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Old     (parker)      Join Date: May 2007       05-13-2007, 9:22 PM Reply   
I am looking to buy a used boat, price is similar on both and will be test driving them on Wednesday but wanted to know if anyone had any experience with both/either of these wakes? Avalanche: 22' 22'' Merc 330 HP - or - SAN 210 21' PCM 330HP. These are both in my price range which is limiting but I want something that I can use for the next five years and not regret the purchase.

Thanks in advance!
Old     (boarder_x)      Join Date: Mar 2006       05-13-2007, 9:23 PM Reply   
Uhh... SAN!
Old     (wake_upppp)      Join Date: Nov 2003       05-13-2007, 9:27 PM Reply   
SAN 210 all the way over the Centurion but that's just me...Or a Sanger V210 and save 5 to 10k.
Old     (parker)      Join Date: May 2007       05-13-2007, 9:31 PM Reply   
Thanks, this is my first boat purchase (obviously) and the room and size of the Avalanche was nice but I had never heard of them. I just want to make sure I didn't overlook anything I didn't know about the centurion, I can find the same amount of info on it online that either says it's a great boat as I can that it's a heavy, difficult to drive boat.
Old     (abhoe157)      Join Date: Feb 2007       05-13-2007, 9:35 PM Reply   
SAN 210, its not difficult at all to drive. My opinion is the 210s the better boat so go with it.
Old     (wake_upppp)      Join Date: Nov 2003       05-13-2007, 9:39 PM Reply   
The only drawback to the SAN 210 is it's a little small inside and somewhat sensitive to weight distribution, that said, it's among the top wakes ever thrown from a comp boat.
Old     (poser007)      Join Date: Nov 2004       05-13-2007, 11:07 PM Reply   
I never liked Sans but over the years they have grown on me. I know they are an awesome boat and built well I just have never liked the look of them. I would say San but I also like the Avalanche, have road in both and the Avalanche has a great wake not to mention a very good surf wake. I have never surfed behind a san though. I would test drive them both and find out for yourself
Old     (05mobiuslsv)      Join Date: Apr 2006       05-14-2007, 12:05 AM Reply   
Is this a joke, SAN no comparison.
Old     (parker)      Join Date: May 2007       05-14-2007, 12:47 AM Reply   
No joke, just trying to decide between a boat that would fit my family comfortably and possibly have a decent wake and a boat that may not be super comfortable but have a great wake. I think this post may have helped point me in the right direction. I'll know after the test drive.
Old     (wakesetter101)      Join Date: Oct 2005       05-14-2007, 5:52 AM Reply   
Test drive them both.
Old     (holloway0105)      Join Date: May 2007       05-14-2007, 6:59 AM Reply   
I had a SAN 210 and put over a 1,000 hours on it with no problems and an awesome wake. Not familiar w/the other though.
Old     (deuce)      Join Date: Mar 2002       05-14-2007, 7:50 AM Reply   
I have a '03 SAN and love the boat. When you say a boat to fit you and your family, how many people are you talking?

As stated above, the SAN is limited with space. 6 people are fine, if you plan on regularly going out with more than that...I am not sure it would be a great boat for you.

We get my wife, 2 kids and some friends out and we are pushing space with gear and everything.

That said, I LOVE my boat and have no plans to get anything else.

My friend has an Avalanche and it is a great boat with a great wake. Feels much bigger than my boat.

I wouldn't trade, but Hell, he may not trade with me.... Everyone has different things that make a boat perfect for them...

best of luck in your search.
Old     (etakk7)      Join Date: Apr 2006       05-14-2007, 8:43 AM Reply   
I think the Avalanche has great interior space and decent build quality, but the wake doesn't compare to a VLX or XStar/205V. I've got no experience with the 210 but everyone on here says it is the best in the business (or one of).

One thing you might want to check for is the vinyl. Centurian had vinyl issues that they corrected I believe in 04? I know somebody who bought an 03 and had to have it repaired within the first year.

If the price is close I'd get the 210 for the resale value alone.

(Message edited by etakk7 on May 14, 2007)
Old     (gymboarder)      Join Date: Feb 2003       05-14-2007, 9:09 AM Reply   
Parker,
Hands down SAN. I have owned both an avalanche (02)and a SAN(04). The only area that the avlanche is better than the SAN is the interior space. The SAN has a smaller interior but if your not into taking 10 people out with you then who cares. I mainly ride with 4 people in our SAN and there is plenty of room. The SAN will also throw a better wake (only my opinion). The wakes from the Avy to the SAN are totally different. The SAN is also going to have a better resale value as well as handle better. I can literally drive my SAN with two fingers. With the Avy the driver has to put effort into steering it.
Like other have said test drive both weight them down and you will notice the difference.
Trust me I have owned both and the SAN is the way to go.
Old     (tommyg)      Join Date: Apr 2002       05-14-2007, 9:10 AM Reply   
I have an '02 SAN, definitely highly recommend it. Top notch boat, and great quality.

the only thing I would check on an '02 is to see if the digital gauges have been replaced. They were awful, and Nautique will generally sell you replacement analog gauges at cost (plus installation). If they haven't been replaced, factor that into the cost...
Old     (parker)      Join Date: May 2007       05-14-2007, 9:29 AM Reply   
wow, thanks guys I appreciate all the input. I'll check into the guages, vinyl etc... So here's what I got:

SAN: wake, better resale, smaller interior, easy to drive, weight distribution can be an issue.

Avalanche: decent wake, larger interior space, harder to drive, vinyl issues.

Got it.
Old     (bmartin)      Join Date: Jan 2007       05-14-2007, 2:59 PM Reply   
I'm not sure if the Avalanche is harder to drive maybe because it is bigger but that shouldn't be a big issue. I think the Nautis can be difficult to drive because the prop rotation is backwards causing the boat to drift over the passenger side when in reverse, but again not a big deal.

One thing to consider is that the SAN has a very steep wake that a lot of peole love and is well suited for people that are good riders, but casing the wake and landing short is very unforgiving. There isn't a large landing area on the SANs and I would not reccommend that boat to learn behind.

A lot of people love their SANs and I never turn down a ride to go behind one, but personally I wouldn't have one at the prices they sell for. You should be able to get a Centurion for somewhat less, but you are comparing 2 different size boats. The Avelanch being one of the bigger in the Centurion line up and the 210 being the smaller in the Nauti line up.
Old     (krbaugh)      Join Date: Mar 2002       05-14-2007, 3:14 PM Reply   
good points Bmartin!

I am not sure what you could say is hard to drive about an AVY. Drives in s Straight line when you want it to and turns when you tell it to. Backs to the drivers side.

AVY is
22' Long with a 100' beam Way bigger boat than the 210!

(Message edited by krbaugh on May 14, 2007)
Old     (boss210)      Join Date: Jun 2006       05-14-2007, 3:42 PM Reply   
the nat will go toward the drivers (rt) side when in rev. And no question about it go with the Natique all the way. My brother has the avalanch and the build quality is like comparing a hyundai to a benz
Old     (trx1noob)      Join Date: Sep 2006       05-14-2007, 4:17 PM Reply   
Phillip, I'm always hearing about build quality comparisons. this ain't a bash, but can you tell me specifically what you found in build differences to make the nati so much superior?? did you pull all the seats out of the boat, and the floors up and engine out to check out these differences?? I'm really really curious as to how you found this out to make a claim like that. If nati made a boat and a tower that looked like that kinda match up, i might consider buying one. i just can't get past the look though. I've heard the nati's put out awesome surf wake on both sides, starboard being the best with the reverse prop. next question for you parker is dealers, which one is going to treat you the best with service??
Old     (deuce)      Join Date: Mar 2002       05-14-2007, 4:40 PM Reply   
I have no issues with how my '03 SAN looks...??? Think it matches up fine... In fact, has a classic look if I say so myself.

I am staying out of the build comparison... Look them over and decide for yourself. I am not a boat engineer or a builder for that matter.... I don't discuss build, wake, resale....bla..bla...bal.... Boats are boats, buy what you like....

The '02 SAN will pull to the left(port I believe it is called).... I have never seen it as an issue???? Not sure if others think it is....

Anyway....having a boat is better than not having a boat. I think the biggest deciding factor right now is deciding if the SAN is big enough for you and the family... If not, the decision is already made....
Old     (deuce)      Join Date: Mar 2002       05-14-2007, 4:45 PM Reply   
Think the boat, windshield and tower lines match up great.....
Upload
Old     (wake_upppp)      Join Date: Nov 2003       05-14-2007, 5:19 PM Reply   
"One thing to consider is that the SAN has a very steep wake"

Not totaly true. All depends how it's weighted and riding speed.
Old     (boss210)      Join Date: Jun 2006       05-14-2007, 5:55 PM Reply   
why thanks for asking. I have been under the floor of both boats, and the way the wiring harnis is strung and quality of it is much better on the nati. Also the seats when compaired are finished off much better and the quality of meteral is higher. The staples under the seats don`t show at all on a nati. The grafixs are not stickers but part of the gelcoat, and are very classy and timeless.
Old     (rkinsell)      Join Date: May 2005       05-14-2007, 6:27 PM Reply   
not to mention Correct Craft has an extra 54 years on Centurion of perfecting boats
Old     (parker)      Join Date: May 2007       05-14-2007, 7:55 PM Reply   
Both are at the same dealer, dealer is great. But also found one 03SAN that a guy moving back east is selling near here with warranty. Man these decisions get harder and harder. But you're right Boat is better than no boat.
Old     (krbaugh)      Join Date: Mar 2002       05-14-2007, 8:11 PM Reply   
Phillip Van Every (boss210)
Centurion Graphics are NOT stickers nor do they use tape for pin stripes.

What are the Nauty seats built from?
How is the wiring better?
Old     (kingskrew)      Join Date: May 2004       05-14-2007, 8:25 PM Reply   
Another vote for SAN.

-Steve
Old     (csparks13)      Join Date: Apr 2004       05-14-2007, 8:30 PM Reply   
SAN all the way!
Old     (trx1noob)      Join Date: Sep 2006       05-14-2007, 8:45 PM Reply   
sorry boys, but the base part of your tower does not match the angle of the windshield. looks like they just plopped the first tower they saw onto the boat. just remember, you boys have no problem throwing your opinion about centurion in here. these are just my thoughts. nati would be in my top 3 for a next boat, so i aint' bashing them.

phillip, whens the last time your wiring made your boat throw a better wake?? I was just at a dealership and belive i saw a big fat natique decal right on the side of a 210 and a 220. musta been a decal goblin running through that dealership that day. staples not showing, that make a wake better??? give me a break buddy, just checked my dads wakesetter and my enzo, not seeing any staples, so my wakes gotta be better this week now that i know that.

Parker, drive each boat and you will not be disappointed with either boat. if you pick san, post some pics. if you pick the avy, just be sure to not take pics of them hidious stickers and pin striping and staples sticking out.
Old     (deuce)      Join Date: Mar 2002       05-14-2007, 9:11 PM Reply   
Look at that picture and tell me the tower doesn't go parallel to the windshield???? What????

Now you can like the boat or not like the boat, doesn't matter to me.... I don't expect people to like the things I like.... As you can see in every post on this thread....I could care less which boat is purchased. I have NEVER had ownership goggles(at least I would like to think so???)....fact is, I just don't care what anyone else has or rides behind. It doesn't affect me..... I am happy to answer direct questions and will throw out pertinent info as needed....but I try to stay away from the arguable points....

But as far as poor lines.....you lost me there? I gave you a pic above....where exactly is it just plopped down and doesn't line up? Please feel free to show me a tower that follows the line of the windshield more pleasing to your eye....because I truly am lost at this point????

As far as the rest of the comments, Phillip replied and then you started talking wake? You ask about build, he replied and then you say that doesn't effect the wake? Well...are you talking wake or build? I don't care to discuss either....but obviously you need to stick to one at a time when carrying on the conversation....

Whatever.... Tower is just thrown on..... Anyone think that irritated me.... That said, someone point it out to me....because if I am missing something I don't want to be ignorant....???
Old     (poser007)      Join Date: Nov 2004       05-14-2007, 10:09 PM Reply   
And it starts
Old     (trx1noob)      Join Date: Sep 2006       05-14-2007, 10:14 PM Reply   
e.j. that's why you drive a nati. you like the boat/tower. that's why i drive an enzo. i like the boat/tower. Just that simple. You guys dont like centurion becuase they have staples showing in the bottom side of a seat and wires not bundled correctly under the floor boards. i dont' like nati cuz they have ugly towers. there, we shared our opinions. hope that helps the thread starter.
Old     (trx1noob)      Join Date: Sep 2006       05-14-2007, 10:21 PM Reply   
E.J. does that bug you that i think the nati tower is ugly. Think i might have hit a nerve wif dat comment. if it makes you feel better, you can call my tower ugly. it aint' gonna bother me much. call my boat ugly, go ahead. dont' bother me. you know why, if i cared what you thought i would have a boat with an ugly tower in my garage. i don't, i have an ugly boat with an ugly tower in my garage with staples showing under my seat. man, that staple comment got under my skin.lmao

you know what i hate more then nati towers, and sorry parker but i hate threads like this. go test drive a boat. if you don't have access to test driving, sit in a boat and base your decision on what you like.
Old     (malibuboarder75)      Join Date: Jan 2004       05-14-2007, 10:41 PM Reply   
Parker,

If you are worried about resale down the road, you probably want to buy the nautique. 210s are easy boats to sell, because 99.9% of people like their classy looks and awesome wakes.
Old     (wakesetter101)      Join Date: Oct 2005       05-15-2007, 5:24 AM Reply   
Question is when does a online forum decide on the boat that fit your needs?

Everyone knows "my boat" is better that yours. When you ask that is going to be what you get in most cases.

Resale, as long as your not buying new, and buy smart you wont take that great of a loss either way.
Old     (deuce)      Join Date: Mar 2002       05-15-2007, 7:07 AM Reply   
Ryan, no it does not bug me at all if you think the tower is ugly. Though I think it is poor taste to come on these forums and call others boats ugly. It may be better to say, I went through the buying process and found X brand fit my needs better, appealed to me more. Negative never gets anywhere.....

You stated that it doesn't follow the lines of the windshield. That is factual stuff, what I am happy to debate on these forums. Again, I do not do wake, build quality, resale.... But tower lines....sure, I'll jump in....

Just like you did with Phillip, you didn't answer the question....or changed the topic is a better way to put it. Again, I never said that I didn't like Centurion boats. In fact, I had fine things to say about them in this thread.

So back on point, you say the lines didn't match up. I ask you to point it out and then back to call my boat ugly or whatever it is.

You say that you hate threads like this.....but who do you think was PART of this thread going negative? Came in all defensive and ask for specifics from Phillip, he responded and you went negative and juvenile.

Again, please show me where the FCT does not follow the window line. I posted an example of my boat to use....

I will again take a second to disagree that it is always a my boat is better. There are many who take that stance on these forums, but there are also people who try to just put out quality information to help a guy/girl out.

Go Jazz!
Old     (deuce)      Join Date: Mar 2002       05-15-2007, 7:20 AM Reply   
....and Daniel P....it has not started. Assuming that response was to me. This is not a boat war, a my boat is better than your boat. I am not in any way bashing any product. I am confronting an individual who apparently wants to go negative on a point that I think is easy to address. It only takes the naked eye to look at the front leg of the FCT and the windshield, watch the line and see if they are parallel.

If any Centurion owner or any other member of this forum think that I have been anything but fair in my assessment of both boats, feel free to tell me and I will ask Dave to remove it.

CHRIST....I told Parker that the SAN may not be the boat for him related to size and the Avalanche being a bigger boat. I told him of my positive experience in the Avalanche and that I thought it was a great boat.
Old     (committed)      Join Date: Jul 2005       05-15-2007, 7:38 AM Reply   
Despite the personal hyjacking comments, I think the buyer here, needs to decide what he wants for the ultimate value. If he has a family, kids, neighbors, buddies who will want to ride, and fill up "a" boat, then I think San would be out, and Avi in. Nothing wrong with being a smallish interior boat, that's just a space issue, and doesn't demean the product. The San is simply, small interior config, and that's only debatable to a kook. The wakes aren't the same either. The San is kicker style, which will help pop you up, whether you like it or not. I haven't ridden behind the Avi, but other Centri's that I have ridden behind, were more rampish, not kicker style. Again, nothing wrong with either style, but they're not the same wakes. The San is a legend, Avi is the johnny come lately-nothing wrong there either. Resale, will not matter, because both boats are able to be bought right and if you (ever) sell them, and sell them when the season is HOT, you will get your money back, or close to it. Try buying a Vdrive during season, and you know what I am talking about.
Best of luck with the buy, you will enjoy either boat.
Old     (jusstty)      Join Date: Dec 2006       05-15-2007, 8:44 AM Reply   
Can't go wrong with a SAN. But it's all preference.
Old     (nar722)      Join Date: Dec 2003       05-15-2007, 12:23 PM Reply   
Parker, If you are looking for a family boat and size matters then the avy will be a better fit. The combination of the interior size of the Avy and a really good wake makes it a pretty good choice for what you are looking for. Build quality and reliability should not be an issue with it either. Centurion builds a fine boat. However, you just can't beat the wake of a san 210 and IF you can live with the smaller confines of that boat, and since the prices are the same then go with the san.
E.J. that color combo and tower are my favorites on that model...hot! again, a personal preference thing.
Old     (trx1noob)      Join Date: Sep 2006       05-15-2007, 1:09 PM Reply   
e.j. at least we agree on one thing. go jazz!!lol

i got to back track here. I never said the boat was ugly, I (my personal opinion) think the tower is ugly. You look in my statements and I think the san is one of the top 3 boats I would pick if i were to buy another boat. My eye thinks the tower don't match the boat. Your eye thinks it does. You can defend it all you want, but i should't matter. you like it and that's what makes it unique. some people hate the evolution tower. I paid extra dough to have it cuz i liked it.
this is what the thread starter is asking, which boat we prefer right. this is where Phillip threw his 2 cents in, and I threw mine in as well. As far as my research has gone, both boats use the same build technology. fiberglass everywhere. No ballast tanks in the stringers for strength purposes. They both claim to use the best foam out there possible for their seating, they both have snap out carpet which is a bonus, they both have upgradeable engines. san has some kind of dam dealio which san claims creates drag as opposed to a wedge/switchblade option(which by the way creates drag as well) this option on the san is controlled with a lever at the side of the driver as is the switchblade.(if these boats even have these options.) even though i'm not a fan of the san tower, both the san tower and centurion tower(in my opinion) are some of the sturdiest towers out there. they both use color proces in there gelcoat, as well as decals that can be taken off. centurion has more of an open area which feels roomier, while san has more of a unique cockpit that allows peeps in the boat to be seated backwards with the comfort of a backrest. while doing this though, some room is sacrificed for this option. when i say some, I'm talking about a person or two to have this seating arrangement. San has more storage areas(on the boats i checked out) but there storage seems to be more shallow so it's kind of a trade off. gauge layout is great on both boats, it's a minor thing and one that won't affect the thread started, but the new san trailers are some of the best I've seen. both companies offer big figerglass platforms which i like.

I agree with you, if a guy says he prefers brand x and leaves it at that, great. the comparison of a benz and hyundai came out in a reply. You want poor taste you got it right there. I admit i was being a pri$k with my response to Phillip. but when a guy says build quality blah blah blah, he's been listening to his dealer waay too much. every dealer showroom you walk into is going to build his product up and tear others down. that's why i asked about phillip being such an expert on the build quality. the only answer i got back was no staple showing and something about wiring harness is better(whatever that means) I was sarcastic in reasoning how that affects performance. I apologize. Phillip wants to make build quality claimes, i want to see exactly what he means.

I will say your boat is one of the best looking san boats out ther and I will rephrase that the newer towers are the ones i dislike. You can check everyone of my threads and I usually am the first to congradulate on whatever brand is purchased, i could care less what you ride in. I've got to be less sensitive about guys like phillip that know nothing, but you want to diss a brand that i own, you dang right I'll defend it just like you have.

sorry to hijack this thread, hopefully my above description of both brands can maybe help you out there.

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