open toe safer?

Well I tore my mcl this year for the first time ever...landing in the flats front foot heavy and my knee buckled. I am okay and back riding lightly after 4 weeks.

Question is......before if i ever landed front foot heavy by accident...I remember my front foot would slip out the front a bit diffusing some of the energy. Now with the closed toe your so locked in your foot really has nowhere to go at all in any direction..even a little. So I am theorizing that maybe I would not of popped my knee if my foot could have moved in the binding even a little.

Closed toe bindings seem to have no leeway for foot movement under heavy forces coming from mistakes....in the open toes your foot could always shift somewhat relieving some of the pressure. So now in closed toe these pressures will go elsewhere...like the knee?

Anyone else have any thoughts on this?

I realize people have blown out plenty of knees with open toes....but if it is a close call..i wonder if there is a difference.

(Message edited by absoluteboarder on July 29, 2008)

I can't imagine that an open toe would have helped.

It likely took a lateral movement (from the side) to tear your MCL. So, you body shifted toward either the tip or the tail of the board. I don't think the that energy would have forced your foot forward. Did your toes slam the front of the boot?

I ride with my front pretty duck...which i dont think helped...it seems the knee can buckle medially easier when ducked out. I didn't really feel my toes slamming..I have the 08 murrays and they are very very form fitting...no room for movement. I guess in the end i was just caught of guard with a straight leg and the water bent it for me...and like you said my body was prob shifting forward.

sounds like your binding postions was more the problem than the binding itself. Just like setting up to do a proper squat, there is a proper way to setup your bindings to reduce stress on your kness.

ducked is actually preferred, this is the bodies natural position. think about doing squats in the gym: do them with your feet pigon toed, not going to work and you feel the stress on your knee big time, now slowly open your stance up, the wider you duck the less stress on the knee, your knees will naturally want to flair out. wide and ducked will be your most natural, comfy, and athletic position.

The reason I went duck was 4 years ago I fractured my tibial plateau.....I was riding only a little duck....I cased the wake and the front leg femur twisted forward and chipped the tibia. So I figured if my leg was pointing a little more forward this would prevent that.....it was good for 4 years.
In the end ...its the nature of the sport...maybe I am just to old!

I have also always placed my bindings such that I am in the comfort zone ...or squat position...as your saying.

Anymore thoughts on the binding theory?

I wouldn't put too much energy into this. Go ride. Open or closed toe will make no difference. If you blow your knee, then you blow your knee. Likely no binding would change that.

Only time a binding will affect your knees is if your position isn't set up right for you body type, or if you go one foot in, one foot out.

Call me crazy but I think the non flexy high rise murray boots may have had a tiny bit to do with it though. When I come down a hair front foot heavy I bring the nose of the board up and take the hit on my ankle instead of my knee and from what ive heard the murray boots are very stiff and were pretty much designed to protect murrays ankles. Its either ankles or knees

I think the lack of binding ejection of most closed toes can increase risk of knee injuries, but not so much from the lack of toe slide. I know this really isn't an issue of open vs. closed, but most of the closed toe custom fit bindings lock you in and the energy that would have been disipated by being released from the binding is going somewhere else. This doesn't sound like the issue with you Michael, but just my 2.

Bryan,

Overactive calf muscles and tight hip flexors are causing your feet to duck out when you squat. I can help you work on that.

Sam, squats should be done with your feet straight forward. Isolating your glutes is not like wakeboarding.

seriously jrod? straight forward? i've never EVER heard of that.

thats an incredibel amount of strain on your patella(sp) when you do them that way. unless youre in a yoke rack.

(Message edited by romes on July 29, 2008)

me neither, until I studied it. You can turn your feet out, but you're taking stress off of the glutes, whch is the purpose of a squat. Most people will have a problem keeping their feet straight. Any trainer will start with a squat assessment, and begin corrective stretching to get your feet pointed forward.

Off topic....sorry guys

one more off topic sorry guys...

i've worked with a lot of trainers(mlb, nfl, major universities) and i've never been told that. i would have a hard time with that straight forward stuff cuz i'm not all that flexible. i'm gonna try it and let you know what i think. hmmmm...

sorry guys

I would think that you'd have to do a narrow stance squat to be able to have your feet face forward. I've never heard of that either. I've always heard to squat at a natural angle with your feet shoulder width (or just past) apart.

I've always isolated glutes on a incline press. Feet forward, with lighter weight. It alleviates back strain.

as jarrod mentioned, MCL tears result from lateral movement, not front to back, so the closed toe binding is likely not your problem.

jarrod, went to x fit and asked all 3 trainers and they agree with both sides. less stress but less strenght building. but they stated any heavy squat should be slight toed out. they also prefer to teach it that way to take it from the gym to everyday work place. less stress means a longer carrear my old bones need al the help they can get, so i'd be stoked on some stretch tips.