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Old     (matthewnunziata)      Join Date: Aug 2015       09-17-2015, 12:08 PM Reply   
Hello, I am getting a 2016 Axis A20 and was wondering what my PNP ballast options are. I want to have the biggest and baddest wake possible without having any bags on the seats or floor. I was wondering if I should get a front ballast bag to go under the seat and what are the largest bags I could possibly fit in the back lockers hooked up to PNP.
Thanks,
Matthew Nunziata
Old     (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       09-17-2015, 12:31 PM Reply   
Sumo 900s in the rear and Straighline plug n play bag for the bow.

You probably won't be able to get on plane for wakeboarding with that setup, though. You'll need some more bow weight. I'd recommend stashing lead in the bow.
Old     (matthewnunziata)      Join Date: Aug 2015       09-17-2015, 6:53 PM Reply   
will sumo 900's fit in the back with no problem and will the boat be able to plane at wakesurf speed? Also what size plug and play for the bow?
Thanks
Old     (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       09-18-2015, 7:06 AM Reply   
Yes the sumo 900s fit in the rear and it will do great wakesurfing.

Not sure, you need the bow sac that is designed for that specific boat. http://www.wakemakers.com/axis-hiflo...t-upgrade.html Choose 2016+ A20.
Old     (jarrod)      Join Date: May 2003       09-18-2015, 8:42 AM Reply   
Are we talking wakesurfing or wakeboarding? I have an A22 and as the water got warmer, I couldn't even get 750s in the rear on plane. Also, the 750s barely fit.
Old     (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       09-18-2015, 9:17 AM Reply   
I have 900s in my A20. They don't fill all the way, but they fit well and maximize the locker space. They do great for wakesurfing and for wakeboarding I usually just drain them a bit until the boat is able to plane off. I can eyeball it at this point.

OP asked about surfing in post 3.
Old     (johnny_defacto)      Join Date: Sep 2006       09-18-2015, 4:12 PM Reply   
Does your A20 have the walk through bow, or solid play pen style? I have not seen the new A20 yet. Regardless, there is, or will be, a front pnp sack specific for your boat, but like said previously, it will not be enough. You can stash lead up in the bow like a lot of us do, or you can have a pump and sack ready to go and throw it into the bow... i vote lead, so it is out of the way and unseen.

As for the rears, not sure how the new A20 lockers will be, but I can say that the old ones Sumo 900's will be the ticket. Run it on top of your hard tanks for the rest of the season, and during the off season, pull your hard tanks out and plumb those 900's in there instead. You will fill those 9's all the way up and give you more total ballast back there. Also, during the off season you will know how much weight you prefer in the bow (by experimenting with sacks and/or lead) and you can then plumb in another sack or permanently stash lead hidden away.

congrats and post up your rig when you get it.
Old     (mnwakerider)      Join Date: Jun 2004       09-18-2015, 7:18 PM Reply   
Subscribed. Ordering a 2016 for spring delivery.
Old     (wakeripper)      Join Date: Oct 2002       10-02-2015, 10:22 AM Reply   
I have a 16 A20 the rear bags need to be 52" length for true plug and play and Axis recommends the use of Fat Sacs....I tried Sumo Sacs and they didnt fit well so i have a this time 1000lb Fat Sac bow bag (fits better in the corners of the bow) and 750lb sacs in the rear no extra lead.
Old     (mnwakerider)      Join Date: Jun 2004       10-02-2015, 10:25 AM Reply   
Pics of the wake!!!
Old     (wakeripper)      Join Date: Oct 2002       10-02-2015, 10:36 AM Reply   
And the boat...
Attached Images
   
Old     (That_Guy)      Join Date: Aug 2015 Location: Central Ohio       10-02-2015, 10:47 AM Reply   
Love dat BLUE!!! Looks great, I have a T22 w/ 900's in the rear and 650 bow sack and find a little bit of lead/extra weight in the bow really lengthens the wave.
Old     (Giesh164)      Join Date: Mar 2012       10-03-2015, 10:00 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wakeripper View Post
I have a 16 A20 the rear bags need to be 52" length for true plug and play and Axis recommends the use of Fat Sacs....I tried Sumo Sacs and they didnt fit well so i have a this time 1000lb Fat Sac bow bag (fits better in the corners of the bow) and 750lb sacs in the rear no extra lead.
That your boarding setup too? Wedge down? Im impressed if you can plane with all bags full and wedge down. I ran that same setup but wedge down on my 11 a20 and it would not plane for boarding. We had to drain rears till it would plane. I know for 15+ models you got the new gear ratio and 350 hp. Just wondering if you can now pull that up to board speed since I'm looking at buying a new 16 a20
Thanks
Old     (xstarrider)      Join Date: Jun 2007       10-03-2015, 7:43 PM Reply   
That's about as legit of a wake and color combo as you can get. The A20 is a homerun for wake performance. Hard to beat that wake. Did they tweak it for 2016 like they did the A22 last year, or is the update coming in 2017
Old     (stevev210)      Join Date: Feb 2005       10-03-2015, 9:20 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by xstarrider View Post
That's about as legit of a wake and color combo as you can get. The A20 is a homerun for wake performance. Hard to beat that wake. Did they tweak it for 2016 like they did the A22 last year, or is the update coming in 2017
The 2016 A20 is redesigned!
Old     (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       10-04-2015, 1:41 AM Reply   
The A20 is the most underrated wake in the game. My 2013 is super legit too.
Old     (simplej)      Join Date: Sep 2011       10-04-2015, 6:25 AM Reply   
Subbing.

Test drive a 2015 a22 yesterday. 350 motor, bow bag, and twin 800s in the rear with wedge, had to drain half of the rear. I believe the boat had the "torque" prop but I will confirm Monday.

I was actually really disappointed at the time to plane off because of the prop/transmission set up. It was worse than my buddies 07 star which is obscene.

In an a20 I don't think you should have too much of an issue. In our RZR, apples and oranges but similar sized and weighted boats. we run the 343 with acme 1631 (new 1235?) with ~1400 lbs in the rear and it planes off pretty well. With the 1.7x:1 drive and torque prop or 5 blade I think you'll be okay
Old     (LYNRDSKYNRD)      Join Date: Sep 2012       10-04-2015, 10:52 AM Reply   
The wedge supposedly adds another 1000lbs of ballast to the rear of the boat so they we running 2600 lbs in the rear of the boat. I would expect most boats would have trouble with that setup. I talked to a guy the other day with a similar set up and had 10 people in the boat and he couldn't understand why it wouldn't plane off. I just shook my head.
Old     (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       10-04-2015, 11:07 AM Reply   
The A20 doesn't need that much rear weight to get big. With 800s full in the rear the swim platform is probably shin deep. You would need at least a 400 extra in the bow to even come close to planing off with that setup.

The only reason I have sumo 900s in my boat is for surfing wake. If it wasn't for that id probably run sumo 450s.
Old     (ecore)      Join Date: Jul 2014       10-04-2015, 1:09 PM Reply   
My 15 a22 when I first got it planed with wedge, 800lbs bags in the rear, bow bag and stock ballast with torque prop (2313) . Once I even planned with an additional 800lbs in the walkway. However something has changed and my boat now struggles to plane with no wedge and just ballast full. Kinda disappointed and curious to know what changed
Old     (wakeripper)      Join Date: Oct 2002       10-04-2015, 9:11 PM Reply   
At this point i have found that i like my wakeboard wake to be full front, center, rear hard tanks and a little in bags with the/wedge. For surf wake fill everything and let it rip..
Old     (tripsw)      Join Date: May 2006       10-05-2015, 6:18 PM Reply   
I tried to do a search but "A20" and "A22" are too short to use for search terms, so I figured I'd ask here: how do A20 and A22 wakes compare?
Old     (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       10-06-2015, 9:47 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by tripsw View Post
I tried to do a search but "A20" and "A22" are too short to use for search terms, so I figured I'd ask here: how do A20 and A22 wakes compare?
basically the same shape, A20 is a little bit wider. Size depends on how much ballast. IMO, the A20 gets bigger with less ballast, but the smaller boat is harder to get on plane and as such hits the wall on planing sooner than A22. Overall, not much difference, but I would ride an A20 at least 2.5" longer than an A22 on line length.
Old     (Nordicron)      Join Date: Aug 2011       10-06-2015, 11:50 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by boardjnky4 View Post
basically the same shape, A20 is a little bit wider. Size depends on how much ballast. IMO, the A20 gets bigger with less ballast, but the smaller boat is harder to get on plane and as such hits the wall on planing sooner than A22. Overall, not much difference, but I would ride an A20 at least 2.5" longer than an A22 on line length.

U mean 2.5' ? I've ridden the a20 and that is one wide wake! For me I'd with the a20 expect to either have to increase speed 1-2mph or shorten the line about 10' from what your used to! Yes that's right if u usually ride 70' then 60' will be your new length.

Honestly I've never ridden a A22 and never gathered that it was wider than the average boat.
Old     (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       10-06-2015, 11:53 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nordicron View Post
U mean 2.5' ? I've ridden the a20 and that is one wide wake! For me I'd with the a20 expect to either have to increase speed 1-2mph or shorten the line about 10' from what your used to! Yes that's right if u usually ride 70' then 60' will be your new length.

Honestly I've never ridden a A22 and never gathered that it was wider than the average boat.
haha yeah meant 2.5' . Although, I usually ride it 5' shorter. I typically go 65' @ 22.2mph
Old     (Nordicron)      Join Date: Aug 2011       10-06-2015, 11:58 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by boardjnky4 View Post
haha yeah meant 2.5' . Although, I usually ride it 5' shorter. I typically go 65' @ 22.2mph

Ok that makes more sense. I tell u I normally ride 75 behind most boats but no chance in He!! I could do that on the a20 at 23. Heck I had to drop to 60' and about 22.5 to even have a chance. Great shaped wake though just super wide.
Old     (wakeripper)      Join Date: Oct 2002       10-06-2015, 12:01 PM Reply   
I was very curious to see what they did with the A20 this year as i never liked the "wake" hull on the previous A20 models but the 16 A20 is the "wake plus" hull which is essentially a A22 just 2 feet shorter and the wake and hull are awesome along with the standard 350, transmission and "high altitude" 2249 prop I have no issue getting on plane although top speed is about 35 @ 5600 rpm
Old     (simplej)      Join Date: Sep 2011       10-06-2015, 7:13 PM Reply   
^ what's your ballast set up and wakeboard rpm like?
Old     (stevev210)      Join Date: Feb 2005       10-11-2015, 3:58 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by xstarrider View Post
That's about as legit of a wake and color combo as you can get. The A20 is a homerun for wake performance. Hard to beat that wake. Did they tweak it for 2016 like they did the A22 last year, or is the update coming in 2017
How would you compare the A20 wake to the 2nd gen star? I'm seriously thinking about getting out of the Star and into 2016 A20. Love the star but tired of taking the tower apart to get it in and out of my garage.
Old     (xstarrider)      Join Date: Jun 2007       10-11-2015, 4:20 PM Reply   
As far as the A20 to the 205v/OG VDrive XStar. It's darn me at right in the ballpark. Was just in the 2016 A20 over the weekend on the showroom floor. Really really like the redesign. Didn't get to ride it, but from what I hear it's even better of a wake than the original.

The main difference was the line length. Being used to riding 75-80ft on the 205v hull at 24.5mph and then riding the A20 at 65-70 ft it was little different. The wake was every bit as great it was just weird on the shorter line. I bet if is had it I would easily get used to it. The hang time and snap was there for sure. The boat drives and planes every bit as good. To me stacked up against the X1/205V you gain room, storage, and surf wake. You don't gain any bling whatsoever though. Wetsounds is a great upgrade for the stereo and the hi flow ballast fills quicker. How can you go wrong? It's on par in every aspect IMO and ahead in others which make it a great upgrade. There isn't another 20ft'r that has the wake to compete. For the X20 lovers I can't say anything yet about the wakeboard wake as I have yet to ride it. But that's worth 3 205v's. So if your looking for an X20 you should be at an A22 or 24 price point, and to me that really "blurs the lines."

Last edited by xstarrider; 10-11-2015 at 4:24 PM.
Old     (stevev210)      Join Date: Feb 2005       10-11-2015, 4:32 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by xstarrider View Post
As far as the A20 to the 205v/OG VDrive XStar. It's darn me at right in the ballpark. Was just in the 2016 A20 over the weekend on the showroom floor. Really really like the redesign. Didn't get to ride it, but from what I hear it's even better of a wake than the original.

The main difference was the line length. Being used to riding 75-80ft on the 205v hull at 24.5mph and then riding the A20 at 65-70 ft it was little different. The wake was every bit as great it was just weird on the shorter line. I bet if is had it I would easily get used to it. The hang time and snap was there for sure. The boat drives and planes every bit as good. To me stacked up against the X1/205V you gain room, storage, and surf wake. You don't gain any bling whatsoever though. Wetsounds is a great upgrade for the stereo and the hi flow ballast fills quicker. How can you go wrong? It's on par in every aspect IMO and ahead in others which make it a great upgrade. There isn't another 20ft'r that has the wake to compete. For the X20 lovers I can't say anything yet about the wakeboard wake as I have yet to ride it. But that's worth 3 205v's. So if your looking for an X20 you should be at an A22 or 24 price point, and to me that really "blurs the lines."
I had a 05 x2 for 5 yrs and the last 3 has been my 06 star. I love the Star but am ready to go back to a smaller boat. I spent an hour going through a 2016 A20 also and really like it. I am a huge fan of simplicity like analog gauges and toggle switches, filling ballast with out timers...etc. I like the wake on my Star but still ride a couple 05 x2's and always find myself liking x2(205v) wake better.
Old     (xstarrider)      Join Date: Jun 2007       10-11-2015, 4:47 PM Reply   
My bad Steve. I always think of x star line like this.

Gen 1: 97-98 direct drive
Gen 2: 99-2002 XSrar 03-05 XSeries/x2 06-11 X1
Gen 3: 2003-2011 Xstar
Gen 4: 2013-current

Unfortunately I still think a sac'd out 03-11 is far superior, but you're going to be running a crap ton of weight in that Star and it will be a pig. If you're using factory ballast or just a bit over, not running the pro tour kit I still think the A20 can compete on the same level. However now you are definitely stepping down in bling and finish. You're still gaining a much better surf wake with the A20 than the Xstar. I think you'll find the cockpit in the A20 more spacious , the bow space obviously little less, and storage about equal all things considered. If you like the idea of a smaller package the A20 is great. Compare it to a current/late model X2 and its better in wake, surf, and handling IMO. If you like the size you're in an A22 will handle better for sure than the Star. A16 A20 is going to be pennies less than a leftover 15A22 at this point so that is something to consider. And the 15 A22 got the hull update first.
Old     (opers13)      Join Date: Feb 2016       03-19-2016, 5:28 AM Reply   
great info..I'm getting a 2014 A20 with around 45hrs, comes with 2x 650lb PNP in rear. Roswell Neptune T/S, bluetooth & sub. I've been wakeboarding behind a Yamaha jet boat and the A20 is just an awesome upgrade for us. I'm hoping to get going soon to figure stuff out and have a great summer wake boarding & surfing.

With my ballast setup, what can I expect as far as planning off?
Old     (granddaddy53)      Join Date: Dec 2013       03-22-2016, 11:18 AM Reply   
I run 750 sumo rear and you need to learn to burp your pnp bags, with is the real determinant of how much water gets in them, my rear drain is short and allows bag to properly overlay raised platform in stern of rear compartment, sort of short in front vent plumbing, again allowing part of bag to extend under rear seat wall, after doing short rear 1st, top needs to be cut adjusted well to keep center of bag in place. I run a sumo 900 mushroom bag up front, that one needs that rear drain cut short barely sticking out of floor hole but with slack to pull on you'll need to disconnect, again burp bag to get water in bag and make sure mushroom is laying flat and pulled toward stern so bottom of mushroom is against wall on eac side and rest centered and flat. Wife and I surf alone with full ballast and wedge and full fuel about 3500 plus wedge plus driver and gear. Very tall shapely wake, needs 350 lbs of 2 riders as front passengers on each side of bag puffing thru holes and it would lengthen nicely,
Old     (granddaddy53)      Join Date: Dec 2013       03-22-2016, 11:21 AM Reply   
Must have ACME 1235 high altitude prop at minimum, you could even wakeboard with almost that load and people
Old     (granddaddy53)      Join Date: Dec 2013       03-22-2016, 11:23 AM Reply   
I only have monsoon330
Old     (granddaddy53)      Join Date: Dec 2013       03-22-2016, 11:28 AM Reply   
By the way this is an old thread , look at the dates, I'm giving you personal and repeated regularly accurate info, if you bring a crowd, you get one person on back seat of 200 lbs, 650 vs 750x2, if you load up back without more front, wave doesn't form well, we put everybody across chillax seat 1 and front bench 2, and maybe one behind driver up against driver seat
Old     (granddaddy53)      Join Date: Dec 2013       03-22-2016, 11:51 AM Reply   
If you don't have one see if you can scrounge up a surplus or used tower mirror mount and mirror and mirror to mount hardware, love that mirror
Old     (granddaddy53)      Join Date: Dec 2013       03-22-2016, 12:01 PM Reply   
https://www.facebook.com/daves.wakeb...6006181829359/

My wife having a great time
Old     (opers13)      Join Date: Feb 2016       04-16-2016, 5:16 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by granddaddy53 View Post
By the way this is an old thread , look at the dates, I'm giving you personal and repeated regularly accurate info, if you bring a crowd, you get one person on back seat of 200 lbs, 650 vs 750x2, if you load up back without more front, wave doesn't form well, we put everybody across chillax seat 1 and front bench 2, and maybe one behind driver up against driver seat
Thanks for the info David. After some reading I went with acme 2315. I heard from my marina yesterday and prop is already installed, so I'm ready to go. I'm going to look into the mushroom bag upfront or lead http://www.leadwake.com/

very excited about the A20 can't wait to pick it up

Alex
Old     (granddaddy53)      Join Date: Dec 2013       04-16-2016, 6:45 AM Reply   
Both I guess huh?
Old     (granddaddy53)      Join Date: Dec 2013       04-16-2016, 6:50 AM Reply   
By the way learn to ride goofy if that's not regular for you , I go all four ways, the best is goofy(wrong term) on starboard which is natural best wave,
Old     (granddaddy53)      Join Date: Dec 2013       04-16-2016, 6:53 AM Reply   
I have 3 board/surf board racks and one surf only , you need them or the boat gets real small fast

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