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Old     (575)      Join Date: Aug 2015       08-10-2015, 12:59 PM Reply   
Tested the G23 and the X23 this weekend. Was able to slalom behind the G, not running courses, unable to Slalom behind the X23. G killed the X in wakeboarding. The X won out on the surf, but I think that has more to do with me figuring out the surfing the day in between demos. So the X23 is out. Iam still considering the X30 but it seems like a lot of work to do to get the surf wave really dialed in. Storage in the G 23 is amazing.

I am going to test the SE450 on Friday. Looking for opinions/knowledge about the Supra and comparisons. I really don't know much about the Supras. Seems like I should probably wait for the 2016's.

Thanks in advance for any help.
Old     (chrisbucklin)      Join Date: Mar 2012       08-10-2015, 6:14 PM Reply   
I love my se550. I don't think u would b disappointed. The surf is amazing... for boarding we got the wake dialed in..I pulled a tournament last week,with nothing but great reviews from the riders (many liked wake better than the g) I hope I can get a 2016, with the upgrades that they did to the sa.. good luck,and let us know ur thoughts.
Old     (chrisbucklin)      Join Date: Mar 2012       08-10-2015, 6:15 PM Reply   
Btw,never road behind the Mastercraft. Have a friend with a x2,and it ain't nothing,can't even compare...
Old     (Nordicron)      Join Date: Aug 2011       08-10-2015, 6:32 PM Reply   
I rode a full factory SE 450 last weekend and wake was pretty nice reminded me a lot of the G. Was a beefy wake with a decent kick. Very easy wake to hit didn't seem at all finicky. I liked it a lot but honestly it wasn't as big and didn't have that nice boost like a G has. Boat was nicely put together and seemed quality. My daughter rode the goofy wave and loved it said it had great push and super easy to ride. Prob was a bigger wave than the G but maybe a tad shorter in length. I don't care about surfing so didn't try it nor have I surfed a G. Other thing I didn't care for on the SE was it took a long long time to plane out! Supposedly this is fixed in 2016 with a type of autolaunch system.
But overall the G would still be my dream boat! It would be the boat I'd take without question assuming I'd just won the lottery!
Old     (chrisbucklin)      Join Date: Mar 2012       08-10-2015, 6:40 PM Reply   
I put the 1050's in my se,and I think my surf us longer than the g. U can fall way back,and have no problem getting back. It almost takes the work out of surfing. Really easy to teach ppl! Can speak on plaining out,the 550 has no problems.
Old     (Shane10p)      Join Date: Jul 2013       08-10-2015, 8:19 PM Reply   
I've had the opportunity to spend a decent amount of time in the G23 & G21 and currently own a SE450. All are great boat and have pros and cons , to get the G surfing well it takes extra weight my buddy Is running a full PNP system in his G23 to get it surfing well. The Gs have some really cool features that I really like unfortunately none of them really have to do with the wake .... Love the vent windows , the ability to add more color to accent pieces on the tower and have always loved the Seadeck in the G. We've spent a lot of time with the G23 and my SE on the water together and everyone said hands down the surf wave was better on the SE. As far as Wakeboarding goes I think the G is a touch better stock but with a little nose weight in the SE both boats have extremely good wakes that are most likely bigger than most will ever need. I think hands down the SE is better handling the G which is very slow and sluggish to move around at speed. My SA I had last year was a great handling boat and my SE is no different even when heavily weighted. The Raptor power plant is phenomenal and seems to be doing very well on fuel consumption and has tons of power . I belive the SE is a bit more user friendly for buddies driving, the screen is very easy to navigate and they seem to have no questions while driving. Even when I get in the G I want to hit the screen thinking its a touch screen which drives me nuts ! I've heard Supra will possibly be offering some different flooring options for 2016 which will be great since this year I did aftermarket flooring by GatorStep to eliminate carpet in mine. Teh price tag on the SE is a whole lot sexier than both the Mastercraft and especially the G series. Take a good look at the SE I think you will be very impressed good luck with your decision all three are awesome boats.

Last edited by Shane10p; 08-10-2015 at 8:21 PM. Reason: Spelling
Old     (chrisbucklin)      Join Date: Mar 2012       08-11-2015, 1:29 AM Reply   
Very well said. Yes u can now get a new floor for the supra,and u will like it!
Old     (Bit)      Join Date: Aug 2014       08-11-2015, 2:09 AM Reply   
Would be no question for me - 2016 G23 - improved hull, new engine... But hey, maybe you like the Supra more... let us know how the testing was.
Old     (Froggy)      Join Date: Nov 2013       08-12-2015, 5:28 AM Reply   
How much is the Supra compared to the G ? How do they stack up at resale?
Old     (Fixable)      Join Date: Oct 2012       08-12-2015, 6:23 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisbucklin View Post
Btw,never road behind the Mastercraft. Have a friend with a x2,and it ain't nothing,can't even compare...
What??? Your 24' latest gen surf/wake boat had better wakes than a little 20' crossover that was designed 10 years ago??!?! I don't believe it......
Old     (Nordicron)      Join Date: Aug 2011       08-12-2015, 6:24 AM Reply   
Froggy,
I'd have to guess that a SE can likely be had for about 10-15k less pretty easy over a comparable G23. But a SE is atleast on paper about the size of a G25.
Old     (Nordicron)      Join Date: Aug 2011       08-12-2015, 6:25 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fixable View Post
What??? Your 24' latest gen surf/wake boat had better wakes than a little 20' crossover that was designed 10 years ago??!?! I don't believe it......
Load enough weight in a x2 and it throws a pretty dang nice wake I thought!
Old     (chrisbucklin)      Join Date: Mar 2012       08-12-2015, 6:29 AM Reply   
All I was saying was that was the only mastercraft I have been in,so I couldnt compare it. Simple as that. No harm done. We don't have many mastercrafts around here. No big deal.....
Old     (575)      Join Date: Aug 2015       08-15-2015, 9:03 PM Reply   
So I finished my test run this morning with Supra SE450. We started out on Friday night but the wake went south on us after my kids had a ride. Turned out on of the fuses came out and the swell system was disabled. Minor problem but concerning that it happened. Anyways my 7 yr old ditched the rope. It was awesome. here is a link https://www.facebook.com/parksmarinaokoboji?fref=ts
leave a comment if you can. He is feeling like a rock star.

The slalom wake on the SE450 is very skiable. Wish I had a better run behind the G23 to compare. I think the SE450 wave is smaller but the G wake felt softer. Overall both are much better than the x23. The supra did not pull me out of the water as nicely as either the G23 or X23. I definitely had to fight more. I noticed this as well with my 9 yr old that he did not come out of the water as easily either.
The wakeboard wake was nice and clean at 19 mph for my kids. Very comparable to the G23. The X23 wake at that speed was a washed up mess.
The surf wake on SE450 looks huge. My 7 yr old is able to ride it. My 9 yr old also rode it nicely. I was able to ride it. Felt the X23 wake had more push and length as well as the G23. Harder to recover when falling back and felt I had to ride a lot closer to the boat. Of course this could just as easily be due to the rider.

As stated before I've ruled out the X23 due to not being able to slalom behind it.
My front runners now are the G23 and SE 450. I'm curious if the SA450 is more comparable to G23 and SE450 is like the G25.
I love all the storage in the G23 with all the ballast being hidden. I feel like if I needed to it would be easy to add some extra weight. The SE450 does not have nearly as much storage and the ballast take up a lot of space that is storage space in the G23. I feel like the SE450 could probably use some more weight due to the size of the boat, but where do you put it. I don't want to pay a 100,000 for a boat then put a fat sac on the back seat. I like that the supra has buttons but of course I did accidentally hit the ballast switches to empty twice that are near the throttle. The helm's chairs in both are very nice. I did really like the height adjustment in the Supra. Super cool.
The racks are nicer in the Supra, don't have to use the bungi cord.

As I right this out I'm realizing I have more checks in the favor column for the Supra than the Nautique. I guess part of my hang up is that i'm just not as familiar with Supras. To me the names growing up were mastercraft and nautique and i'm must still be a little hung up on that. In my mind I wonder if the resale value of the nautique won't be better than the supra. If the supra had the same storage I know I would totally be sold on it.

anyways, if anyone can add any insight to my decision it is much appreciated. And if you have any questions comparing the two please ask, it might make me think of something I hadn't realized.

Thanks
Old     (wolfe_drew)      Join Date: Mar 2010       08-15-2015, 9:25 PM Reply   
The Supra SG at 23' 8" may be more comparable to a G23 than the SE. Just about the same boat from the cockpit to stern with almost identical performance.
Old     (chrisbucklin)      Join Date: Mar 2012       08-16-2015, 5:28 AM Reply   
I couldnt agree more on the storage. The g rocks in that department. I live on river,so it ain't that bad. We pack a cooler and u grab the jacket u need,and we go. I also took out the I think 750's,whatever stock was,and put the 1150's in back. So I lost more room. When u need to ride big, (not all the time 4 us),then u have to pull cooler out. Big bags take up all locker space. But it's worth it. Ppl love the wake. Then get some 50lb bags of lead,and snug them right under front bags. Don't even know they r there. Like 2-300 most and seems to rock!
Old     (Shane10p)      Join Date: Jul 2013       08-19-2015, 8:29 AM Reply   
The storage aspect is where I think the SE wins , both of the G23s I've been on have been running a full PNP system as well so they to have lost storage space. This is where I think the SE wins with space as for the SE being more comparable to the G25 no doubt in size it's closer. I've had mine next to a G25 before and are very close in size but I've only been told never seen it that the 25 doesn't seem to surf or wakeboard that well. Supra was never on my radar either before 2013 but they are in the running as a top boat now and I think this thread proves that. The G23 has been the boat that everyone compares to and in its first year the SE is now being compared to it and seems to be beating it in some aspects of what consumers want. Bummer to hear about the Swell system having a minor hang up can't say I've ever heard of that happening and am pretty sure it isn't something that's a problem. I've loved my SE and once it sells will be getting right back into a 2016 SE.
Old     (schmo)      Join Date: Oct 2003       08-20-2015, 7:48 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shane10p View Post
The storage aspect is where I think the SE wins , both of the G23s I've been on have been running a full PNP system as well so they to have lost storage space. This is where I think the SE wins with space as for the SE being more comparable to the G25 no doubt in size it's closer. I've had mine next to a G25 before and are very close in size but I've only been told never seen it that the 25 doesn't seem to surf or wakeboard that well. Supra was never on my radar either before 2013 but they are in the running as a top boat now and I think this thread proves that. The G23 has been the boat that everyone compares to and in its first year the SE is now being compared to it and seems to be beating it in some aspects of what consumers want. Bummer to hear about the Swell system having a minor hang up can't say I've ever heard of that happening and am pretty sure it isn't something that's a problem. I've loved my SE and once it sells will be getting right back into a 2016 SE.
I think you aren't comparing apples to apples here. The G23, running stock ballast will have a wake that is unmatched. That stock is ALL under the floor. Maybe you can say the SE with PNP is in the same range, but that G still has all that storage (rear lockers, huge area under passenger windshield,etc. If you have only been on 2 G23s with PNP added, that wake was likely insane and an SE would need bags and/or lead all over the place to compare.

No disrespect to Supra as I have owned several, but you have to keep apples to apples comparisons.
Old     (Shane10p)      Join Date: Jul 2013       08-20-2015, 2:18 PM Reply   
So what is apples to apples with the G23 ? Sure seems to me like the SE is about as close as it comes to going head to head with the G series.
Old     (brianinpdx)      Join Date: Aug 2009       08-20-2015, 4:40 PM Reply   
I don't usually jump in these threads of which boat is better... I spent last weekend traveling at the Moomba Supra Jam @ BethyCreek TX. On Sunday I had the pleasure of going out with pro surfer Parker Payne and his family on their SE550 (I think it was a 550). It is hands down the nicest surf wave I've ever been on. The push on this wave is out of this world. Not to mention the build quality on the Supra felt fantastic.

I spend a lot of time on a lot of different boats - some have great waves, with no push. Some have great push with no wave. And other boats are totally random. The SE was hands down the most push I'd ever been on. I'd post me surfing it...but I'm a geezer. Here's a quick Instagram video I posted @parkerpaynesurf. This kid TEARS ITUP.







This wave has so much push its crazy. Truth in advertising--I was told they run #1500lb sacks on either side + the factory ballast.

I sure had a good time. Parker Family your good people. Thanks for the day!

-Brian@Exile
Old     (Nordicron)      Join Date: Aug 2011       08-20-2015, 4:49 PM Reply   
Brian I think what u meant was they ran 1500 bags in back plus stock front? Cuz they way I understand the SE atleast is it is factory bags. No hard tanks so there really isn't plug and play. U just take out the factory bags and put in larger aftermarket bags which is what u probably rode.
Here's a pic of factory bags with my daughter riding. She said it was probably better atleast goofy side than was the g23. As for wakeboard wake on the SE vs G no comparison really. g was way bigger and popped u way more. But wake shape was outstanding on the SE and I imagine with more weight it would get to G size and shape.
Old     (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       08-20-2015, 5:17 PM Reply   
Nobody cares about surf waves...
Old     (DatTexasBoy)      Join Date: Aug 2012       08-20-2015, 6:44 PM Reply   
Well if you want to compare Wakeboard wakes. I'll put the new SA up against it. Call me what you want CRAZY, doesn't matter. Go ride one and get back to me. It's stupid good. I won't say it's better, but they are pretty close to me. Maybe too close to call one way or the other.
Old     (King12)      Join Date: Jul 2012       08-20-2015, 6:52 PM Reply   
I've heard really great things about the SG unlisted surf wave from someone on CCC
Old     (schmo)      Join Date: Oct 2003       08-21-2015, 9:56 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shane10p View Post
So what is apples to apples with the G23 ? Sure seems to me like the SE is about as close as it comes to going head to head with the G series.
I didn't say that comparing the G23 and the SE wasn't apples to apples. The statement was that the SE had more storage than the G23 with ballast full because you said that both G23s you rode on had sacs in the lockers using that space. I assure you this is not the norm.

My point is that most will argue that the G23 with stock ballast (and all storage compartments available) will throw as good (if not better) wake than an SE with it's ballast full and a lot of the rear locker space consumed by that ballast.

As others have said, the G23 is king if you like leaving all of your stuff in the rear lockers when you go wakeboarding. World class wake and no compromise on storage.

Last edited by schmo; 08-21-2015 at 10:05 AM. Reason: Typo
Old     (schmo)      Join Date: Oct 2003       08-21-2015, 10:01 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by DatTexasBoy View Post
Well if you want to compare Wakeboard wakes. I'll put the new SA up against it. Call me what you want CRAZY, doesn't matter. Go ride one and get back to me. It's stupid good. I won't say it's better, but they are pretty close to me. Maybe too close to call one way or the other.
If this is in reference to my comments, I am not going to call you crazy. It may be a comparable wake as I think there are a lot of boats that throw world class wakes. My comment was strictly around the amazing storage in the G23 which throws that world class wake without any compromise on storage. That comparable wake in the SA is probably taking up a good chunk (if not all) of the rear lockers, isn't it? If not, I stand corrected.

Storage isn't important for all, but it was a big selling point for me. I can leave four wakeboards, numerous life jackets, etc in my rear lockers while wakeboarding and still have a fantastic wake. In my Supra, I had to pull everything out of the rear lockers. For some, not a big deal...
Old     (DatTexasBoy)      Join Date: Aug 2012       08-21-2015, 10:04 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by schmo View Post
If this is in reference to my comments, I am not going to call you crazy. It may be a comparable wake as I think there are a lot of boats that throw world class wakes. My comment was strictly around the amazing storage in the G23 which throws that world class wake without any compromise on storage. That comparable wake in the SA is probably taking up a good chunk (if not all) of the rear lockers, isn't it? If not, I stand corrected.

Storage isn't important for all, but it was a big selling point for me. I can leave four wakeboards, numerous life jackets, etc in my rear lockers while wakeboarding and still have a fantastic wake. In my Supra, I had to pull everything out of the rear lockers. For some, not a big deal...
No wasn't aimed at you. Yes the bags do take up space in lockers. But the wake on this boat is more than comparable, it's a true contender.
Old     (schmo)      Join Date: Oct 2003       08-21-2015, 10:07 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by DatTexasBoy View Post
No wasn't aimed at you. Yes the bags do take up space in lockers. But the wake on this boat is more than comparable, it's a true contender.
Isn't comparable basically the same as contender? Comparable - of equivalent quality; worthy of comparison.

Something of equivalent quality is certainly a contender.

Old     (DatTexasBoy)      Join Date: Aug 2012       08-21-2015, 10:11 AM Reply   
OK. I'm from East Texas, cut me some slack. Lol.
Old     (501s)      Join Date: Feb 2010       08-21-2015, 12:56 PM Reply   
All this talk about Supra wakes that are as good or better than a G23 makes me want to see the photos? The closest things I've seen is some of the footage from the PWT of the SE and while it looked good I wouldn't say "as good or better". There was some wash sometimes. Anyways, you Supra guys should post some photos of this wakeboarding wake that rivals a loaded G.
Old     (migs)      Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: SF Bay Area       08-21-2015, 1:22 PM Reply   
NO wake comes close to the G wake. Face it.
You can throw 6,000 lbs on another boat, & yeah it'll be huge, but it still wont be in the realm of the G.
Look at the vids of the Nautique pulled events & watch the PWT or the Xgames - watch how much more effortlessly the riders ride behind the G compared to the SE & the star. Look at where they finish their tricks in the air. Watch the double flips.
Old     (Ttime41)      Join Date: Nov 2011       08-21-2015, 1:35 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by migs View Post
NO wake comes close to the G wake. Face it.
You can throw 6,000 lbs on another boat, & yeah it'll be huge, but it still wont be in the realm of the G.
Look at the vids of the Nautique pulled events & watch the PWT or the Xgames - watch how much more effortlessly the riders ride behind the G compared to the SE & the star. Look at where they finish their tricks in the air. Watch the double flips.
Saying that a boat that you've never seen in person, let alone been in, doesn't compare to a G is pretty ridiculous. I've seen the stock wake on the SA in person and trust me, I can't tell a difference from the boat between it and a G. Come back with some input when you've seen/ridden both wakes.
Old     (migs)      Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: SF Bay Area       08-21-2015, 1:40 PM Reply   
Ive been in & ridden behind the SE, G & Star more than 2 dozen times.
Old     (Ttime41)      Join Date: Nov 2011       08-21-2015, 2:17 PM Reply   
My bad, my post was in reference to the SA (was thinking of another thread). Though, saying "NO wake comes close to the to the G" still implies that you've experienced all of its main competitors, and the 2016 SA is certainly one.
Old     (migs)      Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: SF Bay Area       08-21-2015, 2:18 PM Reply   
^^^Ive ridden the 2015 SA's, not the 2016 though.
Old     (Nordicron)      Join Date: Aug 2011       08-21-2015, 5:42 PM Reply   
I agree with migs about the effortlessness of the G and its size during the pro competitions. I thought the same things. I do think the SE comes very close to the G in terms of shape and was told by supra factory peeps that the new SA is basically just a shorter version of the SE. Storage space be darned if a SA is gonna come in $25k cheaper than a G I think it will take some customers away!
Old     (tn_rider)      Join Date: Dec 2009       08-21-2015, 6:31 PM Reply   
The rumor is Malibu will release a G sized boat in November. May be worth the wait to see what they come up with.
Old     (laptom)      Join Date: Apr 2002       08-22-2015, 12:07 PM Reply   
G sized boat? 21, 23 or 25ft? I think Bu already got those sizes.
Old     (Gary)      Join Date: Mar 2010       08-22-2015, 12:13 PM Reply   
I have not heard anything but I would not shock me if the redesign the MXZ
Old     (DatTexasBoy)      Join Date: Aug 2012       08-22-2015, 12:43 PM Reply   
2016 Supra SA



Here you go. A picture is good but it doesn't show you how it rides. I've ridden both and own one. This boat is the real deal. And yes I love the G.
Old     (575)      Join Date: Aug 2015       08-22-2015, 12:53 PM Reply   
What's everyone's opinion on the SG vs the SE. We are on a busy lake with big chop. Worried about taking water on with the SE pickle fork and thought maybe the SG traditional bow might be better. Also wondering if the SG will surf better.

Thanks
Old     (Ewok01)      Join Date: Apr 2013       08-22-2015, 1:15 PM Reply   
I've heard that some people prefer the SE over the SG for the surf wave. I like the looks of the SG over the SE but that's personal preference. I don't think it will matter much on either bow for taking or dunking the bow. They both sit pretty high in the water and I've seen people dunk regular bow boats just as easily as pickle forks. It's all about the driver.
Old     (laptom)      Join Date: Apr 2002       08-22-2015, 2:34 PM Reply   
Not to bash Supra, but the G surf wake is really not that bad as people say here. It is Cent level if not better.
Old     (Rusty)      Join Date: Mar 2014       08-22-2015, 2:46 PM Reply   
I don't think anyone has said the G wake is bad...
Old     (migs)      Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: SF Bay Area       08-22-2015, 4:00 PM Reply   
^^^^^ how much weight is that SA running on that wake pic?
Old     (tn_rider)      Join Date: Dec 2009       08-22-2015, 5:28 PM Reply   
Old     (DatTexasBoy)      Join Date: Aug 2012       08-22-2015, 6:45 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by migs View Post
^^^^^ how much weight is that SA running on that wake pic?
Probably ##2800 plus two people and gear.
Old     (575)      Join Date: Aug 2015       08-23-2015, 7:54 AM Reply   
DTB
How much of a difference does the Swell 2 surf system make over the original swell surf.
Old     (DatTexasBoy)      Join Date: Aug 2012       08-23-2015, 11:32 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by 575 View Post
DTB
How much of a difference does the Swell 2 surf system make over the original swell surf.
I really can't answer that. I have been on one with the original swell but not sure I can tell. A whole lot. You may need less weight and the waves are cleaner possibly. That's all my opinion for what it's worth.

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