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Old     (brettw)      Join Date: Jul 2007       09-08-2019, 4:26 AM Reply   
I currently have a '99 Nautique 176. The kids are getting better at wakeboarding and doing some wakesurfing, and I'm looking for something bigger but still want to be able to squeeze the boat in the garage. I can do it with a 20' boat at an angle. My wife skis, so I need something that can do it all and at least not have a horrible wake for skiing. I've been looking at some of the 20 footers that are marketed as do it all boats. I don't want to spend more than $50K so looking at used. I've been looking at an Axis A20, Mastercraft NXT20 and a few others.I've read about the NXT20 vs X20 and see people saying the X20 is much better but about $20K more used, which is over my budget. There's the Nautique GS20. I found a brand new Sanger V215 that's 21' but was told it might be a better a fit than some of the 20' boats that have the fork front because at an angle it's be a tougher fit. A salt water package is a big bonus because I'm in San Diego and during the Winter the local lake is only open on Sundays so I like to drop in Salt Water on other days. So does anyone have any opinions on boats to definitely consider or stay away from?
Old     (dougr)      Join Date: Dec 2009       09-08-2019, 4:51 AM Reply   
master craft x2 would prob be a good option
Old     (paulharenberg)      Join Date: Jul 2007       09-09-2019, 1:34 AM Reply   
How about a Malibu VTX?
Old     (wombat2wombat)      Join Date: Sep 2018       09-09-2019, 4:02 AM Reply   
Go with the A20. The problem with the other crossover boats is they do everything decent but nothing well.
Old     (brettw)      Join Date: Jul 2007       09-09-2019, 9:56 AM Reply   
I checked out a used A20, and it looks like a great boat. However, I didn't realize the swim step is very large and very heavy. The owner said he never even attempted to fold it down or take off. Also, the surf gates and all that stick out still, so I wouldn't gain much by taking it off. So with it on, it's about 24' which is way too big for my garage. I need a 20' boat, where the swimstep can actually come off fairly easily like the teak one I have on my current boat. With the swim step off and tongue folded in, I need the boat to actually be 20' or not much more.

Maybe the Mastercraft X2 is a good option?
Old     (bcd)      Join Date: Jun 2012       09-09-2019, 11:18 AM Reply   
XT20 or X2 would be the Mastercraft options to look at, not the x20. They will be better price points between the nxt and x series. How tall is your garage door? A lot of boats won't easily for under a 7' door. The newer MC's also have a rotating swim platform. That means with surf tabs, it won't rotate all the down. And it's a little more if of a pain to completely remove.
Old     (bcd)      Join Date: Jun 2012       09-09-2019, 11:22 AM Reply   
GS20 would be worth looking at. It might come in shorter than the VTX or MCs since their surf system goes out the side of the boat. The older nautique 200v will be a little smaller than the other mentioned boats, but bigger than what you have now. I don't think it surfs very well and can't comment on it's wakeboard wake.
Old     (hal2814)      Join Date: Feb 2006       09-09-2019, 4:38 PM Reply   
You’re a Nautique owner already and the GS20 fits the bill at least as good as your other options on everything but price. I don’t think you’ll find one used at $50k just yet. I personally gave up on garage parking after my SN2001 and park in the driveway now. But I realize that’s not an option for everyone. My thinking based on budget went immediately to the A20 and VTX but I didn’t think about the surf tabs hanging off the back. I hate to say it because they’re ugly as sin but from a size perspective you do seem to be the target audience for the Heyday Wake Tractor. Surf is ok from what I’ve seen. Not sure how they wakeboard or ski though.
Old     (GoBeavs85)      Join Date: Jul 2015       09-09-2019, 6:01 PM Reply   
Problem with gs20 is the surf pipe extends beyond the the stern so even after removing the platform and folding the tongue you are longer than 20í.

We currently have the Malibu vtx before surfgate but it does have the power wedge. We can drop the power wedge and remove the platform but the actuaters and housing for the wedge sticks out some. That being said we have really figured out how to dial the surf wave. Iíve surfed most modern surf boats and we are so pleased with our wave for the price. We still ski and in a side to side comparison of my neighbors mastercraft x7 (direct drive) the vtx was preferred at most line lengths. Itís no pro star for sure but it skiís surprisingly well! I donít know if maybe they made older vtx with a manual wedge?
Old     (brettw)      Join Date: Jul 2007       09-10-2019, 6:24 AM Reply   
Seems many of the 20' boats aren't 20' after-all. I found a Mastercraft X2, but it's really pushing it. The boat alone is actually 20' 6" from what I've read and a little longer since the swim step seems to fold down vs. coming off completely. Seems a lot of folks have issues with the height as well. I'm working on getting details on that from the owner. My boat is 7'1" and goes in the garage fine mainly cuz the driveway is an upward incline. As the tallest point goes into the garage, the tires are a few feet back and saw that tall point drops down. I looked for GS20s. Only found 1 used one, but it was a 2018 for like $98,000 or something. Whatever I consider, I'm gonna have to test a garage fit test before handing over a check.
Old     (paulharenberg)      Join Date: Jul 2007       09-10-2019, 8:50 AM Reply   
FYI - There are two versions of the mastercraft X2. The Earlier ones were the previous XStar and then the X1 (205V hull), which will come in at 20'6". This X2 ran from 2003-2005 (I think)

The 2006+ X2 is the 200V Hull, which is the smaller pickle fork. This boat should come in at 20'. This boat ran for awhile with many incarnations of the mastercraft tower.

Hope you find something that fits your needs.
Old     (mschmidt33)      Join Date: Aug 2013       09-11-2019, 5:51 AM Reply   
2011-2019 Tige r20/RZR for sure should be on the list. Most of then out there will be at or under your budget, true 20", insane surf wave (listed, suck gate, or taps 3), wakeboard wake is lippier than most, need to try it first. Demo it, bring it home, make sure it fits, then enjoy.
Old     (99Bison)      Join Date: Sep 2012       09-13-2019, 2:44 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by mschmidt33 View Post
2011-2019 Tige r20/RZR for sure should be on the list. Most of then out there will be at or under your budget, true 20", insane surf wave (listed, suck gate, or taps 3), wakeboard wake is lippier than most, need to try it first. Demo it, bring it home, make sure it fits, then enjoy.

Agreed 100%.

Re-read original description and sounds like the perfect boat for you. Donít think there was a salt version though.

Last edited by 99Bison; 09-13-2019 at 2:46 AM.
Old     (sandm01)      Join Date: May 2010       09-18-2019, 3:27 AM Reply   
I'll toss this out there if you want to go older. my first wakeboat was a supra 20ssv. 20ft with fold tongue and at 45yo I was able to add/remove the swim platform myself. it's super easy to maneuver if you find one on a single axle and fits under a 7ft door with tower folded.
since it's a crossover it does nothing great but most ok. it's slalom wake will be better than most mentioned on here aside from the vtx. the tige shop that took it on trade used it as the shop boat for the summer and all the guys said the wakeboard wave was fantastic. I only surfed it and it took a lot of bags laying around and running the rubrail to the water. surf wake was decent but as with any 20ft boat it didn't have a ton of length.
that would be my suggestion on a 20ft'er. I have never surfed the tige rzr/r20 but seen pics of the wave and it's pretty good. issue is newer will have taps3 and no benefit to removing swim platform, mid-life boats have convexvx and having one now, good luck removing that to get it in the garage. go older to fit your 20ft length and back to the same tradeoffs. jack of all, master of none...

good luck.
Old     (Matt0520)      Join Date: Feb 2019       09-18-2019, 4:06 AM Reply   
I would avoid NXT unless the Mastercraft name will make you feel good. That's about all that boat has going for it IMO.

A20 or Moomba Mondo in the 'entry' segment or GS20 for sure. With the Axis, power wedge is a must in my opinion so I think that puts you at 2016/17 or later. You'll want similar years of the Mondo to get the latest surf system. 2019 interior on the Moomba sets it apart, you can be in the $60s easy on a 2019 leftover.

I believe sentiment is the GS20 surfs the best out of all the GS sizes, but you do lose a few things like the port side lean-back on the 20 footer.

Demo demo demo. And evaluate your local dealer's reputation and support, all the boats discussed here will get the job done. Comes down to what fits you/your family and how good your local dealer is.
Old     (brettw)      Join Date: Jul 2007       09-20-2019, 3:00 AM Reply   
Been looking and talking to people. I looked at a 2005 Mastercraft X2. Then I started talking to some people about Sangers. A brand new 2019 Sanger V215s can be had for $60,000. I was really tempted to go with that over a used Mastercraft X2 for half the price. Both of these boats have a swimstep that comes off easily, making it much more garage friendly - unlike the Axis with it's massive swimstep. From what I've read the Sanger is a great all around boat for boarding, surfing and skiing. Now I got a line on a great price on a used Sanger and gonna water test that. Will see how it goes. In the meantime when looking at boats and seeing what's out there to add on to help with the surf wake. I came a across the SWELL wakesurf creator which I plan to try on the Sanger and my own boat. Reviews seem good, and it's super easy to use. Will see how that goes.
Old     (Matt0520)      Join Date: Feb 2019       09-20-2019, 3:26 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by brettw View Post
Been looking and talking to people. I looked at a 2005 Mastercraft X2. Then I started talking to some people about Sangers. A brand new 2019 Sanger V215s can be had for $60,000. I was really tempted to go with that over a used Mastercraft X2 for half the price. Both of these boats have a swimstep that comes off easily, making it much more garage friendly - unlike the Axis with it's massive swimstep. From what I've read the Sanger is a great all around boat for boarding, surfing and skiing. Now I got a line on a great price on a used Sanger and gonna water test that. Will see how it goes. In the meantime when looking at boats and seeing what's out there to add on to help with the surf wake. I came a across the SWELL wakesurf creator which I plan to try on the Sanger and my own boat. Reviews seem good, and it's super easy to use. Will see how that goes.

Easy to use but youíll get sick of switching it around for regular and goofy surfers.

Keep in mind the surftab or surfgate automatically retracts on other boats. The suck gates (like swell) are permanent and picking up a downed rider is a pain with that dragging in the water.
Old     (denverd1)      Join Date: May 2004       09-20-2019, 5:25 AM Reply   
shapers don't affect handling at idle that much if you turn to the side the shaper is on. If you get sick of changing sides (Sangers like to be listed so you've got a few minutes to kill anyway) you can always add go surf assist or another tab system later.

love my Sanger. built like a tank, handles big chop and drives like a sports car. Can't go wrong IMO
Old     (Matt0520)      Join Date: Feb 2019       09-21-2019, 5:02 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by denverd1 View Post
shapers don't affect handling at idle that much if you turn to the side the shaper is on.

Iím talking about once turned, trying to drive straight to pick up a rider. Driven a few boats with shapers and it takes a lot of getting used to. So much so that the boatís owners wonít let anyone but experience people drive them.
Old     (brettw)      Join Date: Jul 2007       09-21-2019, 3:30 AM Reply   
Yeah, I've read a lot of good things about Sangers. I don't see anybody complaining about them. It sounds like you get a pretty good bang for the buck. $60K new is a great deal nowadays for an inboard that can boar/surf/ski and still fit in the garage.

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