Release off the wake...

So I read about this a lot on these boards and thought I would see if we could define what exactly this means. I have been riding for a long time (12 years or so) and I still don't know that I understand.

So a lot of people say "this board releases well but this other board does not" and things of that nature. Releases how? I have ridden (and still do I guess in a 3DS) boards that track really well. I haven't never felt like my board wouldn't "release" or gets caught on the wake when doing either spins or inverts. I assume most use this term in talking about spins but maybe some inverts need a "better" release from your board.

Help teach this old dog a new trick!

Release is the sweet spot for your pop. Usually centered between the feet for a quick release, some shapes release late, you have to be slightly tail heavy & more patient. Have stuffed boards (old HL Project/fish fins) into the wake because I wasn't patient fo the late release.

Can also be used to describe the wake, vert wakes have a quick release point, rampy wakes may have a late release point.

(Message edited by socalwakepunk on November 16, 2006)

Interesting - I always thought release had to do with how easily the board broke loose from it's tracking state. Makes sense, though.

I have a really hard time telling the difference in the 'speed' of a board, as well as how quickly it transitions. Maybe I haven't ridden enough boards, but I've ridden the major 'types'. Seems like speed and transition have more to do with your riding style...

Then again, I'm an older dog than Eubanks. Harder to teach.

Takelberry has the idea. Release is the time it takes from the time you stand tall til you pop into the air. See, your pop is determined by the load in the line. As you stand tall you are slightly letting tension off the line. The quicker this release occurs, the less height you lose from losing tension. Generally riding a board with less fin releases quicker because you are just releasing the edge of the board and dont have fins creating drag.

Dont worry, i really didnt get it til I started kiteboarding. Release is huge since you dont always have a wave to pop off of. Kiteboarders generally use the least amount of fin they can get away with in a given condition.

Jerram - kinda right, too. If you hold your edge through the wake, your board is tracking through the wake. Release is the sweet spot where it pops, and I guess that is also where it releases the tracking.

BTW - pretty sure I'm an older dog than both of you, not that there's anything wrong with it.

(Message edited by socalwakepunk on November 16, 2006)

Release is how freely it comes loose. It is most often referred to either just breaking it loose while riding flat or in respects to how well the board will break loose to initiate spins off the wake. I can only think about when I tried my Absolute with fins, the board had a lot more drive and was locked to the wake, when i tried to initiate spins I had to wait longer until the grip (ie. extra fin) was clear. Now when I took the fin off there was less grip and the board was able to be adjusted while riding up the wake. It was made looser and thus not locked in and thus easier to cheat off the wake. People with a hard cut style want to be driving all the way through the wake, those that like to spin off the wake and cheat it like a quick release to start their rotations early.

That makes sense and I guess I understand the "theory" behind wanting a quick release off the wake to initiate spins earlier. What still confuses me though is that if I start a spin off the wake and don't pause after releasing from the water...I get worked HARD!

"to how well the board will break loose to initiate spins off the wake."

Heavy has got it. This is how I interpreted "Release."

IMO...the Transcend release earier than most boards by the way. The molded fins stop way short of the tail.

ya read about the transcend and it will help you better understand the molded fins have extensions you can put on that determine how quick the board will release. Even on the LF shane the fins are pretty far up from the tail for a quicker release.

I stand corrected then. I was told it was about the sweet spot, how some boards work better when you are even on your feet, and pop early, others work best if you slighty tail load, wait (roam). I like Heavy's answer better anyway.

So what do we call the characteristic TackleBerry is talking about?

Eubanks, if you ride (and like the 3DS) use the .8 fins, you will still have one of the fastest boards on the market and will get the release you want.

So, is the conclusion that a loose board = a board that releases early?

Or is it a board that pops 'more quickly' = a board that releases early?

Or is that one in the same?

...I just ride what feels right.

Jerram, I wouldnt say it like that because it implies that the more loose you make it, the faster you can release. I think there is a happy medium. Too loose, and you cant load up at all and you end up having to balance (slow down) your release to keep the board from skipping out. So, similar to what Randy said, drop down a fin size rather than go finless. You do need some drag to leverage against.

Here is a good example; Ive had the Byrely for 3 seasons and just went to the Transcend. I noticed when I rode the Transcend it would release faster than the Byerly (tight board). Although the Transcend is a tight board as well.

I figured release was how Big Heavy explained it. When ever it is explained in brochures it typically says that people who like to spin will typically like boards that release easily.

Tackle: I think the sweet spot you are talking about is more affected by rocker than anything else. An aggressive three stage rocker board will suit a steeper wake more and will probably ride up the wake easier than a continuous flatter rocker board that tend to plow.

In surfing when you want more release in the tail, you are referring to how easy you can break the fins loose.

That's my interpretation anyway. Not to say it's right or wrong.

Randy - It's funny you say that because I've had the .8 p-wings on my board since I bought it. I demoed the board with the stock fins and HATED them. I don't notice a big "release" factor difference at the wake but I just like to be able to slide the board more and break the fins loose on surface stuff which the .8's allow me to do.

The 3DS is the perfect blend for me with the .8's between edge hold into the wake and the ability to break it loose on the surface. The post was more just trying to understand if people really feel a big difference in release off the wake with different boards. I do not but I also don't ride that many different boards.

Sometimes I think we learn terms and throw them around without understanding completely what they mean. I'm probably guilty of this as well. It's always funny to me how there will be a thread about a board where someone will say it's the fastest board every made and someone else will say how incredibly slow it is. I really can't tell that much difference in speed with the Premier (old shape) I rode for 4 years and the 3DS I've been on for 2. Speed (at least in a noticeable sense) is more a product of your edging technique/position more than anything else IMO.

Thanks Blabel - I got to thinkg about how fin shape/size affects release (in addition to board characteristics), you are right, what I described is an effect of board shape/construction. Maybe just a contributing factor to release which Heavy described. Either that or I just dont know ish.

Well, speed it just a product in eliminating drag. You dont notice it as an extreme in wakeboarding because you need a certain amount of drag to create load. You power is constant (the boat) so it really doesnt matter how efficient the board is. You should ride my kiteboard behind the boat. You wouldnt be able to load the line up much because doing so would put you at warp 9 before you ever got to the wake.

JG - Did you skip out on The Truth last night?

An easy way to campare release of a wakeboard is by doing an olie outside the wake. You'll notice some boards don't olie as well as others. For me this is the easiest way to test release characteristics of a board.

Your riding style plays a large part in noticing the speed(drag) of the board. If you ollie hard at the wake to get hieght then your not gonna notice speed as much as if you do a progressive cut and stand tall at the wake. My style being the later I really notice when a board is slower than what I'm used to. I have to put a lot more work into the cut to get the speed I'm accustomed too. Perhaps even more noticable is when you cut out in preparation for your jump. A board that is really easy to cut way out is typically considered a fast board.

An ollie will not help you judge the release you get coming off the wake. A flat board is much different than a board on edge. Perhaps the difference you are noticing comes from the length/width of the board. A wider/longer board will ollie easier as there is more to push off. This is not release.

As stated above release is the ease in which the board comes off the wake. Fin depth/placement/amount plays a large role and obviously this is in conjunction with the boards bottom characteristics. I never understand what people mean when they say they ollie off the wake. I am a wake to wake rider and get more pop than most doing so and that is a foreign statement. Certain tricks certainly require a different edge though so its tough to say one is this or that way. Like a HS 3, a Progressive edge can be used but its gonna make it tough to grab and take to 5 eventually. So you take a hard progressive edge and as you start to ride up you completely back off and focus on getting a good hard pop. This is where release plays its biggest role, a board that has a lot of fin will continue to drive through the wake and make it harder to square up and concentrate on getting the pop. A board with less fin and more release will allow you to really square up and catch all of the vertical buck you are looking for.

What Tackleberry is talking about when it comes to the sweet spot of the pop is in reference to the rocker profile. You always hear abrupt continuous, aggressive three stage etc etc etc. These are all hip ways to describe the length of the flat spot or lack thereof. A continuous board has no flat spot and this lack of a sweet spot that is the best to boost off is what makes it the preferred rocker profile for smooth riders that like a nice consistent hit. Now many hear three stage and instantly think they are all the same. There is a reason a Transcend buck like it does, the reason is the length of the flat spot in the middle of the board. You could have a board with three inches of rocker but have a very small flat spot and a nice smooth ride. But imagine the same three inches of rocker crammed into a much smaller area ie. a longer flat spot. Thats why Parks boards are so bucky, they have a large flat spot and then a large amount of rocker crammed in a smaller area. Thats why a three stage is harder to master and make work well, the sweet spot is more defined and you have to be on top of it to make it work well. You figur that out and a three stage will boost you like no other.

So thats my board design rant. I like hydrodynamics. I said cram... hehe...."cram it in your cram hole LaFleur."

"An ollie will not help you judge the release you get coming off the wake. A flat board is much different than a board on edge. Perhaps the difference you are noticing comes from the length/width of the board. A wider/longer board will ollie easier as there is more to push off. This is not release."

-0bviously I disagree. The shape of the board has specific characteristics in regards releasing the suction from the water. Those characteristics don't change regardless if your doing an ollie or a wakejump. Keep in mind you typically stand tall as you release from the wake. Yeah, I agree that there are fundamental differences between the release of an ollie compared to the release of a wakejump, but more importantly there are many fundamental similarities.

So your saying a board with no fins will release on an ollie better than one with four? How does that work? You are flat and the fins aren't engaged and the release of an ollie will not be affected by the fins. But I guarantee the board with no fins will release off the wake much differently than the multi fin board. When people ask you how well a board releases do you describe how well it can ollie (which has no influence on what release actually is) or do you describe how it comes off the wake?

I would say that the fundamental similarities end right after you pass the part where you say "I'm on a wakeboard", it is two different things. Not completely unrelated but definately not the same.

Big Heavy, if the board was stationary, then you would be exactly right, as the fins have no hold. However in a moving situation the boards bottom shape and fin config creates suction on the board even when riding flat. Also, the fins control "sliding" in the water which aids in release. An ollie will show you how easy you can break the suction. A board that will slide (finless) will break from the suction quicker than a board with fins that has no slide.

While the techniques of doing an ollie and a wakejump are obviously different, they do both have to react to the shape and release characteristics of the board.