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Old     (tripsw)      Join Date: May 2006       09-19-2014, 4:57 PM Reply   
OK Mastercraft pulled their sponsoring a year early. Shapiro says in his interview that PWT is not what it should be and I think the majority of (pro) riders will agree.

What should the pro tour look like then?
In my opinion the coolest (pro) competitions are Park's Double or Nothing and Alliance's Less than 5 comp.
According to Darin going big should be a factor, and I agree. More than that, I think originality is lacking. Would love to see more Bob Soven-ish riding in comps!

Ideas?
Old     (moto817)      Join Date: Jan 2011       09-19-2014, 5:02 PM Reply   
Maybe a double up comp at Bass Lake ?
Old     (dyost)      Join Date: Jan 2007       09-19-2014, 8:38 PM Reply   
They definitely gotta find a way to change the judging to force the riders to mix it up.
I watched a few of the PWT vids posted on here and the top three do pretty much the EXACT same run every time. I can only watch so many un-grabbed 900s.

Also the sliders on the tour IMO are a waste of time where they could be doing another wake trick. They are tiny flat-bars and no-one does anything on them. Best you'll see is a back lip or some form of 270 out (and that is rare). No one wants to risk falling on the slider cause it's at the beginning of each pass.

Thing is ALL of these guys can ride with ridiculous style and go big. Each have their own unique style if you've watched any of them free-ride. However when you watch the tour they all look exactly the same. It's a shame the riders can't showcase their skills in a better light on the tour. It would make the sport look so much better.

I'm not even sure who "Tour" style riding is trying to appeal to.... the casual spectator or the weekend warrior don't even know what they're looking at (can they tell between a 7 and a 9 or between a FS5 and BS5?) and core riders who appreciate style and the skill it takes to ride with style don't like to watch tour passes (at least in their current form).

It's not like the early days when there were a lot of tricks only certain riders could do, and new tricks being invented all the time. They're pretty much all on the same level trick wise, so style and amplitude should set them apart.
Old     (dezul)      Join Date: Jul 2012       09-20-2014, 6:07 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by dyost View Post
They definitely gotta find a way to change the judging to force the riders to mix it up.
I watched a few of the PWT vids posted on here and the top three do pretty much the EXACT same run every time. I can only watch so many un-grabbed 900s.

Also the sliders on the tour IMO are a waste of time where they could be doing another wake trick. They are tiny flat-bars and no-one does anything on them. Best you'll see is a back lip or some form of 270 out (and that is rare). No one wants to risk falling on the slider cause it's at the beginning of each pass.

Thing is ALL of these guys can ride with ridiculous style and go big. Each have their own unique style if you've watched any of them free-ride. However when you watch the tour they all look exactly the same. It's a shame the riders can't showcase their skills in a better light on the tour. It would make the sport look so much better.

I'm not even sure who "Tour" style riding is trying to appeal to.... the casual spectator or the weekend warrior don't even know what they're looking at (can they tell between a 7 and a 9 or between a FS5 and BS5?) and core riders who appreciate style and the skill it takes to ride with style don't like to watch tour passes (at least in their current form).

It's not like the early days when there were a lot of tricks only certain riders could do, and new tricks being invented all the time. They're pretty much all on the same level trick wise, so style and amplitude should set them apart.
Ok. You pointed out the negatives....how do you think it should be? What is your ideal scenario for a competition that allows an audience?
Old     (83Starsnstripes)      Join Date: Jul 2013       09-20-2014, 11:41 AM Reply   
I might be wrong on this but I thought back in the day the riders had to write out their trick run and there was a double up. If they didn't do the tricks on their list the lost points. I actually like this. Now the riders can do whatever they want so if Rusty falls on a 9, then all Harley has to do is stand up a 7. Just seems like these guys play it safe more often than not and the last guy off the dock has a huge advantage. I'd like to see double ups back in every run as a bonus trick. If they want rails then make them real rails. I can hit what they have now. The riding in comps is so different than what you see in videos. I think they need to get closer to that.
Old     (alexair)      Join Date: Oct 2008       09-20-2014, 1:07 PM Reply   
Maybe will be not bad to perform two runs for each - one as is in ice figure skating standard program and next one as freeride with special tricks (maybe even few only + double up as desire) which prepare for impression. And score have to be combined for both. Double up in the end of ride is too hard to do and not all of riders finish the main ride with no problem.
Old     (tripsw)      Join Date: May 2006       09-20-2014, 5:59 PM Reply   
Looks like most agree that double ups should come back. I for sure do so.
Also would be nice if they couldn't do the same tricks every tour stop. Or at least if they were rewarded if they didn't. More diversity, not always the same runs with mostly 9's and mobe 5 and 7's and whatnot.
Oh yeah, more emphasis on style too, por favor.
Old     (Bumpass1)      Join Date: Oct 2010       09-21-2014, 7:56 AM Reply   
Standard 2 pass run. First run for tech with double up at the end. Second run for style with limits to in force that. Limit to 1 invert and no more than 540 spins. I think something like that would be a good mix of both worlds. Like everyone else I enjoy watching the power that Rusty throws down, and and the grace of Harley.
Old     (Orange)      Join Date: Jun 2012       09-21-2014, 11:34 PM Reply   
Honestly, I'd much rather see more and better wakeboard movies and videos rather than contests. Movies and video are accessible to so many more people than contests. I love the "demo days" where some of the pro riders hang with local shops to advertise certain boats and boards, but I could truly do without the contests.

I don't know... Maybe the contests are still necessary to popularize the names so the movies seem cool, its worth seeing Adam Errington (or whoever) at "demo days", or to develop a kinship to a brand or model, but I honestly have zero interest in ever attending a contest (and apparently many people agree or attendance wouldn't be so crappy).
Old     (davedidonato90)      Join Date: Mar 2013       09-22-2014, 7:36 PM Reply   
i like the social aspect of competitions. I like how the pros walk around, talk to fans sign posters and shirts and shoot the breeze. It probably tells them a lot about who the hardcore fans are because they recognize them. I have been to wake stock in canada the past couple years and i have had a conversation with most of the riders and they are all unreal dudes. I even see them at the bar at night and we talk and have a beer. Its also cool to ask for tips, ask how they feel they have been doing this season, ask them about life and plus seeing them throw down motivates us mortals to try and progress our riding. I don't live in an area where "demo days" or clinics are regular so that is what i see as a perk to competitions. the riding i agree i would rather watch a video with harley, rusty, or webb than them just do tricks in order to get first or spin and flip until i get dizzy. it seems like bob is the only one that has a comp run somewhat similar to his free ride - he even throws a slash in there
Old     (jarrod)      Join Date: May 2003       09-23-2014, 8:40 AM Reply   
Me too. I like wakeboarding events. It's nice to hang on the beach with friends, have a beer, and watch riding.
Old     (BamaLurker)      Join Date: Dec 2011       09-28-2014, 2:15 AM Reply   
Lose the boats
Get a couple of system 2's
Do what Silas has done for wakeskating.

The first step has been done already!
Old     (aricsx15)      Join Date: Jan 2014       09-28-2014, 10:29 AM Reply   
If they wanted even less attendance, they would go with that idea. ^
Old     (biggator)      Join Date: Jul 2010       09-28-2014, 11:24 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by BamaLurker View Post
Lose the boats
Get a couple of system 2's
Do what Silas has done for wakeskating.

The first step has been done already!
Not sure about cable, but I live on a lake - I think I've seen people wakeskating twice this year. 5 years ago, everyone 'had to have a skate on the boat'.. now it seems to have dramatically dropped.
Old     (jason_ssr)      Join Date: Apr 2001       09-30-2014, 7:41 AM Reply   
Back in the day, contest riding was about outriding the field with bigger better tricks. It was showing the public something they had never seen. I used to love watching contests and seeing tricks Id only seen on video. Now, the big tricks I see on video are never attempted in a contest. Contest runs consist of the same tricks ive seen for the last 10 years, plus a couple of rail hits that I see groms do at the cable.


IMO, the pro tour should be an exhibition. All the riders who make the tour are paid. Judge the exhibition by something like crowd response, and the winner gets a little kiss extra. That way, you get the wake event crowd\socialization, you get to see riders actually pushing it instead of canned runs, and you remove the negativity of subjective judging affecting a paycheck. Turn it back into something people want to see. Make the event appeal to the 20 something instead of the 12yr old.
Old     (gene3x)      Join Date: Apr 2005       09-30-2014, 2:40 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by 83Starsnstripes View Post
I might be wrong on this but I thought back in the day the riders had to write out their trick run and there was a double up. If they didn't do the tricks on their list the lost points. I actually like this. Now the riders can do whatever they want so if Rusty falls on a 9, then all Harley has to do is stand up a 7. Just seems like these guys play it safe more often than not and the last guy off the dock has a huge advantage. I'd like to see double ups back in every run as a bonus trick. If they want rails then make them real rails. I can hit what they have now. The riding in comps is so different than what you see in videos. I think they need to get closer to that.
I totally agree with Darren's comments about writing out your trick list. Riders going later in the rotation totally have an advantage.

I also think as Jason mentioned that all riders who make the tour should get paid a small amount even if it just covers their competition expenses and gives a bigger incentive to actually make the tour.
The other comment about spreading the money out among all riders is a good idea because it would highlight more riders and their style/ability by allowing them to get further in a competition.
Maybe, one doubleup trick and one wildcard trick not on their list to give them a chance to push for the win if their trick list doesn't stack-up against a more aggressive one. Similar to diving or other judged sports where you get a greater degree of difficulty for different tricks.
Old     (behindtheboat)      Join Date: Aug 2006       09-30-2014, 8:07 PM Reply   
That's the whole point of seeding, ride better in qualifiers, and you gain an advantage to see what others throw and what it'll take to win.
Old     (gene3x)      Join Date: Apr 2005       10-01-2014, 6:47 AM Reply   
Yes, I am aware of that but the discussion was about changing the total format to do something different and more watchable for the general public right?
Old     (tripsw)      Join Date: May 2006       10-06-2014, 5:58 PM Reply   
"Malibu Boats CEO Jack Springer made an exciting announcement for 2015, which will be released to the public on Monday, October 6."

from http://www.wakeboardingmag.com/news/...src=SOC&dom=fb

Malibu sponsoring the PWT, maybe?
Old     (ncsuuh)      Join Date: Jan 2007       10-06-2014, 6:53 PM Reply   
Whatever jungle announcement MC has for tomorrow will be their new tour.
Old     (Goonz)      Join Date: Sep 2012       10-07-2014, 12:37 PM Reply   
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sv8gZd3VQVY
Old     (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       10-07-2014, 1:44 PM Reply   
oh look another Mastercraft built for surfing only.

Gotta love that they take it to a 3rd world country to make a video, where the boat costs is equal to a village's 10 year GDP.
Old     (MCObray)      Join Date: Mar 2013       10-07-2014, 2:10 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by boardjnky4 View Post
oh look another Mastercraft built for surfing only.

Gotta love that they take it to a 3rd world country to make a video, where the boat costs is equal to a village's 10 year GDP.
... Kinda of looks like Kauai to me.
Old     (andrew_moreton)      Join Date: Feb 2003       10-07-2014, 2:56 PM Reply   
Yeah, pretty sure Hawaii is still part of the USofA!
Old     (skiboarder)      Join Date: Oct 2006       10-07-2014, 3:24 PM Reply   
I want to see the documentary where they take pro wakesurfers to a head-high reef break rather than the other way around. That would be way more entertaining to me.
Old     (tripsw)      Join Date: May 2006       10-07-2014, 3:51 PM Reply   
http://www.malibuboats.com/news/news...ro-series.html

Malibu Boats joins forces with wakeboarding’s governing body for the world’s premier pro invitational series, conceived to drive the evolution of the sport though elite competition.


Malibu Boats and the World Wakeboard Association have announced the creation of an elite contest series for 2015—including three stops for the world’s top pro riders—to push competitive wakeboarding to the next level.

Malibu CEO Jack Springer spoke Sunday during the WWA’s 25th-anniversary celebration, which wrapped up the unforgettable Cancun Pro contest. “At Malibu, we’re always looking to progress the sport of wakeboarding in all aspects,” said Springer. “From building innovative towboats to hosting first-class events to producing high-quality media for the world to see, we have combined interests with the WWA to support wakeboarding and inspire participants long into the future. The Cancun Pro by Malibu was a first step and calling it an ‘evolution’ series is no mistake. As details come out, this series will be classy, special and provide much to not only the athletes, but also the citizens who attend the events at each venue.”

Shannon Starling, president of the WWA, is incredibly excited to be launching a new event series for the sport’s top athletes, as well as the fans who love to watch them compete. “The last 25 years of the WWA have been incredible,” said Starling. “And now, with the Evolution Pro Series and a partner like Malibu Boats that shares our vision, I’m confident that competitive wakeboarding will be alive and well for the next 25 years and beyond.”

The Malibu Evolution Pro Series will focus on quality over quantity, bringing the men and women of the professional wakeboarding circuit together at some of the world’s best venues, in the U.S. and abroad. Prize money and media exposure will match the quality of this new, world-class series. For the latest updates, stay tuned to TheWWA.com and MalibuBoats.com.
Old     (pc_sledge)      Join Date: Jan 2006       10-07-2014, 5:55 PM Reply   
Awesome
Old     (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       10-07-2014, 6:01 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by MCObray View Post
... Kinda of looks like Kauai to me.

Lol gotcha
Old    rullery            10-07-2014, 8:08 PM Reply   
Wow, Mastercraft is leading in the marketing department at this point, that kind of video is gonna hit hard with their majority demographic regardless of how ridiculous it is. AND that is one tight boat from many perspectives.

The surf wake looks pretty sick, although you can still see the boat looks listed at about the 4:50 point forward. Just sayin!

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