and other features and let everyone decide for themselves if those things that the boat offers is worth it or not.

PS - Very nice review of the boat by Wakeworld. It was nice to see someone give real information about the boat and be critical of it wihtout getting involved in keeping MC happy and adding thier own pricing concerns.

(Message edited by Wake08 on May 31, 2003)
Old    bigd            05-31-2003, 1:19 PM Reply   
I've seen several pics of the bow and it has an extreme downward slope at the nose and sits very low to the water. It looks like it would be a biatch to handle in even a little chop at slow speed - "everybody to the back please to keep us from swamping! Thank You!" - no thanks.
Old     (sae4life)      Join Date: Mar 2003       05-31-2003, 1:53 PM Reply   
Adam,
Incase you forgot, wakeboarding is a very expensive hobby/sport! I think the trend of boat pricing going through the roof is aweful and the new X-Star is not helping. Apparently mastercraft thinks if they hype a new boat enough and try to point out how revolutionary it is then they can justify the price of it. I see your point about the same talk over and over again but its important for everyone to voice their opinion about pricing and how they won't pay that much for a boat. Who's to say that the X-Star won't pave the way for malibu and Nautique to raise their prices just because the market went up more? Especially since not much has changed at most of the boat manufactures in the last 2-3 years ( color and names mostly) but the prices on boats have gone up 15-20%. Thats ridiculus and thats exactly why I will voice my opinion on boat prices and especially the 03' X-Star. 75g's is a joke. I could have 2 of my new boat and the only difference is the way people look at you, "damn thats a sweet boat, but why the hell would you pay that much for it?" I all ready get the sweet boat comments!
Old    bambamski            05-31-2003, 2:00 PM Reply   
All you guys complaining that the Xstar is too expensive go buy a Bayliner then. For 20K you will get a wake you can board behind and you won't have to worry about spending any more money. Really your SANTE or BU wake can't be 20-30K better than a Bayliner wake can it?
Old    wakeboard4568            05-31-2003, 2:15 PM Reply   
I got a 2001 Larson 18' w/ a fat sac in it...it works for me...but hey dont get me wrong, it sure would be nice to have an Xstar..

Elisabeth
Old    wake08            05-31-2003, 2:21 PM Reply   
Good point Pat, if you dont have the money for it dont complain. I agree price plays a big role but whether it is too expensive for what it is, is for me to decide. And in fact it must not be that expensive for what it is because they are all sold out. If the price didnt warrant something then no one would be buying them. All I am trying to say is that I do not appreciate the constant bickering of how this boat is too expensive and how it isnt worth more than another boat. I would rather hear actual reviews of people who have ridden behind the boat and not the constant comments on price from bashing the boat based on what they have read or think they know about the boat. Oh and just in case its not obvious I have an X-star on order coming in in the next couple days. And I didnt pay close to the 75k mark that everyone keeps mentioning.

"75g's is a joke. I could have 2 of my new boat and the only difference is the way people look at you, "damn thats a sweet boat, but why the hell would you pay that much for it?""

The only difference in your opinion but obviously not in everyones. Minerva surely should have taught you to respect other's opinions as well.

(Message edited by Wake08 on May 31, 2003)
Old     (thane_dogg)      Join Date: Jun 2002       05-31-2003, 2:43 PM Reply   
Rob - I couldn't have said it better myself. Thank-you.

Adam - sounds like buyer's remorse to me. Why are you trying to justify your boat to us? If you think it's awesome, and you think it's worth it, then what does it matter what we think? Would I take a pull behind an '03 X-star? HELL YES, would I buy one if I had the money? HELL NO. Does that bother you?

With boats, or with anything for that matter, it's all about what's important to the consumer. I'm not one to pay for aesthetics, but some people have to look cool, and that's fine with me.
Old     (wstr01)      Join Date: Feb 2001       05-31-2003, 2:44 PM Reply   
Just improves the resale on my boat.
Old    wake08            05-31-2003, 3:04 PM Reply   
Well it obviously doesnt bother me since I dropped the cash for the boat. And with the buzz on the boat I could sell it easy for what I paid for it. So no I am not bothered by the price. And you seem to think I am trying to justify my boat. I have made no mention of anything close to justifying the boat. I just keeping making my my point which is that I would like to see more useful information put foward on this board about the new X-star instead of the single and constant phrase "its too expensive for what it is." That is all.
Old     (sae4life)      Join Date: Mar 2003       05-31-2003, 4:12 PM Reply   
Well i wasn't putting the X-star down directly- for 1) I haven't been in one and no one i know has either so as far as the boats' ride and wake are I can't have an opinion 2) Known Fact: MC's are priced higher then most boats in the comp catagory 3) Also the price of the 03' X-Star is way ahead of any other boat on the market in this catagory. Adam I'm happy you got a great deal and I'm sure you'll love the boat Phi Alpha Bro. My point wasn't to put you down or anyone else who doesn't like the bickering on the price but more to point out that hey this thing is F-in expensive and there is a trend here that I don't like. I have a 40g boat and I love it. My point wasn't to save money on my purchase but to get the most for my money. At some point theres a limit to how much families and individuals will pay for a boat, personally I would rather see more wake boats on the water then bayliners. I din't buy a MC last year exactly becuase of the price and what I percieved that I would have got for the money. I'm sure a lot of people see the X-Star the same way and hence their opinions. You'll have your new boat soon Adam and you can tell us all how it is, but wouldn't it have been nice to get yours' for the same price as a new SANTE or whatever the average price is now. I guess my qoute should have been more like "any boat for 75g's in the comp catagory is a joke. Sorry that the X-Star was the first to get there and thats what sticks out in my mind and 99% of everyone else's!!!"
Old    wake08            05-31-2003, 4:57 PM Reply   
That is an extremely fair argument that I can agree with. Just to clarify. As Rob said I agree that there is an upward rising trend in the boat industry and if it keeps going the boats are gonna be just too expensive. And honestly I dont know if the boat will be 100%worth the money. I dont have it yet so I cant say for sure. But I will not make a decisive decision until I receive the boat and have something to base the opinion on. Something many people who have commented on the price of the boat have no experience with. When I get the boat I;ll be sure to let you know. And with that lets end this thread.

(Message edited by Wake08 on May 31, 2003)
Old    chase            05-31-2003, 5:19 PM Reply   
Why end the thread? Why get offended? Alot of us on here would love to be in your shoes when that boat arrives, but the point of this thread is still very valid! The pricing trend is outrageous! I don't have a clue whether or not the new X-Star is worth $70,000+ but I do know most people could not or would not be able to afford it.

Wakeboarding is an incredibly expensive sport already. This is one of the major factors in its stagnant growth (compared to other board sports). A $70,000.00 wakeboard boat surely can't help, can it?

At any rate, when the boat arrives please post some pics and enjoy the heck out of it!
Old     (delta_glass)      Join Date: Aug 2001       05-31-2003, 7:29 PM Reply   
Thane,
Chris is my hommie.

-Evan
Old     (hyperlitenrd)      Join Date: Jan 2003       05-31-2003, 8:52 PM Reply   
Its like buying a fancy @$$ sports car, who really needs one of those? but people buy em ne ways, why, because they can, its also what your priorties are, my dad could buy us an xstar, i think, or he could save up for college for me and my brothers, its all priorties.
Old     (norcalrider)      Join Date: Jun 2002       05-31-2003, 8:59 PM Reply   
70k... anyone else thinking new truck and boat?
Old     (scott_a)      Join Date: Dec 2002       05-31-2003, 10:49 PM Reply   
mik- I'm thinking it's gonna be more of a status symbol. Look at me I have an 03 xstar and you don't.
Old     (wakewilly)      Join Date: Aug 2001       06-01-2003, 2:52 AM Reply   
The point that I was trying to get across in this post was, that it seems to me and a lot of my friends that the new Xstar isn't worth 70-80k. Sure I haven't ridden behind it or actually stepped a foot in it, but i can gurantee that it's not worth 40k more than the 1997 boat that I have now. The technology has risen since 97, but not so much as to where it's worth a 40k difference. That's my point. I also do agree with Adam in that he will get what he payed for the boat if he were to turn right around and sell it right after he got it. Where I disagree is the point 6 months to a year down the road. Why would anyone in their right mind buy a used boat for anywhere close to 70k??? Especially when they can get somthing very similar in many respects to the '03 Xstar from a different manufacturer for a much cheaper price. I'm not trying to bash people who are waiting for their new '03 Xstar to be delivered (however I do question the purchase), I'm bashing MC for raising the prices to astronomical levels. Anyways, in my opinion, there isn't a wakeboard boat out on the marked today that comes anywhere close to being worth 70-80k.

-Chris
Old    xtigeman            06-01-2003, 3:14 AM Reply   
Just curious, everyone keeps citing the 70+ k MSRP. MC has never before sold their boats at MSRP at least at dealers around here. Once this boat gets settled into production, I bet the new X-Star could be had for in the 60K range.

I quess the first few are getting MSRP, but once the boat sets into full production say next year, I bet the new X-Star will be sold at the regular 15 to 20 percent off MSRP or around the price of a new loaded down Super Air.

My 01 X-Star had a MSRP of over $ 60K. That means we may be seeing only a $ 15,000 real world sales price difference between the 04 X-Star abd the 04 X-2 next summer.

For the extra 15k, the size of the boat makes it a very attractive alternative. Just won't fit in my garage.

I guess my point is, for comparison purposes, we should speak realistically about the sales price difference. The 30k and 40K examples are probably out of the norm and will only been seen during this initial release phase. Dealers will start discounting those boats by next summer ans one shoulkd be anle to obtain one loaded out for 60K or so as oppossed to the 70 and 80k everyone on here is tossing out.
Old    mikebailey            06-01-2003, 5:13 AM Reply   
I dont have a boat, and dont think i will ever be able to get to that level, but I thought I would have a look at the UK price of the Xstar.

I could not find a new price, as It looks like the UK prices, as usual, are US dollar prices with the $ being swapped for a uk pound sign.

I found a 2000 Xstar for $60,500 (36750 UK pounds) This seemed to be the normal price for a 2000 , all around the 40,000 pound mark.

I dont know if any of you have been to this little place recently, but it gets worse

Gallon of regular gas : $6.70
Pint of warm Beer: $ 4.50
Bottle of Bud: $4.30
Marlboro Lights $8.50

Mad isnt it !.. the worse bit, is I have been looking at boat tows etc, and have spent a lot of time on the US sites making comparisons(stupid thing to do), Most of the UK lakes charge from 26 to 30 dollars for a 15 min tow,

and when you are an absolute beginner, $2 a minute goes very quicklly, especially when you spend 90% of that time up to your neck in lake !

So, Does anyone have a spare room ?

Mike
Old     (tdk2828)      Join Date: Apr 2002       06-01-2003, 7:56 AM Reply   
Laying down that kind of money (75k or whatever Adam actually paid) for a boat that no one really has any experience with seems to me to be a bit unrational. It's almost like you forked out the money, and now you are trying to become educated about the product. Shouldn't it have been the other way around?
Old     (auto)      Join Date: Aug 2002       06-01-2003, 7:58 AM Reply   
Not that I would buy a X star at that price, what I am wondering is why the cove cruiser manufacturers crank up their prices? I would love to see less entry level boats so there would be less people on the water. With 15 year financing every tom, harry can afford a boat. I personally think the market will cap soon on wakeboard boats, you are getting to a price the average person can't afford, and today's up and coming generation does not loook overly motivated to get the jobs that can sustain the payment level of today's wakeboard boats. The VC and net boom is over, you will not see America's unemployment rate at 3.6% any time in the near future, I think in the next few years, the true luxury items for the middle and upper middle class will start coming down in price as the available pool of disposable income drops.
Old    mikebailey            06-01-2003, 8:39 AM Reply   
bit of a worrying comment there Shane,

'I would love to see less entry level boats so there would be less people on the water. With 15 year financing every tom, •••••••• harry can afford a boat '

what do you mean ?

Only the rich should be on the water ? Upper and middle class only, no cheap entry level boats, do away with cheap finance so the undesirable classes cant afford to be there.

I can see there can be saftey issues, but in my experience, people ' able to sustain high payment levels ' are just as likely to be as those who cant.

Mike
Old    mikebailey            06-01-2003, 9:30 AM Reply   
That sounded a lot more harsh than I meant it too,

sorry for that,

We have a lot of 'members ' clubs over here, and it is entirely about who you are or what you have, and not the type of person you are. it makes me a little angry sometimes, when you see fantastic facilities going to waste almost, because those who would benefit the most are excluded.

sorry again.. I should engage before typing

Mike
Old    jonnyb            06-01-2003, 1:57 PM Reply   
Adam, you keep saying that you want more people commenting on the wake and other features about the boat instead of the price. I would love to ride behind an xstar... but in order to get a complete and objective result people need to be able to try it. If 0.0001% of the wakeboarders around the world gets to try it then what kind of result do you expect to get. And what do you look for in a wake boat? personally i look for a boat that will pull me and another 2 guys. If it does that then i am happy. If i want to show of in a luxuary item, then i would go and buy a Sunseeker (http://www.sunseeker.com) then you can pay $1M for a boat. And i do not think that i will become a pro or anything close to that, so i dont really need the extra. I just want to have some fun on my spare time with my pals.
That is my point of view.
And Adam congrats on your new boat. I wish you many happy wake hours.

/Jonny
Old     (auto)      Join Date: Aug 2002       06-01-2003, 4:40 PM Reply   
mike no offense taken, my post could seem that I think that upper income people are better. In fact I just had a run with a mastercraft owner today. My point was really more directed towards reducing the number of people on the water, and price from a simple economic perspective is a way to do that. Trust me when I say I know plenty rich . A guy in a early 80's tri hull was broken down today, I stopped to help, he said he had been there waving people down for 30 minutes and no one helped. I towed him to shore. Then a mastercraft hogged the entire unloading dock, I merely mentioned that this was an unloading and loading dock, they got pissy and explained there rope was wrapped around the prop. I feel for them, but they were still inconveinencing everyone else. I would not have said nothing but I have observed there marvelous lake etiquette one too many times.
Old     (33drew)      Join Date: Apr 2003       06-02-2003, 2:30 PM Reply   
I own a mastercraft and love it till death but i too dislike the people that think because they have a MC they are better. Anyway, does anyone else think the front hull is ugly. In my opinion it is the worst design ever by mastercraft. It reminds me of the front of a pontoon or a tri hull deck boat. I dont like how mastercraft has started to price their boats for only the extremely rich people.
Just my opinion
Old    norcal_99            06-02-2003, 2:38 PM Reply   
It's only money.

Old    corey_marotta            06-02-2003, 4:19 PM Reply   
The only problem I see with the new boat is the market. What I mean by that is peoples obsession to have something with more "I suck but check me out" is out of control. As wakeboarding became more popular there was not a Nautique we sold that did not have accessories barfed all over the tower. It became the standard. Now the manufactures are just capitalizing on it. It's no different than all the San Diego men and woman driving around in the family SUV with 20s on them. I sold Nautiques for six years but I can't ignore the new X-Star wake. At leased Master Craft went out of there way to do something different and make a better wake with no B.S. hanging off the bottom of the boat like all the other boat marketing think tanks did. If all of us stopped flossing the accessories on our boats than maybe the manufactures would build basic rides. Pardon me while I go take nonsense off my tower.

Reply
Share 

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:08 AM.

Home   Articles   Pics/Video   Gear   Wake 101   Events   Community   Forums   Classifieds   Contests   Shop   Search
Wake World Home

 

© 2019 eWake, Inc.    
Advertise    |    Contact    |    Terms of Use    |    Privacy Policy    |    Report Abuse    |    Conduct    |    About Us