FINLESS BOARDS

Hey guys dont wanna start any trouble but just curious who invented the first finless board? My buddy who lives in Canyon was telling me that Randy Harris did and was developing it when he was riding with Thruster or something then Herbie Fletcher jacked him and everyone thought Herbie with BadAss boards invented the first finless board(or a board having 4 fins total). And supposedly there is some video called "My House" that Randy is riding a prototype and stillrides the same shape basically to this day. If thats true Randy is even sicker in my head. That sux for randy if its true and having all these board companies making knockoffs each year without paying him. Plus how come randy didnt somehow get a patent on the wrap handle so other companies couldn't steal his design? or did he? Now every handle company things thier big stuff when really handles havent changed since Randy changed them. same with boards too. Every Premier knockoff is really a Randy knockoff if thats true about him riding that board. Im gonna have to see the vid.

the people who invent stuff never make the money on them. Edison invented the light bulb but General electric made all the money off the light bulb. Im sure he made a percent, but general electric is now one of the largerst businesses. Same thing, randy designed it but never tried to market the idea.

I never heard that randy invented the first "finless" board (they're actually molded fin boards--nowadays, there's no such thing as a finless board). There is a video called "my house" by FLF and I think I know what board you're talking about. But needless to say I could not confirm or deny your story. The only thing I heard was that lots of people credit byerly with the first molded finned board, but it was really badass (or at least they use to credit scott).

And as for other companies making a vandall handle...with your logic there'd really be only one company making wakeboards (and it's not who you think). And does he even ride for hardline anymore? That's the company that originally came out with the vandal handle. Needless to say, In my mind, borrowing technology isn't so bad, but it just irks to me when people are given more credit than they deserve.

But I certainly have a lot of respect for randy.

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nowadays, there's no such thing as a finless board

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THANK YOU!!! it's funny to hear people say that they ride this board finless, or that board finless. uh, what are the molded-in fins???

a board isn't finless just cause you take off the center fin on a board w/ molded-in fins!

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but it just irks to me when people are given more credit than they deserve.

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ie; hyperlite coming up with the premier design.

the first finnless board was actully a gb mold that thruster used at the same factory,then it got retooled and is now the caddy 142.just added a pinched rail and nose anb tail a little thiner so it would ride in the water a little deeper.but the vandall is the one that designed it.and is basicaly his board today.

Matt,
As far as I know Chase Heavener used to ride his boards with no fins all the time, and that was way before Randy made the switch over to Thruster. I have been riding since 1996 and in all the older videos. Switch, Switch 22, mayday. Chase always rode finless, and I mean totally finless. No molded fins or anything. He was sick!!! The tricks he threw were huge and innovative for the times and other riders were amazed at how he could land and not wash out.
So as far as im concerned Chase is the Innovator of the finless board ( even though his board wasnt designed to be finless).
Late

slalom trick skiers have been riding completely finless for ages. and don't forget people on those round disks. heck, back in the day we were riding a 2' by 4' piece of scrap plywood around.

pretty much i don't care. however, since I ride an '01 "finless" byerly, I think it would be interesting to ride the bad ass equivalent. anybody have an old one (shroom?) for sale?

Leo, acctually George Swan invented the light bulb. Edison just took the credit for his professors work. Although do give him credit for making it electric. But Edison still doesn't deserve half the credit he gets. Alot of his ideas are stolen and most came from his assistant (I forget his name).
Anyways back to wakeboarding. By chance I was watching My House today. And randy was riding a prototype "finless" board. When did that video come out? 1999? by then BadAss had allready boards with molded fins, though I don't know about them being totally "finless"

well if the video came out in 99 im sure they were shooting for it alot before that. the only thing i heard was randy got jacked when he had his prototype molded fin board and then herbie fletcher started makin them and he ended up designing scott byerly board short after. my guess is thats the first finless board to ever appear in a video so that was the first one being ridden especially if its a prototype.

oh didnt read your post vince. cool so randy did design the first finless board. what if randy had a patent on molded fin boards and a patent on having a wrap handle. hed probably be like hyperlite but way better since hed have all the technology of how most boards are.

i believe the wrap handle is actually 'borrowed' from show skiing. in a strap doubles rope there is typically either a T-handle or a small handle similar to most wrapped handles. while this gives the skier a small unobtrusive handle to start off the dock with rather than to wrap tricks with, that is where the concept had to have come from. people were doing wrapped tricks long before that with a braided handle, which likely came from trick skiing and/or many show ski acts that use braids. people like zane and ruck were show skiers long before they were pro wakeboarders. so many of the ideas likely came from that side of things.

Good call erik. Chase had some really good, truly finless riding in "for what it's worth" as well. One board looked like it was wooden...it's so hard to tell, but that's what my eyes have convinced me (even though they have been wrong many times before).

In my opinion, his tricks weren't that big (size wise) but they were stylish and completely respectable. I actually really miss his riding and matt staker's riding. But, such is life...

i ride the 04 parks without fins.. it comes with a wing fins but i dont put them on.. and you are right, no such thing as finless, i still have grip.. and the 04 parks has 4 fins (A-Wing)
-Curt

Shoot, I almost forgot. Way back when, bill mccaffray used to ride his neptune impala without fins. Yes sirrr...

Good point Matt.

Dam forgot about Bill riding his board finless. I remember seeing him in a magazine, and thought, no-way, can't be done, lol.

uh Joe, I think you get caught a lot in insignificant details... it depends on your conception of a fin... molded fins are not really fins... they really are super sized channels that give more grip... but a real fin can be removed or changed... so that way, when you remove all the fins that can be removed on a board, I consider it being "ridden finless"...
I recon that a finless board is a totally different thing... it is really a board that does not have any holes to put fins on...
so the difference between a board being ridden finless and a finless board is that the last one is made to be ridden like that... the other has the option of adding a fin to get more grip...
if you think molded fins are real fins... there was no such thing as a finless board ever... the bad ass, thrusters, byerlys and others all had molded fins...

I remember having see Chase riding a finless Neptune before any molded fins were even marketed... I don't know about Maccaffrey though...

Well, I for one value joe's opinion and I personally stand behind my original comment (regarding the idea that molded finned boards aren't really finless).

I guess I consider the molded fins to be fins because of the name. They're not called exaggerated channels, or supersized channels, they're called "molded fins." But that's my opinion.

Plus, a channel is actually the exact opposite of a fin. A channel is a cut or groove into the board, while a fin protrudes out from it. Whatever, I guess.

so finless boards never really existed??? that was just a fake name to make money??

it's the only thing that doesn't make sense about your point... if you can explain me that part, go ahead...

i think electricsnow explained it perfectly. so well that a 2 year old would've understood the difference.

it's not a fake name. it's finless that it doesn't have a center fin. but it's stupid 'cause it still has molded FINS.

so you're saying they shouldn't have been called finless in the first place right??? that even the guy who shape that board had it wrong?? that's pretty funny... not even worth arguing...

Jonathan - Let me get a little more P.C. for you. They should have been called Removable-Finless Wakeboards.

yes, that's right.
yes, it is pretty funny.

what's even funnier is you're getting worked up over a debate about whether to call it finless or not.

My 04 Premier must be a....removable center fin, with molded outer fins that are not really fins because they can't be removed and they are not channels because the come out of board and not into the board. So let's just call them "things".

I have an 04 Premier with removable center fins and outer things! Perfect!

shawn... you didn't get it... what joe means is that it's not removable finless... it's not finless at all... if you remove the fins, there still are molded fins so not finless... so finless board never existed cuz they all had molded fins...
electricsnow have you ever thought of how to shape a board??? saying that a channel is carved into the board and a fin protrudes from it is like saying a glass is half full of half empty... it's part of the board and it is designed the same way just enlarged... when making a mold, the entire board is carved out of a bloc of steel, so molded fins are only carved deeper into the metal... which become supersized channel(channel on viagra)... or whatever... it's part of the board anyway...
and joe... you get pretty worked up about it too... you're the one trying to go against the grain here... you know why we'll always be arguing about that?? cuz for you molded fins are fins and for me it's part of the design of the board... it's all about perspective... like a glass half full or half empty... so why don't you call it whatever you want and I'll do the same thing... the only thing is, when you hear someone saying he's riding finless, just suck it up and let people have their own perspective... I'll do the same if it's going the other way...

Jon - Just poking fun at you.....relax.

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just suck it up and let people have their own perspective

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trust me, i do. you know how many times "i rode finless" is mentioned in here? hundreds of times. and how many times did i post in said threads? right.

please take shawn's advice and chill.

Umali- i dont think a two year old would understand. they dont have the mental capacity.

OK, by the dictionary definition, a "fin" is a "thin, usually curved projection." So, in my mind, the "molded fins" on a board are more like secondary rails. They are long, thick, and not noticeably curved (front-to-back).

Of course, it's all just semantics but, IMHO, it is valid to call a board with long, straight, slightly projecting "rails" a finless board if it doesn't have a spot for regular fins. I also think it's valid to say that you ride a board "finless" if it only has those little "rails" known as "molded fins."

I'm pretty relaxed... I have to assume you're right about that one... I only saw you talk crap about finless boards once... I just wanted to explain my point of view... we see things differently and it probably won't change anything arguing about it... I can live with that and I'm pretty sure you can survive too without going crazy...
salmon, that's exactly the way I see it...

dammit jonathan! do i have to spell it out for you????

rule #1. joe is always right!
rule #2. if joe is wrong, see rule #1.



it's all good...i can agree to disagree.

Whatever you say jonathan. I think a molded fin is still a fin and you think it's a channel. Taa-daa!

All I can say is that I was thinking about it from a shapers perspective and starting out with a blank. That's how a wakeboard starts before the actual mold is cut. But I guess I'm an idiot or something, because when you look at the mold, they're all channels!! (sarcastic)

I guess I just don't understand why they call a molded fin a molded fin and not a gigantic channel. W-E-I-R-D.

And this really is all about semantics. What makes a fin a fin? The fact that it's removable, long and curved, or both? Because the molded fins on my substance are long and curved, but they're not removable. And to top it off, it protrudes from the board, which is why I would not call it a channel.

So, whateves people, whateves...