MSRP vs Dealers Cost on most Brand New Boats

http://www.seedealercost.com/boats

here you go
now you got a tool to negotiate, LOL

Wow...great find, all the dealers just shat their pants. This will be a fun one to watch

Wow, that's pretty sweet. I'd be interested to see how accurate it is...

I just ordered a RZ2.I looked at list and cost and it is in line with what i found.It didn't list all the options but it did list most of them.I am satisfied i made an excellent deal.But now i am able to confirm my percentages were accurate.

most dealers wanted it!!

also you always can find prices on the net

just because you know dealer cost of my boat that im selling doesnt mean that im gonna sell it to you for that.. That is the absolute hardest thing about my job as a salesman. people come in and look at our boats, see the prices, and assume im making 1000s of dollars on every 13,000 dollar bass boat i sell. when in reality if i make 1500 im doing awesome!. the average customer forgets that i have to make enough money on 60 boats over the course of basically 5 to 6 months to pay expenses for the other 6 to 7 months out of the year....

SDC doesnt show dealer prep, freight, or (the biggie) financing. i know financing is costing us on average of 5000 a month at my small dealership. hell we get tagged 2% of the boat cost just for GE to put it on their books.

All this site is gonna do is to make me look worse to people who dont understand how this business works. Now the dealer will become even more of a bad guy...

So now we get to tell dealers how much they can charge for a boat? Why don't we find out how much Walmart pays for a 12 pk of Coke compared to what they charge the customer and negotiate a better deal?

Yes Jeremy, we always have been able to tell dealers what they can charge. You don't have to give them your money. Personally I avoid dealers. I've tried a few times and I name my price. They want to play the game of "how are you paying?" or "What extras can we throw in?" or all sorts of BS. It's none of their concern whether I'm paying in cash or coffee beans until after we've agreed on a price (FWIW I always pay cash). I treat 'em just like buying private party, I generally avoid the back and forth. I make an offer, they can accept or not. If not I might ask what their bottom dollar is, if it's too rich for my blood then I walk away and that's the end of it.

Walmart doesn't negotiate on prices with customers. If you buy a whole crapload of pallets worth in a single order they might cut you a small discount but at that point you're better off talking to a local Coke distributor. To be honest I don't think most folks here care of they save a dime or even a quarter on a pack of Coke. Look for the good deals but for me a few cents is not a deal breaker for a soda. A few thousand on a boat will be a deal breaker.

anyone else find it curious that only Tige, Centurion and Moomba are listed. How did CC, MC, and BU not get listed.

This does not help anyone. The average boat buyer has no clue what it takes to keep the lights on at a dealership unless they own a similar business themselves. All this is going to cause is a shift to profits on the back end through the manufacturer like in the car industry. No dealers or manufacturers, especially in the wake boat industry support this site that I know of.

This website won't even let me register. The dealer network is too strong for a site like this, that is why Nautique, Bu, MC are not listed. This website tried to get dealers to give up all their info.

Yes Jeremy, we always have been able to tell dealers what they can charge. You don't have to give them your money. Personally I avoid dealers. I've tried a few times and I name my price. They want to play the game of "how are you paying?" or "What extras can we throw in?" or all sorts of BS. It's none of their concern whether I'm paying in cash or coffee beans until after we've agreed on a price (FWIW I always pay cash). I treat 'em just like buying private party, I generally avoid the back and forth. I make an offer, they can accept or not. If not I might ask what their bottom dollar is, if it's too rich for my blood then I walk away and that's the end of it.

-You get to tell them whay you'll pay not what they'll charge
-You're right, you dont have to give them your money and they don't have to sell you the boat, this should be obvious as you stated you've never been able to buy a boat from a dealer with your one swing offer. "Hey take it or leave it I'm paying cash!" Just an FYI you're more likely to get a better deal if you finance then just pay off your financing.
-Why is it none of theur business how you are going to pay for their poduct?
-Why is it a bad thing if they offer extras?

It looks like the site is down the manufactures are fight back with a denial of service attack

What you will find is that no manufactures cooperated. They just like me used average percentages to arrive at cost.What you must remember is the dealer WILL NOT be in business if he can't make enough money to pay the bills.MULTIPLE dealers creates competition,if you run all the little guys off. You will only have the dealer that doesn't NEED your business,so he will charge as he pleases.It's a numbers game and most businesses are just trying to survive.Be careful how you use this site,it may come back to bite you.When you need to get your boat warrantied or worked on and their is no dealer.

manufactures did corporate

might want to read up on trade only, boating industry, and marine dock age
it was a 50/50 mix

The best thing to me is how incorrect the pricing is on the powersports end of it! Plus figure cash discounts vs free flooring vs cost increases etc etc. It will never be consitent or exact but its a great tool for the consumer and the dealer IMO -

the watercraft is spot on

The wheelers and dealers out their will remain riding on your boat, because they will hit every dealer just to try to buy a boat at or close to dealer cost. Which will never happen. So they will end up not buying and have the attitude that someone will eventually sell them a boat at close to cost... which will not happen...

So they will be waiting on your local dock... with their 1985 Hyperlite Set Up... asking for a ride... and then proceed to ask...

"Hey can I try your new set up... and oh yeah... I will bring you some gas money next time!"

Then I reply and say yes... try these concrete boots on... and jump off the boat! hahah

Why is the sanger v215 listed more expensive than the v210? I think they have them backwards.

http://www.seedealercost.com/product...gorySlug/boats

The Tige prices are in line with what I expected. I figure that a dealer needs to make at least $7k per boat for a large dealer and probably $10k+ per boat just to stay in business. It's not like they are selling 1000's of boats per year at a dealership so I'm ok with that, I need them to be around for years to come so I can get things fixed. Heck, say they sell 30 to 50 boats a year, that's only $300k to $500k in sales profit at $10k per boat to pay the employees, the lease on the building, insurance, advertising, etc. Now I realize there's the pro shop and service too but that's not ridiculous mark up in the pro shop stuff either.

Who out there pays anywhere close to MSRP? I haven't met anyone that has! I think that site is great for people looking for a boat but they better realize that boats are not cars and you can't expect your dealer to sell you a boat for $500 over invoice!

Originally Posted by hatepain

-You get to tell them whay you'll pay not what they'll charge
-You're right, you dont have to give them your money and they don't have to sell you the boat, this should be obvious as you stated you've never been able to buy a boat from a dealer with your one swing offer. "Hey take it or leave it I'm paying cash!" Just an FYI you're more likely to get a better deal if you finance then just pay off your financing.
-Why is it none of theur business how you are going to pay for their poduct?
-Why is it a bad thing if they offer extras?

If they don't align what they're willing to sell for with what people are willing to pay, they'll eventually go under. There comes a point where it's better to move a boat at a smaller profit than what you'd like than have it sitting around forever. I've seen dealers asking way more than market prices for boats while I was searching for an inboard. They had those boats for sale for a long time before I inquired and whenever I peruse listings I still see some of those same boats for sale at the same dealers. Maybe it wasn't worth it for them to drop the price $1000 or whatever, but they still have those boats sitting around.

I don't finance toys. If I can't pay cash for a luxury, then I don't really need it. I entertained financing for a while came to my senses. I didn't need to spend that much and I'm glad I didn't, I found the right deal for me eventually and am happy with my boat.

As for how I'm paying, I don't believe that's any of their business until after we've settled on a price. Lower price but paying interest? No thanks. Extras? I'll entertain what they have to say... But for example if I was looking at a boat that had no tower or PP and I wanted those... I've yet to have an offer to throw it in and work out to be a cheaper deal than buying at a price I'm more comfortable with and installing the extras myself. I treat dealers just as I treat a private party. I just see no benefit to paying more for the same boat just because it's a dealer.

I find it odd how some things are pretty accurate and others are so far off. Use it as you wish but its not any where close to 100% accurate.

Why is the sanger v215 listed more expensive than the v210? I think they have them backwards.

The 215 is more expensive than the 210.

If they don't align what they're willing to sell for with what people are willing to pay, they'll eventually go under. There comes a point where it's better to move a boat at a smaller profit than what you'd like than have it sitting around forever. I've seen dealers asking way more than market prices for boats while I was searching for an inboard. They had those boats for sale for a long time before I inquired and whenever I peruse listings I still see some of those same boats for sale at the same dealers. Maybe it wasn't worth it for them to drop the price $1000 or whatever, but they still have those boats sitting around.

Based on the fact that prices on these boats keep going up they're telling us what we'll pay and we begrudgingly adjust to it.

Just got this:

Jacobs initiates lawsuit against SeeDealerCost.com

Boating Industry
Friday March 18, 2011


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MINNEAPOLIS — In a letter to dealers and sales reps of his boat brands, Irwin Jacobs said he has initiated a lawsuit against SeeDealerCost.com.

Without mentioning the site by name, Jacobs wrote:
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"As you know, a website was recently launched which includes contractual and proprietary pricing information for some of our brands. I am writing to inform you that we have initiated a lawsuit in Hennepin County, Minnesota against such site to stop this illegal behavior."

Jacobs' company, J&D Acquisitions, owns the Larson, Seaswirl, FinCraft and Triumph brands.

Jacobs said in the letter that he is investigating how SeaDealerCost obtains its pricing information.

"Please also know that we are fully investigating how this site obtained our contractual and proprietary information," he wrote. "Once such source is identified you can trust that the appropriate actions will be taken to deal with these individuals. In the meantime, I cannot stress enough the importance that each of you continue to protect and not disclose to third parties any of our confidential business information. We will hold all of our employees, dealers, and sales representatives to the highest standards in this area."

Jacobs does not mince words in the bluntly phrased letter, saying, "These unconscionable acts have and will damage our brands and our dealers and we will not stand for it. We will pursue every legal remedy available to us, including injunctive relief, to stop this in its tracks and recover our damages."

Sorry, I meant it shows the v210 as more expensive than the v215.

Originally Posted by cadunkle

If they don't align what they're willing to sell for with what people are willing to pay, they'll eventually go under. There comes a point where it's better to move a boat at a smaller profit than what you'd like than have it sitting around forever. I've seen dealers asking way more than market prices for boats while I was searching for an inboard. They had those boats for sale for a long time before I inquired and whenever I peruse listings I still see some of those same boats for sale at the same dealers. Maybe it wasn't worth it for them to drop the price $1000 or whatever, but they still have those boats sitting around.

I've seen the same thing. Some of them are listed way over high book value and a year later they aren't dropping the price even though there's been significant depreciation. But that goes for private parties too, the dreamers who believe their boat is worth close to what it was new - 5 years later.

I don't finance toys. If I can't pay cash for a luxury, then I don't really need it. I entertained financing for a while came to my senses. I didn't need to spend that much and I'm glad I didn't, I found the right deal for me eventually and am happy with my boat.

Same here which is why I can afford a toy now and then. All those years of interest have stayed in my pocket.

I treat dealers just as I treat a private party. I just see no benefit to paying more for the same boat just because it's a dealer.

At some times it makes sense to use a dealer if the price is reasonable and they've thoroughly gone through it. Sometimes they will throw in a short warranty. I'm going through a lot of that now looking for a new (used) boat, and the local dealer has one that is a little more expensive but I don't have to have it shipped from another state or pay a surveyor (or fly out myself to check it out). It's a little different with used boats, more risk of problems.

Having the invoice prices out there for new boat can only help the industry because there are always the guys out there trying to screw you on cost. Salesmen get commission and it's in their best interest to get you top pay more. There are always some people with more money than brains and just pay the listed price.

Most people know dealers have expenses to cover, and volume dealers can afford to sell a bit cheaper. With the invoices out there you'd think prices would stay in a tighter range. If you have a good local dealer he's going to quote you a reasonable price, I would absolutely buy a boat from the guy I bought my last one from - as long as the price difference wasn't huge. He always took care of me and was a good guy.

On the other hand, I've been looking for a new tow vehicle and the dealers vary up to $15,000 on the same exact truck. (so much for invoice prices there) Ridiculous. Invoice prices have been out forever on cars, why should it be any different with boats?

"Invoice prices have been out forever on cars, why should it be any different with boats? "

Transparency is better for any business. If dealers are getting upset about this information being exposed, then that makes me think they are trying to hide it. In my opinion that is a bad business tactic.

I want to have healthy marine dealerships in my area, so if the markup on a tow boat needs to be $15k, then so be it. I would just like to know that going into the deal beforehand.