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Old    "G" (grant_west)      Join Date: Jun 2005       08-31-2017, 12:21 PM Reply   
Zuckerburg's Open Borders Organization. Accidentally reveals in a study that ending the dreamer program or "DACA" would open up 700,000 jobs for AMERICAN's Whoops!!!!! No wonder why these liberal Elite, want open boarders.

http://www.breitbart.com/texas/2017/...ngs-daca-ends/

Fu.K ZUCK 2020
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Old    Anastazi Sarigiannis (Stazi)      Join Date: Sep 2011       08-31-2017, 12:35 PM Reply   
Maga!
Old    "G" (grant_west)      Join Date: Jun 2005       08-31-2017, 1:23 PM Reply   
^^^ Exactley ^^^ America First , DACA is Mexico First, America 2nd. This Zuckerturd is a perfect example of the modern Liberal Elite. Didn't you love the hypocrisy when Zuckerberg was critical of Trump's border wall, And at the very same time he was building a 6 foot Wall all the way around his Hawaiian property.

http://abcnews.go.com/Lifestyle/mark...ry?id=40214802
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nati...icle-1.2691286
Old    Paul (psudy)      Join Date: Dec 2003       08-31-2017, 1:33 PM Reply   
Where the hell are we going to find 700K construction workers? Lets focus on shoring up the borders to stop the influx and let the productive law abiding illegals work towards citizenship and a better life.
Old    "G" (grant_west)      Join Date: Jun 2005       08-31-2017, 4:16 PM Reply   
I don't know where they are going to "Find" these 700 thousand jobs, but with the advent of automation every single job they can save is huge. Hell even the Pizza Delivery guys job is going away. Example Domino's is working with Ford and a car that Drives a pizza to your house is a Reality right now.
http://money.cnn.com/2017/08/29/tech...car/index.html
Old    "G" (grant_west)      Join Date: Jun 2005       09-07-2017, 11:05 AM Reply   
Some interesting statements have been flying around about the Dreamers & the DACA program.

Q:Why punish these dreamers for crimes their parents committed if this is true why are we constantly reminded and shamed about slavery if we are to forgive the sins of our fathers-Father, then it should be equal across the board, RIGHT? Yea I didn't think so. My point. Their is always more benefits in being a victim.

Q: Do you think IF we would've had a wall in place years ago do you think we would be dealing with this "dreamers situation" now
I know many people here are against a wall but IMO this Dreamers situation is a result of having not enough protection at our border. IMO these people should have never been here. Not saying they are Bad Ombres, not saying they are Rapist not saying they are drug dealers. I'm saying they were brought here illegally like many other people and now we are having to deal with it.

Last edited by grant_west; 09-07-2017 at 11:11 AM.
Old    John Anderson (fly135)      Join Date: Jun 2004       09-07-2017, 11:23 AM Reply   
I've never felt shamed about slavery. Maybe you are reading too much into it. You say they were brought here as children and "now we have to deal with it". How hard is it to deal with? Doesn't look hard at all. What is so difficult? They came here as children and now they are fully integrated into American life as it's pretty much all they know. Seems like the ideal immigrant being as they are fully Americanized.

Jeff Sessions is a b**tch. He literally said that "following the law is compassionate". Talk about being a lying a$$hole. Why didn't he just say that it's not his job to be compassionate. His job is to follow the law and if the people want to be compassionate then they can elect compassionate leaders instead of people like him or Trump. I know I would be glad to elect people NOT like him.
Old    "G" (grant_west)      Join Date: Jun 2005       09-07-2017, 11:49 AM Reply   
So your point is because they were brought here Illegally and THEY have intergrated it's some how ok to stay or we should pay for them?

So If You smuggle contraband ( drugs, cash, animals, people what every you decide) into the US and "they" or it "integrate's" it some how makes it legal? I'm confused. Is it like wine where it gets better the longer you have it? Hummm I never heard of that with illegal items. Do you make up these rules on you're own or are they part of some what ever "suits me" handbook you prescribe to?
Old    "G" (grant_west)      Join Date: Jun 2005       09-07-2017, 11:56 AM Reply   
And Fly I love how you leave out these things called FACTS in your argument. Here is a example of you cherry picking. You say they were brought here as children and now we have to deal with it" Notice how you left out Illegally
My point (and that's all you need to reply about) since when is it ok to come to the US OR any other country illegally! Please let us know.
Old    Stanfield (stanfield)      Join Date: Mar 2004       09-07-2017, 12:22 PM Reply   
I'd say that the difference is that these, at the time, kids didn't knowingly make a decision to break the law and cross the border illegally. It's painfully obvious that they're here illegally, nobody but yourself is trying to point that out. The fact that they're illegally here is not the issue, in fact, it is the baseline for the discussion.

What if your parents had smuggled narcotics into another country by stuffing them in your diaper when you were a baby. When you turn 18, should you have to go spend 20 years in prison for a crime that was your parents, but technically was yours?
Old    Shawndoggy (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       09-07-2017, 12:25 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by grant_west View Post
So If You smuggle contraband ( drugs, cash, animals, people what every you decide) into the US and "they" or it "integrate's" it some how makes it legal?
Grant you are totally right. Please open your wallet now and take out all of the cash. it has already traded hands in several drug transactions and is therefore permanently "illegal," just like the kids who were brought here by their parents.
Old    "G" (grant_west)      Join Date: Jun 2005       09-07-2017, 1:09 PM Reply   
You Libs will defend your religion even when you don't have a leg to stand on. I know everyone is entitled to their own Opinion BUT. You can't ignore or sweep under the rug the First point in this argument. They came here illegally. GAME OVER! DO not pass GO! Try AGAIN.

Let's put it in terms of sports. Let's use football. If you commit five fouls on your way to get a touchdown should the touchdown count? NO NO NO. The first violation or foul, the whistle is blowen right away and any acts after that are void. The same is true here. As soon as you enter the the US illegally the "Foul or Crime" has been committed your actions their after are void!

If I break into your House ( kick open the door) sit down have a beer how long do I sit in your house before it turns from a Illegal act to "I belong Here"
Old    Darren Yearsley (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       09-07-2017, 1:15 PM Reply   
Why is there so much hysteria about jobs when the US is almost at full employment? You don't need more jobs, you need better jobs, they only come with education, R&D investment and stronger export which comes with trade deals. The US economy needs a renovation, jobs in heavy manufacturing and coal is pretty third world, is that what the American worker wants to do?

Sending these kids to places they have no experience of seems un-American to me, is the land of the free and home of opportunity dead?
Old    Stanfield (stanfield)      Join Date: Mar 2004       09-07-2017, 1:20 PM Reply   
Grant, it sure is a good thing you were born into an upper class white American family.
Old    "G" (grant_west)      Join Date: Jun 2005       09-07-2017, 1:29 PM Reply   
I'll go pop some pop corn, & you guys can tell me how long one has to Wait for an illegal act like "crossing the border in living in this country illegally" how long does one have to wait b4 it becomes "legal and just". I'll wait for your answer.
Old    Darren Yearsley (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       09-07-2017, 1:36 PM Reply   
Did you see the Native American Council just offered amnesty to 240m undocumented whites? Ha ha, they have a sense of humor at least.
Old    Darren Yearsley (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       09-07-2017, 1:39 PM Reply   
G, I know you can think about these things in the macro sense and it seems legit but in the micro sense if it was your job to turn up at these kids/young adults places taking them from there homes/jobs and delivering them to the airport I doubt you would feel like it was justice.
Old    "G" (grant_west)      Join Date: Jun 2005       09-07-2017, 1:56 PM Reply   
Ralph: When they lock up and throw away the key to the illegal "Juan Francisco López-Sánchez" .(that was supposed to deported 5 times) Who shot and killed Kate Steinly here in SF "I doubt I will feel like it was justice EITHER"

Still waiting on that time limit where illegal acts become legal? Let me know when you have come up with a consensus
Old    Darren Yearsley (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       09-07-2017, 2:01 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by grant_west View Post
Ralph: When they lock up and throw away the key to the illegal "Juan Francisco López-Sánchez" .(that was supposed to deported 5 times) Who shot and killed Kate Steinly here in SF "I doubt I will feel like it was justice EITHER"
No, it sounds like that will be justice. How does that justify DACA tho?
Old    "G" (grant_west)      Join Date: Jun 2005       09-07-2017, 2:13 PM Reply   
My point was. Tossing a guy in jail for life at the tax payers expense (estimates of $150-$200k a year to jail a Life'r) is Not a win win situation. I'm sure Kate's parents would agree it's not Justice, but it is the Law. Same as is removing kids & young adults and sending them back to their country of origin. Not the Ideal situation. Brings me back to my original point. #1 Don't break the law and then we don't have to go down this road. In years past it was. Break the law and ask for forgiveness or become the victim and get a pass. How fair is it. No wait libs don't like the word FAIR. You like the word equality or equal. How is there a equality to to people that have been waiting for years to become natural legal citizens to just give people that ran across the border illegally citizenship. Where is the equality in that.

Crickets when it comes to the question of? How long does one have to wait for an illegal act to become legal

Last edited by grant_west; 09-07-2017 at 2:15 PM.
Old    Stanfield (stanfield)      Join Date: Mar 2004       09-07-2017, 2:45 PM Reply   
Grant, it's a simple minded question that doesn't apply here. These were kids that were brought here not on their own accord. If they were unwillingly brought here by someone else, did they actually commit a crime? If this were a criminal case ie. "my father forced me to go into that store to steal food", the child would not be found guilty in a court of law.

Do you honestly not understand this?
Old    Darrel F (95sn)      Join Date: Sep 2005       09-07-2017, 4:44 PM Reply   
Quote:
My point was. Tossing a guy in jail for life at the tax payers expense (estimates of $150-$200k a year to jail a Life'r) is Not a win win situation. I'm sure Kate's parents would agree it's not Justice, but it is the Law. Same as is removing kids & young adults and sending them back to their country of origin. Not the Ideal situation. Brings me back to my original point. #1 Don't break the law and then we don't have to go down this road. In years past it was. Break the law and ask for forgiveness or become the victim and get a pass. How fair is it. No wait libs don't like the word FAIR. You like the word equality or equal. How is there a equality to to people that have been waiting for years to become natural legal citizens to just give people that ran across the border illegally citizenship. Where is the equality in that.

Crickets when it comes to the question of? How long does one have to wait for an illegal act to become legal
G, you seem to be confusing who can participate DACA and what DACA does. You want to deport/jail gang bangers/rapists/killers/those that don't respect our laws or country... I got your back!
DACA isn't that... Its temporary relief from deportation IF and only if you play by the rules. This is not for anyone convicted of a crime. If you have a criminal record...you don't qualify. Most of them were brought here at age 7 or younger, clearly they had no say or choice in the decision. Over 90% of these people are working full time, higher employment rates than US citizens... They are going to school full time and working part or full time, or they going to school full time. No slackers. More than 12% own their own home. 72% are in college or grad school. Many are or have already served in the military and honorably discharged. This is the exact group of people you invite to come to your country and assimilate. Its the cream of the ****in crop. I cannot think of any other All-American group that could be as desirable. This is just one of very few Govt programs that have worked and worked better than expected....Why Kill it?

Racist Jeff Sessions called it “unconstitutional exercise of authority by the executive branch.” however that just his good ole southern boy opinion. What did "Fly" call him? a prick? agree.

DACA guidelines for "G". Educate yourself sir, you don't want to sound like a fool or a racist. Be the smart guy in your group of friends.

Guidelines
You may request DACA if you:
Were under the age of 31 as of June 15, 2012;
Came to the United States before reaching your 16th birthday;
Have continuously resided in the United States since June 15, 2007, up to the present time;
Were physically present in the United States on June 15, 2012, and at the time of making your request for consideration of deferred action with USCIS;
Had no lawful status on June 15, 2012;
Are currently in school, have graduated or obtained a certificate of completion from high school, have obtained a general education development (GED) certificate, or are an honorably discharged veteran of the Coast Guard or Armed Forces of the United States; and
Have not been convicted of a felony, significant misdemeanor,or three or more other misdemeanors, and do not otherwise pose a threat to national security or public safety.
Age Guidelines
Anyone requesting DACA must have been under the age of 31 as of June 15, 2012. You must also be at least 15 years or older to request DACA, unless you are currently in removal proceedings or have a final removal or voluntary departure order, as summarized in the table below:
Your situation
Age
I have never been in removal proceedings, or my proceedings have been terminated before making my request.
At least 15 years old at the time of submitting your request and*under the age of*31 as of June 15, 2012.
I am in removal proceedings, have a final removal order, or have a voluntary departure order, and I am not in immigration detention.
Under the age of 31 as of June 15, 2012, but you may be younger than 15 years old at the time you submit your request.
Timeframe for Meeting the Guidelines
You must demonstrate
That on June 15, 2012 you
As of the date you file your request you
Were under the age of*31 years
Were physically present in the United States
Had no lawful status
Have resided continuously in the U.S. since June 15, 2007;
Had come to the United States before your 16th birthday
Were physically present in the United States; and
Are in school, have graduated from high school in the United States, or have a GED; or
Are an honorably discharged veteran of the Coast Guard or Armed Forces of the United States
*Education and Military Service Guidelines
Your school or military status at the time of requesting DACA
Meet education or military service guidelines for DACA
*I graduated from:
Public or private high school; or
Secondary school.
Or
I have obtained a GED.
Yes
I am currently enrolled in school.
See the Education section of the FAQs for a full explanation of who is considered currently in school.
Yes
I was in school but dropped out and did not graduate. I am not currently in school and am not an honorably discharged veteran of the Coast Guard or Armed Forces of the U.S.
No
I am an honorably discharged veteran of the Coast Guard or Armed Forces of the U.S.
Yes
Please see our Frequently Asked Questions for more detail on school-related guidelines.
Old    "G" (grant_west)      Join Date: Jun 2005       09-07-2017, 4:58 PM Reply   
Darrel: the reference to the illegal Roach that blasted Kate was not about DACA it was a point I was making with Ralph about Justice and how sometimes Justice is not fair.
Old    Jeremy (wake77)      Join Date: Jan 2009       09-08-2017, 4:08 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by grant_west View Post
Darrel: the reference to the illegal Roach that blasted Kate was not about DACA it was a point I was making with Ralph about Justice and how sometimes Justice is not fair.
No, it was your attempt to classify every illegal alien as a murderous thug. At least be honest when you opine.
Old    "G" (grant_west)      Join Date: Jun 2005       09-08-2017, 1:03 PM Reply   
Wake: Nice Try. Unlike you I don't have a problem being honest in my post above. I was not trying to say what your implying. I don't think all dreamers are thugs or criminals. But it's good that you point out how your liberalism is a disease. My point is you either agree with your liberal loon policy or else you're a racist or fascist or some other label that you come up with. SAN95 did a good job making a point for Dreamers. And I can agree with him on his views. You libs are some very unhappy people, trying to find secret racism, under cover conspiracy's, creating fake news. Resisting. And the list go's on. Get out and try your life
Old    "G" (grant_west)      Join Date: Jun 2005       09-08-2017, 1:13 PM Reply   
Still waiting on that Time line where things that are illegal become legal
Old    Shawndoggy (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       09-08-2017, 1:30 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by grant_west View Post
Still waiting on that Time line where things that are illegal become legal
Well how about grand theft? Illegal in your hood on the day it happens. But if prosecution is not initiated within three years, can't be prosecuted.

So in that case, don't you have a time that a thing that was illegal became legal?

One of a bazillion examples.
Old    Darrel F (95sn)      Join Date: Sep 2005       09-08-2017, 1:56 PM Reply   
Quote:
. I don't think all dreamers are thugs or criminals.
No, NONE of them are, none.
Quote:
You libs are some very unhappy people, trying to find secret racism, under cover conspiracy's, creating fake news. Resisting. And the list go's on. Get out and try your life
I don't think the libs are actually unhappy now, more inspired. They are fired up. Unhappy about the orange cheeto dude in office, yes, unhappy about many of his decisions, yes, unhappy about his lying, yes. There are many things to be unhappy about regarding the WH. But its probably the most fulfilling and exhilarating times many have felt in years or ever. So much to resist, so many in trumps circle to ridicule and make fun of. Its non stop " E" ticket ****. Donnie jr 5 hours of interrogation yesterday and he admitted 3 more Russian phone calls after lying/spouting off on Hannity "that's all". Yet more is released or a new twist is reluctantly revealed. They want to question him in public so ALL can see how he answers and judge his character, under oath. . Every freaking day this administration bungles, lies or is caught in another faux paux. I would think its really frustrating and deflating to defend these bozos day after day, F'up after F'up.

I actually don't think all trump fans are racist or bad folks, just misguided perhaps by fake news or not knowing. The day he won, I was surprised (I didn't vote for either one...both were way to flawed for me). My immediate reaction was, hey he is a business 1st guy, thought that would be good for the country. Get rid of a lot of govt waste, cleanup Washington cartel (swamp).... basically MAGA. Except he has done almost nothing to help the country. Turns out he is Trump 1st, last, and only. He has only run a family biz, handed to him and successful only because he doesn't mind F'ing over people who work(ed) for him, BK and bullying. He is the walking definition of a pathological liar, is addicted to twitter and an attention whore. Cant run a country that way.
Old    John Anderson (fly135)      Join Date: Jun 2004       09-08-2017, 3:42 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by grant_west View Post
Crickets when it comes to the question of? How long does one have to wait for an illegal act to become legal
The question of legality isn't in dispute. It's irrelevant to the discussion because we all agree that they were brought here illegally and they they don't have a legal status here. The reason why we are having this discussion is because some people think it's immoral to ship someone out of the country when they were brought here as children and send them to a foreign country that may be completely foreign to them.

The reason conservatives don't agree with DACA and why the GOP is not passing any laws to help them is because the right has different morals regarding these people. They have no compassion for them. But instead of being intellectually honest, they pretend like the law is the ultimate moral authority. The law is not a moral authority, it's the authority of power. The left is having a battle against the right WRT the authority of power over this issue. So you can quit rehashing superfluous argument regarding legality because it just demonstrates that you don't even understand the debate.
Old    Jo Shmoe (joeshmoe)      Join Date: Jan 2003       09-09-2017, 11:17 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by grant_west View Post
Crickets when it comes to the question of? How long does one have to wait for an illegal act to become legal
Grant, I don't think a two year old can commit a crime, it's their parents. So, if they haven't committed any violent crimes, why can't they stay? They are not criminals, or do you really think that a two year old can be a criminal and thrown into jail?
Old    Wes (pesos)      Join Date: Oct 2001       09-09-2017, 7:18 PM Reply   


AGs in 15 states suing over DACA decision/lack of immigration progress by congress:
New York, Massachusetts, Washington, Connecticut, Delaware, Hawaii, Illinois, Iowa, New Mexico, North Carolina, Oregon, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, Vermont and Virginia, along with the District of Columbia
Old    Brett W (brettw)      Join Date: Jul 2007       09-09-2017, 7:23 PM Reply   
Hypothetically, what would be the benefit to the country by deporting all the dreamers vs. an equal # of random legal U.S. citizens around the same age?
Old    dennis engle (deneng)      Join Date: Feb 2005       09-09-2017, 8:15 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeshmoe View Post
Grant, I don't think a two year old can commit a crime, it's their parents. So, if they haven't committed any violent crimes, why can't they stay? They are not criminals, or do you really think that a two year old can be a criminal and thrown into jail?
Yes our nation has laws to protect its citizen's . Rather then complain or cry why are they thanking the U.S. for the amount of years 5, or whatever it may be that they lived off of our Country. I for one do not want anyone to be a citizen if they are not grateful . Send them back. Their parents knew at the time that they crossed the boarders breaking our laws that it was wrong , and that someday they would get caught, so rather then cry give a big thank you.
Old    dennis engle (deneng)      Join Date: Feb 2005       09-09-2017, 8:20 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by brettw View Post
Hypothetically, what would be the benefit to the country by deporting all the dreamers vs. an equal # of random legal U.S. citizens around the same age?
Now you want to deport legal aliens. No we protect U.S. legal citizens. The benefit would be that we are enforcing our laws. Do i need to explain why we have laws?
Old    Brett W (brettw)      Join Date: Jul 2007       09-10-2017, 8:31 AM Reply   
I guess you don't understand the word hypothetically, let alone the point of the question.
Old    dennis engle (deneng)      Join Date: Feb 2005       09-10-2017, 11:53 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by brettw View Post
I guess you don't understand the word hypothetically, let alone the point of the question.
Is there a point? I am afraid to ask what that point would be.
Old    TheWakeIsReal            09-11-2017, 11:00 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by deneng View Post
Yes our nation has laws to protect its citizen's . Rather then complain or cry why are they thanking the U.S. for the amount of years 5, or whatever it may be that they lived off of our Country. I for one do not want anyone to be a citizen if they are not grateful . Send them back. Their parents knew at the time that they crossed the boarders breaking our laws that it was wrong , and that someday they would get caught, so rather then cry give a big thank you.
What the **** are you talking about. You neither addressed his question or really answered anything. What do you mean they're not grateful? Is there a poll I missed or something? 89% of dreamers ungrateful towards U.S., Fox news also found 93% of dreamers also "libtards and communists".

You sound ungrateful to be a citizen of the great country of America with your slogan "Make America Great Again". According to you the country isn't great, sounds pretty ungrateful if you ask me.
Old    Darrel F (95sn)      Join Date: Sep 2005       09-11-2017, 4:24 PM Reply   
I read somewhere it costs the USA approx. $10,000 to deport an illegal alien. Do the math of Dreamers alone, $10K X 800,000. That's a hefty price to pay to deport people who, up until last week, were legally working and paying US taxes. What about the other 11 million...and a wall...$$$$$.
Trump should have fired Sessions when he was hot on him. I swear his ideals are a total throwback to the 1950's. He is short and has beady eyes, cant trust a guy with beady eyes.

Quote:
Yes our nation has laws to protect its citizen's . Rather then complain or cry why are they thanking the U.S. for the amount of years 5, or whatever it may be that they lived off of our Country. I for one do not want anyone to be a citizen if they are not grateful . Send them back. Their parents knew at the time that they crossed the boarders breaking our laws that it was wrong , and that someday they would get caught, so rather then cry give a big thank you.
Why are you citing "laws" to protect from DACA? If they are in DACA, by definition they are not breaking any laws, they are not criminals and no need for "protection".
Complain or cry? no one was complaining until the trump admin F'ed up a very rare perfectly working plan for illegals to work here. (which by the way is rare for any govt plan to work) They have 91% employment and pay taxes (approx. $2 Billion), who is "living off the Country"? Now, remove DACA and force illegals to work under the table, guess what you get? Oh crap.
They do not become citizens or even get a green card, they are grateful or they would not register and jump thru all the hoops to be part of the program. Send them back where? If you were 30 yrs old and lived the last 25 years of your life in the USA...where do they send you. This is home. Yes, their parents knew they were coming over illegal. When you were 9 where could you possibly make your parents move? Clearly zero percent broke the law, they were brought here illegally before the age of consent.
None of the statements you made make any sense or are in any way the truth. Fine to have another opinion but you have to at least educate yourself at least a little on the DACA program before you type out a fistful of incorrect assumptions that make you sound ignorantly racist. Here is the readers digest abbreviated version for you. DACA is a temporary legal presence and employment authorization in the United States, that's it.
Old    dennis engle (deneng)      Join Date: Feb 2005       09-11-2017, 5:43 PM Reply   
They broke the law when they came over ilegally. Don't you get it? Time is up.I don't care if they knew if they were braking the law or not. Thier parnets knew they were breaking the law. All of statements i made make perfect sense unless you are a anarchist who enjoys breaking the laws of a country. I understand that DACA allowed them stay but i think you believe they are legal citizens. I hear no gratitude of the time they were allowed to stay. Taxpayers footing many of the costs. I am sure there alot of good people. Where do they send you? Back. Thank You United States of America for being gracious enough to allow us to stay. Where would they have been if they were not here? Back where they came from. They are in a much better situation then when they arrived. Quit crying. They broke the law.
Old    Jeremy (wake77)      Join Date: Jan 2009       09-11-2017, 6:00 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by deneng View Post
They broke the law when they came over ilegally. Don't you get it? Time is up.I don't care if they knew if they were braking the law or not. Thier parnets knew they were breaking the law. All of statements i made make perfect sense unless you are a anarchist who enjoys breaking the laws of a country. I understand that DACA allowed them stay but i think you believe they are legal citizens. I hear no gratitude of the time they were allowed to stay. Taxpayers footing many of the costs. I am sure there alot of good people. Where do they send you? Back. Thank You United States of America for being gracious enough to allow us to stay. Where would they have been if they were not here? Back where they came from. They are in a much better situation then when they arrived. Quit crying. They broke the law.
What about the 900 or so dreamers that are doing more for this country than you ever dreamed of? They are serving this country in the military, putting their lives on the line every day, while you sit on your fat ass eating chili dogs and drinking Mountain Dew and calling them law breakers. Guys like you are a disgrace and much more detrimental to the success of this country than some youngsters wanting to better themselves.
Old    dennis engle (deneng)      Join Date: Feb 2005       09-11-2017, 8:14 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wake77 View Post
What about the 900 or so dreamers that are doing more for this country than you ever dreamed of? They are serving this country in the military, putting their lives on the line every day, while you sit on your fat ass eating chili dogs and drinking Mountain Dew and calling them law breakers. Guys like you are a disgrace and much more detrimental to the success of this country than some youngsters wanting to better themselves.
I said they are not all bad. They are not citizens. If they truly want to be a legal citizen then go back and apply legally. Quit making excuses for the wrong. Follow the law The law states for them to go back. If you are not aware DACA is temporary and President Trump asked congress to fix it. . I hear nobody thanking the U.S. You really need to get help. Your argument is illogical . I guess you would rather give jobs and resources to illegal aliens instead of your own children.

Last edited by deneng; 09-11-2017 at 8:17 PM.
Old    Darren Yearsley (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       09-11-2017, 8:48 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by deneng View Post
If they truly want to be a legal citizen then go back and apply legally.
Isn't that what DACA is for, to allow people to apply for legal residency without having to be deported first?
Old    dennis engle (deneng)      Join Date: Feb 2005       09-12-2017, 4:26 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by ralph View Post
Isn't that what DACA is for, to allow people to apply for legal residency without having to be deported first?
Well check it out Ralph. DACA should have never been implemented in the first place. It is Congress who needs to make law. President Trump is now doing the thing that Obumer should have done in the first place. President Trump is allowing Congress to do their job by providing them 6 months to finish otherwise go back. I believe the left is finally starting to wake up and get involved with MAGA. I sure hope so. Peace!

Last edited by deneng; 09-12-2017 at 4:29 AM.
Old    Jeremy (wake77)      Join Date: Jan 2009       09-12-2017, 6:34 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by deneng View Post
Well check it out Ralph. DACA should have never been implemented in the first place. It is Congress who needs to make law. President Trump is now doing the thing that Obumer should have done in the first place. President Trump is allowing Congress to do their job by providing them 6 months to finish otherwise go back. I believe the left is finally starting to wake up and get involved with MAGA. I sure hope so. Peace!
Didn't Sarah Huckabee Sanders just say "Congress needs to do their job or get out of the way and let someone else do their job" during one of the recent WH press conferences? Oh that's right, you right-wingers only support Executive orders when a republican is in the WH.

Does it ever get tiring being so hypocritical in all of your political stances?
Old    Jeremy (wake77)      Join Date: Jan 2009       09-12-2017, 6:38 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by deneng View Post
I said they are not all bad. They are not citizens. If they truly want to be a legal citizen then go back and apply legally. Quit making excuses for the wrong. Follow the law The law states for them to go back. If you are not aware DACA is temporary and President Trump asked congress to fix it. . I hear nobody thanking the U.S. You really need to get help. Your argument is illogical . I guess you would rather give jobs and resources to illegal aliens instead of your own children.
When one of these dreamers volunteers and chooses to put his/her life on the line by serving in the armed forces, how much more thanks do you need? You are the one who needs help. You sit on your ass all day and do nothing but bitch. At least thank these brave souls that protect your freedoms.
Old    dennis engle (deneng)      Join Date: Feb 2005       09-12-2017, 11:33 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wake77 View Post
Didn't Sarah Huckabee Sanders just say "Congress needs to do their job or get out of the way and let someone else do their job" during one of the recent WH press conferences? Oh that's right, you right-wingers only support Executive orders when a republican is in the WH.

Does it ever get tiring being so hypocritical in all of your political stances?
HaHaHa. Obama was the one who initiated DACA. Trump negated Obama's decision so Congress could do their job. Liberals are either ignorant or evil.
Old    dennis engle (deneng)      Join Date: Feb 2005       09-12-2017, 11:38 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wake77 View Post
When one of these dreamers volunteers and chooses to put his/her life on the line by serving in the armed forces, how much more thanks do you need? You are the one who needs help. You sit on your ass all day and do nothing but bitch. At least thank these brave souls that protect your freedoms.
Yes the people who are good for America should go the back of the line for legal immigration. This is what is fair.
Old    Darrel F (95sn)      Join Date: Sep 2005       09-12-2017, 3:16 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by deneng View Post
Yes the people who are good for America should go the back of the line for legal immigration. This is what is fair.
And the ones who are working and paying US taxes?
The ones staying out of trouble and getting an education, college, grad school?
The ones who have sacrificed and started business's here?
The ones who have sacrificed bling and bought homes and set down roots are raising a family?
Old    deltahoosier            09-12-2017, 3:59 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by 95sn View Post
And the ones who are working and paying US taxes?
The ones staying out of trouble and getting an education, college, grad school?
The ones who have sacrificed and started business's here?
The ones who have sacrificed bling and bought homes and set down roots are raising a family?
What about the people who are doing this all the right way? Are they supposed to respect the process? If these folks have been here, why have they not applied to be a citizen? Seems odd.
Old    Darrel F (95sn)      Join Date: Sep 2005       09-12-2017, 4:34 PM Reply   
if you are in US and undocumented, you don't qualify for citizenship. That's why DACA was so important, they didn't have to worry about deportation. They could get a job an education and become a contributing member of society.
Old    deltahoosier            09-12-2017, 5:58 PM Reply   
While DACA seems somewhat reasonable, but a bit unfair to those doing it correctly, it looks as if it was done by executive order which has a certain amount of non binding attributes to it. It seemed to set up a type of middle of the road version of illegal alien with some odd "you are illegal, but we will not enforce that portion of immigration law against you" status. As the law dictates, these people are illegal and it should be enforced. This will just continue to allow for more and more illegals to bring over kids if we don't put our foot down.

https://www.dhs.gov/news/2017/09/05/...-arrivals-daca

The Obama administration chose to deploy DACA by Executive Branch memorandum—despite the fact that Congress affirmatively rejected such a program in the normal legislative process on multiple occasions. The constitutionality of this action has been widely questioned since its inception.
Old    Darrel F (95sn)      Join Date: Sep 2005       09-12-2017, 6:46 PM Reply   
Does DACA inhibit those that are "applying" for citizenship in any way? Unfair?

Congress has a very difficult time passing ANY legislation....even when it is something that both side want to pass. There are reasons congress approval ratings are worse than the cheeto. With the Pres, the senate AND the house the current admin has passed zero substantial legislation. How many exec orders has cheeto in chief signed?
If they bring over more kids, the kind that qualify for and flourish under DACA its a good deal for the USA.
Unfortunately, illegal immigration #'s are down.
Old    deltahoosier            09-12-2017, 6:52 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by 95sn View Post
Does DACA inhibit those that are "applying" for citizenship in any way? Unfair?

Congress has a very difficult time passing ANY legislation....even when it is something that both side want to pass. There are reasons congress approval ratings are worse than the cheeto. With the Pres, the senate AND the house the current admin has passed zero substantial legislation. How many exec orders has cheeto in chief signed?
If they bring over more kids, the kind that qualify for and flourish under DACA its a good deal for the USA.
Unfortunately, illegal immigration #'s are down.
Congress approval has been lower than the president for the last 3 presidents if I recall.

I say that not enforcing the law for those who are trying to apply legally gets in there way because they have to have meaningful employment and so on. If you have the DACA people taking those jobs, how does that not affect them? Sounds like Facebook has determined that it is 700,000 jobs. What about others doing the right thing and applying for work Visa's? Those 700,000 jobs could be used by them as well as our own citizens. Now you are creating a second class citizen who are now so out of the loop to their original culture but will never be part of the US. Now sure how that is fair to anyone?

Why is it unfortunate that illegal immigration is down? That is a good thing.
Old    dennis engle (deneng)      Join Date: Feb 2005       09-12-2017, 11:47 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by 95sn View Post
And the ones who are working and paying US taxes?
The ones staying out of trouble and getting an education, college, grad school?
The ones who have sacrificed and started business's here?
The ones who have sacrificed bling and bought homes and set down roots are raising a family?
They all cheated the system. They all broke the law. What did they sacrifice. Some have homes in both countries. Can you go to a South American country illegally and buy a home get a free education ? Lets say your parents dropped you off in say Mexico.
Old    dennis engle (deneng)      Join Date: Feb 2005       09-12-2017, 11:54 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by deltahoosier View Post
While DACA seems somewhat reasonable, but a bit unfair to those doing it correctly, it looks as if it was done by executive order which has a certain amount of non binding attributes to it. It seemed to set up a type of middle of the road version of illegal alien with some odd "you are illegal, but we will not enforce that portion of immigration law against you" status. As the law dictates, these people are illegal and it should be enforced. This will just continue to allow for more and more illegals to bring over kids if we don't put our foot down.

https://www.dhs.gov/news/2017/09/05/...-arrivals-daca

The Obama administration chose to deploy DACA by Executive Branch memorandum—despite the fact that Congress affirmatively rejected such a program in the normal legislative process on multiple occasions. The constitutionality of this action has been widely questioned since its inception.
Furthermore Trump is for DACA and he has said so. He is very wishy washy on the subject . We have to hold him to what he originally said. "Deport them all" He should have just let DACA expire then said they were her illegally and deported them all. He made a big mistake by turning it back to congress. The republicans are looking very very weak now.
Old    dennis engle (deneng)      Join Date: Feb 2005       09-12-2017, 11:59 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by 95sn View Post
Does DACA inhibit those that are "applying" for citizenship in any way? Unfair?

Congress has a very difficult time passing ANY legislation....even when it is something that both side want to pass. There are reasons congress approval ratings are worse than the cheeto. With the Pres, the senate AND the house the current admin has passed zero substantial legislation. How many exec orders has cheeto in chief signed?
If they bring over more kids, the kind that qualify for and flourish under DACA its a good deal for the USA.
Unfortunately, illegal immigration #'s are down.
Just curious are you DACA, or have illegals as employees? I really do not think you would tell the truth . I will ask anyway because of your statement.
Old    Darren Yearsley (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       09-13-2017, 12:52 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by deneng View Post
Furthermore Trump is for DACA and he has said so.
Yes that's what strikes me too. It's like the reason he has pulled the pin is just as a FU to Obama and to show he is "tough on immigration" ie Just politics. But at what personal cost to DACA recipients? Morally I just find it disgusting and a total lack of leadership


https://youtu.be/IBMOsapK_PI
Old    Jack Henry (racer808)      Join Date: Jan 2013       09-13-2017, 7:45 AM Reply   
So lets get this straight. DACA, which Obama said was only a temporary solution as he can't write law, he used prosecutorial discretion when enacting & said at some poimt Congress must take up the issue. The EO was already ruled unconstitutional by a federal court with more lawyers lined up to get rid of it which would have immediate impact on the Dreamers. So Trump, abiding by the constitution cancelled it, gave a 6 month halt to delay enactment & already made a deal with Congress to pass it, is the evil bastard to the left when he's giving the dreamers & the retarded left what they want? Following the law, making sure the Dreamer becomes law which can't be challenged so easily & the loony left is still have a conniption fit. Partisan hacks.
Old    Darren Yearsley (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       09-13-2017, 12:53 PM Reply   
If he has already made a deal to make an alternative then i would totally agree but i haven't seen anything to suggest he has
Old    dennis engle (deneng)      Join Date: Feb 2005       09-13-2017, 1:39 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by 95sn View Post
if you are in US and undocumented, you don't qualify for citizenship. That's why DACA was so important, they didn't have to worry about deportation. They could get a job an education and become a contributing member of society.
HaHaHa. Typical commie response. It is not a law. It does not lead to citizenship. It is just paperwork that says we will not do anything now until later.You are correct they do not qualify for citizenship. Why should these people be allowed in first over the people who have done it the right way? I understand all of your excuses, but thats what they are is excuses to not follow the law.
Old    dennis engle (deneng)      Join Date: Feb 2005       09-13-2017, 1:41 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by ralph View Post
Yes that's what strikes me too. It's like the reason he has pulled the pin is just as a FU to Obama and to show he is "tough on immigration" ie Just politics. But at what personal cost to DACA recipients? Morally I just find it disgusting and a total lack of leadership


https://youtu.be/IBMOsapK_PI
Good point.
Old    dennis engle (deneng)      Join Date: Feb 2005       09-13-2017, 1:51 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by racer808 View Post
So lets get this straight. DACA, which Obama said was only a temporary solution as he can't write law, he used prosecutorial discretion when enacting & said at some poimt Congress must take up the issue. The EO was already ruled unconstitutional by a federal court with more lawyers lined up to get rid of it which would have immediate impact on the Dreamers. So Trump, abiding by the constitution cancelled it, gave a 6 month halt to delay enactment & already made a deal with Congress to pass it, is the evil bastard to the left when he's giving the dreamers & the retarded left what they want? Following the law, making sure the Dreamer becomes law which can't be challenged so easily & the loony left is still have a conniption fit. Partisan hacks.
Remember Trump is not a conservative. He is not a commie like the left is now. Too many progressives on the right. He is not taking leadership. Congress will do nothing and pass it back to Trump. This is more important than the wall. I am afraid that none of the illegals will go back. To many republicans are worried about being seen as good guys. The press and left will always hate them ,and will be pissing on their graves, their families graves and their supporters graves.
Old    Darrel F (95sn)      Join Date: Sep 2005       09-13-2017, 2:13 PM Reply   
I think you may be correct Ralph, Its in part a big FU to Obama as DACA has been a net benefit to USA re immigration problem solving and $. Solves deportation issues for near life long illegals and USA gets taxpayers. And it has jeff Sessions fingerprints all over it.
http://www.al.com/opinion/index.ssf/...e_for_tru.html
https://slate.com/business/2017/09/j...obs-wrong.html
Agree with Rod, congress needs to get better quick, they have been weak for too long. There are issues that both sides agree on and they still cant pass them. Its time for congress to get DACA to law...or trump will do....something. All the states (14-15 or so) suing the Govt should not be necc.

Sessions...none of the dreamers lied on their security clearance applications...
http://www.newsweek.com/jeff-session...ave-him-664119
Old    Jack Henry (racer808)      Join Date: Jan 2013       09-13-2017, 3:23 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by ralph View Post
If he has already made a deal to make an alternative then i would totally agree but i haven't seen anything to suggest he has
No details have been released, sadly I think you're going to see full amnesty though & if no deal on DACA is made Trump has said he would reenact the DACA via EO & kick the can again.
Old    Darrel F (95sn)      Join Date: Sep 2005       09-13-2017, 3:42 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by deneng View Post
HaHaHa. Typical commie response. It is not a law. It does not lead to citizenship. It is just paperwork that says we will not do anything now until later.You are correct they do not qualify for citizenship. Why should these people be allowed in first over the people who have done it the right way? I understand all of your excuses, but thats what they are is excuses to not follow the law.
Typical racist response.
Correct not a law or a path to "citizenship". It was never intended to do that. It is simply an opportunity for those that qualify and willing to do what is required by the Govt. to remain in the USA in 2 year increments. To say "Why should these people be allowed in first...."
Well, they have been here for most of them most of their life, no one is letting anyone in and DACA was the legal route until last week. These are not excuses, its real life and I really do not believe you do understand or are trying to understand. . I don't think you get the fact that this is the only home that they know. If not DACA, what is your plan? Remember, it costs $10k plus per deportation.
If I were vetting foreigners to a citizenship path...
I would accept only those with no criminal record.
I would expect candidates to be productive ie work and or go to school.
I would give brownie points to those that serve in the US military.
I would expect assimilation.
These are the basic qualifications for DACA in addition to handing the govt your name, address, financial info, medical info, school records, employment records, and military record. Plus $500 bucks. Most illegals don't want to let the govt know who and where they are. Now Sessions has all that info, enough to make one nervous.
Old    Darren Yearsley (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       09-13-2017, 4:05 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by deneng View Post
Good point.
Quit agreeing with me, it's weirding me out and eroding my street cred with the liberal snowflakes.
Old    TheWakeIsReal            09-14-2017, 8:28 AM Reply   
Hey Dennis, even your idol says you're wrong. MAGA
Attached Images
 
Old    dennis engle (deneng)      Join Date: Feb 2005       09-14-2017, 11:33 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheWakeIsReal View Post
Hey Dennis, even your idol says you're wrong. MAGA
He is not my idol. He is way better then the crooks who broke the law before him. What is the latest Russia scandal? Let's ignore the facts who does and does not have any proof of being guilty. Right!
Old    TheWakeIsReal            09-14-2017, 11:42 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by deneng View Post
He is not my idol. He is way better then the crooks who broke the law before him. What is the latest Russia scandal? Let's ignore the facts who does and does not have any proof of being guilty. Right!
Way to keep the conversation relevant! MAGA MAGA MAGA MAGA
Old    deltahoosier            09-14-2017, 11:45 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheWakeIsReal View Post
Hey Dennis, even your idol says you're wrong. MAGA
Good for him. However, the left lost their minds by the president actually upholding the law or forcing someone to do something about the lack of law. Making a group of people, that were caught in a bind, a second class citizen with no home here and no home their is not an answer. However, this still does not fix that illegals were allowed to enter in record number so we are going to have more of this. It needs to stop.
Old    Darrel F (95sn)      Join Date: Sep 2005       09-14-2017, 4:59 PM Reply   
^^^Delta, the other day we agreed border crossings are WAY down. If they can make DACA law, increase border patrol #s, implement automation thru cameras... and figure out a way to control those that don't leave when their visa expires....Do we have a immigration problem?
Wait, I just said almost the same thing trump tweeted.

The Russia scandal is heating up, Flynn for sure going to jail.
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics...-deals/539733/
Old    dennis engle (deneng)      Join Date: Feb 2005       09-14-2017, 9:55 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheWakeIsReal View Post
Way to keep the conversation relevant! MAGA MAGA MAGA MAGA
Right on brother. MAGA.
Old    deltahoosier            09-15-2017, 10:37 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by 95sn View Post
^^^Delta, the other day we agreed border crossings are WAY down. If they can make DACA law, increase border patrol #s, implement automation thru cameras... and figure out a way to control those that don't leave when their visa expires....Do we have a immigration problem?
Wait, I just said almost the same thing trump tweeted.

The Russia scandal is heating up, Flynn for sure going to jail.
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics...-deals/539733/
Good Question. When you are speaking of millions of people, I would say yes. California was spending over $15 billion a year on illegals back in the 2000's. Hope you enjoy your tax increases the government has passed or pushed through regulations on PG&E as an indirect tax on you. Considering Obama did almost nothing to stop boarder crossings, I would say the reduction in boarder crossings puts us back to our historic levels of Bush and Clinton. Those numbers were still an issue. They were enough of an issue to impact election cycles more than this phony Russian story.
Old    deltahoosier            09-15-2017, 12:00 PM Reply   
Dang it. Wrote boarder again instead of border...... uggg... sorry Wes.
Old    Darrel F (95sn)      Join Date: Sep 2005       09-15-2017, 3:14 PM Reply   
What part of the Russia story do you think is phony? That Russia played a part and attempted to impact the election or just the part that trump and team colluded? or?

Facebook now admitting Russia used them.
https://www.recode.net/2017/4/28/154...ntial-election
Old    deltahoosier            09-15-2017, 4:47 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by 95sn View Post
What part of the Russia story do you think is phony? That Russia played a part and attempted to impact the election or just the part that trump and team colluded? or?

Facebook now admitting Russia used them.
https://www.recode.net/2017/4/28/154...ntial-election
I believe that the Russians, Chinese, Mexicans, Cubans, the entire UN and NATO have tried to influence our elections. We own the dollar and most world monetary policy. They would be fools to not try and influence our elections. I have pointed out how it is openly documented that democrats asked Soviets to help them win against Reagan and others.

As far as Trump? I don't believe there is collusion. I believe that many actors have tried to work with Trump and with Clinton. Only difference is, Clinton decided to make an accusation based on politics and the only reason it had traction is the "Russian Hack". The Russian hack has now been found to be false. It was Wasserman-Shultz is trying to cover her tracks in some illegal matter and that investigation is getting traction.
Old    Jeremy (wake77)      Join Date: Jan 2009       09-16-2017, 6:09 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by deltahoosier View Post
I believe that the Russians, Chinese, Mexicans, Cubans, the entire UN and NATO have tried to influence our elections. We own the dollar and most world monetary policy. They would be fools to not try and influence our elections. I have pointed out how it is openly documented that democrats asked Soviets to help them win against Reagan and others.

As far as Trump? I don't believe there is collusion. I believe that many actors have tried to work with Trump and with Clinton. Only difference is, Clinton decided to make an accusation based on politics and the only reason it had traction is the "Russian Hack". The Russian hack has now been found to be false. It was Wasserman-Shultz is trying to cover her tracks in some illegal matter and that investigation is getting traction.
Trump isn't being investigated for "Russian Hacks". He is being investigated for collusion. Quit trying to tie the two instances together. Manafort is facing some serious allegations, as is Flynn. I don't think there is any disputing that Manafort colluded, the only question is if Trump was involved. But there is not a bone in my body that doesn't think you'd be suspicious if a Democrat was in Trump's position with the same circumstances. You would be pissed.
Old    deltahoosier            09-20-2017, 2:17 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wake77 View Post
Trump isn't being investigated for "Russian Hacks". He is being investigated for collusion. Quit trying to tie the two instances together. Manafort is facing some serious allegations, as is Flynn. I don't think there is any disputing that Manafort colluded, the only question is if Trump was involved. But there is not a bone in my body that doesn't think you'd be suspicious if a Democrat was in Trump's position with the same circumstances. You would be pissed.
Uh... First collusion is not a crime in elections so you can stop trying to combine collusion with criminality. Since you guys keep trying to use criminality, you must be talking about an illegal act. The only illegal act would be that of the Republican's hacking the democrats and as we can see that is false.

Hey interesting twist. Trump was right. Obama was wiretapping Trump tower and most likely conversations with Trump due to this being Trump's campaign manager. It seems this may have been a FISA warrant starting in 2014 and is not admissible in court. However, the information obtained from this warrant can be shared with the White House. A day after some of this information was shared an article was published about Trump colluding with the Russians showed up in the Washington Post. Interesting stuff coming out.

Exclusive: US government wiretapped former Trump campaign chairman

http://www.cnn.com/2017/09/18/politi...ans/index.html
Old    Shawndoggy (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       09-20-2017, 2:59 PM Reply   
Obama must have been a mastermind to have preemptively obtained a fisa warrant on Manafort before trump even announced he was running, let alone before Trump brought on Manafort to manage his campaign. Seems like some serious jedi mind control going on.
Old    Darrel F (95sn)      Join Date: Sep 2005       09-20-2017, 4:12 PM Reply   
Quote:
Hey interesting twist. Trump was right. Obama was wiretapping Trump tower and most likely conversations with Trump due to this being Trump's campaign manager. It seems this may have been a FISA warrant starting in 2014 and is not admissible in court. However, the information obtained from this warrant can be shared with the White House. A day after some of this information was shared an article was published about Trump colluding with the Russians showed up in the Washington Post. Interesting stuff coming out.
LOL, um no. Trump is rarely right. Hey, did he unleash the Fire and Fury yet?
The more interesting warrant was the search warrant at manaforts house. To get that they must convince a judge of criminal activity. They did. They have told manafort they intend to indict him. Why did trump hire manafort, who was being investigated by the FBI, as his campaign manager. His recent expertise in advancing ukranian / Russian agenda, and money laundering thru real estate. Russians arnt supposed to vote in American elections. This appears to be the guy Mueller is trying to get to flip for the big orange fish.

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