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Old     (markj)      Join Date: Apr 2005       07-20-2017, 10:48 AM Reply   
Hey, there is some hope after all.

http://nypost.com/2017/07/19/finally...s/amp/?ref=yfp
Old    deltahoosier            07-20-2017, 10:50 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by shawndoggy View Post
Can you succinctly (two sentences max) explain how money presently being sent to mexico will build a wall? That's all I'm asking for. I'll argue all of your other points later, but for now, just 'splain how $25B in remittances will turn into $25B of wall funding. How does ALL of that money get into the hands of the feds (not state and local governments)? How do the feds effectively tax that money at 100%?
No I will not, because that was NEVER the argument. That is what is stuck in your head. The argument is that many items will help pay for it and even if it does not completely fund it, it is still a huge win from the collusion standpoint of the democrats trying to change America's voting pattern. Not once in my original discussion say that $40 billion will come completely from stopping remitence or that 100% would make it back to the Feds.. I have laid out pretty clear how stopping the flow of illegals is good for local economies and how it is a benefit to Americans to stop the rigging of elections.
Old     (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       07-20-2017, 11:06 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by deltahoosier View Post
No I will not, because that was NEVER the argument. That is what is stuck in your head. The argument is that many items will help pay for it and even if it does not completely fund it, it is still a huge win from the collusion standpoint of the democrats trying to change America's voting pattern. Not once in my original discussion say that $40 billion will come completely from stopping remitence or that 100% would make it back to the Feds.. I have laid out pretty clear how stopping the flow of illegals is good for local economies and how it is a benefit to Americans to stop the rigging of elections.
You said it, not me. If you are conceding that you misspoke, it's all good. We all talk out our butts from time to time, me included.

Quote:
You realize Mexican nationals send over 25 billion a year to mexico? Stop a good portion of that and it pays for itself.
Old    deltahoosier            07-20-2017, 12:56 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by shawndoggy View Post
You said it, not me. If you are conceding that you misspoke, it's all good. We all talk out our butts from time to time, me included.
I also said:

Quote:
Get rid of illegals and the state of california saves over 15 billion a year (2003 data) in welfare, education and prisons.

If you generate electricity, it pays for itself at some point.
Just because you are not having the whole discussion and don't understand that once a wall is built the construction cost is done does not mean I am incorrect. The $25 billion is each and EVERY Year that flows to Mexico. Not like a one time payment for a construction contract (of course it would be many contracts over various years, however it is a single expenditure for the discussion). This money is gone every year.

If you keep money from flowing out of the country it does pay for itself. If it puts a dollar in the treasury then it takes 40 billion years to pay for itself. If you put 40 million in the treasury then it pays for itself in 1000 years. You put a billion in the treasury, then it takes 40 years to pay for itself. Save 10 billion a year then it does it in 4 years. It is just simple math. I don't even know how this is a discussion? It is an absolute fact that it would pay for itself. The question is how long? I say it pays for itself directly in about 40 years. I think the direct local economy will be even more dramatic and quicker.

Add in if it generates electricity, then the time frame potentially shrinks assuming solar is as great as everyone preaches. That is not even speaking of the local economy savings. How much federal aid has to go to localities for Illegals?

How is this even a discussion point?

At the end of the day, if you save any money at all, you will eventually pay off the cost. If you want to move money from another area such as foreign aid, that will help pay for it. Cut funding to the UN and that will help pay for it. Are you expecting a $40 billion check or something?
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       07-20-2017, 1:03 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by deltahoosier View Post
You do realize that there is expansive wall on the boarder right now right? The 10 dollar rope ladder is not want is being used. They are actually doing expensive mining operations to go underground.
How does a wall stop "expensive mining operation"?
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       07-20-2017, 1:06 PM Reply   
And i very much doubt the wall will be maintenance free so you can factor in that cost too into your payback time if you like
Old     (wake77)      Join Date: Jan 2009       07-20-2017, 1:41 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by ralph View Post
And i very much doubt the wall will be maintenance free so you can factor in that cost too into your payback time if you like
I heard they are going to build it out of Trex.

Lol at Delta for continuing to call things "fake news" even when Donald Trump admits to them.
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       07-20-2017, 1:45 PM Reply   
Trex isn't transparent. Got to watch out for bags of drugs falling on your noggin
Old     (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       07-20-2017, 2:14 PM Reply   
Delta is the state of California paying for the wall now? I'm down with that.
Old    deltahoosier            07-20-2017, 2:30 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by ralph View Post
How does a wall stop "expensive mining operation"?
It doesn't. However they use those for drugs mostly so your regular illegal is not coming through on those. The people are not using just rope ladders either. There are expanses in Texas that are not walled that are used. Every so often you hear of ranchers talking about it. Sometimes stories come out of them being murdered on their property by border crossers. If you make it hard enough, it will raise the chance of getting caught. If the chance of getting caught goes up, the smugglers will have to charge more. It will cut the casual crossings down.

Look law enforcement knows what they are dealing with on the border and where the hot spots are. If they say they need a wall in locations X, Y and Z I say there should be a plan and and a budget of some sort to apply that plan. Not saying run a lifetime budget like many of our programs, but give them the resources they need to get the job done. Will you stop every single person? No. Can you slow down much of the activity? Absolutely.
Old    deltahoosier            07-20-2017, 2:31 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by shawndoggy View Post
Delta is the state of California paying for the wall now? I'm down with that.
Now you are being obtuse. Discussion over.
Old    deltahoosier            07-20-2017, 2:33 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wake77 View Post
I heard they are going to build it out of Trex.

Lol at Delta for continuing to call things "fake news" even when Donald Trump admits to them.
Don't care. Democrats are not in control. Life is much better for Americans.
Old    deltahoosier            07-20-2017, 2:34 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by ralph View Post
And i very much doubt the wall will be maintenance free so you can factor in that cost too into your payback time if you like
Absolutely, especially if it is power generating. The fence that I see in California and Arizona looks pretty maintenance free.
Old     (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       07-20-2017, 2:38 PM Reply   
You are citing a bunch of collateral state and local economic effects to justify paying for the wall. If California saves money, that's great for California. But does that make the congressional delegations from Maine, Michigan and Montana want to authorize federal funding for it? I dunno. California's savings certainly aren't going to be invested dollar for dollar into a wall, that's for sure.

Will the wall reduce *federal* expenditures or increase *federal* revenues such that it "pays for itself?" I dunno, that's not my argument to make. But savings at the state and local level don't result in the feds "having" that money. So lets say with a wall BFE Arizona spends $20K a year less in city services. They aren't going to mail a check for that amount to the "build a wall fund."

Not to mention that all of this ignores the campaign promise that Mexico would build the wall.
Old     (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       07-20-2017, 2:40 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by deltahoosier View Post
Absolutely, especially if it is power generating. The fence that I see in California and Arizona looks pretty maintenance free.
Are there solar panels that can stand up to intentional abuse? Serious question. I'd think that they'd be too fragile to stand up to having rocks thrown at them. ICBW.

Solar panels definitely aren't maintenance free tho. They must be cleaned to maintain performance.
Old    deltahoosier            07-20-2017, 3:13 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by shawndoggy View Post
You are citing a bunch of collateral state and local economic effects to justify paying for the wall. If California saves money, that's great for California. But does that make the congressional delegations from Maine, Michigan and Montana want to authorize federal funding for it? I dunno. California's savings certainly aren't going to be invested dollar for dollar into a wall, that's for sure.

Will the wall reduce *federal* expenditures or increase *federal* revenues such that it "pays for itself?" I dunno, that's not my argument to make. But savings at the state and local level don't result in the feds "having" that money. So lets say with a wall BFE Arizona spends $20K a year less in city services. They aren't going to mail a check for that amount to the "build a wall fund."

Not to mention that all of this ignores the campaign promise that Mexico would build the wall.
Money that stays in the local economy that gets spent gets counted as income for each and every transaction that is make with it. On everyone of those transactions, the Federal government takes anywhere from what 9% to 15% or more? That is every transaction. Here is a good discussion on the velocity of money. At the end a single physical dollar generates approximately $1.68 in federal taxes over it's two year life span. Never mind state taxes. It would appear that paying off the wall could happen faster.

https://www.cointalk.com/threads/how...nerate.258444/

Quote:
ToughCOINS Dealer Member Moderator Velocity and turnover are synonymous. What is important to the generation of taxes, however, is the actual gain realized. In the case of wages paid, the entire amount is taxable after deductions and credits. For items sold, taxes are taken only from net profit after Cost of Goods Sold, overhead, expenses, other deductions and credits. Money has to change hands many times before a dollar creates a dollar in taxes paid. During 2012, there was an average "circulating" total of 3.2 trillion US dollars (isn't it shocking that out national debt is 5 to 6 times what is in circulation, or that our unfunded liabilities, estimated at 100 trillion dollars, are an astonishing 30 times that in circulation?). That 3.2 rtillion figure represents what is in bank vaults, cash machines, wallet, purses and mattresses. That does not include what people had in their bank accounts, as that had been lent out to borrowers or to other financial institutions, and was not physically at the banks for payment on demand. The IRS reported 2013 Federal Tax Revenue at 2.7 Trillion US dollars. That means each circulating dollar earned roughly 84 cents, on average over the course of 12 months. Different denominations are spent with different frequency and, therefore, see varying durations of circulation before being replaced because of excessive wear. A good estimate of average circulating life for a composite of all denominations of US paper money is 24 months. Thus, each US dollar earns roughly $1.68 in taxes before it is destroyed. (Cited from: https://www.cointalk.com/threads/how...nerate.258444/)
While I agree that eastern states may not be motivated to pay for a wall, I bet many boarder states are interested. I bet many red states are interested just from the collusion on elections aspect.
Old    deltahoosier            07-20-2017, 3:24 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by shawndoggy View Post
Are there solar panels that can stand up to intentional abuse? Serious question. I'd think that they'd be too fragile to stand up to having rocks thrown at them. ICBW.

Solar panels definitely aren't maintenance free tho. They must be cleaned to maintain performance.
This is what I was thinking about. I bet they would just beat the crap out of it unless you had a secondary wall. At the same time, much of the rest of the world has serious weather including softball sized hail so there that solar panels need to stand up too. Can a human chuck something at a wall as hard as a softball chunk of being dropped from 30,000 feet?

As are far as maintenance. I agree it will need a staff for that, however the line they are selling people for home solar is just let us slap it on and start collecting lifetime checks. I am pretty sure it is none of that.
Old    deltahoosier            07-20-2017, 3:28 PM Reply   
As far as Mexico paying for it? Semantics. The amount of cash sent back to Mexico is so large that they track it and it is the 4th leading import of money just behind their huge oil industry. You think if we start pulling off $5 billion or what ever amount off that money, that the Mexicans are not paying for it? They are absolutely paying for it if they are counting it as income.
Old     (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       07-20-2017, 3:34 PM Reply   
Is it only remittances to Mexico you are worried about Delta?
Old    deltahoosier            07-20-2017, 4:13 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by shawndoggy View Post
Is it only remittances to Mexico you are worried about Delta?
No. That discussion is it is part of the bigger equation. The remittance to mexico discussion is a sub thread of the cost of the wall coupled by how many taxes we pay to support the amount of illegals in the state and then all the crazy tax schemes that have been passed to increase the state budget to compensate.

I am extremely worried about the voter collusion. Artificially piling in socialist minded voters into the country is not good. California now has a super majority with the democrats in control. Majority are socialist minded and the tax increase they passed as soon as they got it is just the beginning. They also allow un-elected boards levy regulation as well. They have changed how illegals are counted in the population and have opened them up to less restriction. The illegal immigrants that are coming in such masses that they really are not assimulating. They will not even learn English in many cases. I can go into stores now and not even hear English being spoken. Only time they will speak English is when it is time to ring up and then return to Spanish. While it is not the worst thing in the world, it just goes to show how much influence it is having over our state and the lack of worry that Americans would be offended by such practices.

I guess the question I would have, do you want to be heavily influenced by Mexican interests or American interests? I would say Mexico is a moderate failure on the world stage. Why would we want to replicate that?
Old     (95sn)      Join Date: Sep 2005       07-20-2017, 4:23 PM Reply   
I would actually prefer it if Sessions quit. He is the guy doing all the heavy lifting for trump, things like civil forfeiture, and the harsh drug sentencing. He is against illegal and legal immigration and legal marijuana. He is just way too conservative for most of the country. I believe he was the guy that said "Good people do not smoke marijuana". Trump has adopted this guys 1950's mentality on issues. Better gone.
Trump is such a child, every time he opens his mouth he says something stupid or he tweets something that causes more problems for the himself and the WH. I can only imagine what he said to Putin in their 2nd little dinner meeting. The one with only he, Putin and Putins' translator. Thats a winning combo if I ever heard of one.
Way to go on that Repeal and Replace debacle. Trump worked super hard coming down to the wire to get this done. I heard of the 60 tweets he had over the weekend 6 were regarding healthcare...of course a dozen were about the womens golf tournament he was attending at his country club that weekend.
Old     (fly135)      Join Date: Jun 2004       07-20-2017, 4:52 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by 95sn View Post
Trump worked super hard coming down to the wire to get this done.
Throwing tantrums at his age is hard work.
Old     (pesos)      Join Date: Oct 2001       07-20-2017, 5:21 PM Reply   
Trump files to hire 70 foreign workers because he "can't find Americans to do the jobs"

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.65e0194395c5
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       07-20-2017, 7:18 PM Reply   
Lol, in made in America week no less. To be fair i wouldn't want to work for him either with his history of stiffing average Joes. Tired of so much winning yet?
Old    deltahoosier            07-20-2017, 7:19 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by pesos View Post
Trump files to hire 70 foreign workers because he "can't find Americans to do the jobs"

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.65e0194395c5
Sounds like some American's better get down there and apply for those temp jobs. If not, don't bitch in that area that they can not find work.
Old    deltahoosier            07-20-2017, 7:20 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by ralph View Post
Lol, in made in America week no less. To be fair i wouldn't want to work for him either with his history of stiffing average Joes. Tired of so much winning yet?
fake news...... Trump is not the hiring manager.
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       07-20-2017, 7:35 PM Reply   
It's not news, fake or otherwise, I just find it funny.
Old     (wake77)      Join Date: Jan 2009       07-20-2017, 7:47 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by deltahoosier View Post
It doesn't. However they use those for drugs mostly so your regular illegal is not coming through on those. The people are not using just rope ladders either. There are expanses in Texas that are not walled that are used. Every so often you hear of ranchers talking about it. Sometimes stories come out of them being murdered on their property by border crossers. If you make it hard enough, it will raise the chance of getting caught. If the chance of getting caught goes up, the smugglers will have to charge more. It will cut the casual crossings down.

Look law enforcement knows what they are dealing with on the border and where the hot spots are. If they say they need a wall in locations X, Y and Z I say there should be a plan and and a budget of some sort to apply that plan. Not saying run a lifetime budget like many of our programs, but give them the resources they need to get the job done. Will you stop every single person? No. Can you slow down much of the activity? Absolutely.
Look man, while a wall would be huge to Trump and his backer's egos, it would do little to accomplish anything else (except to maybe displace the wildlife that doesn't give a damn whether they are in Mexico or the US) unless there are armed guards that will shoot any one that attempts to cross. Being killed trying to scale the Berlin wall, Palestinian/Israeli wall, etc. is what made them effective, not the physical wall itself. That's why those comparison's drove me crazy during his campaign. Drug kingpins and their gangs have access to rocket launchers and other explosives that would have no problem putting large holes in the wall.
Old    deltahoosier            07-21-2017, 10:53 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wake77 View Post
Look man, while a wall would be huge to Trump and his backer's egos, it would do little to accomplish anything else (except to maybe displace the wildlife that doesn't give a damn whether they are in Mexico or the US) unless there are armed guards that will shoot any one that attempts to cross. Being killed trying to scale the Berlin wall, Palestinian/Israeli wall, etc. is what made them effective, not the physical wall itself. That's why those comparison's drove me crazy during his campaign. Drug kingpins and their gangs have access to rocket launchers and other explosives that would have no problem putting large holes in the wall.
You would have to be ballsy to shoot a rocket at American soil and not expect to die.

The whole notion that you guy are bitching about why is the wall not done is stupid. It will never be a whole wall around Mexico. Law enforcement needs help. They know where the bad spots are and they need some resources and a budget to do so. To suggest it was a wall for everywhere is a little high expectations even if you are interpreting the president as saying that. It is all hyperbole.
Old     (95sn)      Join Date: Sep 2005       07-21-2017, 1:48 PM Reply   
Quote:
As far as Mexico paying for it? Semantics.
you cant keep moving the line. It was pretty clear during every speech trump made who was paying.


Quote:
The whole notion that you guy are bitching about why is the wall not done is stupid. It will never be a whole wall around Mexico. Law enforcement needs help. They know where the bad spots are and they need some resources and a budget to do so. To suggest it was a wall for everywhere is a little high expectations even if you are interpreting the president as saying that. It is all hyperbole
"it will never be a whole wall... moving the line again and there was zero hyperbole when this was a campaign promise. I do agree about listening to law enforcement, from what i read...they're requesting more agents and automation...cameras and the like.
Old    deltahoosier            07-21-2017, 1:57 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by 95sn View Post
you cant keep moving the line. It was pretty clear during every speech trump made who was paying.




"it will never be a whole wall... moving the line again and there was zero hyperbole when this was a campaign promise. I do agree about listening to law enforcement, from what i read...they're requesting more agents and automation...cameras and the like.
And I was very clear. You take away several billion dollars of remittance, then mexico is paying for it. Pretty clear if you ask me. \

It is not moving the line. Did Trump say a wall form sea to shining sea? Sounds like you are putting expectations on what you wanted to hear. Executive puts out the policy. The Jr Execs put together the plan. It really is not that hard. Only people who want to hold on to every little syllable are the same type of kids that got beat up in school for being "that kid". Just stop with the literal translations of every freaking word. The American public spoke. he was elected. He has laid down a general agenda. Let's see what they come up with. Measure for success or failure then we can make claims. nothing moves fast in government. Right now you or anyone else has a metric for measurement.
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       07-21-2017, 2:37 PM Reply   
Uh huh. Got lots ticked off his first 100 days contract with the American voter
Repeal Ohbuma care
Deport some bad hombres
Take a Dump on nafta
Freeze some federal workers
Swamp drainer 5 year ban for lobbiests
Solve terroism
Be nasty to Ghina currency fraudsters.

Oh wait, i got confused, hes done none of that stuff. It's hard, who knew. Ha ha. Fake news!
Old     (deneng)      Join Date: Feb 2005       07-21-2017, 3:00 PM Reply   
Love the fact that Trump will let Obamacare fail. Republicans did not create Obamacare. The democrats did. Why should the republicans fix it on their own? It was created to fail in order to get single payer and have the government pay for it. I say let it fail. Lets make the liberals beg to fix it. Once we take it apart and repair it watch the liberal rats scurry . Sounds like a liberal to blame the right for their mess. Our previous system was not all that bad, and now we have the Obama legacy to fix. Let it fail.
The swamp is really deep full of liberals and republicans.
Old     (deneng)      Join Date: Feb 2005       07-21-2017, 3:34 PM Reply   
Hang in there Ted. I think we may have a winner.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...n-in-ted-cruz/
Can we fix the Obama mess?
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       07-21-2017, 8:37 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by deneng View Post
Love the fact that Trump will let Obamacare fail.
You love the fact millions of people will lose their Healthcare and have to endure unnecessary suffering due to government incompetence? You truely are a strange cat.

Quote:
Originally Posted by deneng View Post
Republicans did not create Obamacare. The democrats did. Why should the republicans fix it on their own?
Well because they are in government and is their responsibility to look after the citizens. If Obamacare fails it will leave millions of people worse off. Just saying not our problem is just another example of childish simplification of a complex problem. Yes the ACA has problems but they are fixable without tearing it down.

The reality is the republicans have control of both houses but yet again fail to repeal and replace the ACA, Trump is not as good a negotiator as he would have you believe. Incompetent.
Old     (deneng)      Join Date: Feb 2005       07-21-2017, 9:22 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by ralph View Post
You love the fact millions of people will lose their Healthcare and have to endure unnecessary suffering due to government incompetence? You truely are a strange cat.


Well because they are in government and is their responsibility to look after the citizens. If Obamacare fails it will leave millions of people worse off. Just saying not our problem is just another example of childish simplification of a complex problem. Yes the ACA has problems but they are fixable without tearing it down.

The reality is the republicans have control of both houses but yet again fail to repeal and replace the ACA, Trump is not as good a negotiator as he would have you believe. Incompetent.
HaHaHaHa. You are truly amazing. Who promised that everyone would save thousands of dollars and that they could keep their doctors? You are right the lefts incompetence and shoving this piece of crap down the publics throat. Which side refuses to take part in fixing this giant turd? Your blaming the right it has failed . No bring it on. The left created it. The left refused to participate and fix it because they love it so much. Let it fail. That will force the left to participate since they would rather let it fail then fix it now. Now who is evil?
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       07-21-2017, 11:03 PM Reply   
If the republicans were united then they wouldn't need the left, they control both houses. The fact they can't agree Trumpcare is better than ACA shows how poor the replacement plan is. I don't think any side is evil, just disfunctional/incompetent.
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       07-22-2017, 12:17 AM Reply   
I'm going to miss Spicer but the mooch looks like a Goomba used car salesman, I've got high hopes he will be as entertaining.
Old     (pesos)      Join Date: Oct 2001       07-22-2017, 12:25 AM Reply   
Rats starting to flee the ship. First Spicey (who will certainly have some interesting tales to tell in the book he's been furiously writing in his spare time) and now Trump's top personal lawyer calls it quits as he "disagreed with the alleged strategy of Mr Trump's lawyers to discredit or limit the team directing the investigation."
Old     (pesos)      Join Date: Oct 2001       07-22-2017, 12:31 AM Reply   
Attached Images
 
Old     (deneng)      Join Date: Feb 2005       07-22-2017, 8:08 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by ralph View Post
Uh huh. Got lots ticked off his first 100 days contract with the American voter
Repeal Ohbuma care
Deport some bad hombres
Take a Dump on nafta
Freeze some federal workers
Swamp drainer 5 year ban for lobbiests
Solve terroism
Be nasty to Ghina currency fraudsters.

Oh wait, i got confused, hes done none of that stuff. It's hard, who knew. Ha ha. Fake news!
Liberals are Ignorant or Evil
https://www.facebook.com/TheAmerican...8843579327456/
Old     (deneng)      Join Date: Feb 2005       07-22-2017, 8:34 AM Reply   
MAGA
https://www.facebook.com/agt/videos/10155178398409760/
Old     (deneng)      Join Date: Feb 2005       07-22-2017, 8:59 AM Reply   

Evil left refuses to fix this ACA . I mean UCA.
Old     (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       07-22-2017, 9:45 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by deneng View Post
The left created it. The left refused to participate and fix it because they love it so much. Let it fail. That will force the left to participate since they would rather let it fail then fix it now. Now who is evil?
Dennis when o-care was adopted, the republicans r.e.f.u.s.e.d. to participate. They were invited and refused.

Maybe you can remind us when the republicans invited the democrats to participate in the fix? The fact that we are where we are (reconciliation) shows precisely that the republicans chose to go this alone. They don't have 60 votes but they do have 50+VP, so that's the route they chose. Can't blame the dems for this F-up.

And I for one would love to see a bipartisan bill where the moderates from both parties get together and cut the legs out from the crazy wings of both parties. Let Cruz, Sanders, Warren and Lee all hang out in the wind.
Old     (deneng)      Join Date: Feb 2005       07-22-2017, 11:48 AM Reply   
Once again the liberals are either ignorant or evil.
The right was closed out and even part of the left. This all when on behind closed doors. The right never had the chance. Obama met with big pharma and insurance and promised alot but just like his promises to the American public of lower premiums and you can keep your doctors it never happened. Obama promised that costs of drugs would come down. The government would cover costs to insurance if it started to fail. Electronic medical records were so suppost to make caring for the patients more efficient. Doctors spend more time with medical records now and get paid less per patient. One doctor told me the insurance company told him that he could still make the same income all he had to do was take twice as many patients.
The left refuses to participate now. Trump has publically asked them over and over. Your evil lies are not going to fly anymore. Watch and see all the left rats scurry when it fails. Don't worry though the UFA is great right? It was all based upon the premises of preexisting conditions. What is preexisting condition?
Old     (deneng)      Join Date: Feb 2005       07-22-2017, 1:06 PM Reply   
Amarica will not take it anymore. CNN Fake News is what is destroying America.
Live now. https://www.facebook.com/Breitbart/v...9527745105354/
Old     (deneng)      Join Date: Feb 2005       07-22-2017, 1:15 PM Reply   
Donald Trump has only one thing on his mind MAGA. America get your s*%, together and stand behind what he is trying to do in order to MAGA
https://www.facebook.com/TyrusSmash/...7598802971669/
Old     (pesos)      Join Date: Oct 2001       07-22-2017, 7:25 PM Reply   
Dennie, you're adorable! This republican senate can't get its head out of Mitch McTurtle's ass and even figure out what it wants to do. Quite clear they only know how to obstruct and don't have a clue how to actually get anything done.
Old     (wake77)      Join Date: Jan 2009       07-22-2017, 7:54 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by deneng View Post
Once again the liberals are either ignorant or evil.
The right was closed out and even part of the left. This all when on behind closed doors. The right never had the chance. Obama met with big pharma and insurance and promised alot but just like his promises to the American public of lower premiums and you can keep your doctors it never happened. Obama promised that costs of drugs would come down. The government would cover costs to insurance if it started to fail. Electronic medical records were so suppost to make caring for the patients more efficient. Doctors spend more time with medical records now and get paid less per patient. One doctor told me the insurance company told him that he could still make the same income all he had to do was take twice as many patients.
The left refuses to participate now. Trump has publically asked them over and over. Your evil lies are not going to fly anymore. Watch and see all the left rats scurry when it fails. Don't worry though the UFA is great right? It was all based upon the premises of preexisting conditions. What is preexisting condition?
So basically, you are talking out of your ass and a la Trump, you are making another excuse why Trump cannot get a GOP-majority House and Senate to pass a Repeal/Replace bill.
Old     (deuce)      Join Date: Mar 2002       07-22-2017, 10:11 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by pesos View Post
Dennie, you're adorable.
I spit my bourbon. Thank you, Wes, added to my evening.
Old     (deneng)      Join Date: Feb 2005       07-23-2017, 8:01 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by pesos View Post
Dennie, you're adorable! This republican senate can't get its head out of Mitch McTurtle's ass and even figure out what it wants to do. Quite clear they only know how to obstruct and don't have a clue how to actually get anything done.
Sorry Wes I am married and i don't swing that way so all the best to you in that arena. Who is obstructing the progress of the country? Can you define preexisting condition? That is the number one reason that Obamacare was going to be so great. Tell us how that turned out.
Old     (deneng)      Join Date: Feb 2005       07-23-2017, 8:16 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wake77 View Post
So basically, you are talking out of your ass and a la Trump, you are making another excuse why Trump cannot get a GOP-majority House and Senate to pass a Repeal/Replace bill.
No dumb#&it I am pointing out that the left is screwed if socialized medicine fails. Man Trump really f*%?#3 things up. Hillary was going to win the election and finish continue with globalization of America. Too bad for you Commie..

Last edited by deneng; 07-23-2017 at 8:25 AM.
Old     (wake77)      Join Date: Jan 2009       07-23-2017, 6:32 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by deneng View Post
No dumb#&it I am pointing out that the left is screwed if socialized medicine fails. Man Trump really f*%?#3 things up. Hillary was going to win the election and finish continue with globalization of America. Too bad for you Commie..
Guys like you take up for the Russians so maybe you should be more careful in tossing that "Commie" term around. If the VA or Medicare "fail" that will be a GOP problem.
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       07-24-2017, 3:42 AM Reply   
So if Trump gets busted doing something fishy he can just pardon himself? Is that how it works over there? Ha ha, democracy at its finest
Old     (deneng)      Join Date: Feb 2005       07-24-2017, 9:31 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wake77 View Post
Guys like you take up for the Russians so maybe you should be more careful in tossing that "Commie" term around. If the VA or Medicare "fail" that will be a GOP problem.
Wake 77. Do they call you that because you landed on your head after hitting a 77 inch double-up?
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       07-24-2017, 2:15 PM Reply   
Dennie, stick to your top notch logical arguments, comedy is not your gift.
Old     (95sn)      Join Date: Sep 2005       07-24-2017, 3:27 PM Reply   
Trump already talking pardons? Why pardon talk if this is all a witchhunt? Whenever times get difficult this born with a silver spoon child walks. Just like bailing from a business with a BK, this is trump MO. Anyone tired of all the winning yet?
Old     (deneng)      Join Date: Feb 2005       07-24-2017, 10:41 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wake77 View Post
Guys like you take up for the Russians so maybe you should be more careful in tossing that "Commie" term around. If the VA or Medicare "fail" that will be a GOP problem.
Just like a dem when there is a serious issue then its sombody else problem. Sorry but this is not about transgender insecurities so not our problem.
Old     (wake77)      Join Date: Jan 2009       07-25-2017, 6:52 AM Reply   
How can Trump backers justify his tweets concerning Jeff Sessions? He is condemning Sessions for not going after Hillary, but in November, Trump said he would not pursue charges against Hillary. Instead of simply firing Sessions, Trump is acting like a vindictive teenager. Did Sessions not offer to resign last month? Why didn't Trump just accept his resignation? Now he wants to bully him on social media. It seems as though Rex Tillerson is not happy with Trump's behavior and has mentioned stepping down.

Trump holds a rally and instead of trumpeting his achievements (which are very few at this point) he starts going after Hillary. Uhhh, the gd campaign ended over six months ago. And then he makes provocative comments at this rally. Now mind you, this was a Boy Scout jamboree. This has to be the biggest *****show on the planet.
Old     (deneng)      Join Date: Feb 2005       07-25-2017, 7:47 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wake77 View Post
How can Trump backers justify his tweets concerning Jeff Sessions? He is condemning Sessions for not going after Hillary, but in November, Trump said he would not pursue charges against Hillary. Instead of simply firing Sessions, Trump is acting like a vindictive teenager. Did Sessions not offer to resign last month? Why didn't Trump just accept his resignation? Now he wants to bully him on social media. It seems as though Rex Tillerson is not happy with Trump's behavior and has mentioned stepping down.

Trump holds a rally and instead of trumpeting his achievements (which are very few at this point) he starts going after Hillary. Uhhh, the gd campaign ended over six months ago. And then he makes provocative comments at this rally. Now mind you, this was a Boy Scout jamboree. This has to be the biggest *****show on the planet.
Are you making your own news Wake 77? You have been watching too much fake news. You have your unrelated facts trying to justify an idiots opinion. Better luck next time chump!
Old     (wake77)      Join Date: Jan 2009       07-25-2017, 11:35 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by deneng View Post
Are you making your own news Wake 77? You have been watching too much fake news. You have your unrelated facts trying to justify an idiots opinion. Better luck next time chump!
Tell me what is "fake" about what I posted. Everything I posted is FACT. You are a delusional nut that chooses to treat anything negative reported about Trump as "fake news". Be your own person, quit being a Trump puppet that simply echos what the almighty says.

Last edited by wake77; 07-25-2017 at 11:38 AM.
Old     (95sn)      Join Date: Sep 2005       07-25-2017, 4:51 PM Reply   
More exits, not Sessions (As much as trump is pushing him, which BTW is really strange) the head of Government Ethics quits.
http://www.npr.org/2017/07/06/535781...-to-be-tougher

Kushner gets questioned and low and behold...discloses another meeting with .....noooooo... the Russians. I believe he will be questioned under oath next time. More smoke from the silly witch hunt.
Old    deltahoosier            07-26-2017, 10:57 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wake77 View Post
Guys like you take up for the Russians so maybe you should be more careful in tossing that "Commie" term around. If the VA or Medicare "fail" that will be a GOP problem.
What are you talking about. Obama already told you the Russians are our friends when he told Romney that his calling Russia one of the biggest foes is a return to 1980's politics.
Old    deltahoosier            07-26-2017, 10:59 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wake77 View Post
How can Trump backers justify his tweets concerning Jeff Sessions? He is condemning Sessions for not going after Hillary, but in November, Trump said he would not pursue charges against Hillary. Instead of simply firing Sessions, Trump is acting like a vindictive teenager. Did Sessions not offer to resign last month? Why didn't Trump just accept his resignation? Now he wants to bully him on social media. It seems as though Rex Tillerson is not happy with Trump's behavior and has mentioned stepping down.

Trump holds a rally and instead of trumpeting his achievements (which are very few at this point) he starts going after Hillary. Uhhh, the gd campaign ended over six months ago. And then he makes provocative comments at this rally. Now mind you, this was a Boy Scout jamboree. This has to be the biggest *****show on the planet.
Obama and you guys on this board blamed Bush for at least 6 years......
Old    deltahoosier            07-26-2017, 11:00 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wake77 View Post
Tell me what is "fake" about what I posted. Everything I posted is FACT. You are a delusional nut that chooses to treat anything negative reported about Trump as "fake news". Be your own person, quit being a Trump puppet that simply echos what the almighty says.
Quit being a Hillary and Obama puppet and echo everything their political machine says. There fixed.....
Old    deltahoosier            07-26-2017, 11:03 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by 95sn View Post
More exits, not Sessions (As much as trump is pushing him, which BTW is really strange) the head of Government Ethics quits.
http://www.npr.org/2017/07/06/535781...-to-be-tougher

Kushner gets questioned and low and behold...discloses another meeting with .....noooooo... the Russians. I believe he will be questioned under oath next time. More smoke from the silly witch hunt.
Oh no. Someone spoke to the Russians. Don't care. Did not see this kind of issues when Obama was caught on the hot mike with Putin or when Hillary and Obama blamed a video for a attack and arrested a citizen over their lie. Peoples fake outrage is part of the problem
Old     (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       07-26-2017, 11:04 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by deltahoosier View Post
Obama and you guys on this board blamed Bush for at least 6 years......

Not the right comparison. You need to show that Obama kept going after his OG opponent (McCain) post election. Or that Bush II went after Gore.
Old    deltahoosier            07-26-2017, 12:40 PM Reply   
Bush II did not go after Gore nor do I remember him going after Clinton, Obama certainly did go after Bush. I can see Trump going after Hillary at this point. Her and Obama set this whole conspiracy up and Clinton was not just an opponent, she was part of the administration.
Old     (wake77)      Join Date: Jan 2009       07-26-2017, 1:10 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by deltahoosier View Post
Obama and you guys on this board blamed Bush for at least 6 years......
Different comparison, but what else is new? Obama wasn't gloating in the fact that he beat McCain/Romney months after the election. Does it ever become tiresome for you? Suspending your morals in an effort to defend Trump's missteps? I find it puzzling that you think Trump can do no wrong.
Old     (wake77)      Join Date: Jan 2009       07-26-2017, 1:11 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by deltahoosier View Post
Bush II did not go after Gore nor do I remember him going after Clinton, Obama certainly did go after Bush. I can see Trump going after Hillary at this point. Her and Obama set this whole conspiracy up and Clinton was not just an opponent, she was part of the administration.
She wasn't "part of the administration" after Obama was reelected. You're 0-2 so far today.
Old     (wake77)      Join Date: Jan 2009       07-26-2017, 1:13 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by deltahoosier View Post
Quit being a Hillary and Obama puppet and echo everything their political machine says. There fixed.....
Okay, go to my post that Dennis called "Fake News" and identify any part of it that is not true.
Old    deltahoosier            07-26-2017, 1:49 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wake77 View Post
Different comparison, but what else is new? Obama wasn't gloating in the fact that he beat McCain/Romney months after the election. Does it ever become tiresome for you? Suspending your morals in an effort to defend Trump's missteps? I find it puzzling that you think Trump can do no wrong.
Why would it be tiresome for me? I don't pay attention to it but maybe for this forum a few times a week and even then the only thing I am paying attention to is your American hating hypocrisy. You seem to be triggered by it. I point out that you did not care when your guy did it but now you do? What does that say about you? You are no better than a Jerry Springer viewer.

Trump has always been a cornball when speaking. That is why he was not my guy. Between him and any of the uber leftist American last democrats that we have, he is my guy in that context. Everyone knows who he is. He is a corn ball former New York democrat who gets down to facts when it comes to global warming scams, is American First, and seems willing to listen to those around him. I am OK with that considering all outcomes. Now let the man do his job.
Old    deltahoosier            07-26-2017, 1:50 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wake77 View Post
She wasn't "part of the administration" after Obama was reelected. You're 0-2 so far today.
Stick to math as you contradicted yourself in your own argument. I never had a qualifier as to when. Fact remains. She was.
Old    deltahoosier            07-26-2017, 1:52 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wake77 View Post
Okay, go to my post that Dennis called "Fake News" and identify any part of it that is not true.
Not worried about the facts of your statements. You are just as big of a puppet as you say he is. If the democrats through the press did not make up this Russian narrative, what would you be complaining about? Talking about lack of independent thinking.....
Old     (95sn)      Join Date: Sep 2005       07-26-2017, 4:52 PM Reply   
trump is not America first, he is strictly trump first. He is not (as far as I can tell) listening to those around him, especially his 5 or 6 personal attys. Unless of course those around him told him to deny emphatically about ANY russian involvement by his staff, fire the head of the FBI, Lie regularly, Twitter badger the AG, go all campaign speech on 30 or 40,000 boy scouts...
He does so much dumb stuff, they all run together. He seems really fixated on the election 6 months ago (perhaps because he was having fun campaigning)... and blaming anyone and everyone but himself. Must be fun being married to a guy like that. When facts surface, he instinctively moves the line in the sand and blames someone else.
Seriously, if you want to fire Sessions, dont be such a little wuss and fire the guy. Shenanigans.
Old     (wake77)      Join Date: Jan 2009       07-26-2017, 5:26 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by deltahoosier View Post
Why would it be tiresome for me? I don't pay attention to it but maybe for this forum a few times a week and even then the only thing I am paying attention to is your American hating hypocrisy. You seem to be triggered by it. I point out that you did not care when your guy did it but now you do? What does that say about you? You are no better than a Jerry Springer viewer.

Trump has always been a cornball when speaking. That is why he was not my guy. Between him and any of the uber leftist American last democrats that we have, he is my guy in that context. Everyone knows who he is. He is a corn ball former New York democrat who gets down to facts when it comes to global warming scams, is American First, and seems willing to listen to those around him. I am OK with that considering all outcomes. Now let the man do his job.
"American hating"? Because I don't like the man that occupies the WH? You should really speak of "hypocrisy". I don't think you know the definition of the word.

"Do his job"? He is more fascinated with personally insulting the guy he hand-selected for AG on Twitter than he is about "doing his job". At the Boy Scout rally, he was more interested about beating his chest than showing a bit of humility. "Willing to listen to those around him"? You have to be joking.
Old     (wake77)      Join Date: Jan 2009       07-26-2017, 5:29 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by deltahoosier View Post
Not worried about the facts of your statements. You are just as big of a puppet as you say he is. If the democrats through the press did not make up this Russian narrative, what would you be complaining about? Talking about lack of independent thinking.....
My post made no mention of Russia.

There is nothing "made up" concerning the "Russian narrative". The only unknowns are if Trump colluded or received any Russian financial contributions. It is not made up, fake news, whatever. There is an active investigation in progress and Trump's actions are those of a guilty party.
Old    deltahoosier            07-26-2017, 5:48 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by 95sn View Post
trump is not America first, he is strictly trump first. He is not (as far as I can tell) listening to those around him, especially his 5 or 6 personal attys. Unless of course those around him told him to deny emphatically about ANY russian involvement by his staff, fire the head of the FBI, Lie regularly, Twitter badger the AG, go all campaign speech on 30 or 40,000 boy scouts...
He does so much dumb stuff, they all run together. He seems really fixated on the election 6 months ago (perhaps because he was having fun campaigning)... and blaming anyone and everyone but himself. Must be fun being married to a guy like that. When facts surface, he instinctively moves the line in the sand and blames someone else.
Seriously, if you want to fire Sessions, dont be such a little wuss and fire the guy. Shenanigans.
Don't really care about the squabbling. He backed us out of the TPP and the Paris agreement. He could do nothing else and I would call his presidency a huge success.
Old    deltahoosier            07-26-2017, 5:54 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wake77 View Post
"American hating"? Because I don't like the man that occupies the WH? You should really speak of "hypocrisy". I don't think you know the definition of the word.

"Do his job"? He is more fascinated with personally insulting the guy he hand-selected for AG on Twitter than he is about "doing his job". At the Boy Scout rally, he was more interested about beating his chest than showing a bit of humility. "Willing to listen to those around him"? You have to be joking.
I call you America hating because of the people you support and their policies toward trying to turn America over of the UN by every shady little enovro-nazi treaty they can get their hands on.

You disliked the "man in the white house" before he was elected. The fact he has an "R" next to his name automatically makes him someone you dislike in the white house. He can tweet and still go to meetings. You don't know anything that goes on in the meetings. Everything he says publicly, you will never "like" so why does it matter what you say he is?
Old    deltahoosier            07-26-2017, 6:02 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wake77 View Post
My post made no mention of Russia.

There is nothing "made up" concerning the "Russian narrative". The only unknowns are if Trump colluded or received any Russian financial contributions. It is not made up, fake news, whatever. There is an active investigation in progress and Trump's actions are those of a guilty party.
Like Hillary smashing her phones and hard drives? The DNC IT guy arrested leaving the country just recently? The FBI finally getting their hands on the smashed DNC hard drives that the DNC would not let the FBI have access to after making claims they were hacked by the Russians however did not allow an independent review of said hacking by the FBI?

You mean those actions of a guilty party? If the truth is just so appealing to you, why are you not posting and feigning your outrage of the DNC??? You and others bitching on this board and in the media are not interested in any truth. You and them are interested in narrative. I have a few choice words that describe people like you.
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