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Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       10-25-2017, 12:34 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeshmoe View Post
And, as you can see, it doesn't matter who is in office, nothing is going to change.
The only redeeming factor of the man-child in chief is he is going to smash the system, if nothing changes, or gets worse then what's the point of trump?
Old     (psudy)      Join Date: Dec 2003       10-25-2017, 1:10 PM Reply   
"Then put some law around back costs to suits which are proven frivolous"

The word frivolous is a very subjective term. Trying to prove a case is frivolous will just cost you a lot more after you spent the money to win it in the first place.
Old     (95sn)      Join Date: Sep 2005       10-25-2017, 2:57 PM Reply   
Pence, another bad seed. Very faux Christian of you. If there is a god he should strike him by lightening.
Record profits for banks yet they need more. This is how the trump drains the swamp.
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       10-25-2017, 3:23 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by psudy View Post
"Then put some law around back costs to suits which are proven frivolous"

The word frivolous is a very subjective term. Trying to prove a case is frivolous will just cost you a lot more after you spent the money to win it in the first place.
Lots of words are subjective, it doesn't stop law being written and all the law needs to be able to do is recover costs. But the point is, this roll back helps big business and hurts consumers, a step in the wrong direction and the opposite of what trump ran on.
Old     (grant_west)      Join Date: Jun 2005       10-25-2017, 9:01 PM Reply   
Hida Beast & the DNC pay for Russian BS dirt on TRUMP. LOL you dems must be so proud of your political affiliation. I love the FACT that all the Russian allegations the DNC & the Beast had thrown at Trump are turning right back around to point directly back at them. All the un-hinged librtards like Wes must be spinning new tails of re-direction & denial. The Swamp is thick & deep. Drain the Swamp. MAGA
Old     (wakeslash)      Join Date: Sep 2017       10-25-2017, 9:39 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by grant_west View Post
Hida Beast & the DNC pay for Russian BS dirt on TRUMP. LOL you dems must be so proud of your political affiliation. I love the FACT that all the Russian allegations the DNC & the Beast had thrown at Trump are turning right back around to point directly back at them. All the un-hinged librtards like Wes must be spinning new tails of re-direction & denial. The Swamp is thick & deep. Drain the Swamp. MAGA
AYYY lets gooooo MAGA
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       10-25-2017, 10:55 PM Reply   
Ok back to Healthcare costs, explain me this:
Attached Images
 
Old     (xstarrider)      Join Date: Jun 2007       10-26-2017, 2:26 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by ralph View Post
Ok back to Healthcare costs, explain me this:

Government regulations/restrictions. . The end.
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       10-26-2017, 2:46 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by xstarrider View Post
Government regulations/restrictions. . The end.
So shouldn't the govt change regulations/restrictions to be more like other counties when trying to fix the healthcare system? Why is the healthcare insurance the only thing that is talked about when it is the underlying costs which are the biggest problem?
Old     (psudy)      Join Date: Dec 2003       10-26-2017, 7:31 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by ralph View Post
Lots of words are subjective, it doesn't stop law being written and all the law needs to be able to do is recover costs. But the point is, this roll back helps big business and hurts consumers, a step in the wrong direction and the opposite of what trump ran on.
Ill break it down to you.
1) you would have to defend yourself first and win. $$$$$
2) you would have to file a new suit against whomever filed against you sighting the "new law", try and prove it(this is were the subjective nature of the word "frivolous" will get twisted. Whats frivolous to you isn't frivolous the complaintant), and win. $$$$$.

The only people that win= Lawyers.

The other thing you don't get is that every time the word "bank" get used, people automatically think Wells Fargo, Chase, etc... You fail to remember the 5400 community banks that will see the brunt of that legislation if it passed. There were and still are consumer protections in place to keep predatory practices away.
Old     (fly135)      Join Date: Jun 2004       10-26-2017, 9:51 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by xstarrider View Post
Government regulations/restrictions. . The end.
Only in the sense that the govt forces medical providers to have mandated qualifications and denies consumers the right to buy drugs from outside the country. But that's only the beginning, not the end.

The HC market is hyper-inflated from a elimination of the free market paradigm decades ago. Like Ralph indicated, the rest of the world has left us in the dust when it comes to the welfare of the public WRT HC. Unfortunately too many Americans are ignorant in the belief that no other country can do anything better than us. Even when they can demonstrate HC systems that provide equal or better results in terms of life expectancy at half the cost per capita these ignorant deniers keep claiming it can't be true. Unfortunately the flat earthers are in control of congress and the executive office right now. But don't worry... They'll set those pervert enabling women in Hollywood straight.
Old     (grant_west)      Join Date: Jun 2005       10-26-2017, 10:08 AM Reply   
Hey Libral Loons what do you have to say about the fact that all the Russian conspiracy theories you threw @ TRUMP are now coming back to haunt the DNC & Hillary. I have always been up for a investigation, bring out the truth. But when the truth about Trump and Russian involvement turns out to be a giant “Nothing Burger” and you libral loons still will not accept it I’m loving that fact that the DNC & The Beast are gonna get what’s coming to them.

When Trump won. I liked that he was saying “I’m not going to investigate or go after Hillary further” I got the feeling like it was “ Let by gone’s BE by gone’s” but as you libral LOONS have proven over the 9+ months your not happy with the results and you will try and grind the country to a hault and devide America at all costs. I love the fact that your gonna get what you wanted “The Truth” I’m gonna love it even more when the Truth throws your Beast and people in the DNC in Jail. Let the SWAMP be Drained. MAGA
Old     (fly135)      Join Date: Jun 2004       10-26-2017, 10:18 AM Reply   
It seems like Fox is tooling their minions again like they did with Benghazi. So far I haven't seen anyone claim that the DNC did anything illegal about compiling the Trump dossier except reporting it as "legal services" instead of opposition research on campaign finance filings. Go take a look at the Faux News headliner for the day. There is nothing in there WRT wrong doing except the allegation of improperly filing disclosure.

Quote:
The Campaign Legal Center, a watchdog group, filed a complaint Wednesday with the Federal Election Commission accusing the DNC and Clinton’s campaign committee of breaking campaign finance law by failing to accurately disclose the money spent on the Trump-Russia dossier.
So yeah the Federal Election Commission should take action and get it over with so the lunatics can complain that anyone else would be in jail for life for writing "legal services" instead of "opposition research". LOL!
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       10-26-2017, 3:57 PM Reply   
I'll be stoked if Hilderbeast gets thrown in jail, i like the flavor of all justice.
Old     (95sn)      Join Date: Sep 2005       10-26-2017, 5:04 PM Reply   
Quote:
Hida Beast & the DNC pay for Russian BS dirt on TRUMP. LOL you dems must be so proud of your political affiliation. I love the FACT that all the Russian allegations the DNC & the Beast had thrown at Trump are turning right back around to point directly back at them. All the un-hinged librtards like Wes must be spinning new tails of re-direction & denial. The Swamp is thick & deep. Drain the Swamp. MAGA
Before the nominations were set, a competing republican hired FusionGPS for opposition research. After they failed the nomination they bailed. Then an atty for DNC picked up Fusion to continue their research on cheeto. Kinda like Donnie Jr. meeting with Russians to get dirt on Hildabeast, except it is legal. So...As I recall the DNC and Hillary never used any of the info during the campaign. Right? Knowing who paid for the research tells one just a little. Many parts of the dossier have been proven true and some has not yet been verified. Very little if any has been proven false. To call it BS is just putting on the blinders again. The Dossier is only one small part of the Russian interference of a US election. It shouldn't be big news as to which side was investigating whom, just common sense.
What is trump doing to drain the swamp other than appointing goldman sachs to the white house, using government planes for pleasure, spending weekends at the golf club, appointing people with major conflicts of interest (betsy devos, Scott Pruit,Ryan Zienke... ), Nepotism, His conveniently located trump hotel in Washington, repealing rules that regulate big corporations and lowering Corporate taxes? Who is paying for Mar-a-lago each weekend? Draining the swamp? How so? do tell.
Old     (fly135)      Join Date: Jun 2004       10-26-2017, 5:05 PM Reply   
Pretty sure it's going to take more than the DNC labeling opposition research as legal services. So nobody finds it weird that Faux News is making a big deal about this even though they can't identify the "crime"? Just looked again and it's almost completely wiped from the web page. Now they're back to football players. They sure knows what gets the knuckledraggers juices flowing.
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       10-27-2017, 8:11 PM Reply   
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...-a8024216.html
Old     (grant_west)      Join Date: Jun 2005       10-27-2017, 9:54 PM Reply   
One thing the DNC @ piece of $hit people like “The Beast” are Very Very proficient at is deflecting. This Bit$h is one tough bird. She has not got as far as she has by going down after 1 shot. Remember her husband was IMPEACHED! Yes that’s right Billl Clinton was IMPEACHED!. You don’t think simple he said he said things are gonna paze them?? He’ll no your gonna need D&A, Video, and Written confession and even then they are gonna blame someone else. Remember that’s the DemaRAT way of life
Old     (stanfield)      Join Date: Mar 2004       10-28-2017, 7:15 AM Reply   
Bill Clinton was not impeached. I’ve tried to look past the fact that you write like a 2nd grader, but more and more I think you very well might be “speshul.”
Old     (fly135)      Join Date: Jun 2004       10-28-2017, 8:55 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by stanfield View Post
Bill Clinton was not impeached. I’ve tried to look past the fact that you write like a 2nd grader, but more and more I think you very well might be “speshul.”
He was. He just wasn't found guilty and removed from office.
Old     (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       10-28-2017, 9:15 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by grant_west View Post
One thing the DNC @ piece of $hit people like “The Beast” are Very Very proficient at is deflecting. This Bit$h is one tough bird. She has not got as far as she has by going down after 1 shot. Remember her husband was IMPEACHED! Yes that’s right Billl Clinton was IMPEACHED!. You don’t think simple he said he said things are gonna paze them?? He’ll no your gonna need D&A, Video, and Written confession and even then they are gonna blame someone else. Remember that’s the DemaRAT way of life
Why does this matter today, Grant? I mean Gary Hart got caught in an affair and Nixon resigned too. How far back do we go? And how do those things have anything to do with Trump's shenanigans?

It feels a lot like you are "blaming someone else" for Trump's current woes. Are YOU a "DemaRAT"?
Old     (grant_west)      Join Date: Jun 2005       10-28-2017, 4:18 PM Reply   
Shawn : Sorry but your just a Basic Bit$H! ( do some reacearch on Basic Bit$h) sorry nothing special about you even thought your parents told you you were specia your just a Dong Tard Dummacrat. Take what one persons says & twist it around into what your think. Wow what a progressive you are !!!! LoL all you dumaRat’s are cut from the same cloth. In case you did not get that “im calling you ORDINARY” LOL Basic Bit$h. LOL
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       10-28-2017, 5:05 PM Reply   
Lol, Whitefish contract starting to stink to high heaven.
http://www.politicususa.com/2017/10/...-contract.html

Sounds like FEMA are getting one back against trump for wanting to cut their funding. Ha ha
Old     (wakeslash)      Join Date: Sep 2017       10-28-2017, 6:41 PM Reply   
Grant holding all the libturds at bay lol. Its a nasty job but someone gotta do it.
Old     (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       10-28-2017, 8:55 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by grant_west View Post
Shawn : Sorry but your just a Basic Bit$H! ( do some reacearch on Basic Bit$h) sorry nothing special about you even thought your parents told you you were specia your just a Dong Tard Dummacrat. Take what one persons says & twist it around into what your think. Wow what a progressive you are !!!! LoL all you dumaRat’s are cut from the same cloth. In case you did not get that “im calling you ORDINARY” LOL Basic Bit$h. LOL


Totally. Let’s assume all that’s true. So why do you keep bringing Bill Clinton up in the Trump thread?
Old     (pesos)      Join Date: Oct 2001       10-28-2017, 9:22 PM Reply   
I always thought Grant simply wrote like a real housewives-obsessed preteen girl - now I’m starting to wonder if he actually is one. That is quite a sentence... or paragraph? Not quite sure what to call it.
Old     (grant_west)      Join Date: Jun 2005       10-28-2017, 11:19 PM Reply   
Wes you baby sit this thread like no other. Pretty sure you have more posts & links in this thread than anyone. Who is the housewife
Old     (grant_west)      Join Date: Jun 2005       10-28-2017, 11:26 PM Reply   
Well at least your not “melting down” and becoming UN hinged ! like you have on 3 previous occasions. LOL
Old     (fly135)      Join Date: Jun 2004       10-29-2017, 9:48 AM Reply   
Anyone notice that since Trump became President the political news has been consumed with "leaks". Are they trying to convince us that average Americans should be kept in the dark and anything to the otherwise is bad?
Old     (grant_west)      Join Date: Jun 2005       10-29-2017, 11:30 AM Reply   
I think that leaks are from “Swamp Creatures” GOP & Dem-a-Rats, To me it seems like Demarats think they are helping America by undermining anything and everything this administration wants to do weather it’s good for America or not. I bet come next election the DemaRats will be beating their chest saying elect us “The TRUMP administration got nothing done over that last 4 years.” The DemaRats crowing achievement over the next 3 + years will be to try and slow down goverment and the TRUMP administration and bring it to a hault & cause as much chaos as they can. Kind of like how little kids stomp/feet and throw tantrums, trying to make the environment as uncomfortable as possible until they get their way.
Old     (fly135)      Join Date: Jun 2004       10-29-2017, 11:38 AM Reply   
I can't think of any more positive outcome than Trump achieving nothing. Too bad the last Republican President didn't suffer the same fate. We wouldn't have wasted trillions turning the ME into a hot bed of terrorism.
Old     (grant_west)      Join Date: Jun 2005       10-29-2017, 6:28 PM Reply   
Fly Just admit it YOUR a $HIT bird. LOL im serious your a sawed off 1/2 man. LOL you think shaking hand with roaches will make them your friends. LOL now wonder why you and Wes are Glory Hole buddys
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       10-30-2017, 12:14 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by fly135 View Post
Anyone notice that since Trump became President the political news has been consumed with "leaks". Are they trying to convince us that average Americans should be kept in the dark and anything to the otherwise is bad?
Yes, leaks and fake news. They should really choose one. Either the media are making stuff up or reporting inside info. Don't see how it's both. Not that trumpsters seem to care.
Old     (wakeslash)      Join Date: Sep 2017       10-30-2017, 8:35 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by grant_west View Post
Fly Just admit it YOUR a $HIT bird. LOL im serious your a sawed off 1/2 man. LOL you think shaking hand with roaches will make them your friends. LOL now wonder why you and Wes are Glory Hole buddys
DAMNNN Grant ain't playing around out here.
Old     (grant_west)      Join Date: Jun 2005       10-30-2017, 9:29 AM Reply   
Yes I need to walk that statement back! Calling peeps $hit Birds & Glory Hole customers. What was I thinking. I just come here to kick the Dumarats from time to time That was a full blown Cristiano Ronaldo kick right to the balls.
Old     (fouroheight68)      Join Date: May 2006       10-30-2017, 9:58 AM Reply   
Here is the official 31 page, 12 count indictment against Trump's former campaign chairman Paul Manafort and his cohort Richard Gates:

https://www.justice.gov/sco

Among the charges, "Conspiracy against the United States"

"Conspiracy against the United States" is king of a bid deal. Trump-supporting "patriots" should be outraged. We all should be.
Old     (fouroheight68)      Join Date: May 2006       10-30-2017, 9:59 AM Reply   
This may be bigger than Manafort/Gates. First guilty plea in all this, looks like a cooperating witness based on the plea.

Quote:
George Papadopoulos, of Chicago, Illinois, pleaded guilty on Oct. 5, 2017, to making false statements to FBI agents, in violation of 18 U.S.C. 1001. The case was unsealed on Oct. 30, 2017.

Last edited by fouroheight68; 10-30-2017 at 10:04 AM.
Old     (racer808)      Join Date: Jan 2013       10-30-2017, 10:08 AM Reply   
Actually I wouldn't read much into this at all. They're being indicted on charges that happened long before Trump enters the picture. I know you're all hoping for it, but it isn't there.
Old     (fouroheight68)      Join Date: May 2006       10-30-2017, 10:10 AM Reply   
The Papadoupoulos guilty plea was for making false statements regarding ties to Russians to dig up Clinton dirt. All during the campaign, not prior. Manafort is a complete slimeball who would sell our country to the highest bidder. Our POTUS hired him to run his campaign. Says a lot about his character.
Old     (fouroheight68)      Join Date: May 2006       10-30-2017, 10:22 AM Reply   
Here’s the conspiracy against the United States charge:

Quote:
From in or about in between 2006 and 2017, both dates being aproximate and inclusive, in the district of Columbia and elsewhere, the defendants Paul J Manafort and Richard gates, together with others, knowingly and intentionally conspired to defraud the United States by impeding, impairing, obstructing, and defeating the lawful government functions of a government agency, namely department of justice in the department of treasury, and to commit offenses against the United States.
Note that the charges go to 2017.

Lock him up! (Am I doing this right?)
Old     (racer808)      Join Date: Jan 2013       10-30-2017, 10:40 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by fouroheight68 View Post
Here’s the conspiracy against the United States charge:



Note that the charges go to 2017.

Lock him up! (Am I doing this right?)
He's going to be locked up! Yes you're doing it right. Too bad you can't apply your same logic to the left who's corruption is every bit as bad. The real story here is is that after months of investigating they still have nothing on Trump but found charges of un reported income allowing Manafort to not pay taxes. So when is Jesse Jackson & Al Sharpton going to be arrested? Let me know when they finally get something on Trump, otherwise the left is still eating a big nothing burger, no matter how much you wish it to be something else.
Old     (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       10-30-2017, 11:33 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by fouroheight68 View Post
This may be bigger than Manafort/Gates. First guilty plea in all this, looks like a cooperating witness based on the plea.
Am I the only person who thinks of this guy when he hears the name George Popodopolous?

Old     (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       10-30-2017, 11:36 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by racer808 View Post
The real story here is is that after months of investigating they still have nothing on Trump
That wasn't really the goal of the investigation. I think many hoped it'd be a byproduct, but the investigation itself, and the appointment of the special prosecutor specifically, were to look into Russian election meddling.

If Trump's clean, all the better.
Old     (racer808)      Join Date: Jan 2013       10-30-2017, 12:10 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by shawndoggy View Post
That wasn't really the goal of the investigation. I think many hoped it'd be a byproduct, but the investigation itself, and the appointment of the special prosecutor specifically, were to look into Russian election meddling.

If Trump's clean, all the better.
Correct. And I haven't read whole lot but skimming around this morning I saw the charges may not stick because they were found while looking for ties to Russian meddling & the evidence gathered was far outside the scope of the warrant when they discovered the business dealings. Manaforts dirty & should do his time, but so far nothing ties him to Russian meddling. Or anyone else for that matter, as of now.
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       10-30-2017, 2:59 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by racist808 View Post
The real story here is is that after months of investigating they still have nothing on Trump....
What news are you following, faux and friends maybe?
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Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       10-30-2017, 3:22 PM Reply   
Lol, Faux news is incredible. Interestingly i read that popolopolopodus is described in the docs as "proactive cooperator" which usually means he wore a wire.
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Old     (fouroheight68)      Join Date: May 2006       10-30-2017, 3:40 PM Reply   
You're delusional if you dont think this all ties back to Trump. See the footnote at the bottom?



According to the footnote, the FBI possesses an email from one "high-ranking campaign official" to another which states

Quote:
Lets discuss. We need someone to communicate that DT is not doing these trips [to Russia]. It should be someone low level in the campaign so as not to send any signal.
Old     (racer808)      Join Date: Jan 2013       10-30-2017, 3:44 PM Reply   
Did you even read your own crap, Ralph? Seeking a meeting & getting one are two different things.

"George Papadopoulos pled guilty to a single charge of making a false statement to the FBI. He was not charged with so-called “collusion” because no such crime exists in American statutory law, except in anti-trust matters. It has no application to elections and political campaigns.

It is not a crime to talk to a Russian. Or, in Papadopoulos’s case, attempting to talk with a Russian through an intermediary"

Getting your faux news from your facebook feeds, Ralph?

Last edited by racer808; 10-30-2017 at 3:50 PM.
Old     (fouroheight68)      Join Date: May 2006       10-30-2017, 3:53 PM Reply   
One of the most interesting things about the Papadopoulos Guilty Plea is the nature of the false statement. During his interview with the FBI, he admitted meeting with Russians who offered dirt on Clinton. The lie was his insistence that he met with the Russians months before he was ever considered for a position with the Trump campaign. In other words, the only lie he told was an effort to insulate the Trump campaign from his meetings.

Now, I ask you - why do you think Papadopoulos would lie about that one thing? Was he trying to protect himself or was he trying to protect someone else? It is beyond credibility to believe that he came up with his "story" without coordinating with the White House regarding the need to protect Trump. And you can be sure that Mueller asked him why he lied and what role the White House played in the false statements he made to the FBI.
Old     (fouroheight68)      Join Date: May 2006       10-30-2017, 3:56 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by racer808 View Post

It is not a crime to talk to a Russian. Or, in Papadopoulos’s case, attempting to talk with a Russian through an intermediary"
No it is a not a crime to talk to a Russian. Papadopoulos just plead guilty to actively soliciting the help of a foreign government, setting up meetings, discussing their opposition research, and lying to the FBI about when that occurred. He was already a foreign policy adviser when this collusion started.
Old     (racer808)      Join Date: Jan 2013       10-30-2017, 5:23 PM Reply   
My understanding is all his meeting requests were purely energy related with a final meeting being offered a meeting & one of his emails he sent back to the campaign said; "oh hey by the way, the Russians want to give us dirt". One of the people in the Trump circle reported the email cause it violated the Logan Act.

He's also reportedly cooperating & is a witness with Mueller, to who or what we don't know.
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       10-30-2017, 10:04 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by racer808 View Post
Getting your faux news from your facebook feeds, Ralph?
Twitter. With source docs, no commentary necessary.
Old     (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       10-31-2017, 8:26 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by racer808 View Post
Correct. And I haven't read whole lot but skimming around this morning I saw the charges may not stick because they were found while looking for ties to Russian meddling & the evidence gathered was far outside the scope of the warrant when they discovered the business dealings. Manaforts dirty & should do his time, but so far nothing ties him to Russian meddling. Or anyone else for that matter, as of now.
Meuller's team is basically an all-star team of federal prosecutors. They don't lose. How come? It's not because they are so good that they can never fail (though they are very very good)... but rather because prosecutors don't prosecute cases that aren't winners.

Which is all to say I very much doubt that there's an issue with the scope of the warrant. We'll see, but I'd be very surprised.
Old     (sidekicknicholas)      Join Date: Mar 2007       10-31-2017, 11:09 AM Reply   
Quote:
Papadopoulos just plead guilty to actively soliciting the help of a foreign government, setting up meetings, discussing their opposition research, and lying to the FBI about when that occurred. He was already a foreign policy adviser when this collusion started.
I think one more thing this does is provide some level of context to a few events:

1. In April, Papadopoulos went to London and discussed the hacked e-mails with the professor, a month before anyone else knew about them
Source - https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/30/u...os-russia.html
2. He tries to get the campaign to send someone there to deal with Putin. Manafort says that it will have to be someone low-level, not Trump.
Source - http://www.businessinsider.com/trump...-gates-2017-10
3. In July, they send Carter Page to Moscow. He makes a deal with Putin: Putin gets sanctions relief, Trump gets election help and a brokerage fee of the sale of the 19% stake in Rosneft (according to the dossier). Putin says he wants a personal confirmation from Trump that the deal is a go.
Source: http://www.businessinsider.com/carte...dossier-2017-1
4. On July 27, Trump looks into the camera and says, "Russia, if you're listening, I hope you're able to find Hillary Clinton's 30,000 e-mails." That was the 'yes.'
5. December: 19.5% of Rosneft vanishes in a sell-off to a group of anonymous shell corporations.

.... I honestly think his July 27th "Russia, if you're listening" was him talking directly to Putin and gang in a verbal handshake. Let's say that 19.5% of Rosneft was bought by a shell corporation ultimately controlled by Trump and his buddies, that's approximately $16 billion. If Trump succeeds in dropping sanctions and improving Russia's trade agreements, that could increase perhaps 5-10+ fold. That's $65-145+ billion in profit from a single source, and there is no reason for that you be the only source. The ability to make such sweeping changes to the economy of an entire country the size of Russia on the scale of global policies puts a single person in the position to control levels of wealth that are only really understandable on the scale of dictators of massive, wealthy countries.

Russia's oligarchical structure could easily allow someone to basically get their fingers in every major pie the country has to offer in exchange for the ability to create a massive economic boom. Which is easy, since their economy is currently crippled by largely a single thing: economic sanctions that are largely contingent upon US support.

All Trump would have to do to become the world's first Trillionaire and literally the richest man in all history would be to convince the Russian Oligarchy that he can get the sanctions lifted in exchange for a piece of the profits, and then carry through.
Old     (sidekicknicholas)      Join Date: Mar 2007       10-31-2017, 11:23 AM Reply   
I should note ... the above post is just how I personally think things went.
Old     (fouroheight68)      Join Date: May 2006       10-31-2017, 11:37 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by sidekicknicholas View Post
I should note ... the above post is just how I personally think things went.
Looks like you are also on Reddit!
Old     (sidekicknicholas)      Join Date: Mar 2007       10-31-2017, 11:38 AM Reply   
Quote:
Looks like you are also on Reddit!
You bet!

This timeline / series of events makes way too much sense vs. every other possibility I've seen.
Old     (pesos)      Join Date: Oct 2001       10-31-2017, 1:30 PM Reply   
LOL

http://money.cnn.com/2017/10/31/medi...age/index.html
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       11-01-2017, 12:07 AM Reply   
Manafort seems like a sweet dude. Why does trump sound himself with these people?

https://amp.businessinsider.com/paul...ukraine-2017-3
Old     (pesos)      Join Date: Oct 2001       11-01-2017, 12:17 AM Reply   
Wow. Those are some interesting texts.
Old     (fouroheight68)      Join Date: May 2006       11-01-2017, 9:19 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by ralph View Post
Manafort seems like a sweet dude. Why does trump sound himself with these people?

https://amp.businessinsider.com/paul...ukraine-2017-3
"Only the best people" -DJT
Old     (95sn)      Join Date: Sep 2005       11-01-2017, 4:15 PM Reply   
Concur, Nothing but the best.
http://www.nationalreview.com/articl...rupt-practices

Add Ryan Zienke, who thought he had that little $300M Puerto Rico deal all wrapped up. Whitefish stinks.
https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2017...ighbor-packing
Scott LLoyd, http://www.slate.com/articles/news_a...n_crusade.html
Jeff Sessions needs to get a buzz and chill a bit.
https://thinkprogress.org/papadopoul...-05fc02506be9/
Betsy DeVos, Scott Pruit, http://time.com/5004927/scott-pruitt...ory-committee/

Nothing but the best!
Old     (stevo8290)      Join Date: Sep 2008       11-02-2017, 12:53 PM Reply   
someone please explain to me why the proposed tax plan will increase middle class taxes.
Old     (stevo8290)      Join Date: Sep 2008       11-02-2017, 1:01 PM Reply   
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/02/u...publicans.html

As someone who pays taxes, it seems pretty good to me. Looks like they will have to cut spending, or just bet on this really stimulating our economy so in the end for the feds maybe it's six one way half a dozen the other. Except this way hopefully the economy grows and more people find themselves doing meaningful work and not dependent on the government. I like it!
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       11-02-2017, 2:43 PM Reply   
I like the plan, any simplification to the tax code is good imo.

Personally I would scrap the children rebate all together and make the first tax bracket 0% rather than 12% but overall seems to be an improvement on what you have. What is not stated is what the changes does to the overall tax take and how that affects the overall fiscal budget. The most important thing is the books balance and your not running at a budget deficit.
Old     (psudy)      Join Date: Dec 2003       11-02-2017, 3:02 PM Reply   
HA! That would require a whole lot of cutting crap people don't want to get rid of. Hopefully it will stimulate the economy and capture the offshore liquidity it says its suppose to do.
Old     (stevo8290)      Join Date: Sep 2008       11-02-2017, 3:44 PM Reply   
I think that's the idea. So will this thing have bipartisan support or nah?
Old     (95sn)      Join Date: Sep 2005       11-02-2017, 4:30 PM Reply   
They always say it will stimulate the economy and "trickle down" It didn't under Reagan and it didn't under Bush. The $$ stays at the trump...er I mean top. Then Demorats have to come in and raise taxes once the economy is in a tailspin. Lather, rinse, repeat.
Who benefits on eliminating the 5 M+ Estate/inheritance tax? Who benefits from a 15% drop in corp tax. Who benefits from repealing the Alternative min tax? To sell it as a win for the middle class is classic trump.
The stock market at all time highs...indicating business is booming...and they NEED a 15% tax cut? Seems like they are doing pretty well.
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       11-02-2017, 7:39 PM Reply   
Lol, Trump probably withdrew in protest because the treaty didn't include, beautiful clean coal. Lol
http://thehill.com/policy/internatio...ion-effort?amp
Old     (stevo8290)      Join Date: Sep 2008       11-02-2017, 9:55 PM Reply   
well I'm sure you guys are investors so tell me this. What will happen to your investments when their earnings improve? Will the stock go up? What will you do with that earned money? Maybe start a business? Maybe companies that went overseas will come back and open a huge location in your hometown? Maybe get a job there? Or maybe open a restaurant next door, or a drycleaning place, or whatever you can think of. Idk, am I totally alt right for thinking this way???
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       11-02-2017, 10:10 PM Reply   
Trickle down is all well and good but if the inequity between rich and poor gets too wide the poor say ****it and the system collapses. Nobody wants that, it's not good for anyone, rich or poor. Redistribution of wealth is extremely unpopular but it is necessary to keep the system stable.
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       11-02-2017, 10:14 PM Reply   
To make the system stable we need to take some wealth from the top and invest it in equality of opportunity for the bottom.
Old     (wakeslash)      Join Date: Sep 2017       11-02-2017, 10:25 PM Reply   
This thread is as entertaining as watching paint dry lol.
Old     (sidekicknicholas)      Join Date: Mar 2007       11-02-2017, 11:55 PM Reply   
Quote:
To make the system stable we need to take some wealth from the top and invest it in equality of opportunity for the bottom.
This x100. If a rich dude makes more money, he ain't spending it... its getting stashed away, because he is already buying everything he needs prior to the new influx of cash.

Quote:
What will happen to your investments when their earnings improve? Will the stock go up? What will you do with that earned money?
Its just like this, I'm by no means rich... my wife and I are sitting comfortably in the middle class.... if my investments do well, that **** just gets rolled to something longer term / safer. I'm not cashing that stuff out to buy more now, I'm trying to shave years off my retirement. I think this become the case more and more as you get further up the tax brackets. Folks below, or who are living paycheck to paycheck are gunna spend that ****.... and that will fuel the economy 10x more than the upper crust getting a break. This past year I've had some of my "risky" stocks do crazy well... not a penny is getting cashed out, all the gains are being moved to my self direct IRA. I'm doing everything I can to try and retire in my early 50's.

Last edited by sidekicknicholas; 11-02-2017 at 11:58 PM.
Old     (wake77)      Join Date: Jan 2009       11-03-2017, 4:10 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by racer808 View Post
Actually I wouldn't read much into this at all. They're being indicted on charges that happened long before Trump enters the picture. I know you're all hoping for it, but it isn't there.
Are you only reading half of the news on this? I mean honestly, unless you have your head stuffed up your rear, there is no way that you can say your second sentence has any truth to it.
Old     (sidekicknicholas)      Join Date: Mar 2007       11-03-2017, 7:17 AM Reply   
Quote:
They're being indicted on charges that happened long before Trump enters the picture. I know you're all hoping for it, but it isn't there.
Everything I see says this was a very strategic move by the special council and anything Russia related is coming later.

By limiting the initial Manafort charges to financial crimes and not including anything about Russia collusion, it would make it less likely that Trump would issue a pardon. The reasoning there was that pardoning egregious financial crimes is much harder to spin as a witch hunt than pardoning Manafort for advice he gave in the context of the political campaign.

Either way I think Jeremy is right here... if you don't think this is bad news from Trump and friends you haven't been paying enough attention.
Old     (stevo8290)      Join Date: Sep 2008       11-03-2017, 8:35 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by ralph View Post
Trickle down is all well and good but if the inequity between rich and poor gets too wide the poor say ****it and the system collapses. Nobody wants that, it's not good for anyone, rich or poor. Redistribution of wealth is extremely unpopular but it is necessary to keep the system stable.
Sure. I get that. Charity and taking care of your fellow man are great things, not disagreeing there and i think we should do more for these people and families. I guess a lot of us feel that the gov isn't doing a very good job of that and at the same time smothering the growth of the economy. I hope the tax bill passes, in the long run I think it will be very good for the lowest earners.
Old     (stevo8290)      Join Date: Sep 2008       11-03-2017, 8:42 AM Reply   
BTW if you are in California or new york or somewhere else with really high state taxes you're screwed. I guess those states will need to lower their state taxes and pay their fair share of federal taxes.
Old     (fly135)      Join Date: Jun 2004       11-03-2017, 10:17 AM Reply   
IIRC, California is one of those states that add more to the federal coffers than it takes. So the fed will really be soaking CA to pay for those red welfare states.
Old     (95sn)      Join Date: Sep 2005       11-03-2017, 1:48 PM Reply   
Yeah, I know I live in So Cal. State tax, Property tax, Unsecured property tax, Gas tax...highest taxed state in the nation (98.5% sure on that). I believe I read in the bill that up to $500K property tax can be written off. $500K doesn't buy the Average house anywhere near my neighborhood.
Quote:
Quote:
To make the system stable we need to take some wealth from the top and invest it in equality of opportunity for the bottom.
This x100. If a rich dude makes more money, he ain't spending it... its getting stashed away, because he is already buying everything he needs prior to the new influx of cash.

Quote:
What will happen to your investments when their earnings improve? Will the stock go up? What will you do with that earned money?
Its just like this, I'm by no means rich... my wife and I are sitting comfortably in the middle class.... if my investments do well, that **** just gets rolled to something longer term / safer. I'm not cashing that stuff out to buy more now, I'm trying to shave years off my retirement. I think this become the case more and more as you get further up the tax brackets. Folks below, or who are living paycheck to paycheck are gunna spend that ****.... and that will fuel the economy 10x more than the upper crust getting a break. This past year I've had some of my "risky" stocks do crazy well... not a penny is getting cashed out, all the gains are being moved to my self direct IRA. I'm doing everything I can to try and retire in my early 50's.
^^^Exactly, 100%. It does not shake down, never has, never will. Wait til you see the size of the bonuses on Wall Street (as if they are not already super-sized).
Where are the supporters of "Drain the Swamp"? How is this a "middle class" Christmas gift? Does middle class start at $10M net worth? Blind Faith should only be allowed in church or if you need a Ginger Baker/Eric Clapton/JackBruce fix What was the old hippie bumper sticker? ...Question Authority.
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