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Old     (markj)      Join Date: Apr 2005       09-04-2014, 10:51 PM Reply   
Has anyone else noticed that the majority of talk as to a new boat's usefulness and value is directly related to the surf wave it can produce? What happened??? This is fascinating to me. It's like a part of wakeboarding has died in a way.

My opinion is, people who have gotten older, had a knee surgery or three, have said "Heck with it, I'm sort of done wakeboarding but, I still love water sports and still want to be out there enjoying that lifestyle and I'm the guy who can buy a new boat".

Boat makers wanna make boats for the people who will actually be buying them. Ten years ago, wakeboarding was still young enough to where people didn't know the potential or likelihood of injury to themselves via wakeboarding. Now, all of those older riders who've been riding and have been educated on reality (you mean my body won't hold up forever?) and have money are in the market for something they can still have fun on and not jeopardize their future earnings by doing.

My prediction? Surfing is the wave of the future. Pun intended. Thoughts?
Old     (WakeDirt)      Join Date: Jun 2011       09-04-2014, 10:56 PM Reply   
I agree...I get my ass kicked physically on the reg at work, I'm cool with low impact. I haven't wake boarded in over 4 yrs and 3 boats...and I am ok with that. I promise I'm still having fun.
Old     (markj)      Join Date: Apr 2005       09-04-2014, 10:56 PM Reply   
^^^ disclaimer: I believe your own personal longevity with wakeboarding depends on the shape you keep yourself in as well as how much you risk by "pushing yourself" to do more tricks.
Old     (seth)      Join Date: Sep 2002       09-04-2014, 11:14 PM Reply   
Everybody loves surfing because it is easy and anybody can do it. Wakeboarding will be gone in 5 years, there wont be any rideable water anywhere because of all the rollers. The only wakeboarding will be at the cable.
Old     (markj)      Join Date: Apr 2005       09-04-2014, 11:18 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by seth View Post
Everybody loves surfing because it is easy and anybody can do it. Wakeboarding will be gone in 5 years, there wont be any rideable water anywhere because of all the rollers. The only wakeboarding will be at the cable.
Interesting theory. I wonder what the fishermen said when waterskiing became popular.
Old     (99Bison)      Join Date: Sep 2012       09-05-2014, 5:29 AM Reply   
Surfing looks way less intimidating to the average person, hence people aren't scared as much to try it. Yep, surfing is the hot topic now, I wonder how long before boredom with that takes over and it becomes just another water activity. Sup is also hot right now and will have a similar fate. IMO what I call the "hype cycle" will be mirrored by these activities.
Old     (patrick)      Join Date: Apr 2003       09-05-2014, 5:51 AM Reply   
I think it's a combination. But, mostly I think, wanna be wakeboarders realize it's not easy and you can slam pretty quickly when trying to progress. So they take their new $75k boat and bring a bunch of people to wake surf which I personally think is pretty lame and create huge rollers ruining all the good water for wakeboarders... And we thought tubers were bad... For the money your paying in gas and boat costs to wakesurf why not take a couple trips a year to a decent surfing spot. On my lake I see about 50% wakeboarders and 50% wakesurfers and rarely see anyone do any decent jumps w/ grabs let alone rolls, flips, and spins on the wakeboard. I've definitely been wondering why everyone's wimping out and wakesurfing. Haven't seen anyone (besides myself) wakeskate in 3 years...
Old     (sppeders)      Join Date: Jul 2011       09-05-2014, 6:05 AM Reply   
I agree, but for me surfing is no fun/expensive. I have moved from mainly a wakeboarder in my 20's, to a 50/50 split board/slalom in my early 30's to almost exclusively slalom now that i'm 35 and have three kids... I can't afford to be physically down rehabbing when i have two one year olds and a two year old.

It's also nice to not have to deal with ballast, and sets are 10 minutes, not 45.

I think i'm in the minority though because cross-over boats are almost nill, and there are only a handful of boats i'd ski behind on the market yet.
Old     (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       09-05-2014, 6:06 AM Reply   
There is a paradigm shift in boat design, for sure. That's because wake boat builders (at least the big 3) already know how to build a great wakeboard boat. Malibu, MC and Nautique (other too) have been throwing big wakes for 10 years. So now they are focusing on surfing, because people want options.
Old     (turbojedi)      Join Date: Jun 2013       09-05-2014, 6:10 AM Reply   
I have been thinking the somethings with the new boat lines, I am 40 and I still wakeboard and try to progress every season. We don't really surf on my boat , my girlfriend her daughter and my daughter all feel that surfing behind a boat is boring and trust me we all have taken a few good wakeboard slams and still ride 3-4 times a week. I hope it's a trend and wake boarding sticks around..I for one will always wake board even if I can't progress , nothing like hitting a stacked wake . Well at least for me..On thing I will say with all the boats getting bigger the wakes are too. Nothing wrong with that.

Last edited by turbojedi; 09-05-2014 at 6:14 AM.
Old     (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       09-05-2014, 6:14 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by patrick View Post
I think it's a combination. But, mostly I think, wanna be wakeboarders realize it's not easy and you can slam pretty quickly when trying to progress. So they take their new $75k boat and bring a bunch of people to wake surf which I personally think is pretty lame and create huge rollers ruining all the good water for wakeboarders... And we thought tubers were bad... For the money your paying in gas and boat costs to wakesurf why not take a couple trips a year to a decent surfing spot. On my lake I see about 50% wakeboarders and 50% wakesurfers and rarely see anyone do any decent jumps w/ grabs let alone rolls, flips, and spins on the wakeboard. I've definitely been wondering why everyone's wimping out and wakesurfing. Haven't seen anyone (besides myself) wakeskate in 3 years...
Well I think the problem with people being scared away from wakeboarding injuries is somewhat due to progressing in the WRONG way.

Too many times I see the following mistakes being made:

- 13 year old beginner trying to go wake to wake behind a slammed A22 at 70 feet.
- clueless people on the boat saying "just go faster" to someone learning to go wake to wake
- healside heroes that just want to learn a flip to impress girls and try their first backroll/tantrum at full speed behind a slammed boat and all of the sudden call themselves "advanced" riders

I think that if people would let their egos go and progress by learning new things at slower speeds with shorter ropes, as well as focus on fundamental skills like surface spins, proper edging, riding switch, etc... before doing back flips, that more fun would be had and newbies would progress faster.

Alas, the above doesn't happen for a number of reasons.
Old     (turbojedi)      Join Date: Jun 2013       09-05-2014, 6:20 AM Reply   
All very true Tom, I have a slammed out boat and when new people ride they want it slammed, I say nope no weight for you sorry. They are all bummed but what's the point if you can't ride just to say you rode a slammed boat with a huge wake, sorry ego check...
Old     (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       09-05-2014, 6:39 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by turbojedi View Post
All very true Tom, I have a slammed out boat and when new people ride they want it slammed, I say nope no weight for you sorry. They are all bummed but what's the point if you can't ride just to say you rode a slammed boat with a huge wake, sorry ego check...
Yep, storytime. I need to vent.

So I wakeboard with a Team (we compete at local INT, everything from beginner to outlaw in terms of rider skill), and I like to do my best to help the younger newbies out because I love to see people progress. So we have a 13 year old girl who is just getting started wakeboarding riding on the team. She couldn't go wake to wake up until this point. Her stepdad has an A22 with 1100 sacs on the plug n play. Whenever she rides, he always fills to capacity and it takes like a minute and a half to get the thing on plane. Wake is ridiculous. This is boat she is trying to go w2w behind. Stepdad sees no problem and encourages her.

So one day, after much of her struggling, I take her out behind a friend's boat with no parents around. Me, my wife and a friend. When it comes her time to ride, I tell the driver, dump the ballast. She insists she wants it full. I said no. And here's the thing, at the INT comps, they put ZERO ballast in the boat for her division. So I explain that to her, "At competition, the boat wont have ballast, so you need to ride without ballast". She doesn't fight me too much on it. Then I shorten the rope to 50 feet. She fights me again, "put it at 65 feet", she says. Again, I tell her no, that we are going to slow the boat down since there is no ballast and it will be too wide at 65 feet. Eventually she gives in to that argument.

Finally gets in the water, we tweak the speed here and there, give her some pointers for 15-20 minutes, BAM, she goes wake to wake. She was stoked and we got it on video. I was proud of her, she did a great job and she was riding a setup that matched her skill level.

Next day, her step-dad calls me and the first thing he says is, "I didn't know you were gonna have her go wake to wake behind a jet ski wake." I was floored, he's just being completely ignorant to what it takes to progress in this sport. Worst of all, he's going to get his step-daughter injured. I don't know if she's gone wake to wake since then.
Old     (turbojedi)      Join Date: Jun 2013       09-05-2014, 7:40 AM Reply   
That's what we do with are girls, dump all ballast and shorten rope and slow down. That way they can work on edge control, proper cutting and over all riddling with out fear of speed or crossing a monster wake. Good for you Tom, it's just to bad her step dad is a fool and very well may get her hurt and or scare he off wake boarding all together ..
Old     (jarrod)      Join Date: May 2003       09-05-2014, 7:56 AM Reply   
Tom, glad to see someone else gets it. The long rope, fast speed, huge wake craze has made the sport much harder. When I learned, I learned at 60 feet, and then stayed at 65 until I had multiple spins and inverts. I followed the pro setup trend and started losing tricks and stopped progressing once I got to 75/80 feet of rope.

For years I watched newbies come and go as they got frustrated trying to learn a toeside wake to wake at 75/80 feet of rope. Getting POUNDED. No one wants to listen though.

Over the last couple of years I saw riders like Mike Schwenne, Trever Maur, Harley Clifford, and many others riding rope lengths much shorter. And KILLING IT! I shortened my rope down to 65 feet this season, dropped the speed, and started getting tricks back. I turned 40 this season and learned 4 new tricks, including TSBS 180s. And aside from shaving off a few feet into the flats, I go just as big, with less weight and less gas. I've smiled at crashes this season that would have ended my day at 24mph.

This season I taught a female rider how to ride between 55 and 60 feet, and she is progressing faster than her friends that insist on learning at 70 feet.

On the subject of surfing. The West Coast Malibu factory rep told me that 9/10 people at the boat show are buying a boat to wakesurf.
Old     (kbob)      Join Date: Aug 2009       09-05-2014, 8:04 AM Reply   
I can see the appeal of wake surfing as it's low impact...you can bring a lot of people, it's easy to learn, and you don't have to worry about bindings. My ideal day at the lake is slalom ski in the morning, wakeboard after breakfast, surf in the afternoon when the water is choppy, and ski or wakeboard again in the evening if the water is smooth. I explain it to newbies as...slalom skiing is a lost art of pure adrenalin compared to drag racing and a need for speed, and wakeboarding is like motocross...slower speeds...but intense jumps and tricks. I appreciate and enjoy all water sports and feel like it's not a complete lake trip without at least 2 of those...and preferably all 3. The boat doesn't change anything for me except convenience of automated ballast under the seats and more room for family and friends. I did all the same sports with my old Prostar 205 as I do with my MC 245.
Old     (markj)      Join Date: Apr 2005       09-05-2014, 8:08 AM Reply   
9/10? Wow. I wonder what percentage of the market is people switching from wakeboarding to surfing versus people buying boats for the first time for surfing.
Old     (wakebrdr94)      Join Date: Jul 2010       09-05-2014, 8:29 AM Reply   
People do not care about learning the basics anymore, it's a culture of instant gratification and image. How many times have you seen or heard the guy that runs the most ballast and they can not go wake to wake, or like in the example above have ropes lengths way too long. They hear that's what the pros do, so good enough, they forget the pros worked up to those speeds, and ballast weights. It's like the magic diet pill scam, take this and you don't need to work out or watch what you eat. Buy this boat and weight it with 5k and you'll be a pro in no time.

Part of it is also is the guys who use to charge it have gotten older (like myself). I enjoy wakeboarding more than surfing, but let's face it, it does not pay may bills, a knee surgery later it's not the same. Surfing let's me get on the water and have a little fun, but it's nothing like wakeboarding. And has the guys like me have gotten older, it gives us an option to be on the water longer. Plus the older guys can usually afford these boats a little more easily. Not saying that young people can't, I was 26 when I bought my 1st my Malibu and the dealers didn't take me seriously walking in looking at a brand new expensive boat.

The other side of what will kill wakeboarding will be the manufacturers themselves. They are pricing much of the population out I the sport. 70k+ just to get a wakeboat, 800 for a board and bindings, ropes, etc, it's expensive. And let's not forget you need a decent tow rig for your boat. All of us who participate in any of these things are extremely fortunate. My opinion will be cable parks will replace much of the riding because you don't need the most expensive part, the boat.
Main thing, have fun!
Old     (tdc_worm)      Join Date: Sep 2002       09-05-2014, 8:30 AM Reply   
Wakesurfing is tubing for grown arse adults...

If you are just now noticing/feeling this paradigm shift, you are going to be heart broken in 5 years. I live in Austin, TX and I would estimate the split on Lake Austin to be 90/10 in favor of the wake surfers. It is so pervasive that I have thrown in the towel on wakeboarding...and considering i started in early 90s, it was hard to come to terms with the fact that wakeboarding, or more accurately flat-water sports, are being destroyed.

Wakesurfing has opened the door to water sports for people that were either a) unwilling to put in the effort to learn and progress a new skill or b) unable to participate in higher risk activities secondary to physical issues. Its so easy that most people can learn to wakesurf in 2-3 tries.

Wakesurfers have made the water so rough, that tubers are hitting the water earlier and earlier. Why? Moms and dads have zero interest in tossing a kid off a tube in a roller filled lake. It doesnt take much to lose sight of a 10 year old in wakesurf rollers, and when you do, you have to trust that the wakesurfer captain can see over their severely off plane bow, listed vessel. And you have to assume that the captain is sober. The solution: start earlier to avoid the wakesurf rush (which is typically accompanied by dubstep and 10am beers). Can you blame them? I can't.

And to be real, everyone thinks that SURFING is cool (me included), and the majority of WAKESURFERs think they are doing the same thing. Yet 95% of wakesurfers wouldn't survive 5 minutes actually having to put forth effort into paddling out to actually catch a wave, which takes skill. I see people all the time being tossed a beer so they can get the ultra cool selfie of them shotgunning said beer while wakesurfing. Its my opinion that if you can do it while slamming a beer or being flat wasted (and I have), then it is not a skill, its not a sport, its an activity. I digress, its not my position to decide what makes people happy.
Old     (bcrider)      Join Date: Apr 2006       09-05-2014, 9:16 AM Reply   
At the last boat show every dealer asked me if I was in to wakesurfing opposed to wakeboarding. As others have said, it's the new thing and has a larger audience than wakeboarding because it's easier on the body and you are doing half the speed. I will say with getting my new to me boat this year that we have been primarily surfing as well do to the fact that the new boat puts up a great wave compared to my old DD. I still love wakeboarding and have done it since the early 90's as well but most of my friends have only been in it a few years and with all of us being in our 30's most aren't pushing themselves to learn new tricks and don't really care too. You can rag on surfing all you want but I don't think it's going anywhere.
Old     (skiboarder)      Join Date: Oct 2006       09-05-2014, 9:47 AM Reply   
"Wakesurfing is tubing for adults" I'm using that this weekend. Unless I get a chance today.

Preach it Brutha!
Old     (you_da_man)      Join Date: Sep 2009       09-05-2014, 10:10 AM Reply   
I think it's hilarious that wakeboarders complain about wakesurfing boats ruining "THEIR" water lol. It's my boat, I pay my Parks and Wildlife registration to use it on a public lake so I'll use it how I want and where I want. Wakeboarders are not entitled to smooth water but they act like it by pulling up to boats with tubers or surfers and yelling at them or even suggesting they use another part of the lake. Since when do you own a public lake? Get up earlier or be more dedicated to your wakeboarding and get some sets on a weekday for hassle free riding. I haven't wakeboarded this year and really don't miss the slams when catching a leading edge trying tricks. I use to bitch about tubers but also kept in mind they have the right to the same water...the same goes for any tow sport.
Old     (txwakerider14)      Join Date: Apr 2010       09-05-2014, 10:20 AM Reply   
If Wakeboarding is seen as the least legit of the major board sports (Surfing, Skateboard, Snowboarding) in terms of skill and consequence then what does that mean for Wakesurfing?
Old     (you_da_man)      Join Date: Sep 2009       09-05-2014, 10:20 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by tdc_worm View Post
Wakesurfing is tubing for grown arse adults...

If you are just now noticing/feeling this paradigm shift, you are going to be heart broken in 5 years. I live in Austin, TX and I would estimate the split on Lake Austin to be 90/10 in favor of the wake surfers. It is so pervasive that I have thrown in the towel on wakeboarding...and considering i started in early 90s, it was hard to come to terms with the fact that wakeboarding, or more accurately flat-water sports, are being destroyed.

Wakesurfing has opened the door to water sports for people that were either a) unwilling to put in the effort to learn and progress a new skill or b) unable to participate in higher risk activities secondary to physical issues. Its so easy that most people can learn to wakesurf in 2-3 tries.

Wakesurfers have made the water so rough, that tubers are hitting the water earlier and earlier. Why? Moms and dads have zero interest in tossing a kid off a tube in a roller filled lake. It doesnt take much to lose sight of a 10 year old in wakesurf rollers, and when you do, you have to trust that the wakesurfer captain can see over their severely off plane bow, listed vessel. And you have to assume that the captain is sober. The solution: start earlier to avoid the wakesurf rush (which is typically accompanied by dubstep and 10am beers). Can you blame them? I can't.

And to be real, everyone thinks that SURFING is cool (me included), and the majority of WAKESURFERs think they are doing the same thing. Yet 95% of wakesurfers wouldn't survive 5 minutes actually having to put forth effort into paddling out to actually catch a wave, which takes skill. I see people all the time being tossed a beer so they can get the ultra cool selfie of them shotgunning said beer while wakesurfing. Its my opinion that if you can do it while slamming a beer or being flat wasted (and I have), then it is not a skill, its not a sport, its an activity. I digress, its not my position to decide what makes people happy.
I live about 60 miles northwest of Lake Austin and have taken my boat on it but only on weekdays. I could not imagine trying to enjoy Lake Austin on a weekend day and could imagine how it must look like interstate traffic but with boats...literally. Plus the rollers would make open water chop on an open big lake seem like nothing.
Old     (iShredSAN)      Join Date: Apr 2012       09-05-2014, 10:30 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by tdc_worm View Post
Wakesurfing is tubing for grown arse adults...

If you are just now noticing/feeling this paradigm shift, you are going to be heart broken in 5 years. I live in Austin, TX and I would estimate the split on Lake Austin to be 90/10 in favor of the wake surfers. It is so pervasive that I have thrown in the towel on wakeboarding...and considering i started in early 90s, it was hard to come to terms with the fact that wakeboarding, or more accurately flat-water sports, are being destroyed.

Wakesurfing has opened the door to water sports for people that were either a) unwilling to put in the effort to learn and progress a new skill or b) unable to participate in higher risk activities secondary to physical issues. Its so easy that most people can learn to wakesurf in 2-3 tries.

Wakesurfers have made the water so rough, that tubers are hitting the water earlier and earlier. Why? Moms and dads have zero interest in tossing a kid off a tube in a roller filled lake. It doesnt take much to lose sight of a 10 year old in wakesurf rollers, and when you do, you have to trust that the wakesurfer captain can see over their severely off plane bow, listed vessel. And you have to assume that the captain is sober. The solution: start earlier to avoid the wakesurf rush (which is typically accompanied by dubstep and 10am beers). Can you blame them? I can't.

And to be real, everyone thinks that SURFING is cool (me included), and the majority of WAKESURFERs think they are doing the same thing. Yet 95% of wakesurfers wouldn't survive 5 minutes actually having to put forth effort into paddling out to actually catch a wave, which takes skill. I see people all the time being tossed a beer so they can get the ultra cool selfie of them shotgunning said beer while wakesurfing. Its my opinion that if you can do it while slamming a beer or being flat wasted (and I have), then it is not a skill, its not a sport, its an activity. I digress, its not my position to decide what makes people happy.
Well said! I live in Austin as well and couldn't agree more... even the weekdays aren't what they used to be
Old     (nailem)      Join Date: Apr 2011       09-05-2014, 10:54 AM Reply   
remember when wakeboarding came out and all the skiers cried that these massive wakeboard wakes ruin the lake for the real boaters. Now you think you are the real boaters.
I live by a ski resort and the skiers hated snowboarders when it started to become popular. carving up the slopes and messing the snow for all the true snow sports.
I use to race sport bikes but I'm older with kids and my priorities have changed. I blew my knee out a few years ago wakeboarding and I can't afford to be off work like that again.
My family loves the water and I love to surf, deal with it. on "my lake" I hate the 35' pleasure boats running around at 20mph. it really messes up the water for all us true water lovers, they should take their big boats somewhere else.
Old     (turbojedi)      Join Date: Jun 2013       09-05-2014, 10:57 AM Reply   
To me the whole oh I can't get hurt I have bills, in most cases is the excuse people use not to get raged on by there wakeboard friends. I have bills too dont we all.. I have never lived life with that Type of mentality . I blow a knee and can't work we will go from there when it happens. Life is a one time shot. We are getting a wrap on are boat and the idea of a anti surf logo or saying has been mentioned more than once.. But hey that's us to each there own. I do look at new boats or when people ask about my boat first thing is " do you wake surf" we laugh and reply with no we wakeboard and don't care to wakesurf and as you guessed it odd and even dirty looks fallow by a oh that's cool.. I hope wake boarding stays around..
Old     (nailem)      Join Date: Apr 2011       09-05-2014, 11:08 AM Reply   
Quote:
I blow a knee and can't work we will go from there when it happens.
has it happened to you? I use to feel that way until it happened. even at that point I didn't think surgery would be a big deal. I had 3 shoulder surgeries, shattered my hand and wrist all from racing when I was young. I did not bounce back from knee surgery like I did from the others. It was a year before I was 90%. my family is more important. Some learn to loose the ego as they grow some do not. I have nothing to prove. I have raced sport bikes, motocross, sky dived, and wakeboarded and things change. they haven't yet for you, good for you but don't play it out like it is just some pussy excuse.
Old     (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       09-05-2014, 11:13 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by turbojedi View Post
To me the whole oh I can't get hurt I have bills, in most cases is the excuse people use not to get raged on by there wakeboard friends. I have bills too dont we all.. I have never lived life with that Type of mentality . I blow a knee and can't work we will go from there when it happens. Life is a one time shot. We are getting a wrap on are boat and the idea of a anti surf logo or saying has been mentioned more than once.. But hey that's us to each there own. I do look at new boats or when people ask about my boat first thing is " do you wake surf" we laugh and reply with no we wakeboard and don't care to wakesurf and as you guessed it odd and even dirty looks fallow by a oh that's cool.. I hope wake boarding stays around..
I would definitely recommend having someone proofread your wrap first.
Old     (cjh1669)      Join Date: Apr 2005       09-05-2014, 11:39 AM Reply   
This thread has a weird deja vu to the 90s for some reason lol


Everyone's body is going to start to wear out, the more you do early, the more injuries you get early, the more of a toll you'll feel later in life. I've grown tired of building up injuries all summer, then taking well into winter to heal up. I'm starting to take up foiling now, but man it's a tough learning curve to get good at, and I enjoy surfing too. Wakeboarding won't die away anymore than slalom skiing did, just more people want to surf. Nothing wrong with it as long as you don't do it on glass. To each their own, but to say it's some pussy excuse that you can't afford an injury is a joke. I get hurt and lose my company I lose my boat too.

Last edited by cjh1669; 09-05-2014 at 11:46 AM.
Old     (dougr)      Join Date: Dec 2009       09-05-2014, 12:25 PM Reply   
All too funny, all watersports are hobby's just for fun, its not about who's cool and who's not. Its about spending time on the water and having fun, i am 39, 6 knee surgery's and still (limiting myself) wakeboard, but only in the early morning when conditions are perfect and do nothing but wake to wake. I can't afford anymore knee surgery's. I surf all the time, and tube the kids.

We all need to stop bashing and start enjoying. The only problem water sport enthusiast have is the mind set that wake boarding is a sport. Its a hobby, keep it that way and enjoy it, just like surfing and tubing. trying to make it something that its not is why people hate on surfing.

Boarders want to feel special, as if they have some super special sport that sets what they are doing above the rest, guess what there is more money and interest in RC car racing than wake boarding and very few consider that a sport.

there is plenty of room on most lakes for everyone to enjoy, find your group, hang out board, surf, tube, or drink beer but do it with respect to all boaters
Old     (you_da_man)      Join Date: Sep 2009       09-05-2014, 12:30 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by cjh1669 View Post
. To each their own, but to say it's some pussy excuse that you can't afford an injury is a joke. I get hurt and lose my company I lose my boat too.
Some people have physical careers that an injury could put them out for half a year if not more. Office or corporate type (aka: sit on your ass jobs) you blowout a knee or tear shoulder and you're out a couple weeks to recover from surgery then you get "light duty" but can still sit and work. I myself am a railroad conductor so any hint of an injury and i'm out. Heaven forbid a guy puts providing an income first over learning a new W2W trick on a wakeboard. However, you are correct, to each his own. This is not a "why you so mad" or "butt hurt" comment. Just looking at it from another perspective.
Old     (wakemitch)      Join Date: Jun 2005       09-05-2014, 12:34 PM Reply   
Wakesurfing is easy, has no fear factor, and water conditions do not effect it as much. Of course more people are going to want to do that. You can have fun with very little effort.

wakeboarding is hard and the crashes scare people away. Now that there is an option for a much easier alternative, many people are going to go with (and are) taking the easier sport. Most people are not athletic and do not have the same kind of drive and patience to progress in a difficult sport like wakeboarding.

Recently this was brought up on wakeskating.com, we were discussing how we (members of wake skating.com) figured wakeskating would one day get more popular than wake boarding because it is cheaper and you can do it behind pretty much any kind of boat. We have realized that this will not happen. Even though the sport is significantly less expensive, it is extremely difficult and it takes a lot of patience to learn even the simplest tricks such as a shuvit. People are willing to spend big dollars on wakesurf boards and the latest boats so that they can have fun behind a boat with as little effort as possible.

To me, the effort it takes to progress at wakeskating, wakeboarding, and even higher level wakesurfing is a lot of the fun. I want to push myself and get better. The average population couldn't care less. They just want to have fun in the water with their family.

Because of all this I have started spending almost all my ride time at cable parks. Almost everyone there is there to push themselves and it is a great community of riders that are all trying to get better and help each other progress and have fun at the same time. Also for wakeskating, the park is one of the only places to find smooth enough water to ride.

Last edited by wakemitch; 09-05-2014 at 12:38 PM.
Old     (tdc_worm)      Join Date: Sep 2002       09-05-2014, 12:34 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by you_da_man View Post
I live about 60 miles northwest of Lake Austin and have taken my boat on it but only on weekdays. I could not imagine trying to enjoy Lake Austin on a weekend day and could imagine how it must look like interstate traffic but with boats...literally. Plus the rollers would make open water chop on an open big lake seem like nothing.
it wasnt so long ago that LA was a calm and quiet as Stillhouse, Belton, or Whitney.

at the end of the day its about coexistence, which is affected by two parameters:

1) population---the more crowded any venue gets the more we are going to get in each others way. wakesurfing has grown the watersports crowd at an alarming rate (coincidentally, 3 event skiers might say the same thing about wakeboarders)
2) activity---the more invasive our activity in said venue, the more we are going to affect others in that venue. wakesurfing rollers are super invasive and affect boaters from all directions.

i have seen 'footers, buoy hookers, trickers, skaters and wakeboarders all coexist peacefully on the same stretch of water at the same time because we are all chasing the same thing: flat water. that coexistence vaporizes the moment a wakesurfer decides its time to crank up his Skrillex and crack his Keystone with 11 of closest fist pumping friends so he can get his morning exercise in his dude canoe.
Old     (denverd1)      Join Date: May 2004       09-05-2014, 12:54 PM Reply   
had some newbs on the boat a few weeks ago. a 50 year old couple, their teenaged kid and friend and us 30 somethings. Everyone got up on the surf. kid's friend was the only one that rode a board. share the water and do what makes you happy. but at the end of the day, surfing is easy to learn and you can begin enjoying it all in the same day. wakeboarding, not so much.

Personally, i'm recovering from a separated shoulder I got snowboarding. I've been on a wakeboard once this year and my shoulder hurt for about 3 days afterward. Surfing has been the only thing I can enjoy on the water until my shoulder is 100%. I miss wakeboarding and can't wait till I can rip on it again, but I'm damn sure enjoying being out on the water spending time with friends surfing.
Old     (allzway)      Join Date: Feb 2014       09-05-2014, 1:20 PM Reply   
Is wakesurfing as fun as wakeboarding or as challenging...heck no....but it sure as hell a lot easier on the body when you fall.

If I was 20, I wouldn't want to surf, but as you get older you still want to learn and do new stuff and at near 50 you aren't going to want to learn many new wakeboarding tricks.
Old     (JDboarder05)      Join Date: Mar 2013       09-05-2014, 1:50 PM Reply   
Brilliantly said. Not even sure if this is how I reply to this. I check the threads on here a lot but never write back to anything. I've been wakeboarding since 11 now 27 and its just annoying to see everyone fall in love with wakesurfing. I get it tho... its a craze and its helped boat sales BIG TIME. But come on... its not a competitive sport. SURFING is.. not wakesurfing.


Quote:
Originally Posted by tdc_worm View Post
Wakesurfing is tubing for grown arse adults...

If you are just now noticing/feeling this paradigm shift, you are going to be heart broken in 5 years. I live in Austin, TX and I would estimate the split on Lake Austin to be 90/10 in favor of the wake surfers. It is so pervasive that I have thrown in the towel on wakeboarding...and considering i started in early 90s, it was hard to come to terms with the fact that wakeboarding, or more accurately flat-water sports, are being destroyed.

Wakesurfing has opened the door to water sports for people that were either a) unwilling to put in the effort to learn and progress a new skill or b) unable to participate in higher risk activities secondary to physical issues. Its so easy that most people can learn to wakesurf in 2-3 tries.

Wakesurfers have made the water so rough, that tubers are hitting the water earlier and earlier. Why? Moms and dads have zero interest in tossing a kid off a tube in a roller filled lake. It doesnt take much to lose sight of a 10 year old in wakesurf rollers, and when you do, you have to trust that the wakesurfer captain can see over their severely off plane bow, listed vessel. And you have to assume that the captain is sober. The solution: start earlier to avoid the wakesurf rush (which is typically accompanied by dubstep and 10am beers). Can you blame them? I can't.

And to be real, everyone thinks that SURFING is cool (me included), and the majority of WAKESURFERs think they are doing the same thing. Yet 95% of wakesurfers wouldn't survive 5 minutes actually having to put forth effort into paddling out to actually catch a wave, which takes skill. I see people all the time being tossed a beer so they can get the ultra cool selfie of them shotgunning said beer while wakesurfing. Its my opinion that if you can do it while slamming a beer or being flat wasted (and I have), then it is not a skill, its not a sport, its an activity. I digress, its not my position to decide what makes people happy.
Old     (srock)      Join Date: Mar 2002       09-05-2014, 1:56 PM Reply   
What an interesting thread.

I remember when everybody gave up tubes and skis for kneeboards and footing was at the top of the food chain. Then when the crappy old skurfer gave way to the twin tip wakeboards it was all over and most people would not be seen dead on a kneeboard. It also drove boat sales and Mastercraft buried the slogan, "What Wake?".

Wakesurfing for 9 out of 10 buyers...WOW. I guess the foil and wakeskate never had its popularity run because difficulty is not in the path of progression. I don't see many barefooters either. Good thing the tube seems alive and well.

Myself - I've added Motorcross along with little league coaching. Wakesurfing - I'd just rather drink beer...and to add some difficulty I'll do it while riding a wake surfer.
Old     (runin90lx)      Join Date: Sep 2009       09-05-2014, 2:06 PM Reply   
im sure 99.999999999999999999% of any tow boat owner is not out on the lake to be "competitive". we are there to enjoy time on the water with friends, family, kids, etc. whether that be wakeboarding, wakesurfing, tubing, or whatever. im pretty sure IDGAF what anyone else thinks about what i do with my boat. unless you own a private lake you deal with whatever else is going on that particular day on the water.
Old     (brhanley)      Join Date: Jun 2001       09-05-2014, 2:42 PM Reply   
Great thread. Wakesurfing has been gaining steam for years, and is clearly the wave (pun intended) of the future. How I wish for the good old days of cursing out of control jet skiers or the occasional rogue tuber. But, it is what it is, and we now have two cable parks within reasonable distance so you win some and lose some.
Old     (migs)      Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: SF Bay Area       09-05-2014, 3:11 PM Reply   
Only thing more boring on the water than wakesurfing, is being stuck on a boat watching people wakesurf
Old     (tdc_worm)      Join Date: Sep 2002       09-05-2014, 3:27 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by runin90lx View Post
im sure 99.999999999999999999% of any tow boat owner is not out on the lake to be "competitive". we are there to enjoy time on the water with friends, family, kids, etc. whether that be wakeboarding, wakesurfing, tubing, or whatever. im pretty sure IDGAF what anyone else thinks about what i do with my boat. unless you own a private lake you deal with whatever else is going on that particular day on the water.
probably overshooting with that percentage...especially as it applies to water sports enthusiasts. while they may not be competitive against others, you can bet your speedo that many are competitive against themselves. i suspect that even you try to slaysh the wave a bit harder with every carve until you fall, competing against your last ride.

its cool that you are worry free. one thing is for sure, however, while currently legal (giving wakesurfers the green light to not care), our actions do affect others. shoreline erosion is a hot topic on many lakes. and while we may be able to "afford" a $100k boat, the power brokers are those that can afford the $5m house on the lake that is having its shoreline and dock trashed. i suspect that will eventually be the demise of wakesurfing on smaller lakes...
Old     (runin90lx)      Join Date: Sep 2009       09-05-2014, 3:33 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by tdc_worm View Post
probably overshooting with that percentage...especially as it applies to water sports enthusiasts. while they may not be competitive against others, you can bet your speedo that many are competitive against themselves. i suspect that even you try to slaysh the wave a bit harder with every carve until you fall, competing against your last ride.

its cool that you are worry free. one thing is for sure, however, while currently legal (giving wakesurfers the green light to not care), our actions do affect others. shoreline erosion is a hot topic on many lakes. and while we may be able to "afford" a $100k boat, the power brokers are those that can afford the $5m house on the lake that is having its shoreline and dock trashed. i suspect that will eventually be the demise of wakesurfing on smaller lakes...
I guess im fortunate im that most of the lakes I use dont have homes on them. And when we do surf we use the middle of the lake or by the dam area where there arent people trying to get calm water. My son only wake boards so I understand where those that want to.board come feom....but I also knownits a public lake and you arent guaranteed a smooth pass everytime. U deal with whats given
Old     (bzubke1)      Join Date: Feb 2010       09-05-2014, 3:49 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by migs View Post
Only thing more boring on the water than wakesurfing, is being stuck on a boat watching people wakesurf
Not mention driving someone surfing and having to constantly tell someone in the back to throw the rider the rope.
Old     (tdc_worm)      Join Date: Sep 2002       09-05-2014, 4:09 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by runin90lx View Post
I guess im fortunate im that most of the lakes I use dont have homes on them. And when we do surf we use the middle of the lake or by the dam area where there arent people trying to get calm water. My son only wake boards so I understand where those that want to.board come feom....but I also knownits a public lake and you arent guaranteed a smooth pass everytime. U deal with whats given
lucky you, and it circles back to my coexist theory. you don't have to coexist with lakefront owners, and by surfing in the middle you don't have to coexist with smooth water hunters...

Quote:
Originally Posted by bzubke1 View Post
Not mention driving someone surfing and having to constantly tell someone in the back to throw the rider the rope.
that fix is too easy. have the rider toss the rope to the opposite side wave when slayshing (or have the spotter toss it in when the rider falls if you insist on bringing the rope aboard). circle around to pick up your rider. the rider's job is to paddle the SURF board like they are paddling in to SURF a wave in order to fetch the rope. if its effective enough to surf for real, it is effective enough to [wake]surf for fake. its shocking how many kooks will try to swim one armed whiled dragging the board behind them and go nowhere, when ocean surfers taught us how to do it decades ago.
Old     (nailem)      Join Date: Apr 2011       09-05-2014, 7:19 PM Reply   
I guess I do feel for those of you that boat on tinny lake's. It really has never been an issue for me. My home lake (lake Erie) you have from US to Canada and Buffalo to Ohio and beyond. I also boat Kinzua more than enough space and Norris lake. Norris has the most wakeboarder's out of the three and we always try to respect their space, again plenty of room for everyone. Most of the time we will have some dip **** wakeboarder come to the spot we are in and have been all day and start circling us when there is literally miles of water. I also notice that our wave does the same impact on the shore line as a slammed G3. On Norris the wave goes across and stops, no rebound at all. I could surf across the lake and you could follow behind and wakeboard and never know the difference. Maybe some of you hardcore, passionate boarders need to move to a bigger lake?
Old     (bftskir)      Join Date: Jan 2004       09-06-2014, 2:31 PM Reply   
Its just the same ol same ol...as the prop turns...my boat got no boards no skis you come with me you will be barefooting. I got places where I get lonely glass for miles even on memorial day 4th of July and labor day.
Old     (kimper)      Join Date: May 2008       09-06-2014, 7:02 PM Reply   
To OP, yep you have me pegged.
I am 42. I have some slipped discs that act up every time I wakeboard.. But I can surf all day and be out on the water with my family. When I went boat shopping last year you better believe the surf wave was at the top of my list of priorities! I went with a MC X-30 and could not be happier!
Old     (ak4life)      Join Date: Nov 2003       09-08-2014, 12:00 AM Reply   
I love being on the water. While I don't find wakesurfing nearly as exhilirating as wakeboarding, I too will probably wakesurf once the body can't handle wakeboarding anymore. Or not, since as others have pointed out, if you take care of yourself and don't try stuff too far beyond your ability (and don't get hurt outside of wakeboarding), you can probably wakeboard well beyond what people would consider "too old". I'm 40 this year and my riding is finally starting to come together.

I do see a lot more wakesurfing over the last couple of years. I mostly ride Norcal Delta, and it sucks when people surf on long straight channels as wakesurf waves tend to carry on for a while. I think if everyone followed sensible practices, like wake surfing or tubing on Old River, not Victoria Canal [1], not powerturning to pick up fallen riders [2], or pulling up right in front/behind/beside other boats pulling riders on a narrow channel, we'd all get through this just fine.

[1] http://baydeltaoffice.water.ca.gov/D...-Waterways.pdf
[2] http://www.wakeworld.com/news/featur...powerturn.html
Old     (skiboarder)      Join Date: Oct 2006       09-08-2014, 6:40 AM Reply   
Paint a picture in your mind of the guy who can shell out $30K or so and make a $800/mo payment. It is probably not a guy riding every day, he/she is probably middle aged, he doesn't hit double-ups, etc. He is probably a wake surfer. That is why you see the shift in BOAT offerings.

There are still plenty of guys killing it behind boats on a wakeboard, but the innovation for wake boats is maturing. And don't worry about the shift. Wakeboarding is still growing behind the boat and it is absolutely exploding out at the cable. I know several guys who are now starting to compete in Open and Pro at the triple crown who have never been behind a boat even one time.

As a wakeboarder that still considers himself a boat rider (60/40). I see wake surfing as a wally plague (No disrespect to the guys taking it seriously, being courteous, etc), but I don't see it going away either. Its pretty easy, there is little physical sacrifice (on and off the water), you can do it when you are wake surf-wasted and there are a million opportunities to sell, sell, sell, sell midlife crisis guys on "game changing" innovation. That is a formula for commercial success in my book.

The industry (not the sport) is just going where the money is.
Old     (rockballer)      Join Date: Jun 2014       09-08-2014, 8:25 AM Reply   
Purchased a new Centurion boat 5 months ago. Into it for around 70k now and bought it only for surfing. They offered us wake boarding equipment for free when we purchased the boat. We declined and my neighbor has had his wake board on our boat the entire summer. Not one person out of about 30-40 people over the summer have asked to wakeboard once.
Old     (scwellman)      Join Date: Nov 2006       09-08-2014, 8:38 AM Reply   
I live in Austin on Lake Travis, before that I lived on Lake Conroe, so I've seen the shift first hand from living room over the last couple of years. Funny thing is we were just talking about how we never see people wakeboarding anymore and only see people surfing.

I get why it's become so popular, but someone needs to tell people it is not cool to surf 25' way from the floating docks.
Old     (tampawake)      Join Date: Mar 2008       09-08-2014, 9:01 AM Reply   
This reminds me of the slalom barefoot and fishing guys talking about wakeboarding. Boats with 5k worth of ballast 4-6 HLCD speakers turned all the way up to 11 rollers and wakes the size of a teenager. Now the wakeboats weigh over 5k and still putting 3-5k of ballast in them. I see alot of pot calling in here. Boating has always been about the family and family fun. I prefer to wakeboard and have 3k worth of ballast in my boat.
Old     (timmyb)      Join Date: Apr 2007       09-08-2014, 9:05 AM Reply   
Here's a question, which industry is bigger, (ocean) Surfing or Wakeboarding? My guess is that more people have heard of Surfing than Wakeboarding. Combine that with the ability to "Surf" behind a boat and voila, you have something that people are familiar with and want to be able to say that they do. Wakesurfing is also more interactive with the people on the boat because you can communicate back and forth.

Wakeboarding = Adrenaline Rush
Wakesurfing = relaxing day on the water chillin with your family and friends

I still wakeboard a few times a year but only when I get some really good water. Nothing gets your adrenaline pumping more than that first cut and hitting the wake, it's so fun! The lakes I ride on are usually so blown out that it's just not worth wakeboarding on so I surf but my 14 year old daughter still loves wakeboarding and she puts up with the garbage water to get her adrenaline fix.
Old     (Andy_Elliott)      Join Date: Jun 2011       09-08-2014, 9:06 AM Reply   
Whats the worst part about wakesurfing? Telling your parents you're gay.
Old     (boardman74)      Join Date: Jul 2012       09-08-2014, 9:06 AM Reply   
Really not cool to be doing anything 25 feet away from your dock. Thats an idiot regardless of their chosen water sport. Have some respect and stay out from the docks. I let my kids launch water balloons when people are buzzing our dock Or we anchor a couple rafts out in front of the dock.
Old     (timmyb)      Join Date: Apr 2007       09-08-2014, 9:07 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy_Elliott View Post
Whats the worst part about wakesurfing? Telling your parents you're gay.
That's what the barefoot skiers used to say to the wakeboarders!
Old     (loudelectronics)      Join Date: Sep 2013       09-08-2014, 11:07 AM Reply   
I used to live for wakeboarding during the summer. I was always in shape as I played hockey at a decent level through out the winter... paid for school. Every year though it was a new trip to the hospital, broken neck, torn achilles, stitches, blown knee and the list continued. I have never been so injured in my life doing any sport and I was a goalie. It just really started getting old, still loved it but just could not take it any more. If i could not progress then it would get boring. Then I learned to surf. I have just as much fun and rarely hurt my self excpet for the odd credit card or bonk on the head.

I know a lot of people that have headed this way for the same reason.

One thing to also consider that is killing wakeboarding is Orlando. If you ride boat and you want to progress and compete, you pretty much have to move to Orlando. Once there it is such a small elite group that it is near impossible to get in. This is really killing the boat scene. Cable parks are popping up everywhere and this opens up the scene to so many more people. There are so many good riders now and most rarely ride the boat. The price of the boats are also way over done and prevents newbies getting into the sport. Look at Dyllan Miller... amazing rider behind a boat but could not break into the orlando competitive scene so made his own way and got bigger as a result. All his success is with out a boat.

Boat builders are realizing this and boats are no longer required for wakeboarding or skating. Surfing is saving the boat market right now. This market is safe unitl people start making laws against it or these surf parks start popping up through the land locked nation.
Old     (hatepain)      Join Date: Aug 2006       09-08-2014, 3:12 PM Reply   
Its funny to me that people think they should tell others how to enjoy their boat and their time on the water. As long as you're being respectful to others and safe who cares? I was on the water all day yesterday. I saw people surfing, a kid knee boarding others tubing, an old guy skiing on two skis and of course people wakeboarding. They all looked to be having fun and that's all that matters.

I'm perfectly capable of wakeboarding still but I just enjoy surfing a lot more and choose to spend the valuable time I get on the lake doing just that. You can choose to do something else but don't judge me and others and I won't you.
Old     (tdc_worm)      Join Date: Sep 2002       09-08-2014, 3:36 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by hatepain View Post
Its funny to me that people think they should tell others how to enjoy their boat and their time on the water.
i dont think that has been the vein of this thread at all. the thread has been an observance of how/why the scene is changing. its a matter of those that desire flat water and those that can care less, they both cannot coexist, and neither one is right.

the one place where i think we are allowed to have and it is our responsibility to have a voice is when actions begin to affect other persons expectations of safety or their personal property. to not own that responsibility will ultimately get us all punished. wakes of all sizes have effects of varying degrees on shorelines, docks, and other vessels. typically, the bigger the wave, the bigger the effect. eventually it will reach it breaking point.
Old     (hatepain)      Join Date: Aug 2006       09-08-2014, 4:55 PM Reply   
I guess I was talking about the derision expressed towards wake surfers in this thread being a passive aggressive way of telling us we shouldn't do it or else we're "gay" etc. Its a constant theme on this website.
Old     (tdc_worm)      Join Date: Sep 2002       09-08-2014, 5:04 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by hatepain View Post
I guess I was talking about the derision expressed towards wake surfers in this thread being a passive aggressive way of telling us we shouldn't do it or else we're "gay" etc. Its a constant theme on this website.
haha. i had my mental filter engaged and didnt process that...and it was right there in front of my eyes!
Old     (srock)      Join Date: Mar 2002       09-09-2014, 5:08 AM Reply   
If you pick up a wake surfer it sounds like you are either young and new to watersports or old and broken down and riding on Daddies boat or your midlife "Corvette".

I guess I will have to keep watching the Wake World globe. When Dave slips in "Surf" for "Wake" I will then know its time to park my wakeboard next to my kneeboard.

An all white Vett is not going to cut it.... Needs to be red.
Old     (timmyb)      Join Date: Apr 2007       09-09-2014, 7:26 AM Reply   
I bought my Corvette when I was 25 and my wakeboard boat when I was 33...guess I did it backwards?
Old     (willyt)      Join Date: May 2010       09-09-2014, 8:22 AM Reply   
wakesurfing is difficult. it really is, just a little more difficult than taking a bath.
Old     (tonyv420)      Join Date: Jul 2007       09-09-2014, 11:21 AM Reply   
I always let the wakeboarder take his set when I see them coming, unless someone is already in the water riding. (They should go the other way if they see us surfing, thats what i do.) If someone is riding up and down the lake like 15-20 passes and has done nothing but ride behind the boat like a slalom skier, IE: Not even doing a wake to wake jump, and power turning everytime they fall, like 99% of the wakeboarders on our lake, then I say screw it! lets surf!
I always make a good effort to share the water.......
Old     (timmyb)      Join Date: Apr 2007       09-09-2014, 1:26 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by willyt View Post
wakesurfing is difficult. it really is, just a little more difficult than taking a bath.
Same as wakeboarding. I have only had a one or two people ever not get up on the board. It's attached to your feet, how challenging could it be to stand up with a 350hp boat pulling you up? Once you're up, all you have to do is not dig the edge in and bend your knees when you hit some chop and you can ride around the lake all friggen day.
Old     (rockballer)      Join Date: Jun 2014       09-09-2014, 1:33 PM Reply   
I feel as if it's more hate than anything from other boats as they see the awesomeness of our wakes... instead of cheering us a high5 with a handful of awesomeness.. Instead they sort through their bag of d1cks and throw the biggest one they can find... In hope it might just get stuck in the right bum
Old     (bwake)      Join Date: Sep 2009       09-11-2014, 2:37 AM Reply   
In my opinion its pretty simple. Who buys new boats? Predominantly older guys (40's) who don't have huge house loans and can afford to spend big on a new boat. Those guys dont really want to kill their body wakeboarding, and surfing is a nice compromise, while still enjoying a day on the lake.....

Pretty simple really, there cant be many guys under 30 or 35 buying brand new boats.
Old     (newmy79)      Join Date: Jun 2005       09-12-2014, 8:04 AM Reply   
Patrick, just curious how surfing and making big rollers is any different than people putting thousands of pounds of ballast in their boat to slam them and wakeboard?


I love all the comments for people against surfing. It's like the snow skier hating the snowboarders debate...just go out and enjoy yourself!
Old     (migs)      Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: SF Bay Area       09-12-2014, 8:40 AM Reply   
^^^^Because Wakeboard wakes dissipate sideways. So after a few seconds you have a good water again.
Surf waves follow the trail of the boat & continue to multiply. Therefore after a surf boat passes & is long gone, there are waves after waves after waves.
THATS THE DIFFERENCE
Old     (brhanley)      Join Date: Jun 2001       09-12-2014, 8:44 AM Reply   
And surfers tend to drive in circles, which = no bueno for flat water conditions
Old     (iShredSAN)      Join Date: Apr 2012       09-12-2014, 8:59 AM Reply   
I'm not against surfing or "surf hating" but if you cannot tell the difference in a wakeboard wake and a surf wake and the impacts each has on surrounding water, you are either not paying attention or not spending much time on the water...
Old     (srock)      Join Date: Mar 2002       09-12-2014, 9:23 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by timmyb View Post
Same as wakeboarding. I have only had a one or two people ever not get up on the board. It's attached to your feet, how challenging could it be to stand up with a 350hp boat pulling you up? Once you're up, all you have to do is not dig the edge in and bend your knees when you hit some chop and you can ride around the lake all friggen day.

Funny you say that. I pulled a neighbor kid who flipped, spinned and then did both at the same time in every direction on my little wake. When I ran the slalom course at my "beginner" level of 34mph and 20 off he said he wanted to do learn to do that one day but he had not because it was so difficult. I had been thinking the same thing about a lot of his moves.
Old     (Ronskal1)      Join Date: Sep 2014       09-12-2014, 10:00 AM Reply   
I'm old (55) but love to wake board. Give me 3 good long pulls, nothing fancy- go W to W, surface 180's yeah I'm boring but I love it.
This summer I bought a surfboard, lots of fun, does not get me tired which is a bummer. My girlfriend likes surfing more than wake boarding now I think.
What continues to impress me is the versatility of a V-drive inboard and yes the boat mfg. are going to market for surf because it is growing.
Old     (timmyb)      Join Date: Apr 2007       09-12-2014, 10:15 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by brhanley View Post
And surfers tend to drive in circles, which = no bueno for flat water conditions
LOL! What does that mean? At some point you come to the end of the lake and have to make a turn to go back the other way? Pretty sure ALL watersports do that.
Old     (timmyb)      Join Date: Apr 2007       09-12-2014, 10:18 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by migs View Post
^^^^Because Wakeboard wakes dissipate sideways. So after a few seconds you have a good water again.
Surf waves follow the trail of the boat & continue to multiply. Therefore after a surf boat passes & is long gone, there are waves after waves after waves.
THATS THE DIFFERENCE
Hilarious! It's really just because the wake is bigger and the boat is going slower so you perceive that there is a difference, it's doing the same exact thing that a wakeboard wake is doing only it puts out a larger wave on one side.
Old     (skiboarder)      Join Date: Oct 2006       09-12-2014, 11:02 AM Reply   
Timmy--that is 100% correct. Wakesurf rollers follow the boat. Wakeboard wakes dissipate on the shoreline. On my river, it is absolutely impossible for me to share a line with wake surfer. That is the #1 source of conflict.
Old     (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       09-12-2014, 11:08 AM Reply   
When wakesurfing you actually get a roller/swell that follows the boat as well as the wake that rolls slowly and more perpendicular to the shore.
Old     (migs)      Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: SF Bay Area       09-12-2014, 11:24 AM Reply   
At the delta you can have 15-20 boats share a slough all together. Wakeboaders, skiers, tubers, and everyone will have good water.
You add 1 surfer & its all over for everyone.

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