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Old    fordman            05-10-2004, 7:35 AM Reply   
I am looking for some thoughts on the following

I was looking at a Sanger that turned out to have a crack in the block.

How much $$ am I looking at to replace it,and is it worth my trouble if i can get the boat for a good price.

What is the difference between a marine block and a regular automotive block?

Old    wakesideup            05-10-2004, 7:55 AM Reply   
Depending on how big the crack is, you can have the blocked repaired for about $500. Basically the crack is honed out and there is some metal compound (buggle gum for the block) that fills the crack.

My blocked cracked when I missed one drain plug and did the the bubble gum thing and it lasted for 6+ years until the boat died of other unrelated causes.

Good Luck!
Old    tlk            05-10-2004, 8:26 AM Reply   
You need to check if the inner wall is also cracked, usually the oil will turn a milkly color. If the inner wall is cracked you're looking at about $4500...
Old    wakesideup            05-10-2004, 8:43 AM Reply   
tlk is right - if it is the inner wall that is cracked, it is time for a new engine/block. The bubble gum will only work for the outer wall, which is the one most often to fail since it is usually thinner.
Old     (bluesman)      Join Date: Oct 2002       05-10-2004, 8:45 AM Reply   
We had a cracked block in our Nautique. We went with a new "crate motor". It ran just a bit over 5K.
Old     (ktm250)      Join Date: Jan 2003       05-10-2004, 9:32 AM Reply   
Check out Jasper Marine engines. They are the world's largest engine rebuilder. Year make and model will determine price. The engine also comes with a 3 year warranty that includes labor. Many boat dealers refurb boats this way.
Old    nooner            05-10-2004, 1:11 PM Reply   
Dont even think about putting some kinda of BS filler to fix a crack in a block. Go to a junk yard get another block from an automobile. Probably around $150. Take it to a machine shop to prep and use all the internals off your old block. You might end up having to buy some new pistons that would probably be it. I paid $1,500 to have a used block and heads from a junkyard, new pistons, new oil pump, new timing chain and they were able to reuse the cam,crank,rods, and valtrain. They built it for me. All I had to do is bolt it back in and crank it up. Has run great for 3yrs now.
Old    fordman            05-10-2004, 2:10 PM Reply   
Isn't there a difference between and automotive motor and a marine one?

I was quoted $3300 for a mercury long block

I can get a brand new GM crate motor for around $1600.

Can anyone confirm that there is a difference?


Old     (bob)      Join Date: Feb 2001       05-10-2004, 10:14 PM Reply   
gasket are definitely different and i dont think the crate motor was designed to rev at 5k all day long and live to tell about it?? Heads are probably ported better or the casting cleaned up, oh and im sure the cam is going to be different. Where is the crack? A buddy had a minor winter accident where the block froze and he had a shop weld the crack/gaping hole closed and it ran fine afterwards, make sure the cylinders and crank were not adversly affected and you can just weld it up.
Old    bigd            05-11-2004, 6:47 AM Reply   
Marine and auto blocks are the same.
Old    tommyadrian5            05-11-2004, 7:19 AM Reply   
the block itself is the same, but the camshaft, pistons, rods, and bearings are upgraded.
Old     (ktm250)      Join Date: Jan 2003       05-11-2004, 10:06 AM Reply   
Marine and automotive engines these days are pretty much the same. Indmar and others that maranize marine engines install proprietary cam shafts, intake systems and sometimes ignition systems...but for the most part do not "build" engines. They buy (in bulk) engine assemblies and make their modifications that have been tested and approved by the OEM manufacturers (validated for warranty issues). The days of the “marine” block (which was manufactured by Ford) are long gone, as they are not required in most applications. If you feel that you application requires such both Ford and GM offer HD blocks with special features such as increased nickel content to make the cast Iron “harder”. These specialty blocks typically weigh considerably more than the street going counter part due to increased wall thickness, increased deck thickness and increased cylinder wall thickness for large bore applications. It would be cost prohibitive and for the most part unnecessary for a marine engine supplier to change such things as pistons, rods, crank and such. I say “unnecessary” for the most part as engine failures are now almost non-existent due to part failure…just like oil related failures, you just don’t hear about them really anymore. GM stopped “wet” testing there engines years ago. The warranty cost of the .001% that failed was a drop in the bucket compared to the cost of wet testing each engine. All that being said I am not a fan of “snap cap” powdered metal connecting rods, hypereutectic pistons or rolled fillet cast crank shafts…I guess they have there place but I would prefer if it was not in my engine.

Before somebody calls me out on this…specialty engines like the Malibu Callaway stuff are exceptions to the above rules, I am referring to massed produced OEM engines.

Hopefully this sheds some light on the subject for you. I would still go to Jasper and call it a day.
Old    fordman            05-11-2004, 12:12 PM Reply   
thanks to all of you that shared your thoughts. I haven't heard back from the seller. (He was pretty discouraged on the phone) thank goodness I was dealing with someone honest or I could have possibly missed the crack (very small weep) and ended up with this problem sitting in my driveway. I think the lesson I learned is before I buy a boat someone (mechanic) is going to look it over.

I will follow up with Jasper and see how it goes.

thanks again.
Old     (wiltok)      Join Date: Feb 2003       05-11-2004, 12:27 PM Reply   
Unless the guy is practically giving it away or for some reason the boat is unique - why bother? There are plenty of working boats out there - plus on the resale you have an older boat with a newer engine. Maybe that's a benefit to some - but I personally would rather have the original - you never know what problems could happen from the install. I'm not a mechanic - just my opinion.


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