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Old     (grant_west)      Join Date: Jun 2005       11-28-2012, 2:32 PM Reply   
Some cool take off's aboard the USS Wasp


Notice how the Elevator (the rear wing) becomes Flap's as it leaves the ground. Normaly in a conventional aircraft. if you had the Elevator in the position that the F-35 has in this video at take off you would be swimming. It's is so weird how computers and Fly by wire has changed flight. Control surfaces we can now do things we never thought they could or would do.
Old     (wakeboardingdad)      Join Date: Aug 2008       11-29-2012, 9:10 AM Reply   
I watched the manufacturer shootout for this plane between McDonnell Douglas and Lockheed Martin. The show included the military bid for the multi-military arm aircraft from conception to trials. Very interesting. I have to admit that I hated to see anyone lose the competition because the show connected the viewer with the personnel creating the product and the difficulties experienced in doing so.
Old     (wakeboardingdad)      Join Date: Aug 2008       11-29-2012, 9:22 AM Reply   
Not McDonnell Douglas, Boeing
Old     (stanfield)      Join Date: Mar 2004       11-29-2012, 12:35 PM Reply   
It was kind of McD. Boeing bought them out to help them compete for the bid since they didn't have any modern day fighter experience. My wife is an Engineer working in flight test on the project. She's got a pretty rad job.
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Old     (stephan)      Join Date: Nov 2002       11-29-2012, 12:54 PM Reply   
Stanfield, that is very cool. Your wife has a great job. Thank her for helping us keep this country bad ass.

I always thought that the 35B variant was going to be a strictly Marine version and the C was the Navy version. I was surprised to see the B on a Navy carrier. Will both branches be using the short take off B? Anyone know the rundown on which branches are getting what and how many?
Old     (stanfield)      Join Date: Mar 2004       11-29-2012, 1:21 PM Reply   
W/O asking my wife, I imagine the STOVL variant will get used by multiple branches, but generally speaking yes, STOVL = Marines, CV = Navy, CTOL = Air Force. As for how many, that number is forever changing. Other countries will be getting them too. It's been an interesting process to watch from the outside. I can remember not long ago at all when there was only 1 plane out on the flight line and now they are really cranking them out.
Old     (wakeboardingdad)      Join Date: Aug 2008       11-29-2012, 3:11 PM Reply   
Stanfield, I have to admit that I looked at the Boeing group as the underdogs and Lockheed as a shoe-in. I was pulling for Boeing since I typically root for the underdog. Sorry. It was amazing seeing how one person can effect the basic design and I was somewhat dismayed when the requirements were altered which seemed to help Lockheed. In Lockheed's defense, the competition's plane just did not create enough stationary lift with all of the cowls in place. In the end, I was pleased to see Boeing catch the helo contract. As I said, the program connected the viewer with the real people and the strife they endured while overcoming problems and creating two amazing fighter jets.
Old     (grant_west)      Join Date: Jun 2005       11-29-2012, 3:16 PM Reply   
Can anyone point me to the move you are talking about I would love to check it out
Old     (SimonSez)      Join Date: Nov 2012       11-29-2012, 8:22 PM Reply   
I know a few guys thoroughly involved in these projects and I think people really underestimate the phenomenal game-changing tech and engineering that goes into these beasts. We're talking LM doing for air combat what NASA did for space exploration in the 60's (hums national anthem).
Old     (stanfield)      Join Date: Mar 2004       11-29-2012, 8:37 PM Reply   
Grant, I'm not sure if its the same show that AKAdirt is talking about, but PBS did a NOVA special on it, battle of the x planes iirc. I got it off Netflix. Was funny to see my wife's coworkers when they still had hair.
Old     (markj)      Join Date: Apr 2005       11-30-2012, 2:08 AM Reply   
Okay, who is playing the Top Gun theme in their had right now?
Old     (markj)      Join Date: Apr 2005       11-30-2012, 2:09 AM Reply   
Oops-meant to say head.
Old     (stepintoliquid)      Join Date: Sep 2005       11-30-2012, 11:06 AM Reply   
The shot of the 35 with the two 16's is awesome. Will the F-16 ever be replaced? Probably costs half as much as the 35 and 22 and still holds it's own in air combat.
Old     (grant_west)      Join Date: Jun 2005       11-30-2012, 11:48 AM Reply   
Kevin: that's a good point. I remember seeing story about the F-14 Tomcat (Speaking of top gun) VS the F-18 Hornet. The Huge F-14 they said was almost 2 times the price of the F-18. The F-18 is smaller and costs less to fly per hr. So the Military can have twice as many in the air for the same cost. Makes you wonder if Quanity wins over Quality in military theater.

Its cool to know we have so many people here on Wake World that are close to these projects and know lots about them. I wish more of you would post on these subjects because they are so amazing. Please don't be shy and contribute. We would all love to see / hear what you have to say. Thanks
Old     (stepintoliquid)      Join Date: Sep 2005       11-30-2012, 11:57 AM Reply   
That's part of the reason why the Mitsubishi Zero was a tough opponent in world war II, there was so damn many of them! I've always been a military plane geek. As bad ass as the F-22 and F-35 are I would love to see them dogfight with the F-16. That being said the 22 and 35 probably wouldn't let a 16 get close enough to dogfight in a real life scenario. They have much more advanced stealth and fire and forget capabilities.
Old     (lugwrench)      Join Date: Jul 2002       11-30-2012, 12:30 PM Reply   
Kevin have you seen the video's of the Aim 9x with the look and fire sighting in action? Takes a little bit of badassery away compared to the old school stick and rudder aces, but the pilot just has to look at the other plane and the missile will turn a full 360 if need be. It can even be fired from something like a sub or another plane and then controlled from the F-22 or 35 to connect with its target.

Grant, the flight control of modern planes astounds me. Even the Super Hornet, check out how both ailerons are down during take off. The computer puts the ailerons down to match the flaps during take off and landings. I read a funny quote to the effect of, the pilot suggests what he wants to do and the computer flies the plane.

Oh and here are some youtube urls for the Boeing X-32 VS. Lockheed X-35

Part 1
Part 2
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Old     (stepintoliquid)      Join Date: Sep 2005       11-30-2012, 2:19 PM Reply   
Fat-B, I have not seen any of those videos! Post em up!
Old     (tacosupreme)      Join Date: May 2003       12-03-2012, 10:07 AM Reply   
This is a cool video of the Aim-9x using the helmet sighting. Watch these things turn:

Old     (grant_west)      Join Date: Jun 2005       12-03-2012, 10:34 AM Reply   
Lugwrench; I see what you mean about the flaps and ailerons. In RC flight we call them "flap-er-on's " ailerons that work as flaps. RC flight has a few similarities as far as you don't have a cable that turns or pulls in a control surface you have a electronic signal that is sent to the control surface. In RC flight we can do a thing call "Mixing " its where you can have a few things all happening at once.
Example. You pull right on the stick and the controller automatically throws rudder and elevator and power all at once so instead if the pilot having to do all 3 things the computer does them for you. You had no idea what the computer did all you know is the plane turned the way you wanted it to.

I have heard people say planes like the F117 can't fly with out a computer because the plane is so aerodynamically incorrect that if you tried to fly it like how a conventional airplane flys it would crash. Equal and oppasete aileron inputs. Just don't work on a plane like that.

I have seen pics of the F22 flying straight and level but yet you can see the rear vertical stabilizer having rudder input as well as a rear elevator input that just didn't make sense. It's the computer deciding (not the pilot) what control surfaces need to be input to get the plane to do what the pilots hand is doing. Simply Amazing
Old     (wakeboardingdad)      Join Date: Aug 2008       12-03-2012, 12:17 PM Reply   
Originally Posted by stanfield View Post
Grant, I'm not sure if its the same show that AKAdirt is talking about, but PBS did a NOVA special on it, battle of the x planes iirc. I got it off Netflix. Was funny to see my wife's coworkers when they still had hair.
I think that was the show that I watched and I may have even caught it on Netflix. It is definitely worth the "seat time" lol to watch.


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