How much do you expect your tow vehicle?

I’m on my second Chevy Astro – right a minivan. This mini is rated for 5,300 lbs. My boat dry weight is 2,900, add a trailer, fuel and gear and I should be below the rated limit.

The engine on my first Astro died at 130K miles, I bought a new Astro the next day. At 116K miles I lost the transmission on the second Astro. I’ve been flushing the transmission after every towing season, as well changing the differential fluid. I thought that I’d get more out of my Astro before seeing major trouble.

So, am I asking too much from an Astro?

Yup

I think your doing good getting that mileage on a stressed transmission.

WOW I am going to go knock on some wood. 2001 Chevy pu with a 6 in it 215 miles and still going strong. I tow a 2001 SAN.

Get a BIG ass tranny cooler. But yes, you are asking too much from the astro.

The Trany on an Astro is a 4L60E. I think this is the same transmission on some larger V8s, including Suburban, does anyone know if that's correct?

The 4L60 family is found in most (light duty)rwd applications. Silverado, Tahoe, Suburban, trailblazer, corvette, camero, etc. Same basic tranny in those applications. I will say there are some minor differences though.
Anyway, it's not exactly the world strongest tranny. So, I'd say 130K probably isn't bad with regular towing. GM uses the 4L80 in the HD applications, and also have an upgraded 4L65E version of the 4L60E that addresses some of the common weaknesses.

4l60e is correct. Heat kills that tranny fast thouhg, and nothing generates heat like towing, and towing in OD.

Cooler, like i suggested before (like an RV size one), and make sure always to tow in Drive, not OD

Hummer H2's are built offroad tough and come with the 4L60E, so it must be a great tranny. Right?

Darren Hall is dead on!

get a DIESEL

I know I will get a ton of heat for this, but its American. haha sorry.

We actually used a Dodge Grand Caravan to tow our X-Star for a few years, and it beat it to hell. Went through 2 transmissions and an engine.

Now, we use an Acura MDX (works beautifully, plenty of power, but sags a bit in the rear), and I have a 93 Pathfinder (V6 stick, stock adjustable suspension). The Pathy is only rated to tow like 3,500lbs; and the boat, trailer, gas and gear is a lot more than that. It does decently well actually, and I'm very proud of it, however I'm well aware I am punishing it and probably slowly shortening its life. Anyway, not trying to bash anyone or anything, just getting carried away, sorry. Good luck with the Astro (we took that van into consideration at one point too. I would have thought it would have no trouble in an application such as yours)

Right, I never tow in OD.

Looks like this transmission is used on other trucks so it’s not a mini-van issue, it’s a transmission one. The other thing that I’ve done with this van is change oil 3,000 miles, exception once at 4,000 miles. I was on a 7,000 mile oil change schedule with the old van, which when it died had a lot of bearing slap (noise) and metal in the oil. So I’d like to see if this engine holds out better given religious devotion to changing the oil.

When I bought the van The salesman told me that the van came with a transmission cooler, to be honest I’ve looked under the hood but I’ve never see what looked like an additional radiator.

If I hadn’t maintained the transmission, then I’d accept problems at the +100K mark, but a failure at 116K for me is a disappointment. I expect a lot from new vehicles, they cost a lot and they should be a lot better than they were 20 or 30 years ago.

I really don’t like buying foreign cars/trucks, and I’d like to think that especially in the truck arena the US is holding its own. I have friends that own Toyotas with over 265K on them and few problems. However, those guys only use their trucks for brining home bedding plants and mulch from the hardware store or nursery, they don’t tow.

I’m going to try to make this van last another two years, maybe Ford next time.

Oh, and pulling an X-star with a caravan – I wouldn’t do that. My brother on the other hand used to pull a 16 foot, 1967, 55HP outboard Starcraft behind a 66 HP diesel Rabbit, man was that a slow ride.

Just curious, why would anyone tow with such light vehicles? First off they would be gutless on any grade, and the stress on the trans and rear end would be nutz... I wouldnt tow any boat/trailer with anything less than a burly 1/2 ton rated vehicle. I personally have a 1 ton dually for a 3k lb setup. Overkill is always better. Just my opinion tho.

So thats why my buddys tranny fell out of his H2.

Oddly enough the Chevy Astro Van got tow vehicle of the year in one of the power boat magazines I read a few years back. I wonder how they payed off?

Okay...why not tow in OD? 55mph at 2300 rpm vs 55 mph at 3,500 rpm is a bigger deal on the engine than the tranny, no?

Some transmissions are fine to tow with on OD according to alot of RV and trailer website information. The problem occurs when the tranny is hunting for a gear like going uphill or into a headwind.

I would suspect that larger trucks and larger engines have no problem with hauling in Overdrive. On a large hill, just take off OD and protect your tranny.

roberto-the engine can handle the rpms much better then the tranny constantly searching thru gears and overheating. Heat will kill a tranny faster then anything. Tranny coolers are must for towing. Just dont redline the engine for long lengths of time.

You got my vote for diesel, and I would suggest a stick, Imo you can control a stick easier. I dont have any fancy boat but I do have a 24ft potoon. Dogde ram 2500 4x4 diesel, no sag at all, or go with one of those new doges with the hemi, very solid I have seen those pull a fortune and have barely any sag,

good luck on you van I hope it last longer

Paul, IMO buying the Astro as a tow vehicle has (had) a lot of attractive considerations. Not in an effort to slam back or anything I’m going to list my reasoning for selecting the Astro as a value based tow option. But first I’d like to take the liberty of removing my current transition problem from the discussion, so consider the following.

First I don’t live in Colorado or have any other mountain in my back yard to overcome. The biggest hill I’ve towed up is probably from the Ohio river from Cincinnati up into Kentucky, which is a pretty good sized hill by Midwest standards. I pull up this hill maybe once per year, no problems.

The Chevy 4.3L has 250 foot pounds of torque, I’ve never needed any more. I’ve never had a “gut less” experience with the Astro, never failed to pull the boat up the boat ramp, reach highway speeds, or climb a hill.

This same transmission is used on ½ ton pickup trucks. I think it’s only used with 4.3L, 4.2L(?) and 5.0L engines (I’m not 100% sure abut this). So there wouldn’t be a difference until you go up in engine size.

Compared to an SUV the Astro cost much less. Every “me-too” out there has an SUV to go and pick up groceries and is paying the highest dealer markups and manufacture profit margins in the industry. That helps to keep the price on other vehicles that are “not Cool” low, thanks guys. I have more space, more seats, better gas mileage and higher rated towing capacity than a Ford Explorer and at a considerably lower cost.

I’m a family man, I need a vehicle that can transport my family and tow. A regular cab truck won’t carry my family. The extra cab pick up trucks have less people space, cost more, have worse gas mileage. How much did your heavy duty truck cost, a lot I bet? I could have probably bought two Astros, Or how about this an Astro and a civic go to work car.

I think the Chevy Avalanche is an awesome concept, but it still doesn’t compare to the value of the Astro.

There is no Coolness factor with an Astro – I don’t care.

Overkill costs, vehicles cost a lot, put that together and then ask you’re self are you spending too much for your tow vehicle.

I bet you’ve got a nice tow rig and a good boat, have fun out there. For me, my d*mn van is still in the shop, Tuesday it rained like heck so I didn’t really miss one of my regular days, I’ll miss boarding this Thursday, and I hope I get on the water Sunday. You’re probably boating this week and I’m not so maybe you win.

diesel, diesel, diesel 140k and going strong.

Don't forget that the manufacturers trailer rating is for an empty vehical, with just a driver and is figured on a base model vehical. So you need to deduct the wieght of your family, everything you put in the van, plus all the upgrades on the van. (yes even the factory options or packages)

There is also a very big difference between ability to tow a certain weight and an ability to tow that wieght safely.

It really depends, if you are towing your boat out of the garage and 2 miles down to the launch or are you loading up the family for a 2 week trip that involves hundreds of miles, long driving hours and steep grades.

All that being said, Astro vans are hard to overlook for a value family vehical that can tow. I have a famly of 5, the list of vehicals that can take us on our trips is a very short list.

Given the fact that the Astro is a bit undersized and powered for towing and hauling I would not be unhappy with the miles you are getting. It may be half the miles you get from a full size or 3/4-1 ton rig, but it also cost 1/2 the price.

Yeah towing with the Caravan was pretty wild. Sometimes we'd have to pile some people on the hood for more weight on the front wheels when pulling out of a slippery ramp haha.

I think the mileage you got outta your transmission with towing alot was normal. I have a s-10 blazer with the same transmission and i have 155,xxx on mine and while not towing as much I got a transmission cooler and while starting to get sloppy it'll make it throught the winter. As far as the engine goes you should got much more then 130,000 miles out of it. Mines at 155,xxx and runs like a champ.

The shop said that the planetary gears went out, looks like I’m going to miss boating on the long weekend. On the bright side I’ll save money on boat gas, but I don’t think it’s going to make up for the repair cost.

I also asked abut the transmission cooler that the new car sales man told me came standard with the van – the shop said there is no cooler – sales man either didn’t know or…

as far as I know all astros come with a tranny cooler. Look where the raditor is, you can plainly see what looks like another small raditor.

4L60 tranny's should last quite a while in most vehicles.
Having said that, it depends upon how you USE them, even more than how you maintain them. No matter what GM or anyone else says, they are not built for towing AT capacity for long periods of time. That's why they build heavier duty transmissions!
The mileage you gat out of your Astro's should be considered excellent. By maintaining them (you said you changed engine oil very regularly-I am assuming you did the same with tranny oil and filter as well), you probably did better than most would.
As far as the H2, I have no idea why anyone thinks they are a heavy duty off road vehicle. The are nothing but a standard Yukon with a new body that LOOKS tough on them. Check the specs, the running gear is IDENTICAL to a Yukon.
The hummer thing is smoke and mirrors, but apparently there are people out there willing to fall for the hat trick.

Most tranny coolers are built into the radiator. There are oil lines connected to a seperate loop in the middle of the radiator. My Suburban has that from the factory. You can add an aftermarket cooler that is larger and seperate. Some factory "towing" packages on larger tow vehicles have a seperate cooler.

George thats not the kind of cooler people are trying to recommend here. All cars/trucks have the trans fluid (automatics) run thru the bottom of the radiator. This is barely enough for not towing. My explorer came with a tow pkg that included a seperate oil and seperate trans cooler for towing. A friend was towing someone elses trailer to little talladaga behind his full size dodge and his check engine light came on. I asked him if he had a cooler as though i knew he had one and he said no. I was all over him. I said i cant believe we got this far without killing the trans (it was a pretty big trailer). Towing is the #1 killer of automatics. Also id like to say i would never have my transmission power flushed. It can cause more problems then it fixes. Small stuff breaks free and gets stuck in passageways, bad news.

All trannies have a cooler. They are built into the radiator in most applications. When you opt for a tow package most vehicles get an auxiliary trans cooler that is mounted in front of the radiator. They are absolutely essential for anything that tows. the 4L60e is a great transmission and should last a long time if taken care of properly. I change my fluid every 20k and my filter at every second fluid change. Haven't had a single problem yet. There are also 2 pans that can come on those trannies, not sure which one the Astro van uses, but the 1/2ton trucks with the tow package get the deep pan with extra fluid capacity to help keep things cool.

About towing in OD. Not a problem at all if your vehicle has the power to stay in torque converter lock-up. If the tranny is in and out of lock-up you'll cause problems very fast (you'll know this by the tranny hunting up and down about 500rpms). My Tahoe barely stays in lock-up on flat ground at freeway speed with my X-2 behind it. There's no way anything with a V6 would stay in lock-up therefore I'd shift out of OD whenever towing, unless you are going down hill or coasting. Anything more than 1 or 2 times in and out of lock-up and my truck gets shifted down.

As far as powerflushing. I wouldn't recomend it either. If it gets that bad it's too late. If your tranny fluid isn't bright pink you've let it go too far. Change it regularly and you wont have many problems.

BTW I've been a technician for more than 10 years so take the info for what its worth.

Bob, I realize that people were recomending an external cooler. JC had said that all Astro's have the external cooler. I don't think that is true unless it is a special towing package. The standard cooler is not adequate for towing a ski boat.

No this Astro did not come with a cooler as the salesman claimed.

Just got my Astro back from the shop. The guys at the shop were projecting completion by early next week, after the long holiday. I made a little noise, not complaining or anything, but I did mention that not having my van meant that I couldn’t boat this weekend. Well the guys at the shop heard me and came through. They also threw in a transmission cooler at no charge, pretty cool, oh look a pun! The guy I’ve been talking to at the shop has skied before, I invited him out with my crew this weekend, we’ll see if he gets a kitchen pass. Now the dilemma is hold-it or sell-it, it would be nice to pay off the boat before taking on another vehicle loan.

I have only kicked the PSD out of OD once, going north on I-540 north out of FT. Smith headed to Beaver. Loved passing those half ton gassers begging 35mph As I say diesel=boobies

I bought a cosmetically trashed high mileage '96 full sized Bronco on Ebay for cheap. It has the 351 with towing package which means a bigger radiator, an external trans cooler, oil cooler and P/S oil cooler. Different bumper with big openings for airflow. 175k miles, now at 223k and I pull with the AC on and in OD with no issues. Good cheap tow vehicle that seats 5 with room for gear. SUCKS the gas, though

It has been a while since we had our Safari (GMC) Now that I think back, It may have been a regional version of the vans. But I do specifically remember that the Towing package came on all of the Astros/Safaris when we bought ours.

Didn't mean to mislead anyone.

(Message edited by slow driver on September 05, 2005)

3/4 ton club cab dodge diesel 6 speed. manual

20mpg towing the mastercraft.

doing 75mph.

need i say more.