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Old     (jbkriss)      Join Date: Mar 2011       05-25-2016, 11:13 AM Reply   
I have the new Q7 and use it to tow my X10. Before that, I used the bigger Sequoia with V8 and 4x4 and never had any problems towing. I have not towed the boat that much with the new vehicle, but it seems to pull just as well as the Sequoia did. Accelerates and brakes just as well. I'm not going to push it and haul over the mfg's limit because that's just not a smart decision if I'm transporting something as valuable as a wakeboat or something almost as important- my family members. Just kidding. For what it's worth, the Q7 is full time 4WD. I'm not sure if or how that affects the accelerating and braking of the trailer.
Old     (timmyb)      Join Date: Apr 2007       05-25-2016, 11:24 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by beg4wake View Post
WRONG! It also comes down to how much weight is still on those FRONT tires since those are your braking tires! If the vehicles rear suspension is too soft for the load, when you go to brake, the forward momentum of the trailer will have an added tongue weight effect which will push down on the back, adversely lifting the front. Most trucks (not all as many these days have softer suspension for a smoother ride) have a stiffer rear suspension. I've had this happen to me in a Ram 1500 and that alone was enough for me to upgrade to a 2500. The added power and torque from the diesel was a bonus! I'm not saying an Audi can't do the job...but like others have stated, it is pushing the limits.
No, I'm not. The tires and the brakes are still doing the work that actually stops the rig. Have you discussed outside factors that affect the ability to do their job? Yes, you have. If you had just bought an Audi instead of a Ram 1500, you wouldn't have had that problem.
Old     (markj)      Join Date: Apr 2005       05-26-2016, 12:41 AM Reply   
I'd love to close this thread (actually, I'm sure I won't) by saying if one of those asshats that wants to push the limits of their towing capacity ever hits me or one of my family, I will release hellfire on them. I will own everything that is theirs and more. I pay fat money to ensure I'm doing everything above board, safe and legal. If you're some cheap as$, tight wad that wants to save a few bucks by towing his 5-8000 lb boat with your wife's car, know this: you're goin down if you cause an accident or even if you're partly at fault. Doesn't matter if you meant well and were just tryin to get to the lake which is 10 mins away. No excuses. Man up and own a proper tow vehicle or downsize your boat until you can afford the whole package.
Old     (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       05-26-2016, 4:49 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by markj View Post
I'd love to close this thread (actually, I'm sure I won't) by saying if one of those asshats that wants to push the limits of their towing capacity ever hits me or one of my family, I will release hellfire on them. I will own everything that is theirs and more. I pay fat money to ensure I'm doing everything above board, safe and legal. If you're some cheap as$, tight wad that wants to save a few bucks by towing his 5-8000 lb boat with your wife's car, know this: you're goin down if you cause an accident or even if you're partly at fault. Doesn't matter if you meant well and were just tryin to get to the lake which is 10 mins away. No excuses. Man up and own a proper tow vehicle or downsize your boat until you can afford the whole package.


Hah nice tough guy response
Old     (mlzelenik)      Join Date: Apr 2016       05-26-2016, 6:32 AM Reply   
Does anyone know the GCWR on the 2017 Q7? I can't seem to find it anywhere. That will help tell whether or not it can legally tow an 8K boat
Old     (markj)      Join Date: Apr 2005       05-26-2016, 8:23 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by boardjnky4 View Post
Hah nice tough guy response
Ha! I guess it sounded like that. I should have only typed the last sentence.
Old     (xxrb2010)      Join Date: Jan 2014       05-26-2016, 8:55 AM Reply   
Interesting finding on the Q7 user manual,

The max towing of 7,700 is the maximum and accessories will reduce this figure. All the specifications are for road with less than 12% incline (page 101 of online manual). The information about the GCWR is on the car door and not in the manual as specified in the manual .
Old     (brycejb328)      Join Date: Aug 2009       05-26-2016, 8:58 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by markj View Post
I'd love to close this thread (actually, I'm sure I won't) by saying if one of those asshats that wants to push the limits of their towing capacity ever hits me or one of my family, I will release hellfire on them. I will own everything that is theirs and more. I pay fat money to ensure I'm doing everything above board, safe and legal. If you're some cheap as$, tight wad that wants to save a few bucks by towing his 5-8000 lb boat with your wife's car, know this: you're goin down if you cause an accident or even if you're partly at fault. Doesn't matter if you meant well and were just tryin to get to the lake which is 10 mins away. No excuses. Man up and own a proper tow vehicle or downsize your boat until you can afford the whole package.
^^^^ this is why wakeworld is so entertaining
Old     (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       05-26-2016, 9:06 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by xxrb2010 View Post
Interesting finding on the Q7 user manual,

The max towing of 7,700 is the maximum and accessories will reduce this figure. All the specifications are for road with less than 12% incline (page 101 of online manual). The information about the GCWR is on the car door and not in the manual as specified in the manual .
Same towing capacity as a 2016 Chevy Colorado Duramax.

Don't see anyone hating on this dude:

Quote:
Originally Posted by twin2112 View Post
Finally got the boat out for a pull. The truck pulls great.

Drives fine, but droops a bit. May look at installing some load leveling airbags.
http://www.wakeworld.com/forum/showthread.php?p=1933169

Last edited by boardjnky4; 05-26-2016 at 9:11 AM.
Old     (mlzelenik)      Join Date: Apr 2016       05-26-2016, 9:19 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by boardjnky4 View Post
Same towing capacity as a 2016 Chevy Colorado Duramax.

Don't see anyone hating on this dude:



http://www.wakeworld.com/forum/showthread.php?p=1933169
He's also not towing close to 8K with it. I'm not hating on anyone's tow rig, I just prefer to be on the safe side when towing
Old     (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       05-26-2016, 9:24 AM Reply   
true on the weight
Old     (all2matt)      Join Date: Apr 2015       05-26-2016, 9:36 AM Reply   
so heres my question from those with an educated opinion: if the master engineers at our car manufacturers have come forth to set the "Society of Automotive Engineers (SAE) J2807 set of recommended practices" for towing and some on here dont feel these are good enough then what numbers are the ones we should be using?

I keep hearing from people on here and in discussions in the real world that you need a big heavy vehicle but wouldn't physics say that those heavier vehicles be harder to stop in an emergency situation? so is heavier better? do the brakes on current 1/2 ton and 3/4 account for their weight as good as the above stated audi?


so what A L O T of us are wondering what is the real limits? I hear from alot on here that they use the 10% buffer as their limit so if your chevy silverado is rated at 9100lbs then you shouldnt tow anything over 8200lbs, or is it the 30% buffer and we shouldnt tow over 6300lbs
Old     (all2matt)      Join Date: Apr 2015       05-26-2016, 10:03 AM Reply   
maybe those with educated opinions/facts could compile a list of worthy vehicles and unworthy vehicles that would fall close the "tow line" then maybe a quick snippet of why some make the cut and some fail in their opinions.

I think that would alot more useful for this debate.

for example:
dodge ram 1500 crew cab shortbox 3.0 ecodiesel would not make the list because it only has a tow capacity of 8750#s but the 5.7 hemi version would because it has a tow capicity of 10,200#s. But in that example I either proved both are safe or both are not because all I changed was the motor, NOT a thing safety wise was different in that configuration.

chevy does the same thing, you changes the gears and you go from 9100 to 11,700

so do they really build these vehicles infinity safer in 2016 then they did in 2001 to make the safety not as much of a hindrance on tow rating as is power to the final numbers?
Old     (beg4wake)      Join Date: Aug 2012       05-26-2016, 10:09 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by all2matt View Post
so heres my question from those with an educated opinion: if the master engineers at our car manufacturers have come forth to set the "Society of Automotive Engineers (SAE) J2807 set of recommended practices" for towing and some on here dont feel these are good enough then what numbers are the ones we should be using?

I keep hearing from people on here and in discussions in the real world that you need a big heavy vehicle but wouldn't physics say that those heavier vehicles be harder to stop in an emergency situation? so is heavier better? do the brakes on current 1/2 ton and 3/4 account for their weight as good as the above stated audi?


so what A L O T of us are wondering what is the real limits? I hear from alot on here that they use the 10% buffer as their limit so if your chevy silverado is rated at 9100lbs then you shouldnt tow anything over 8200lbs, or is it the 30% buffer and we shouldnt tow over 6300lbs
A lot of it actually just comes down to the fine print. And SUSPENSION in the rear of a vehicle plays a HUGE role in towing. Some people just can't seem to comprehend the physics behind it. When you break it down, there are some 250's that have the same motor and brakes as a 150...but the rear suspension and beefier frame is what makes the difference in towing capacity. Way too many people on here just seem to think the size of their rotors and the motor itself are the lead factors in towing.

Simple physics people, when you apply brakes, the forward motion of the object being towed due to inertia will cause forward down pressure on the rear of the vihicle doing the towing (an effect which increases the instant tongue weight) which in turn alleviates friction between the front tires and the ground which reduces braking effect. 3/4 ton pickups have stiffer rear suspension which helps to absorb that shock. Granted this is what also makes them ride rougher. IMO, the Audi in question is just as good as many of today's 150/1500 pickup trucks due to the fact that many of those are now offered in softer suspension settings (usually the higher end ones). Albeit the pickups will have engines and transmissions better suited for towing. But if you read the FINE PRINT on the tow ratings of many vehicles...you will find that the "max tow rating" may be a lot lower than what you think. Take the new F-150...states it has a 12,000lbs which they will state all day for advertising purposes...but this is only on a very small configuration of the F150 and ONLY from a 5th wheel setup - NOT from the rear bumper.

My argument has nothing to do with whether or not the vehicle in question CAN tow the load, it is can it do it safely?! I really feel that the size boat in question is pushing on those limits of safety. And I don't argue that "you're going to blow your motor" or " you're going to fry your transmission", because even though you would be more likely to than I will in my 3/4 ton pickup...I could care less. That's your money and your car! What I do care about is the safety of you, your passengers, and others on the road when you decide to take such ventures. I just really hope you use full caution and don't drive like a bafoon!

Last edited by beg4wake; 05-26-2016 at 10:18 AM.
Old     (beg4wake)      Join Date: Aug 2012       05-26-2016, 10:14 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by all2matt View Post
maybe those with educated opinions/facts could compile a list of worthy vehicles and unworthy vehicles that would fall close the "tow line" then maybe a quick snippet of why some make the cut and some fail in their opinions.

I think that would alot more useful for this debate.

for example:
dodge ram 1500 crew cab shortbox 3.0 ecodiesel would not make the list because it only has a tow capacity of 8750#s but the 5.7 hemi version would because it has a tow capicity of 10,200#s. But in that example I either proved both are safe or both are not because all I changed was the motor, NOT a thing safety wise was different in that configuration.

chevy does the same thing, you changes the gears and you go from 9100 to 11,700

so do they really build these vehicles infinity safer in 2016 then they did in 2001 to make the safety not as much of a hindrance on tow rating as is power to the final numbers?
Part of that is safety. Most newer trucks have much "beefier" framework making them more rigid...and YES that does make a difference. Brakes are slightly better. A lot does have to do with power of the engine too, not from a safety factor, but from the point that they can handle more weight now without the manufacturer being worried about them being overworked leading to more warranty issues.
Old     (all2matt)      Join Date: Apr 2015       05-26-2016, 10:34 AM Reply   
so in your opinion on thing that some one should do if they are towing closer to their limit they should at least upgrade the rear suspension on the vehicle to help accommodate that extra weight. i would assume Airbag helper systems and stiffer springs should help make your front braking more effective.

So 1 thing that is still a bit confusing to me is the lack of difference in towing capacity of the a Jeep GC hemi and a Jeep GC SRT. the SRT8 has huge brembos a bigger engine but no upgrade to towing capcity, so I would assume from that they either dont feel the need to determine a more accurate capcity or the frame/safety equipment is maxed out in both configurations thus not allowing for the motor and brakes to increase its ratings.
Old     (CALIV210)      Join Date: Jun 2015       05-26-2016, 11:22 AM Reply   
1. I like the Audi I thinks its a beautiful CAR .

2. But call it what you want your using a CAR to do a real trucks job your pushing the limits and risking not only your own family but mine and everyone else on the road .

3. Another thing is the manufacturers tow ratings are total crap . Yes in perfect conditions you can get away with a lot . But say you hit some debris on the road and blow out 2 trailer tires and the 8k lb fully loaded boat your pulling stars yanking that CAR around your gonna wish you had a bigger tow vehicle .

4. To me to be on the safe side a 3/4 ton truck is the only way to go . I used to pull my old boat with a Toyota which it pulled it fine since it was a really light malibu skier . Should I have been doing it ..no friggin way ..kids make you wise up i guess .

Im just trying to say that if you have to question it you probably making an iffy decision .I'm not trying to hurt anyones feelings or offend anyone I just want us all to enjoy the sport and make it home as safely as possible
Old     (CALIV210)      Join Date: Jun 2015       05-26-2016, 11:29 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by beg4wake View Post
a lot of it actually just comes down to the fine print. And suspension in the rear of a vehicle plays a huge role in towing. Some people just can't seem to comprehend the physics behind it. When you break it down, there are some 250's that have the same motor and brakes as a 150...but the rear suspension and beefier frame is what makes the difference in towing capacity. Way too many people on here just seem to think the size of their rotors and the motor itself are the lead factors in towing.

Simple physics people, when you apply brakes, the forward motion of the object being towed due to inertia will cause forward down pressure on the rear of the vihicle doing the towing (an effect which increases the instant tongue weight) which in turn alleviates friction between the front tires and the ground which reduces braking effect. 3/4 ton pickups have stiffer rear suspension which helps to absorb that shock. Granted this is what also makes them ride rougher. Imo, the audi in question is just as good as many of today's 150/1500 pickup trucks due to the fact that many of those are now offered in softer suspension settings (usually the higher end ones). Albeit the pickups will have engines and transmissions better suited for towing. But if you read the fine print on the tow ratings of many vehicles...you will find that the "max tow rating" may be a lot lower than what you think. Take the new f-150...states it has a 12,000lbs which they will state all day for advertising purposes...but this is only on a very small configuration of the f150 and only from a 5th wheel setup - not from the rear bumper.

My argument has nothing to do with whether or not the vehicle in question can tow the load, it is can it do it safely?! I really feel that the size boat in question is pushing on those limits of safety. And i don't argue that "you're going to blow your motor" or " you're going to fry your transmission", because even though you would be more likely to than i will in my 3/4 ton pickup...i could care less. That's your money and your car! What i do care about is the safety of you, your passengers, and others on the road when you decide to take such ventures. I just really hope you use full caution and don't drive like a bafoon!

excellent explanation !!!
Old     (cjh1669)      Join Date: Apr 2005       05-26-2016, 1:07 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by beg4wake View Post
A lot of it actually just comes down to the fine print. And SUSPENSION in the rear of a vehicle plays a HUGE role in towing. Some people just can't seem to comprehend the physics behind it. When you break it down, there are some 250's that have the same motor and brakes as a 150...but the rear suspension and beefier frame is what makes the difference in towing capacity. Way too many people on here just seem to think the size of their rotors and the motor itself are the lead factors in towing.

Simple physics people, when you apply brakes, the forward motion of the object being towed due to inertia will cause forward down pressure on the rear of the vihicle doing the towing (an effect which increases the instant tongue weight) which in turn alleviates friction between the front tires and the ground which reduces braking effect. 3/4 ton pickups have stiffer rear suspension which helps to absorb that shock. Granted this is what also makes them ride rougher. IMO, the Audi in question is just as good as many of today's 150/1500 pickup trucks due to the fact that many of those are now offered in softer suspension settings (usually the higher end ones). Albeit the pickups will have engines and transmissions better suited for towing. But if you read the FINE PRINT on the tow ratings of many vehicles...you will find that the "max tow rating" may be a lot lower than what you think. Take the new F-150...states it has a 12,000lbs which they will state all day for advertising purposes...but this is only on a very small configuration of the F150 and ONLY from a 5th wheel setup - NOT from the rear bumper.

My argument has nothing to do with whether or not the vehicle in question CAN tow the load, it is can it do it safely?! I really feel that the size boat in question is pushing on those limits of safety. And I don't argue that "you're going to blow your motor" or " you're going to fry your transmission", because even though you would be more likely to than I will in my 3/4 ton pickup...I could care less. That's your money and your car! What I do care about is the safety of you, your passengers, and others on the road when you decide to take such ventures. I just really hope you use full caution and don't drive like a bafoon!
This pretty much wraps up this thread
Old     (meathead65)      Join Date: Sep 2006       05-26-2016, 2:57 PM Reply   
Maybe someone smarter than me can clear up this "weight transfers and forces the rear of the vehicle down thereby unloading the front tires" theory..... Nothing on the boat trailer moves during braking, and the tongue load would have no reason to change. The natural tendency of the tow vehicles front end to "dive" under braking would actually seem to hike the rear of the vehicle upward, reducing weight on the rear axle and increasing weight on the steer axle.

Now if your hitch load was dramatically over the max rating, I can we the front end being light on the tow vehicle. But on a properly distributed load, there is nothing that is going to cause a trailer tongue to increase its weight under braking.

Maybe I'm wrong. I speak only from 30 plus years as a commercial driver, including 10 plus years in both heavy haul (oversize/overweight loads) as well as more than a few years pulling heavy trailers from a rear pintle hook as well as from traditional fifth wheels.
Old     (timmyb)      Join Date: Apr 2007       05-26-2016, 4:35 PM Reply   
I'd like to see video of the tongue pushing down on the rear of the vehicle. In my experience, the nose is still diving and the rear end is still lifting. Since it's "simple physics", someone should have a video of this.
Old     (WheelerWake)      Join Date: Mar 2013       05-26-2016, 6:25 PM Reply   
A boat on a trailer equipped with brakes will increase the tongue weight while braking, much the same way a car dives when the brake are applied. This is because the center of gravity is maybe 4' above the ground with the boat/trailer and when the brakes are applied, the boat/trailer tries to rotate forward. It's easier to understand it you had a very tall boat, say 100 ft. If you slammed on the brakes it would really force the tongue down.

By the way, this same center of gravity height applies to doing wheelies with a car or motorcycle (except accelerating), the higher the center of gravity, the easier it is to wheelie.
Old     (markj)      Join Date: Apr 2005       05-26-2016, 10:09 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by beg4wake View Post
A lot of it actually just comes down to the fine print. And SUSPENSION in the rear of a vehicle plays a HUGE role in towing. Some people just can't seem to comprehend the physics behind it. When you break it down, there are some 250's that have the same motor and brakes as a 150...but the rear suspension and beefier frame is what makes the difference in towing capacity. Way too many people on here just seem to think the size of their rotors and the motor itself are the lead factors in towing.

Simple physics people, when you apply brakes, the forward motion of the object being towed due to inertia will cause forward down pressure on the rear of the vihicle doing the towing (an effect which increases the instant tongue weight) which in turn alleviates friction between the front tires and the ground which reduces braking effect. 3/4 ton pickups have stiffer rear suspension which helps to absorb that shock. Granted this is what also makes them ride rougher. IMO, the Audi in question is just as good as many of today's 150/1500 pickup trucks due to the fact that many of those are now offered in softer suspension settings (usually the higher end ones). Albeit the pickups will have engines and transmissions better suited for towing. But if you read the FINE PRINT on the tow ratings of many vehicles...you will find that the "max tow rating" may be a lot lower than what you think. Take the new F-150...states it has a 12,000lbs which they will state all day for advertising purposes...but this is only on a very small configuration of the F150 and ONLY from a 5th wheel setup - NOT from the rear bumper.

My argument has nothing to do with whether or not the vehicle in question CAN tow the load, it is can it do it safely?! I really feel that the size boat in question is pushing on those limits of safety. And I don't argue that "you're going to blow your motor" or " you're going to fry your transmission", because even though you would be more likely to than I will in my 3/4 ton pickup...I could care less. That's your money and your car! What I do care about is the safety of you, your passengers, and others on the road when you decide to take such ventures. I just really hope you use full caution and don't drive like a bafoon!
Winner! Agreed.
Old     (jws2)      Join Date: Apr 2015       05-27-2016, 6:28 AM Reply   
Ok one last addition to the great comment for "beg4wake" if you look at the original picture of the Audi and boat. The rear of the vehicle is "squatted" the mean the reduction in" front friction" exist, but in addition the front steering geometry has also been change, toe is changes, as well and camber and caster......... the negative camber is reduced. This will make the steering extremely positive, and hard to control. Some say like standing on a beach ball.
Old     (MattieK27)      Join Date: Mar 2010       05-27-2016, 8:01 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by jws2 View Post
Ok one last addition to the great comment for "beg4wake" if you look at the original picture of the Audi and boat. The rear of the vehicle is "squatted" the mean the reduction in" front friction" exist, but in addition the front steering geometry has also been change, toe is changes, as well and camber and caster......... the negative camber is reduced. This will make the steering extremely positive, and hard to control. Some say like standing on a beach ball.
This thread is just getting better and better. Would you care to explain how a slight amount of rear squat has any effect caster and toe? Assuming it is a mcpherson strut front suspension, I will give you a slight (very very slight) change in camber will occur because of that setup's inherent dynamic camber issues; but come on, like standing on a beach ball?

Everyone keeps crying out in the name of safety, but this is the same group who thinks nothing of putting lift kits on their trucks and adding over-sized wheels and tires. That reduces stability and INCREASES braking distances. (And you want to talk about suspension geometry changes with a slight rear squat? )

Liability keeps getting brought up, over and over. Besides you the owner/driver, who is the most liable party in this equation? The manufacturer, the one with the deepest pockets. Don't you think that if anything, they would go CONSERVATIVE on their tow ratings, especially in today's lawsuit happy society? As someone who has worked in the automotive industry, let me rephrase that, manufacturers consistently give CONSERVATIVE tow ratings to their vehicles. It would be ridiculous to assume otherwise, as it is their ass on the line if it is proven the vehicle cannot handle the load it is rated at.

Will a truck with a 10k tow rating handle a 7000lb setup better than a sport utility rated at 7300lbs? Yes, but to call the SUV setup inherently dangerous? You are reaching at that point. Two very important factors in all of this, trailer brakes and the driver. Those of you hammering on the safety topic, when was the last time you checked or serviced your trailer brakes? Have you tested the force required to lock those brakes up, and made sure the actuator is performing as intended? From a driver perspective, I have seen how some people with big trucks go flying past me while trailering to the river; I have read how owners claim they can't feel a boat behind their massive mini semi. I will take a more cautious driver in the SUV over the idiot in the truck any day.

Claim you bought the giant truck in the name of safety, Claim you did it because its the most appropriate tool for the job. Those of us with half a brain know the more typical reason you bought it, and it becomes even more painfully obvious with your responses in threads like this...

Last edited by MattieK27; 05-27-2016 at 8:10 AM.
Old     (MattieK27)      Join Date: Mar 2010       05-27-2016, 8:15 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by jws2 View Post
.....but in addition the front steering geometry has also been change, toe is changes, as well and camber and caster......... the negative camber is reduced.


Quote:
Originally Posted by MattieK27 View Post
This thread is just getting better and better. Would you care to explain how a slight amount of rear squat has any effect caster and toe? Assuming it is a mcpherson strut front suspension, I will give you a slight (very very slight) change in camber will occur because of that setup's inherent dynamic camber issues; but come on, like standing on a beach ball?
Actually, is a hilarious twist, the Q7 actually has a double wishbone setup up front. This would have even LESS dynamic camber issues stemming from ride height changes...

Last edited by MattieK27; 05-27-2016 at 8:17 AM.
Old     (CALIV210)      Join Date: Jun 2015       05-27-2016, 8:16 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by MattieK27 View Post
This thread is just getting better and better. Would you care to explain how a slight amount of squat has any effect caster and toe? Assuming it is a mcpherson strut front suspension, I will give you a slight (very very slight) change in camber will occur because of that setup's inherent dynamic camber issues; but come on, like standing on a beach ball?

Everyone keeps crying out in the name of safety, but this is the same group who thinks nothing of putting lift kits on their trucks and adding over-sized wheels and tires. That reduces stability and INCREASES braking distances. (And you want to talk about suspension geometry changes with a slight rear squat? )

Liability keeps getting brought up, over and over. Besides you the owner/driver, who is the most liable party in this equation? The manufacturer, the one with the deepest pockets. Don't you think that if anything, they would go CONSERVATIVE on their tow ratings, especially in today's lawsuit happy society? As someone who has worked in the automotive industry, let me rephrase that, manufacturers consistently give CONSERVATIVE tow ratings to their vehicles. It would be ridiculous to assume otherwise, as it is their ass on the line if it is proven the vehicle cannot handle the load it is rated at.

Will a truck with a 10k tow rating handle a 7000lb setup better than a sport utility rated at 7300lbs? Yes, but to call the SUV setup inherently dangerous? You are reaching at that point. Two very important factors in all of this, trailer brakes and the driver. Those of you hammering on the safety topic, when was the last time you checked or serviced your trailer brakes? Have you tested the force required to lock those brakes up, and made sure the actuator is performing as intended? From a driver perspective, I have seen how some people with big trucks go flying past me while trailering to the river; I have read how owners claim they can't feel a boat behind their massive mini semi. I will take a more cautious driver in the SUV over the idiot in the truck any day.

Claim you bought the giant truck in the name of safety, Claim you did it because its the most appropriate tool for the job. Those of us with half a brain know the more typical reason you bought it, and it becomes ever more painfully obvious with your responses in threads like this...
Well that's pretty insulting !! You can try to justify your mediocre tow rigs all you want and its a big difference between a 20 year old with a lifted booty wagon and the rest of us with a good safe 3/4 ton truck . This is not to mention MY trailer brakes work perfectly as I am a stickler for safety . Maybe because they pound it into us at my job or because I could never live with myself if my under weight under braked under powered car ,truck or SUV lost control and killed some one . I get your point but your delivery is wrong . If you cant support the idea of using the safest rig you can afford then apparently I'm wasting my time .

BTW I REALLY HATE REPLYING TO THESE TYPES OF THREADS I am really not trying to be confrontational . I hope im not offending anyone with my opinion

Last edited by CALIV210; 05-27-2016 at 8:19 AM.
Old     (all2matt)      Join Date: Apr 2015       05-27-2016, 8:21 AM Reply   
thanks MATT (mattiek) that was the other part is the lifted crowd. How much tow capacity is taken away from a truck with a lift kit because both on here and in real life there a a TON of those and to me it would seem if your serious about safe towing a lowered center gravity would be better than a lifted center of gravity for both handling and braking.

so my question is whats the perceived loss on capacity for a 4" lift and how much do you think the handling and braking are affected under towing situations?
Old     (MattieK27)      Join Date: Mar 2010       05-27-2016, 8:21 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by CALIV210 View Post
Well that's pretty insulting !! You can try to justify your mediocre tow rigs all you want and its a big difference between a 20 year old with a lifted booty wagon and the rest of us with a good safe 3/4 ton truck . This is not to mention MY trailer brakes work perfectly as I am a stickler for safety . Maybe because they pound it into us at my job or because I could never live with myself if my under weight under braked under powered car ,truck or SUV lost control and killed some one . I get your point but your delivery is wrong . If you cant support the idea of using the safest rig you can afford then apparently I'm wasting my time .
I'd say your kindergarten style "black or white," absolute "right or wrong" delivery is wrong, but clearly we are going to disagree. I hear there is a liquidation sale near Chicago selling semis cheap, you want me to check them out for you to see if you can swing upgrading to an even safer rig?

I figured the last comment I made about the "more typical reason" would be insulting to those that it applied to, I guess I was right...

Quote:
Originally Posted by CALIV210 View Post
BTW I REALLY HATE REPLYING TO THESE TYPES OF THREADS I am really not trying to be confrontational . I hope im not offending anyone with my opinion
Stop replying then...

Last edited by MattieK27; 05-27-2016 at 8:23 AM.
Old     (MattieK27)      Join Date: Mar 2010       05-27-2016, 8:32 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by all2matt View Post
thanks MATT (mattiek) that was the other part is the lifted crowd. How much tow capacity is taken away from a truck with a lift kit because both on here and in real life there a a TON of those and to me it would seem if your serious about safe towing a lowered center gravity would be better than a lifted center of gravity for both handling and braking.

so my question is whats the perceived loss on capacity for a 4" lift and how much do you think the handling and braking are affected under towing situations?
It depends on the lift honestly. If it is done well, with matched spring rates and damping forces; and it isn't a ridiculous lift, it should be ok. But there will be some change to the stability of the vehicle. By lifting it, you raised the center of gravity, and you changed the distance from the roll center to that COG. The lift certainly won't help towing safety.

Actually the bigger issue is the larger wheels/tires. Theoretically, going from a 30" tire to a 36" tire changes the moment arm acting on wheel/hub assembly by 3", and it now requires a good bit more force from the calipers to stop rotation.

But hey, lets beat that safety drum...
Old     (timmyb)      Join Date: Apr 2007       05-27-2016, 8:38 AM Reply   
Here's a question, how many in this thread feel that this would be a better tow vehicle?
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Old     (CALIV210)      Join Date: Jun 2015       05-27-2016, 8:38 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by MattieK27 View Post
I'd say your kindergarten style "black or white," absolute "right or wrong" delivery is wrong, but clearly we are going to disagree. I hear there is a liquidation sale near Chicago selling semis cheap, you want me to check them out for you to see if you can swing upgrading to an even safer rig?

I figured the last comment I made about the "more typical reason" would be insulting to those that it applied to, I guess I was right...



Stop replying then...
I never said you couldn't tow with a smaller less adequate vehicle I said for me and safety's sake its not the wisest decision . But holy crap your argumentative .. I apologize if you felt insulted . I'm sorry you find it necessary to make childish remarks about upgrading to a semi truck to tow a wakeboard boat. I tried to be civil in my reply's and you don't want to accept the truth of the matter . I was under the impression forums are for people to post there opinions and the readers to use everyone opinions to make a somewhat educated conclusion . I hope you feel good about your internet tough guy persona . PEACE .. I'm done with this one .
Old     (timmyb)      Join Date: Apr 2007       05-27-2016, 8:43 AM Reply   
2003 Chevy Suburban - max tow capacity at 7,100 lbs and a curb weight of 5,405. If the Op had posted a pic of that Suburban towing his boat, nobody would have said a word yet it has very similar specs to the Audi Q7.
Old     (MattieK27)      Join Date: Mar 2010       05-27-2016, 8:47 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by CALIV210 View Post
I never said you couldn't tow with a smaller less adequate vehicle I said for me and safety's sake its not the wisest decision . But holy crap your argumentative .. I apologize if you felt insulted . I'm sorry you find it necessary to make childish remarks about upgrading to a semi truck to tow a wakeboard boat. I tried to be civil in my reply's and you don't want to accept the truth of the matter . I was under the impression forums are for people to post there opinions and the readers to use everyone opinions to make a somewhat educated conclusion . I hope you feel good about your internet tough guy persona . PEACE .. I'm done with this one .
I was merely trying to give you an avenue to continue "the safest rig you can afford" approach. Surely a semi is safer, right?

The only truth in this thread is people feel they need to build in some theoretical factor of safety when towing, when the auto manufacturers have already done that. Your passive aggressive response is not going to change that.
Old     (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       05-27-2016, 8:50 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by MattieK27 View Post
It depends on the lift honestly. If it is done well, with matched spring rates and damping forces; and it isn't a ridiculous lift, it should be ok. But there will be some change to the stability of the vehicle. By lifting it, you raised the center of gravity, and you changed the distance from the roll center to that COG. The lift certainly won't help towing safety.

Actually the bigger issue is the larger wheels/tires. Theoretically, going from a 30" tire to a 36" tire changes the moment arm acting on wheel/hub assembly by 3", and it now requires a good bit more force from the calipers to stop rotation.

But hey, lets beat that safety drum...
Hah, 90% of "lifted" trucks are just leveling blocks installed over the front struts, which increases towing squat significantly. I would reckon a guess that MAYBE 1% of lifted truck owners know even the slightest thing about spring rates and damping.

I'm glad that someone else here is emphasizing that safe driving is THE KEY FACTOR in safety, more than anything else here.
Old     (CALIV210)      Join Date: Jun 2015       05-27-2016, 8:52 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by MattieK27 View Post
I was merely trying to give you an avenue to continue "the safest rig you can afford" approach. Surely a semi is safer, right?

The only truth in this thread is people feel they need to build in some theoretical factor of safety when towing, when the auto manufacturers have already done that. Your passive aggressive response is not going to change that.
I'm done trying to make my point with you please lets just agree to disagree and knock off the Bull $H&T .
Old     (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       05-27-2016, 8:53 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by timmyb View Post
2003 chevy suburban - max tow capacity at 7,100 lbs and a curb weight of 5,405. If the op had posted a pic of that suburban towing his boat, nobody would have said a word yet it has very similar specs to the audi q7.
exactly
Old     (MattieK27)      Join Date: Mar 2010       05-27-2016, 8:57 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by CALIV210 View Post
I'm done trying to make my point with you please lets just agree to disagree and knock off the Bull $H&T .
Quote:
Originally Posted by CALIV210 View Post
You can try to justify your mediocre tow rigs all you want...
Do you have a point, or an agenda? Again, if you are done, stop replying.
Old     (CALIV210)      Join Date: Jun 2015       05-27-2016, 9:16 AM Reply   
replied
Old     (nautiquesonly)      Join Date: Sep 2007       05-27-2016, 9:53 AM Reply   
argue all you guys want but the simple truth is the OP admitted in the first post he is overweight according to specifications of the manufacturer. Most people are harping on his towing capacity and argue he is just a few pounds overweight. He has to also take into consideration the weight of all passengers and crap inside the vehicle. If the vehicle is fully loaded, the towing capacity would probably decrease due to the max gross combined vehicle weight rating. There is a very good chance that he is overweight on his vehicle weight as well as his towing capacity. This clearly isn't about whether or not he can afford the proper vehicle. He clearly has plenty of money or really good credit. He has 150k sitting in that picture. He bought what he wanted and if he hurts or kills someone then that's on him. He will lose his ass to any decent lawyer if he does. Both sides in this have valid arguments. I have a diesel myself and have found that most guys I know and occasionally myself gain a false sense of security from the big truck and it s ability to tow so well. I have seen many diesel trucks pulling wakeboats way too fast just because they can. I agree that this guy driving sensibly should be just fine. However that isn't going to protect him from the liability or lawsuit if he causes a problem.
Old     (sppeders)      Join Date: Jul 2011       05-27-2016, 10:23 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by timmyb View Post
Here's a question, how many in this thread feel that this would be a better tow vehicle?
as an owner of a 2002 Suruban, no chance in hell i'd tow anything larger than my 205 with it. Gutless.
Old     (jws2)      Join Date: Apr 2015       05-27-2016, 10:43 AM Reply   
I do not have not I every had a lifted vehicle, or a diesel for that matter. However the comment about lifted diesel seem a little stupid to me because no matter what weight you put on a solid from axle (ford and dodge 2500 and 3500) (or remove) the steering geometry never changes. FYI the two scientist about the Double wishbone front susp. putting two adult in the back seat of Q7 can have a major affect on the camber.....( as a matter of fact to Align a BMW x5 properly you have to have the gas tank full and all four seat loaded with 160 lbs.)
Old     (MattieK27)      Join Date: Mar 2010       05-27-2016, 12:06 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by jws2 View Post
I do not have not I every had a lifted vehicle, or a diesel for that matter. However the comment about lifted diesel seem a little stupid to me because no matter what weight you put on a solid from axle (ford and dodge 2500 and 3500) (or remove) the steering geometry never changes. FYI the two scientist about the Double wishbone front susp. putting two adult in the back seat of Q7 can have a major affect on the camber.....( as a matter of fact to Align a BMW x5 properly you have to have the gas tank full and all four seat loaded with 160 lbs.)
My question, again, since it remains unanswered...

Quote:
Originally Posted by MattieK27 View Post
Would you care to explain how a slight amount of rear squat has any effect on caster and toe?
Also, what do you consider major? How many degrees is major? How much is that poor X5 sagging from only 750lbs of weight? My point; I think you are being a bit dramatic in your claim that the sag on the Q7 will result in a feeling like you are standing on a beach ball.

Steering geometry was not the reason for discussing the lift of a solid axle vehicle. It was to point out that you need to take into account spring rate and damping (not just add some hockey pucks), that no matter how good the lift is you are sill raising the COG, and with that raised COG you increase the distance from the COG and the roll center. I don't care what way you slice it, that will result in less stability and ultimately diminished safety while towing. Since the emphasis of this thread turned to safety, I found it ironic people with big wheeled/lifted trucks were leading the rally cry.

Simple concept people. Scale your setup, make sure it is not over your vehicle's tow rating, and drive safely. Ultimately, it is up to you to define what vehicle is best. Some people want a big truck for a sense of security (and other reasons), some want a smaller tow vehicle that they can live with easier. But to try and use self proclaimed "facts" and ridiculous arguments to say something is unsafe, all in an attempt to make yourself feel better about your tow vehicle of choice? Hilarious for a bit, but it gets annoying fast...
Old     (cjh1669)      Join Date: Apr 2005       05-27-2016, 1:08 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by MattieK27 View Post
This thread is just getting better and better. Would you care to explain how a slight amount of rear squat has any effect caster and toe? Assuming it is a mcpherson strut front suspension, I will give you a slight (very very slight) change in camber will occur because of that setup's inherent dynamic camber issues; but come on, like standing on a beach ball?

Everyone keeps crying out in the name of safety, but this is the same group who thinks nothing of putting lift kits on their trucks and adding over-sized wheels and tires. That reduces stability and INCREASES braking distances. (And you want to talk about suspension geometry changes with a slight rear squat? )

Liability keeps getting brought up, over and over. Besides you the owner/driver, who is the most liable party in this equation? The manufacturer, the one with the deepest pockets. Don't you think that if anything, they would go CONSERVATIVE on their tow ratings, especially in today's lawsuit happy society? As someone who has worked in the automotive industry, let me rephrase that, manufacturers consistently give CONSERVATIVE tow ratings to their vehicles. It would be ridiculous to assume otherwise, as it is their ass on the line if it is proven the vehicle cannot handle the load it is rated at.

Will a truck with a 10k tow rating handle a 7000lb setup better than a sport utility rated at 7300lbs? Yes, but to call the SUV setup inherently dangerous? You are reaching at that point. Two very important factors in all of this, trailer brakes and the driver. Those of you hammering on the safety topic, when was the last time you checked or serviced your trailer brakes? Have you tested the force required to lock those brakes up, and made sure the actuator is performing as intended? From a driver perspective, I have seen how some people with big trucks go flying past me while trailering to the river; I have read how owners claim they can't feel a boat behind their massive mini semi. I will take a more cautious driver in the SUV over the idiot in the truck any day.

Claim you bought the giant truck in the name of safety, Claim you did it because its the most appropriate tool for the job. Those of us with half a brain know the more typical reason you bought it, and it becomes even more painfully obvious with your responses in threads like this...
Wow straw man much? When did anyone here mention lifted trucks. Now you're just reaching. to make a point.

You can't sue the manufactures unless they rated the SUV above the the limit and it was proven to be the cause. The facts are the Q7 is rated right at empty this boat, anything above is the drivers liability

You're really butt hurt over this, were you dreaming of the day you could afford a Q7 so you could go out and really tow some heavy loads?
Old     (timmyb)      Join Date: Apr 2007       05-27-2016, 1:26 PM Reply   
Small SUV's think they are like this Volvo!
Old     (MattieK27)      Join Date: Mar 2010       05-27-2016, 3:31 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by cjh1669 View Post
Wow straw man much? When did anyone here mention lifted trucks. Now you're just reaching. to make a point.

You can't sue the manufactures unless they rated the SUV above the the limit and it was proven to be the cause. The facts are the Q7 is rated right at empty this boat, anything above is the drivers liability

You're really butt hurt over this, were you dreaming of the day you could afford a Q7 so you could go out and really tow some heavy loads?
The people claiming they own trucks due to safety are the same people who make them less safe to tow with by adding lift kits and bigger wheels/tires. I mean seriously, are you incapable of making that connection?

I should probably expect that when someone's wrap up includes the phrase butt hurt, and the puzzling inference I can't afford a Q7. Well done bro, another intelligent showing on Wakeworld.
Old     (cjh1669)      Join Date: Apr 2005       05-27-2016, 5:48 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by MattieK27 View Post
The people claiming they own trucks due to safety are the same people who make them less safe to tow with by adding lift kits and bigger wheels/tires. I mean seriously, are you incapable of making that connection?

I should probably expect that when someone's wrap up includes the phrase butt hurt, and the puzzling inference I can't afford a Q7. Well done bro, another intelligent showing on Wakeworld.
Once again straw man, please reference once where someone some mentioned a lifted truck, much less did it while mentioning safety


Wait I jumped to an unsubstantiated idea? Where could I have gotten that idea after reading your post?? Sorry "bro"....
Old     (MattieK27)      Join Date: Mar 2010       05-27-2016, 6:13 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by cjh1669 View Post
Once again straw man, please reference once where someone some mentioned a lifted truck, much less did it while mentioning safety


Wait I jumped to an unsubstantiated idea? Where could I have gotten that idea after reading your post?? Sorry "bro"....
So wait, all the people having this argument about trucks all have bone stock trucks; no lift, no bigger tires, no bigger/heavier wheels? My claim is based on most tow threads and truck pictures I have seen on this site. That is hardly unsubstantiated. What was your claim around financial status based off of, besides you attempting to be the typical internet warrior?

"Straw man," "butt hurt," and an attempt to bring up financial capacity. Yep, all indicators of someone who has a lot to add to the topic of safely towing a boat. Keep crushing it bro...
Old     (CPanner)      Join Date: May 2015       05-27-2016, 8:38 PM Reply   
I've towed my G21 with a V10 Toureg (similar spec to the Q7). And my 08 F350. The Toureg gets the job done but my F350 does it a whole lot better. To say you don't feel a boat that's 7000lbs+ behind anything is is laughable though.
Old     (markj)      Join Date: Apr 2005       05-28-2016, 1:11 AM Reply   
A V10 Toureg??? Wow I never knew that existed.
Old     (markj)      Join Date: Apr 2005       05-28-2016, 1:26 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by MattieK27 View Post
So wait, all the people having this argument about trucks all have bone stock trucks; no lift, no bigger tires, no bigger/heavier wheels? My claim is based on most tow threads and truck pictures I have seen on this site. That is hardly unsubstantiated. What was your claim around financial status based off of, besides you attempting to be the typical internet warrior?

"Straw man," "butt hurt," and an attempt to bring up financial capacity. Yep, all indicators of someone who has a lot to add to the topic of safely towing a boat. Keep crushing it bro...
Earlier, you also implied people who change their wheels/tires go from 30" to 36". For the record, there is no full sized 3/4 ton truck that comes stock with only 30" tires. Personally, I went from stock to 35" tires on my 3/4 ton Ram and thought it was gonna make a big difference. Turns out after measuring the circumference of brand new stock to the new 35" tires was only 1" in circumference. Go figure.
Old     (cjh1669)      Join Date: Apr 2005       05-28-2016, 5:07 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by MattieK27 View Post
So wait, all the people having this argument about trucks all have bone stock trucks; no lift, no bigger tires, no bigger/heavier wheels? My claim is based on most tow threads and truck pictures I have seen on this site. That is hardly unsubstantiated. What was your claim around financial status based off of, besides you attempting to be the typical internet warrior?

"Straw man," "butt hurt," and an attempt to bring up financial capacity. Yep, all indicators of someone who has a lot to add to the topic of safely towing a boat. Keep crushing it bro...
I don't know if the all the people involved in this debate are running stock or not, because none of them have mentioned it, nor made statements about the safety of large lifted trucks. You're just pulling that out of thin air to try and make a point based off other unrelated conversations to try and strengthen your argument. That's what's call called a straw man fallacy, go look it up.

Much like you I did the same thing when mentioning your finances to make a point. It doesn't strengthen your argument to throw straw man fallacies around, it actually just shows the holes in it. The finance thing sure got your hackles up though, maybe I hit a nerve "bro"....
Old     (MattieK27)      Join Date: Mar 2010       05-28-2016, 6:52 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by cjh1669 View Post
I don't know if the all the people involved in this debate are running stock or not, because none of them have mentioned it, nor made statements about the safety of large lifted trucks. You're just pulling that out of thin air to try and make a point based off other unrelated conversations to try and strengthen your argument. That's what's call called a straw man fallacy, go look it up.

Much like you I did the same thing when mentioning your finances to make a point. It doesn't strengthen your argument to throw straw man fallacies around, it actually just shows the holes in it. The finance thing sure got your hackles up though, maybe I hit a nerve "bro"....
You keep getting hung up on this lifted thing, and it's ok, I get it, you don't can't connect the dots. Let me spell it out for you, with quotes from my initial post.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MattieK27 View Post
Everyone keeps crying out in the name of safety, but this is the same group who thinks nothing of putting lift kits on their trucks and adding over-sized wheels and tires. That reduces stability and INCREASES braking distances. (And you want to talk about suspension geometry changes with a slight rear squat? )
The point of bringing up lifted trucks was to highlight how ridiculous it is for this group to pretend like safety is their main objective. All the crying over stability and stopping distances, from a group of people who historically decrease stability and increase stopping distances of their trucks all in the hopes of looking cool. And to claim I am pulling the lifted truck thing out of thin air? Yea, I must have imagined all those pictures, just like I imagined all these people claiming the trucks they use are safer.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MattieK27 View Post
Will a truck with a 10k tow rating handle a 7000lb setup better than a sport utility rated at 7300lbs? Yes, but to call the SUV setup inherently dangerous? You are reaching at that point. Two very important factors in all of this, trailer brakes and the driver. Those of you hammering on the safety topic, when was the last time you checked or serviced your trailer brakes? Have you tested the force required to lock those brakes up, and made sure the actuator is performing as intended? From a driver perspective, I have seen how some people with big trucks go flying past me while trailering to the river; I have read how owners claim they can't feel a boat behind their massive mini semi. I will take a more cautious driver in the SUV over the idiot in the truck any day.
This was the main point of the original post. I definitely could see how you could get hung up on the lifted truck topic though; let me guess you own a truck?

The finance thing hardly has struck a nerve, you could infer I'm the richest or poorest person on the internet and it wouldn't matter. I merely pointed it out to highlight how pathetic your response was; you have nothing to add of substance so lets bring up finances.

So keep harping on the lifted truck thing. I mean really its all anyone has at this point, right? Vehicle weight, braking system, suspension, etc has all been sited as areas the Audi in question has huge gaps compared to a truck, yet all were shown to be very similar to the "safer" choice, a truck. I am still waiting on an explanation of how a slight amount of rear squat changes caster and toe.

I'll post up the summary of my points again for you as well, because I am sure you are already imagining the lifted-truck related response you are about to puke out:

Quote:
Originally Posted by MattieK27 View Post
Simple concept people. Scale your setup, make sure it is not over your vehicle's tow rating, and drive safely. Ultimately, it is up to you to define what vehicle is best. Some people want a big truck for a sense of security (and other reasons), some want a smaller tow vehicle that they can live with easier. But to try and use self proclaimed "facts" and ridiculous arguments to say something is unsafe, all in an attempt to make yourself feel better about your tow vehicle of choice? Hilarious for a bit, but it gets annoying fast...



Quote:
Originally Posted by markj View Post
Earlier, you also implied people who change their wheels/tires go from 30" to 36". For the record, there is no full sized 3/4 ton truck that comes stock with only 30" tires. Personally, I went from stock to 35" tires on my 3/4 ton Ram and thought it was gonna make a big difference. Turns out after measuring the circumference of brand new stock to the new 35" tires was only 1" in circumference. Go figure.
I did not imply anything, they were merely two numbers chosen for the sake of comparison, don't get hung up on the example.

The circumference is one thing to consider, but that really will only effect gearing and your odometer reading. The radius change (diameter/2) is going to have an effect on the forces seen by the braking system. Such a small circumference change means you probably only went up a half inch or so in tire size, which isn't really going to change much in braking. It is the larger changes that lead to issues. (And the weight the larger rim/tire adds)

Last edited by MattieK27; 05-28-2016 at 7:00 AM.
Old     (Blamey)      Join Date: Apr 2016       05-30-2016, 6:23 PM Reply   
Matt, I really think you hit the nail on the head. I think your posts have been thoughtfully and show an understanding of the topic and the responses you are getting seem pretty defensive and butt hurt to me. Reading this thread was really upsetting me, until you showed up with some actual info.

I do agree that OP was probably overloaded and that not safe though.
Old     (Iceberg)      Join Date: Dec 2011       06-02-2016, 9:34 PM Reply   
Doesn't anyone have brakes that work on their trailers? However, some cars tow better than some SUVs and mini-trucks. Some SUV can't tow much at all. Most larger trucks tow better than all the rest. Power doesn't mean much if the vehicle is skittish going down the road, around curves or over rough terrain.

I always can feel the trailer, but I like it best when the trailer is just following with no input or feedback on the tow vehicle. I once towed my wakeboat with my SUV 3 miles to get fuel. After about 1/2 mile I knew I would never again use that vehicle to tow my boat, and it was rated for the weight but the shorter wheel base just didn't feel right.

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