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Old     (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       11-14-2019, 10:21 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by dougr View Post
Example, my neighbor said he heard our other neighbor stole money out of the church donation box. i would not go to the church and make a statement that i did not see, my neighbor was the second party to hear it, he did not go to the church and make a statement, the only person that has proof is the person who saw it happen. I would not go to the police and make a statement because my input would not be reliable. only if i had an agenda against that person, a hate for them etc etc would someone go to that extent to go that far. The second hand people did not "blow the whistle" they found some tool box to do it for them, or carry the allegations.
This is actually a great example Doug. In my mind I totally get it -- that you only heard the story third hand so you don't want to go to the cops and sign a statement. Would it be unreasonable for you to call the "Secret Witness" tip line, though, and give the tip anonymously? In my mind that's really the better comparison -- we want people to be able to anonymously report wrongdoing without fear of reprisal.

In the secret witness context, the police will obviously consider the apparent truthfullness of the claim in the first instance, and then assuming it has an air of legitimacy, will need to corroborate it with independent facts to lead to a prosecution. Similarly here, the investigators have taken the whistleblower's road map and have confirmed the facts with relevant parties (to the extent possible given the WH's prohibition of testimony from first hand witnesses).

Here's the whistleblower complaint with all of that homework done for you so you can see for yourself what real people are on the record saying: https://www.npr.org/2019/11/09/77617...ated-heres-how
Old     (95sn)      Join Date: Sep 2005       11-14-2019, 10:24 AM Reply   
So, you as the second party go and report to the police dept. The police follow up with your lead, they find the perp base don your info. The perp has a lighter, empty gas cans and a gas receipt paid by his credit card is located at the scene of the crime. What next? Let him go because you had only second party info? It is what we have here. Second party alerted authorities, authorities investigate and find ample evidence. There is no difference.
Old     (dougr)      Join Date: Dec 2009       11-14-2019, 12:26 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by 95sn View Post
So, you as the second party go and report to the police dept. The police follow up with your lead, they find the perp base don your info. The perp has a lighter, empty gas cans and a gas receipt paid by his credit card is located at the scene of the crime. What next? Let him go because you had only second party info? It is what we have here. Second party alerted authorities, authorities investigate and find ample evidence. There is no difference.
I have read the report, watched or listened to the testimony yesterday and also understand all the arguments. this is a policy issue, not a bribery claim. this was and is a common conversation, with all the leaking, back stabbing, russian hoax etc etc, I would be very worried about leaking info, and would be hesitant to believe anyone in that cabinet and would believe Ukraine is still corrupt, that Biden (when the VP) was involved with corrupt companies, had his son involved in courupt companies and allowed these Ukrainian entities manipulate the National security of the united states.

If Hunter was on the Board of Enron, would you be concerned? Would you be concerned if VP Biden took his son to another country to meet with Enron, get on the board with Enron and supported Enron. Burisma is the mob. Hunter was on the board of a mob holding company. His father was and did help him get on it. was aware and was glad to see his son profit from it. Both testified yesterday they were concerned,

Where was the whistleblower on that one? No where to be found, because the people in the Obama cabinet agreed with his Agenda. liked the ideals and liked Obama and VP Biden, and liked seeing them profit, etc etc.

People who like other people like to see them win. They bat a blind eye. Trump is an idiot, but our idiot, Obama, Clinton, Bush all idiots, but all were our idiot. all playing the game. Every Dem candidate is a fraud, its just who is the least fraudulent out of the bunch. Thats politics.

I would not have impeached any of them for this call, and I think Hilary should have been put in prison for destroying the server and phones, not for being stupid and having a server, she's an idiot, but for hiding it. Trump did not hide anything and thats why this entire sham is crap.
Old     (dougr)      Join Date: Dec 2009       11-14-2019, 12:35 PM Reply   
heres the other thing, let the idiots fight it out, just not on OUR money, not on our time, they are wasting time. Let the people vote him out! People want good jobs, larger paychecks, better retirement etc etc. Things are really good for most. My person job would be better if the economy was down, my sales go up. The doctors i service work harder, more hours, and look to diversify their practices. When things are good, pockets are fat, they all stop working more, stop growing, stop learning new things and sit back and enjoy the ride. So i could argue a crash would serve me well. but most of us are reasonable, rational people. thats not the government or the people in it. unfortunately thats the truth.

90% of all republicans or democrats are just normal, everyday people who want very similar things, but when you see the stupidity of whats happening around the country and the world, you start to wonder how whack people are becoming.
Old     (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       11-14-2019, 12:38 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by dougr View Post
Trump did not hide anything and thats why this entire sham is crap.
If he really wasn't hiding anything why was a TV lawyer conducting foreign policy for him, and why won't he let Bolton, Pompeo and Mulveney testify?
Old     (wombat2wombat)      Join Date: Sep 2018       11-14-2019, 12:50 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by shawndoggy View Post
If he really wasn't hiding anything why was a TV lawyer conducting foreign policy for him, and why won't he let Bolton, Pompeo and Mulveney testify?
Yeah, does that logic apply to all the ones the right want to testify or just the ones you think has the goods on Trump? Why has the left refused all the witnesses the right requested if they have nothing to hide? Why ya'll freaking out about Durham & Barr is they have nothing to hide. You put forth the dumbest obtuse crap.. No one is above the law, but no one is beneath it either. It's called rights. not play the lefts retarded game of lets find a crime.

We all know after the circus goes up in flames you idiots are just going start "obstruction obstruction!!"
Old     (dougr)      Join Date: Dec 2009       11-14-2019, 1:00 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by shawndoggy View Post
If he really wasn't hiding anything why was a TV lawyer conducting foreign policy for him, and why won't he let Bolton, Pompeo and Mulveney testify?
I don't think there is anyone he could possibly trust, 90% of the swamp want him out. they despise him, so Guiliani is also an idiot, what Trump believes is Giuliani is his "go too" person, and Giuliani will burn him too.lol I would imagine that very few of the people that work in this arena have any integrity.
Old     (wombat2wombat)      Join Date: Sep 2018       11-14-2019, 1:02 PM Reply   
203 pages of lefties being wrong on everything thus far. Doesn't the losing get old?
Old     (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       11-14-2019, 1:04 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by dougr View Post
I would imagine that very few of the people that work in this arena have any integrity.
Did you feel that way about Taylor and Kent yesterday? Like they are partisan hacks with no integrity?
Old     (wombat2wombat)      Join Date: Sep 2018       11-14-2019, 1:08 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by shawndoggy View Post
Did you feel that way about Taylor and Kent yesterday? Like they are partisan hacks with no integrity?
Well tell us how you know they are stand up men of integrity, Shawn? Did you hear it from a friend who heard it from a friend or was it just your feeling & gut? Or is it their bravery where they face no blow back?

Last edited by wombat2wombat; 11-14-2019 at 1:10 PM.
Old     (dougr)      Join Date: Dec 2009       11-14-2019, 1:18 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by shawndoggy View Post
Did you feel that way about Taylor and Kent yesterday? Like they are partisan hacks with no integrity?
It does not matter what they think, its not their jobs to make opinions. Its a policy issue. This is a policy issue that affects one person, Hunter Biden. The dam's do not want anyone digging into anything Biden, if Biden was not running, this would never had begun.

Actually the Dems would be in favor of investigating Burisma If hunter Biden was not on the board, and VP Biden was not VP at the time this all went down, we would still be talking Russian corruption..
Old     (95sn)      Join Date: Sep 2005       11-14-2019, 1:25 PM Reply   
^^^because the "right" wants to try to prove a false, debunked Russian conspiracy theory. That it was Ukraine that attacked the election. They want to publicize the whistleblower which blows the whole reasoning behind whistle blower rules. They cannot defend the actual crimes.
I don't think any libtard has even brought up barr and durhams investigation. There are no worries. It will be just like all the Hillary Clinton email and Benghazi crap all over again. They find nothing. Point them out, who is freaking?

Quote:
this is a policy issue, not a bribery claim. t
The problem is that it is an illegitimate policy issue. The career officials were following formal US foreign policy with Ukraine. Trump sent his personal atty and EU ambass and Perry, and Volker to work an illegitimate policy in order to assist trump in a federal campaign. This "non-legit" policy was so out of whack with the official policy they had to first oust the current Ambass to Ukraine. They had to really lie and badmouth about her to get her out of the way. why if its just the pres new policy? If trump were concerned about corruption, can we recall all the other things he was doing to stop corruption in the world? Exactly.

As far as the believability of the 2 early witnesses, Did you watch? Taylor went to west Point, grad in 1969. He was #5 out of over 800 in his class. That's top 1%. These guys could have any job they want. Taylor joined the army and went to combat in nam. He served the country for 50 years w/o one single blemish on his record. Yeah, I believe him to be THEE expert in that part of the world and I believe that he understands what he is saying.
You wanna peg someone up or down based on their integrity and history? Please explain in detail of trumps long history of integrity.

As I watch this investigation unfold I get more upset about trumps assistance to Russia. Ukraine is a relatively poor country at war with Russia for the last 5 years. They desperately need US assistance in $$ and they need world recognition the USA is on Ukraine side not Russia's. Trump was sabotaging them in addition to bribery. Puppet.
Old     (dougr)      Join Date: Dec 2009       11-14-2019, 2:02 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by 95sn View Post
^^^because the "right" wants to try to prove a false, debunked Russian conspiracy theory. That it was Ukraine that attacked the election. They want to publicize the whistleblower which blows the whole reasoning behind whistle blower rules. They cannot defend the actual crimes.
I don't think any libtard has even brought up barr and durhams investigation. There are no worries. It will be just like all the Hillary Clinton email and Benghazi crap all over again. They find nothing. Point them out, who is freaking?


The problem is that it is an illegitimate policy issue. The career officials were following formal US foreign policy with Ukraine. Trump sent his personal atty and EU ambass and Perry, and Volker to work an illegitimate policy in order to assist trump in a federal campaign. This "non-legit" policy was so out of whack with the official policy they had to first oust the current Ambass to Ukraine. They had to really lie and badmouth about her to get her out of the way. why if its just the pres new policy? If trump were concerned about corruption, can we recall all the other things he was doing to stop corruption in the world? Exactly.

As far as the believability of the 2 early witnesses, Did you watch? Taylor went to west Point, grad in 1969. He was #5 out of over 800 in his class. That's top 1%. These guys could have any job they want. Taylor joined the army and went to combat in nam. He served the country for 50 years w/o one single blemish on his record. Yeah, I believe him to be THEE expert in that part of the world and I believe that he understands what he is saying.
You wanna peg someone up or down based on their integrity and history? Please explain in detail of trumps long history of integrity.

As I watch this investigation unfold I get more upset about trumps assistance to Russia. Ukraine is a relatively poor country at war with Russia for the last 5 years. They desperately need US assistance in $$ and they need world recognition the USA is on Ukraine side not Russia's. Trump was sabotaging them in addition to bribery. Puppet.
I think both men are emotionally involved with Ukraine. very much so to the point that they are personally upset with all of this, I do think they both want their opinions to be the rule of engagement and they are upset that the rules have changed, like them or not.

they both agree Ukraine is a stinky pile of never ending corruption and maybe just maybe they can dig out of it. But, if the Dems want to know about voter suppression, and foreign manipulation in our elections, they would want to know what happened with Burisma, what happened with Biden's involvement, What happened with the steal dossier. Lets dig into everything. lets let it all out! Then when a crime arises, no matter what side, lets investigate and charge.

Lets not act as if the Dem's want that, and lets not act as if the republicans want it either. Neither want it, they just want it their way.

Ukraine is poor, so what, there are many poor countries. We are using them as they are using us! They need help, they need money, they need support, we need someone to deal with Russia. that the game Fight the Russians, we will give you arms. Don't fight back, we will give you nothing. Why did the Dems not give the level of support the admin is now? I don't know, but I am sure there is underling reasons, favors, greasing of wheels somewhere. Please don't go down this almighty sanctity of the "position" game.

What blows my mind is the idea that elections have not been manipulated until now. seriously. There will be manipulation on both side no matter who is in office. It will be in every election for the rest of time

Warren lied about being native american, just to get a leg up. Why would she not lie about anything else if it would get her a leg up, Trump is no better, Obama etc etc all the same.

Schiff doesn't know who the whistleblower is, lol his entire staff does and he doesn't ? Lies, so what, of coarse he is going to lie, and if he gets away with it, he will continue to lie, its a game of manipulation.

just like the catholic church says, we didn't know priests were molesting boys. really! they still have the same problem and every so many years, one pops up and everyone is SO SHOCKED!
Old     (fly135)      Join Date: Jun 2004       11-15-2019, 2:51 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by dougr View Post
Warren lied about being native american, just to get a leg up. Why would she not lie about anything else if it would get her a leg up, Trump is no better, Obama etc etc all the same.
This is pretty much the Republican stance. All politicians are the same, so they can do whatever they want without repercussions. If the criminal apologists get their way, then someone lying about their heritage in a college application is equivalent to the President lying to America on a daily basis. We all know that Trump is "no better". But really, he's no worse than Obama's one lie about keeping your health ins, or Warren's one lie about her heritage? You'd have to be a f**k'n idiot to think that. But this is where the f**k'n idiots hang out to defend Trump, so no surprises.
Old     (wombat2wombat)      Join Date: Sep 2018       11-15-2019, 4:26 AM Reply   
LOL, the grifter dems new witness was removed from her post in May, before any of this supposed stuff happened. Do these clowns have anything but a circus to offer? "she felt, it was a coordinated effort to oust her". You serve at the presidents discretion. Mueller 2.0 with a lil more energy & a bigger let down.
Old     (skiboarder)      Join Date: Oct 2006       11-15-2019, 4:58 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wombat2wombat View Post
LOL, the grifter dems new witness was removed from her post in May, before any of this supposed stuff happened. Do these clowns have anything but a circus to offer? "she felt, it was a coordinated effort to oust her". You serve at the presidents discretion. Mueller 2.0 with a lil more energy & a bigger let down.
Yeah, but the guy Trump appointed is saying the same thing...
Old     (pesos)      Join Date: Oct 2001       11-15-2019, 5:34 AM Reply   
Stone has been convicted on all 7 felony counts - Gates' testimony in the case directly contradicts Trump's written answers under oath in Mueller investigation.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/11/15/u...al-guilty.html

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/rog...-mueller-probe
Old     (wombat2wombat)      Join Date: Sep 2018       11-15-2019, 5:35 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by skiboarder View Post
Yeah, but the guy Trump appointed is saying the same thing...
And? Again, they serve at his discretion. He was also ousted before as well. Neither have ever met Trump. The dems have nothing, even if he is guilty, the evidence isn't there.
Old     (skiboarder)      Join Date: Oct 2006       11-15-2019, 5:53 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wombat2wombat View Post
And? Again, they serve at his discretion. He was also ousted before as well. Neither have ever met Trump. The dems have nothing, even if he is guilty, the evidence isn't there.
You understand that he is not being impeached for a phone call, right. It is the activities of Guliani and Sondland operating under his orders. Those started back when Fiona Hill was the ambassador.
Old     (markj)      Join Date: Apr 2005       11-15-2019, 6:09 AM Reply   
The stated reason for an impeachment keeps changing. That's what's so funny about this. What are we on now? Like reason number 4? Libs keep schitting the bed and striking out. Sure provides great entertainment and a great distraction though.
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       11-15-2019, 6:27 AM Reply   
So glad Trump weasel Roger Stone got convicted. Only the best people! LOL.
Old     (DeltaHoosier)      Join Date: Mar 2018       11-15-2019, 7:47 AM Reply   
Now the dems are focus grouping the words they need to use when talking about Trump and what to impeach him on. Now it is Bribery. Can't make this stuff up. Actually focus grouping. Clowns.
Old     (DeltaHoosier)      Join Date: Mar 2018       11-15-2019, 7:50 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by skiboarder View Post
You understand that he is not being impeached for a phone call, right. It is the activities of Guliani and Sondland operating under his orders. Those started back when Fiona Hill was the ambassador.
Impeachment is a political endevor. Has nothing to do with convicting anyone. The democrats will move the goal post to what ever answer they can get from any interviewee. They will continue to focus group until they find a topic that their focus groups find moves the needle. They will stay on that topic and drag it out. Trump will not be convicted on policy differences and this is exactly what this is. He will be re-elected and the democrats will now be facing a president that they can not touch.

Also, listening to interviews about ambassadors, they tend to start suffering from stockholm syndrome after a while. They start to feel that the country they work in is the most important thing and even start aligning themselves with the politics of the host country. That can not be any more clear then hearing the testimony of those people and their version of what they believe the policy should be vs Trumps.

Last edited by DeltaHoosier; 11-15-2019 at 7:53 AM.
Old     (joeshmoe)      Join Date: Jan 2003       11-15-2019, 8:25 AM Reply   
Stocks are about to break 28,000 and Trump is still going to LOSE! Check it out
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com...roval-ratings/
His approval rating is STILL stuck below 42%, of course the impeachment hearings are Not hurting the base, but his base is Not and will Not grow! Keep believing Trumps going win, but the Truth is Americans are Tired of his Chit! Good luck in Winning, you are going to Need it! How about some ideas this president can do besides lying and tweeting, because if he did those two things he would easily win.
Old     (DeltaHoosier)      Join Date: Mar 2018       11-15-2019, 8:45 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeshmoe View Post
Stocks are about to break 28,000 and Trump is still going to LOSE! Check it out
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com...roval-ratings/
His approval rating is STILL stuck below 42%, of course the impeachment hearings are Not hurting the base, but his base is Not and will Not grow! Keep believing Trumps going win, but the Truth is Americans are Tired of his Chit! Good luck in Winning, you are going to Need it! How about some ideas this president can do besides lying and tweeting, because if he did those two things he would easily win.
It is way too early in the day to be this drunk or stoned.
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       11-15-2019, 9:04 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeltaHoosier View Post
It is way too early in the day to be this drunk or stoned.
Agree, Trump is odds on to be re-elected IMO. The Dems need to start being a positive alternative to Trump not a whiney bunch of no idea clowns.
Old     (wombat2wombat)      Join Date: Sep 2018       11-15-2019, 9:24 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by ralph View Post
Agree, Trump is odds on to be re-elected IMO. The Dems need to start being a positive alternative to Trump not a whiney bunch of no idea clowns.
Thank you! It's the only reason I am going to vote for him as of now. Not one of the other contenders is worth a ****. My thoughts; If we didn't allow such dirty politics, destruction of peoples lives, digging up every last bit of dirt decent people might actually want to run.
Old     (wombat2wombat)      Join Date: Sep 2018       11-15-2019, 9:24 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeltaHoosier View Post
Now the dems are focus grouping the words they need to use when talking about Trump and what to impeach him on. Now it is Bribery. Can't make this stuff up. Actually focus grouping. Clowns.
Like I said, it'll end up being cries of obstruction. Looking forward to whats coming from Barr & Durham
Old     (dougr)      Join Date: Dec 2009       11-15-2019, 9:25 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeltaHoosier View Post
Impeachment is a political endevor. Has nothing to do with convicting anyone. The democrats will move the goal post to what ever answer they can get from any interviewee. They will continue to focus group until they find a topic that their focus groups find moves the needle. They will stay on that topic and drag it out. Trump will not be convicted on policy differences and this is exactly what this is. He will be re-elected and the democrats will now be facing a president that they can not touch.

Also, listening to interviews about ambassadors, they tend to start suffering from stockholm syndrome after a while. They start to feel that the country they work in is the most important thing and even start aligning themselves with the politics of the host country. That can not be any more clear then hearing the testimony of those people and their version of what they believe the policy should be vs Trumps.
The fact she was not fired blows my mind, have you ever been fired BUT not fired, She was given all her credential, a georgetown job and full pay. Its was a move, thats it, like it or not, and she did not like it. She's upset. too bad. she had no reason to be there. period. her opinion has no barring on impeachment.

Its getting redic, after 30 years, they feel its their country, their rules, I am sorry she's out, but thats too bad. Thats the job you agreed on. Its like a pro baseball player being traded, they don't kick and scream to the other team. They pack their **** and move on. Bush league ****
Old     (95sn)      Join Date: Sep 2005       11-15-2019, 10:34 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeltaHoosier View Post
Now the dems are focus grouping the words they need to use when talking about Trump and what to impeach him on. Now it is Bribery. Can't make this stuff up. Actually focus grouping. Clowns.
Are you assuming there is no "War-Room at the WH? Please they hired plenty of extra attys and PR companies to fight this.
Does it not concern you that the grifters story has changed 7 times with respect to whistleblower. As far as Dems, Is there a limit to the number of allegations they are allowed? There is a good chance there will be more than one article of impeachment. Bribery sounds like a good one, abuse of power, Intimating witnesses, obstruction...
Cant make this stuff up.

Quote:
The fact she was not fired blows my mind, have you ever been fired BUT not fired, She was given all her credential, a georgetown job and full pay. Its was a move, thats it, like it or not, and she did not like it. She's upset. too bad. she had no reason to be there. period. her opinion has no barring on impeachment.
She had no reason to be there? She was the Ambassador. You know who had no reason to be there? Rudy and his merry band of felons plus the 3 amigos. I agree her opinion has no bearing on the impeachment however she is an excellent witness. Her expertise draws the picture as to what US Policy has been, recent Ukraine history, State Dept goals... and since she was removed from her position so trump could set up illegit channels, she is a qualified witness. Every time I have fired someone, I had a reason. What was the grifters reason to fire her? Why the need to smear her reputation? He clearly has authority to hire/fire anyone, but he sent Rudy in to smear her. Where is MikePompeo? Pompeo was head of CIA when ALL US Intelligence determined that Russia attacked out 2016 election. Pompeo needs to appear.

Quote:
Its getting redic, after 30 years, they feel its their country, their rules, I am sorry she's out, but thats too bad. Thats the job you agreed on. Its like a pro baseball player being traded, they don't kick and scream to the other team. They pack their **** and move on. Bush league ****
Specifically, what did she do or say that was bush league? She said nothing, she packed her bags and flew back to DC. Please provide where you read about her whining of her bad luck and her bush league attitude. What leads you to the conclusion she felt like it was her country, her rules? She was there starting aug 2016, trump appointed her. She has worked all over the world she did not spend 30 years in Ukraine. You seem to have the actual facts mixed up.

Hey Delta, Roger Stone was indicted by Mueller and has been found Guilty on all 7 charges in your Russia Hoax. That's 7 of trumps inner circle that have admitted guilt or have been found guilty in court. How many til its not a hoax?

Quote:
The stated reason for an impeachment keeps changing. That's what's so funny about this. What are we on now? Like reason number 4? Libs keep schitting the bed and striking out. Sure provides great entertainment and a great distraction though.
Allow me to help you. It isn't "changing" its just getting bigger. Its more. Like when you go into 7/11 and you want a soda, but for .19 cents more you get the BigGulp. They just got the BigGulp.

Do you think it costs the US more for trump to have a golf weekend in Florida? or the impeachment hearing? hmmm. I got $$ on golf.

Changes.
https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q...22CC&FORM=VIRE
Old     (markj)      Join Date: Apr 2005       11-15-2019, 10:41 AM Reply   
[QUOTE=joeshmoe;1993324]Stocks are about to break 28,000 and Trump is still going to LOSE!


Does your mom know what a mess you just made of your sheets with that wet dream? WAKE UP!!!
Old     (DeltaHoosier)      Join Date: Mar 2018       11-15-2019, 2:08 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by dougr View Post
The fact she was not fired blows my mind, have you ever been fired BUT not fired, She was given all her credential, a georgetown job and full pay. Its was a move, thats it, like it or not, and she did not like it. She's upset. too bad. she had no reason to be there. period. her opinion has no barring on impeachment.

Its getting redic, after 30 years, they feel its their country, their rules, I am sorry she's out, but thats too bad. Thats the job you agreed on. Its like a pro baseball player being traded, they don't kick and scream to the other team. They pack their **** and move on. Bush league ****
Yep. The written letters and then their testimony is all about sour grapes that Trump does not agree with their policies. That is all this crap is. It can not be clearer. Dragging the country through this and stirring up hate for this? Democrats dragged the country in the first civil war. They seem determined to want to do it again.
Old     (dougr)      Join Date: Dec 2009       11-15-2019, 3:24 PM Reply   
I am tired of all the feelings, its "how I feel" if you were to be hanged, would you care about someones feeling. you don't have to like trump, you can hate trump, but as for the "rules" You would be bent 2 ways to nowhere if you were being slammed without any ability to stand up for yourself. Its phony, she was phony. You really don't believe, after 30 + years, of living in insanely corrupt countries, she actually acts like that. She would cut your throat and bleed you like a stuck pig. She is a senior, ambassador, not a middle school cheer leader. She's had many years of extreme confrontation. Wars have been fought over her decisions, influence and opinion.

She put on her best sunday suit. she could be a warm loving person, but she's no pre madonna. She has been around the block and now she's out. Her responses to Dems were long winded. always agreeing, then defensive on republican responses. only to justify her existence. I am not saying she was not a great ( or poor) ambassador. It does not matter. Mary poppins just wasted our day. I wish she would have been the person she really is when she was arguing with the Armenian dialogue over political opposition. She's an actor, totally sharp, not stupid, new Biden was a total nightmare, new the entire background, She's argued extreme political opposition against extreme countries. then she wept today, for the camera's

Last edited by dougr; 11-15-2019 at 3:32 PM.
Old     (joeshmoe)      Join Date: Jan 2003       11-16-2019, 5:34 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeltaHoosier View Post
It is way too early in the day to be this drunk or stoned.
So, there is nothing Trump can improve on? Truth is Trumps approval rating is closer to 41%, even worse than Jimmy Carter, check it out
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com...roval-ratings/
You have no clue how to win over the independent voters, which is what it will take to have Trump win, but that's OK, Trump has no clue either, he is a piece of Schitt!
Old     (pesos)      Join Date: Oct 2001       11-17-2019, 2:34 PM Reply   
Hmm Trump’s campaign trail magic doesn’t seem to be bearing out MarkJ and the Buttboy’s claims of late.

He went into deep red Kentucky and Louisiana and apparently inspired the opposition’s voters more than his own (or perhaps both equally and it’s simply a math problem, which doesn’t bode well for him either). And Virginia had both houses of the legislature flip to the democrats last week too.

So when do we think he announces he’s dropping Pence for Haley?
Old     (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       11-18-2019, 2:18 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by pesos View Post
So when do we think he announces heís dropping Pence for Haley?
Methinks she's not that dumb. She's seen what's happened to Pompeo. Haley is probably the one person who has gotten in and out of the Trump administration relatively unscathed, and who is also known for speaking truth to him. How'd that work out for Priebus, Tillerson, Sessions, McMaster, Mattis, Neilsen... who am I forgetting?
Old     (95sn)      Join Date: Sep 2005       11-18-2019, 8:12 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by shawndoggy View Post
Methinks she's not that dumb. She's seen what's happened to Pompeo. Haley is probably the one person who has gotten in and out of the Trump administration relatively unscathed, and who is also known for speaking truth to him. How'd that work out for Priebus, Tillerson, Sessions, McMaster, Mattis, Neilsen... who am I forgetting?
Or...its like a drug and she is hooked. Like all addicts, I dont trust her. Shell be slapping her forearm looking for a vein. Everyone who has worked for trump, all of them will regret it. He dumps virtually everyone, eventually even the most dedicated, like Sessions. Grifter demands loyalty yet never is loyal to anyone. Ever. Over 70 years of precedent proving this fact over and over again.
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       11-18-2019, 10:06 AM Reply   
https://youtu.be/oIhX5Q9qUUY
Powell warns debt is currently growing faster than the economy and it's unsustainable. Trump slags this dude because he won't pump up the stock market bubble to make him look good but he seems to know what end of the snackie stick to hold on to IMO
Old     (markj)      Join Date: Apr 2005       11-18-2019, 11:54 AM Reply   
Okay, that’s it. I can’t take it any more. Joe, Wes, Shawn, Ralph and 95... I’m convinced. You guys win. I’m voting democrat... .....said no one ever!

Honestly, you guys keep that circle jerk goin any longer and yer gonna have to start the nuptials. Even by your low marriage standards. I’m willing to bet 95 has the stain on his blue, drag queen dress already.
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       11-18-2019, 12:15 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by markj View Post
Okay, thatís it. I canít take it any more. Joe, Wes, Shawn, Ralph and 95... Iím convinced. You guys win. Iím voting democrat... .....said no one ever!

Honestly, you guys keep that circle jerk goin any longer and yer gonna have to start the nuptials. Even by your low marriage standards. Iím willing to bet 95 has the stain on his blue, drag queen dress already.
I'm not suggesting you vote democrat, just pointing out how screwed you all are. As far as I can tell there are no good options, just less terrible. At least Hilderbeast is out of the picture, if Biden sucks turnip too you might get at least a less corporate option.
Old     (grant_west)      Join Date: Jun 2005       11-18-2019, 2:46 PM Reply   
Lol Lol
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Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       11-18-2019, 6:50 PM Reply   
Who's this Eric Fartwell guy? You've got to admit it's the most sense a Democrat has made for a while.
Old     (joeshmoe)      Join Date: Jan 2003       11-19-2019, 12:31 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by markj View Post
Okay, thatís it. I canít take it any more. Joe, Wes, Shawn, Ralph and 95... Iím convinced. You guys win. Iím voting democrat... .....said no one ever!

Honestly, you guys keep that circle jerk goin any longer and yer gonna have to start the nuptials. Even by your low marriage standards.
Glad to see you put me on the winning team, chit tor brains Mark, what truth did you not like me stating, the fact that Trump could win easily if he quit lying and texting? Haven't heard or read anything else he could do to win more votes. Here is the Truth!
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com...roval-ratings/
Old     (fly135)      Join Date: Jun 2004       11-19-2019, 2:49 AM Reply   
If the Republicans got on board with dumping Trump there is still time for them to offer up a decent candidate.
Old     (markj)      Join Date: Apr 2005       11-19-2019, 4:07 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by fly135 View Post
If the Republicans got on board with dumping Trump there is still time for them to offer up a decent candidate.
If repubs could produce someone who went to bat for the American people with the same level of energy as Trump and the same policy positions, Iíd support him or her. Until then, Iíll keep holding my nose and supporting Trump. You gotta admit politics would not be as much fun to watch though.
Old     (markj)      Join Date: Apr 2005       11-19-2019, 4:09 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeshmoe View Post
Glad to see you put me on the winning team, chit tor brains Mark, what truth did you not like me stating, the fact that Trump could win easily if he quit lying and texting? Haven't heard or read anything else he could do to win more votes. Here is the Truth!
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com...roval-ratings/
Shut your mouth before I pop the tires on your house. Get back in your trailer house, trailer trash!

Last edited by markj; 11-19-2019 at 4:11 AM.
Old     (markj)      Join Date: Apr 2005       11-19-2019, 4:09 AM Reply   
Excuse me. “Luxury trailer house”.
Old     (markj)      Join Date: Apr 2005       11-19-2019, 4:18 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by ralph View Post
Who's this Eric Fartwell guy? You've got to admit it's the most sense a Democrat has made for a while.
If youíre referring to his on-air farting, that IS the most sense made by a dem in years.
Old     (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       11-19-2019, 4:44 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by markj View Post
If repubs could produce someone who went to bat for the American people with the same level of energy as Trump and the same policy positions, Iíd support him or her.

I like it when this thread moves away from name calling and towards policy discussions because even if we wonít change each otherís minds, it helps us understand one another.

So in that light, which of Trumps policy positions are the most important to you?
Old     (grant_west)      Join Date: Jun 2005       11-19-2019, 6:00 AM Reply   
Quote:
Who's this Eric Fartwell guy? You've got to admit it's the most sense a Democrat has made for a while.
LoL . Fly that’s a good one, I didn’t you had it in you.

#FARTGATE
https://youtu.be/0XK797-vj4k
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       11-19-2019, 6:41 AM Reply   
Seeing trump has junk fooded and stressed himself to death how about Dan Crenshaw? I like him, some of his views are a bit eyed but mostly good.
Old     (grant_west)      Join Date: Jun 2005       11-19-2019, 7:04 AM Reply   
Wow Ralph got 1 Eyed Jokes for Dan C LOL, another good one!
Old     (wombat2wombat)      Join Date: Sep 2018       11-19-2019, 7:42 AM Reply   
DEMOCRAT: "Would it ever be U.S. policy in your experience to ask a foreign leader to open a political investigation?"

VINDMAN: "There are proper procedures in which to do that. Certainly the President is well within his right to do that."

WENSTRUP: You said you respect the chain of command. Did you go to your direct boss, Tim Morrison?

VINDMAN: No, I didn't. I first met with my attorney



kangaroo court going no where. These people are stupid
Old     (wombat2wombat)      Join Date: Sep 2018       11-19-2019, 9:34 AM Reply   
Even with a rigged hearing they're controlling they look like idiots. Can't imagine how much worse it would be if it was done fairly, the pubes & witnesses they wanted would have destroyed what's left of the criminal democrats
Old     (markj)      Join Date: Apr 2005       11-19-2019, 1:42 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by shawndoggy View Post
I like it when this thread moves away from name calling and towards policy discussions because even if we won’t change each other’s minds, it helps us understand one another.

So in that light, which of Trumps policy positions are the most important to you?
Yeah, but calling names and harassing each other can be fun if you do it creatively like when I said I was gonna pop the tires of Joe’s house. I laughed all day because of that. I’m here all week too. To answer your question, Supreme Court, Immigration, China, EPA regs, taxes and changing the PC climate. I love it when he ruffles the feathers of the perpetually offended libtards. I realize that those are not “policy positions” per se, but I think you get my drift. The dial needed and still needs to be pushed more to the right. Especially socially and culturally. The left was totally out of control before the new sheriff came to town.
Old     (racer808)      Join Date: Jan 2013       11-19-2019, 2:27 PM Reply   
And with the close of today's testimonies that is Jenga. Shall we take bets on what the next conspiracy theory the dims invent will be?
Old     (markj)      Join Date: Apr 2005       11-19-2019, 4:58 PM Reply   
Looks like we need to start taxing all fresh water lakes for their newfound emissions. Those dirty old lakes. How dare them...

https://news.yahoo.com/freshwater-la...081121676.html
Old     (pesos)      Join Date: Oct 2001       11-19-2019, 5:50 PM Reply   
Racer, how do you figure? The repubs key witness actually came in and reversed his closed door testimony (whoops). Sets up Sondland to potentially do the same...
Old     (racer808)      Join Date: Jan 2013       11-20-2019, 12:01 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by pesos View Post
Racer, how do you figure? The repubs key witness actually came in and reversed his closed door testimony (whoops). Sets up Sondland to potentially do the same...
How do you figure the opposite? Did you listen in? It was a bad.

They all said there was no bribery, the president was with-in rights, there was no crime. All of them said they disagreed with his policy that is why they came forward. Then Voldman & Schiff are caught lying they don't know the whistle blower when Voldman is the whistle blower.

Voldman repeatedly testifies he has no idea who the whistle blower is but freezes when asked "then how would you know that's who it is if we said their name". Then he freezes & refuses to answer the question. Says "I was told by my attorney & Mr Schiff to not answer these questions". He testified he never met Schfiff but when challenged on it cites Schiff & his attorney telling him not to answer. Let that one sink in, many missed it.

This won't make it to the senate, I predict it is dropped or they've lost enough votes not to move it out of the chamber.

Now I wish I would have just stayed away from this forum, getting sucked back into this ****.

Edit: In regards to Sondland, I highly doubt the dems have saved the best for last. It's day 4, it's over. His recollection of events that have been in the open still contain no crime, no bribery, no quid pro quo. The crime in their minds is Trump didn't let these people run his foreign policy for him.

Last edited by racer808; 11-20-2019 at 12:07 AM.
Old     (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       11-20-2019, 2:22 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by racer808 View Post
Voldman repeatedly testifies he has no idea who the whistle blower is but freezes when asked "then how would you know that's who it is if we said their name". Then he freezes & refuses to answer the question. Says "I was told by my attorney & Mr Schiff to not answer these questions". He testified he never met Schfiff but when challenged on it cites Schiff & his attorney telling him not to answer. Let that one sink in, many missed it.
Sounds like you may have just been watching excerpts and not the whole hearing?

Schiff cautioned Vindman not to identify the whistleblower in the hearing immediately before Vindman's statement. It's not like there was a secret meeting between Vindman and Schiff -- or at least there is a very reasonable basis for his statement, which is that within the preceding 60 seconds Schiff had cautioned Vindman and everyone else in the room to protect the identity of the whistleblower.
Old     (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       11-20-2019, 2:24 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by racer808 View Post
His recollection of events that have been in the open still contain no crime, no bribery, no quid pro quo.
Quote:
"Was there a ďquid pro quo?" Sondland, the U.S. ambassador to the European Union ó a close Trump ally and GOP donor ó plans to say in his opening remarks to impeachment investigators. "The answer is yes."
https://www.politico.com/news/2019/1...stimony-071708
Old     (wombat2wombat)      Join Date: Sep 2018       11-20-2019, 2:38 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wombat2wombat View Post
Like I said, it'll end up being cries of obstruction. Looking forward to whats coming from Barr & Durham
And boom, here it is right on que

"Schiff goes off his prepared remarks and says Trump and his aides have made a "concerted, across the board effort to obstruct this investigation and impeachment inquiry, and I just say this -- they do so as at their own peril."


Clown show
Old     (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       11-20-2019, 3:21 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wombat2wombat View Post
And boom, here it is right on que

"Schiff goes off his prepared remarks and says Trump and his aides have made a "concerted, across the board effort to obstruct this investigation and impeachment inquiry, and I just say this -- they do so as at their own peril."


Clown show
Soooo... why won't Pompeo, Bolton, Mulveney, and their aides comply with subpoenas? Sondland says they were ALL in the loop the whole time.
Old     (wombat2wombat)      Join Date: Sep 2018       11-20-2019, 3:26 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by shawndoggy View Post
Soooo... why won't Pompeo, Bolton, Mulveney, and their aides comply with subpoenas? Sondland says they were ALL in the loop the whole time.
Sooooo, why won't people willing testify. Are you really this daft? Once again, it's called rights. Notice how you change it up and admit the left is losing but now it's because people won't willingly testify to satisfy your innate need for the "smoking gun". Why has Schiff rigged this & won't allow the right to call witnesses, only he can approve who testifies & holds secrete meetings with these "witnesses" where it's clear they're being coached. You're a smart guy, but you're a moron with your constant "what about ism's" "why are people not willingly throwing themselves into their testimonies. Considering what a joke this & a clear perjury trap, it's obvious. None of them have asked to be in there with Trump not allowing them. That is nothing more than a retarded liberal talking point. They're ignoring subpoenas because they are not enforceable. If they were, you can bet your ass you lefties wouldn't be asking why you'd be demanding & they'd be held in contempt. We have executive privilege for a reason. Once again, Shawn. These people are not beneath the law because you demand it that they be

And based on your comment on the matter, you're basically admitting the dems have nothing but if only the others would willingly play along with your stupid game you might come up with something.

Last edited by wombat2wombat; 11-20-2019 at 3:31 AM.
Old     (markj)      Join Date: Apr 2005       11-20-2019, 3:36 AM Reply   
Good points, W2w.

Watching this morning it has become clear that Adam Schiff has an incredibly punchable face. Also reminds me of Mr. Mackey on South Park. I keep waiting for him to say mmmkaaay.
Old     (markj)      Join Date: Apr 2005       11-20-2019, 3:37 AM Reply   
Bulging robot eyes like a stick is shoved up his wake77.
Old     (wombat2wombat)      Join Date: Sep 2018       11-20-2019, 3:51 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by markj View Post
Good points, W2w.

Watching this morning it has become clear that Adam Schiff has an incredibly punchable face. Also reminds me of Mr. Mackey on South Park. I keep waiting for him to say mmmkaaay.
OMG, you nailed it!! MMMkaaaay. That's a good laugh!


They may have something with Guillani now though, we'll see where this takes it. But unless they can prove it's intent, they still have nothing & they're losing support among their own party that doesn't want to be on record voting for this since it's going sideways. We'll see how Days of our Lives evolves here.
Old     (joeshmoe)      Join Date: Jan 2003       11-20-2019, 4:05 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by markj View Post
Excuse me. ďLuxury trailer houseĒ.
Get it right, it is an "RV resort community", I never said it was a luxury trailer, but it is pretty nice!
Old     (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       11-20-2019, 4:23 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wombat2wombat View Post
Sooooo, why won't people willing testify.
You understand that subpoenas are not optional, right? They are willfully refusing to comply, at the direction of the WH.
Old     (wombat2wombat)      Join Date: Sep 2018       11-20-2019, 5:11 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by shawndoggy View Post
You understand that subpoenas are not optional, right? They are willfully refusing to comply, at the direction of the WH.
You're in over your head with constitutional law. Give it a rest. If they were enforceable, they'd be being enforced, derp. They are not being held back from testifying. They have all said they'll exercise their legal right. You gotta be cold stoned retarded to think they all are jumping up to testify but pesky Trump is blocking them. If there was any validity to your argument, again based on opinion, then your democrats are a bunch of inept idiots that can't enforce the law. derp derp derp mMMMMkaayayyy
Old     (DeltaHoosier)      Join Date: Mar 2018       11-20-2019, 7:03 AM Reply   
I can't wait for them to vote for impeachment. The Senate can all witnesses they want. Republicans in control will absolutely call the whistleblower because there is no law that says he gets to stay behind the vail. He or she just can not be retaliated against in his or her profession. They can also call Biden, Hunter Biden and everyone that they House members wanted to talk to. They can also drag it out for months while those democrat members want to go run for president. They can keep the Biden's in the news cycle and pepper him the narrative of corruption.

Right now the democrats control all the narratives and are getting killed with their own witnesses. In the Senate, the Republicans will control the narrative and can actually call their witnesses. They will most likely have Barr's report at that time as well to play off of.
Old     (pesos)      Join Date: Oct 2001       11-20-2019, 7:27 AM Reply   
Lol you guys need to flip away from Faux News. Trump gets out in front of the cameras this morning with a page written in giant sharpie letters to try and distance himself from Sondland saying he doesn't know him (Giuliani tweets trying to do the same thing, then immediately deletes the tweet probably since he realized there is a ton of evidence that he's lying through his tweeth). And Trump can't even spell Zelensky's name right
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Old     (pesos)      Join Date: Oct 2001       11-20-2019, 7:31 AM Reply   
The dogs are starting to turn on each other lol. First Nunes clearly didn't know Sondland (the GOP's witness) was flipping this morning, and then the GOP's own lawyer gets attacked by Giuliani.
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Old     (pesos)      Join Date: Oct 2001       11-20-2019, 7:33 AM Reply   
When you've lost Ken Starr (and Faux publishes it)...

https://www.foxnews.com/media/ken-st...-quo-bombshell
Old     (DeltaHoosier)      Join Date: Mar 2018       11-20-2019, 7:54 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by pesos View Post
When you've lost Ken Starr (and Faux publishes it)...

https://www.foxnews.com/media/ken-st...-quo-bombshell
Sorry. Heard his interview and I also listened to the follow up questioning in congress afterward. They did not lose Starr. He was talking about having to react to the mornings testimony. Then the Republicans went out and did what they have done all week. They boxed Sondland into a corner and made him and them admit that they actually did not know it was about the Biden's and that they were just guessing on details. Most of them admitted that they have never talked to Trump or even met him. What made them guess? You guessed it, it was the media making the link and not the actual truth. Witness after witness the same thing. They admitted they did not think any of this had to do with Biden until they read news reports and heard people talking about it. None of the words or actions, but the news reports and people talking about it. Then during the questioning of Sondland they read and asked him about the Ukrainians trying to sink Trump during the election and he never heard of that either. Got him to admit he is too busy to remember details. Asked him if he knew that Trump was also working on trying to get the European partners to chip in with aid during the same time frame and he was not aware. They got Sondland to admit that there were not irregular diplomatic channels. They got him to say out loud that Trump did not want anything from the Ukraine and specifically that there were to be no Quid Pro Quo.

Not only did they destroy the witnesses, they made Sondland admit that he just inferred all this after reading all the reports.

Well no kidding. I got that just from the couple of those statements posted on this board.
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       11-20-2019, 7:58 AM Reply   
I just watched Sonderlands deposition, we must have been watching completely different. Yeah,Trump said no quid pro quo explicitly, kinda like when a mob boss rings a hit man and says, I want him to dissappear, everybody knows what magic is about to happen.
Old     (wombat2wombat)      Join Date: Sep 2018       11-20-2019, 8:07 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by ralph View Post
I just watched Sonderlands deposition, we must have been watching completely different. Yeah,Trump said no quid pro quo explicitly, kinda like when a mob boss rings a hit man and says, I want him to dissappear, everybody knows what magic is about to happen.
And? You people are simply making the case that Biden should be arrested for his direct quid pro quo & public statement about it. You want to say Drump is guilty of these things but they can't prove it so they've already settled on obstruction. You can't have one guys a day later saying there was quid pro quo & other witnesses stating there is nothing illegal about Trump did it was inappropriate. Can't say we all didn't all Nazi this coming. Dig & Dig & dig & oh look they refused Sodlands document request, que cries of obstruction. All of us on the right want this impeachment to go to the senate so we can see what ALL the players have to say
Old     (wombat2wombat)      Join Date: Sep 2018       11-20-2019, 8:31 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by pesos View Post
When you've lost Ken Starr (and Faux publishes it)...

https://www.foxnews.com/media/ken-st...-quo-bombshell
Did you even read it? He said it would lead to obstruction charges. So when this goes, if it goes, to the senate it will be challenged & it does not seem they have the goods to make it past a sound bite. Time will tell. Let us know when something criminal happens. As of today you might as go & arrest every past president & future presidents since they're all guilty of the exact same allegations being presented.
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       11-20-2019, 8:36 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wombat2wombat View Post
You people are simply making the case that Biden should be arrested for his direct quid pro quo & public statement about it.
I've got no problem with that Biden is a corporate weasel and swamp dweller.

If your argument is Biden has done the same, fine. Lock them both up. But no, republicans argument is everybody does it and it's fine.
Old     (pesos)      Join Date: Oct 2001       11-20-2019, 8:51 AM Reply   
Evidently Trump's here in Austin today. Hope he at least gets some good bbq inbetween rage tweets.
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