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Old     (timelinex)      Join Date: Oct 2014       10-18-2016, 1:43 PM Reply   
We have all been injured while wakeboarding or know people that have been. It seems like the most frequent are ribs/knee/ankle type injuries.

I've seen the following advice toted here and there as good ways to prevent injuries, but I'm not sure how much truth there is to it.:

1. Speed: The slower speed the better. No doubt about it. But I'm not really sure just how much 2 mph matters. I go 21.4mph which is 'slow' but have still twice hurt my ribs now and had a class 2 pec tear. Obviously falls at 16 mph hurt a TON less, but outside of practicing some beginner things, it's not really realistic going THAT slow.

2. Not trying new tricks. It seems like alot of people get injured on old tricks, just as much as new tricks though. Maybe because they get complacent with old tricks and also probably go bigger with them?

I love riding, just like most of you here. However I've been in sports my whole life and never really had any injuries. Then I start wakeboarding 2 years ago and I've already had several moderate injuries.

Anyone have any solid advice on reducing the risk of injuries?
Old     (razorjaw)      Join Date: Jan 2003       10-18-2016, 9:15 PM Reply   
1. Warming up. The amount of people who simply rock up, board on and ride is crazy. Whether you prefer a ballistic warm up or an old school jog and static stretches, you're far less likely to do incidental damage.
2. Correct fitting gear. Wear a set of bindings 2 sizes too big is a good way to hurt your knee or ankle.
3. Good instruction. You get better at everything including falling safely.

Hope that helps.
Old     (dococ)      Join Date: Mar 2002       10-18-2016, 9:26 PM Reply   
Maybe with one or two exceptions, every time I've gotten really effed up wake boarding has been while attempting a new trick, usually an invert. It sucks but after I turned 40 I had to really start thinking is it worth it to try and dial in any new inverts. Spins usually don't give me much trouble for injuries, although a couple times I've gotten worked on a spin off a big double-up if I got a weird pop and came down hard and off balance, taking a knee to the chin or something like that.

So from that perspective, the advice might be "don't try new inverts if you are old." But that sucks!

At 48, I'm itching so, so bad to try some familiar inverts off the kickers at the cable park, but I just don't know if it's worth risking another concussion, broken face, wrecked knee, etc.
Old     (99Bison)      Join Date: Sep 2012       10-18-2016, 11:59 PM Reply   
Do slow progression... short rope, slower, 1 wake, surface, etc. Hucking things at 21.4 is still risky.
Basically almost anything you are trying to do can be done incrementally.
As the above says, instruction, in person... do all of the "The Book" foundation, beginner, ride switch, etc.
Old     (denverd1)      Join Date: May 2004       10-19-2016, 8:43 AM Reply   
really like the Book's progession. lots of good drills to get your edging perfected. once you can hit the wake the same way every time, things get a lot more predictable. then you can start working on spins and inverts. When we started out, we'd just throw things with no idea if they have the mechanics down or not. my buddy and I decided we were going to learn tantrums one day. I landed on my head a few times, he broke his foot. neither of us had any business trying them.

work on basics and build your way up to the fun stuff. slow down and shorten rope for new maneuves
Old     (fly135)      Join Date: Jun 2004       10-19-2016, 9:08 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by dococ View Post
At 48, I'm itching so, so bad to try some familiar inverts off the kickers at the cable park, but I just don't know if it's worth risking another concussion, broken face, wrecked knee, etc.
Do it! Inverts off a ramp are easier than the wake. Plus you are going much slower.
Old     (ottog1979)      Join Date: Apr 2007       10-19-2016, 9:25 AM Reply   
I'm 55 and still wakeboard somewhat regularly. As you age, goals change - just continuing to participate (for a long time yet) is what I'm mainly after. With that said:
Warming up.
Slow (sometimes very slow) progression on new tricks.
Going with the flow - Some days, it's just not flowing, so I don't force it. When it is going well, I try more new things.
Staying in shape generally (running, lifting, working out and keeping weight down/appropriate).
Old     (timelinex)      Join Date: Oct 2014       10-19-2016, 9:46 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by denverd1 View Post
really like the Book's progession. lots of good drills to get your edging perfected. once you can hit the wake the same way every time, things get a lot more predictable. then you can start working on spins and inverts. When we started out, we'd just throw things with no idea if they have the mechanics down or not. my buddy and I decided we were going to learn tantrums one day. I landed on my head a few times, he broke his foot. neither of us had any business trying them.

work on basics and build your way up to the fun stuff. slow down and shorten rope for new maneuves
I think this is probably the key for me. I need to slow down. I've always been an 'aggressive' learner, trying to progress as fast as possible in everything by always pushing myself past the comfort zone. I just learned the backroll and I'm already doing drills for learning the tantrum, 360's, wakeskate raleys, blind landings, etc... I'm not sure I know how to live any other way though! haha

But atleast I guess I am still going through the proper steps and drills to learning a trick, versus just hucking it! I can thank learn wake instruction for that.

As far as shortening the rope goes.... I'm assuming this is safer because you can slow the boat down and also you can do a smaller cut which results in a slower horizontal speed as well. How do you guys shorten the rope a ton without messing with your timing and general riding feel? Whenever I have tried shortening the rope, the riding feeling is very different. The line tension is very different and the entire approach feels extremely rushed. I ride at 65ft, so I guess maybe it's because I'm not all the way out there anyways? Is the advice geared more towards those riding at 75-85ft. I'm not so sure that if I learned my backroll at 55ft I would land it right away at 65ft because of the big change in line tension response. I guess I gotta give it a go again, I haven't in a long time.

Last edited by timelinex; 10-19-2016 at 9:49 AM.
Old     (MystiikVLX)      Join Date: Jul 2014       10-19-2016, 10:04 AM Reply   
Nice to see some fellow "life experienced" folks out there wakeboarding. As a 50 year old, I usually board with folks ages 17-22 .
Old     (ottog1979)      Join Date: Apr 2007       10-19-2016, 2:39 PM Reply   
It's still just too much damned fun to quit and it's such a great workout.
Old     (brettw)      Join Date: Jul 2007       10-19-2016, 3:58 PM Reply   
Don't slam for me this, but I got into foiling (Airchair) partly in thinking that it'd be easier on the body long-term, and that I wanted to be able to get behind a boat until the day I die. I didn't want to eff my legs in a way that would likely affect me long-term. I ended up liking it quite a bite more and don't have to worry about wrecking my legs or knees. You can certainly get injured still, but the leg injuries are out. I've popped my ear drum twice but now wear either ear plugs or helmets. Anyway, don't knock it till you've tried it - several times.
Old     (dococ)      Join Date: Mar 2002       10-19-2016, 8:16 PM Reply   
John, I knew you were going to say that!
My most comfortable invert always has been HS back roll to revert. I saw a guy on video do one off the kicker recently at one of the pro Red Bull contests, and I thought to myself it actually looks pretty easy (but if easy, wondered why this would be the big finale trick chosen by a pro?) But I don't seem to see many folks doing HS backrolls at the park. Given that behind the boat you come in with a progressive cut and sort of scoop the wake to sling the board up and around, is there something weird about it off the kicker where you can't get the scoop effect, or is it pretty straight-forward? It seems to me the progressive cut concept doesn't translate so well at the park, but then again, I'm still pretty new to park riding.
Disclaimer: I fully realize I'm opening myself up here, because if you tell me it's easy and just be a man and nut up, and I still don't, then well...
Old     (razorjaw)      Join Date: Jan 2003       10-20-2016, 3:05 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by dococ View Post
John, I knew you were going to say that!
My most comfortable invert always has been HS back roll to revert. I saw a guy on video do one off the kicker recently at one of the pro Red Bull contests, and I thought to myself it actually looks pretty easy (but if easy, wondered why this would be the big finale trick chosen by a pro?) But I don't seem to see many folks doing HS backrolls at the park. Given that behind the boat you come in with a progressive cut and sort of scoop the wake to sling the board up and around, is there something weird about it off the kicker where you can't get the scoop effect, or is it pretty straight-forward? It seems to me the progressive cut concept doesn't translate so well at the park, but then again, I'm still pretty new to park riding.
Disclaimer: I fully realize I'm opening myself up here, because if you tell me it's easy and just be a man and nut up, and I still don't, then well...
Depends on the park you go to Definitely different, but I, like you, love the R2R behind the boat and gave them a go at the park. The scoop is different (no water to accelerate through), but as long as you initiate off the middle-top of the kicker (obviously off the top once you get them) you should be right. You won't spin like you do on a R2R and may do a normal backroll instead - have you landed them before? (Silly question but I've never landed a regular backroll behind the boat, only R2R...). Either way, I got it second go after over rotating my first one. It was low but usually your first ones are. Let us know how you go!
Old     (fly135)      Join Date: Jun 2004       10-20-2016, 5:53 PM Reply   
Doc, it's hard for me to imagine a pro throwing a R2R as a money trick. A R2R off the kicker isn't that hard. The way you throw it depends on the kicker. If it's a flat ramp you just kind of bounce off of it. I hate flat ramps. You have to charge them hard because you don't get a lot of lift. If it's a curved ramp like a Unit XL try to ride to the top and jump straight up. You'll get a ton of height and a lot of float time.

I'll be 61 in less than 2 weeks. This has been a rough year. Broke my foot behind the boat 6 months ago and pulled my right hamstring last month on a wakeskate. But it wouldn't be any fun if I wasn't trying something new. My broke foot limited how much I could wakeboard so I picked up wakeskating about 4 months ago. Love'n it!
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Old     (eternalshadow)      Join Date: Nov 2001       10-20-2016, 7:26 PM Reply   
Yoga helped me out quite a bit. Getting some flexibility back goes a long way. I've also been very conscious of my mental state. If I'm not feeling something I don't force it like I would have as a younger rider. I'd rather shelf something big and work on something new that's switch or smaller. Learning new things on the tramp/diving board also help by increasing air awareness and some muscle memory, while still different than the boat it adds an extra element of saving yourself.
Old     (99Bison)      Join Date: Sep 2012       10-20-2016, 9:17 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by timelinex View Post
I think this is probably the key for me. I need to slow down. I've always been an 'aggressive' learner, trying to progress as fast as possible in everything by always pushing myself past the comfort zone. I just learned the backroll and I'm already doing drills for learning the tantrum, 360's, wakeskate raleys, blind landings, etc... I'm not sure I know how to live any other way though! haha

But atleast I guess I am still going through the proper steps and drills to learning a trick, versus just hucking it! I can thank learn wake instruction for that.

As far as shortening the rope goes.... I'm assuming this is safer because you can slow the boat down and also you can do a smaller cut which results in a slower horizontal speed as well. How do you guys shorten the rope a ton without messing with your timing and general riding feel? Whenever I have tried shortening the rope, the riding feeling is very different. The line tension is very different and the entire approach feels extremely rushed. I ride at 65ft, so I guess maybe it's because I'm not all the way out there anyways? Is the advice geared more towards those riding at 75-85ft. I'm not so sure that if I learned my backroll at 55ft I would land it right away at 65ft because of the big change in line tension response. I guess I gotta give it a go again, I haven't in a long time.


Length and speed can vary quite a bit for progression if you let it help. Almost to the a ridiculous point if you want it to.

The book and learnwake sometimes have suggested speeds, even for each step in the progression. For example for the hsfs 360 steps I think the speeds go from 14-19 for all 10 steps to Ollie 360.

Basically you want to learn the trick at the minimum speed and length possible, then once you have that down on lock (the muscle memory / comfort, confidence takes over the thinking) gradually go longer rope/bigger.

Yes, shorter/slower = less time in air, less distance traveled, less impact flat,edge catch, more time to correct, etc. it's pretty significant, there's a learnwake graphic in one video I think that shows like 2x distance traveled for like 10 feet of rope.
For example, would you rather train for cliff jumping off the peak of your house first, or work your way up starting with something closer to the ground? Say start at porch, then try deck, then try side of roof, then finally peak.

Our riders now tend to go about 55' at 20.4 mph for new things... which is pretty much all the time it seems. Sometimes still go faster and longer for fun aggressive days, but no one has ever not been able to land any of their tricks at the slower speed and length.

And if really doing progression will go say 19 and try the trick 1 wake first, or 14 on the surface.

Yes your timing will be different, but it gets adjusted, just as if you were going longer. IMO the varied speeds also helps your brain be more adaptable instead of only understanding one path.
Old     (dococ)      Join Date: Mar 2002       10-20-2016, 9:33 PM Reply   
Thanks guys for all the pointers, makes me feel better about giving it a go. I doubt I'll try it now because I'm out of shape and also snowboard season is right around the corner, but this spring I'll prob have a go at it. When I get to ride it's either VIP, Terminus (both Unit XL) or I really like the kicker at Wake Island, which seems similar but a bit smaller and slightly less aggressive curve to it I think. John actually gave me an idea that maybe I'll try it first on a skate and let the skate go before I do the flip, that way I can feel the pull and the rotation first with less risk (like some do for learning raleys). All of your comments were helpful and I appreciate it. John, sorry to hear of your injury, but I'm glad (not surprised) you are making something positive out of it. I've always appreciated your philosophy and attitude about things, and if occasionally I start thinking it's time to "grow up" and leave this stuff to the kids, you are one of the folks who reminds me actually the thing to do is just keep going and keep chasing the stoke in whatever way is available.
Cheers, fellas!
Old     (theloungelife)      Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Salt Lake City, UT       10-21-2016, 8:49 AM Reply   
I feel clueless ,but what is this "Book" everyone is mentioning?
Old     (99Bison)      Join Date: Sep 2012       10-21-2016, 9:20 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by theloungelife View Post
I feel clueless ,but what is this "Book" everyone is mentioning?


https://www.amazon.com/Book-Box-Set-.../dp/B0009WSV6Y
Old     (bftskir)      Join Date: Jan 2004       10-21-2016, 12:35 PM Reply   
Probably the #1 way to reduce chances of injury is to have no alcohol of any kind before or during boating/participating in watersports
Old     (YYCBoarder)      Join Date: Apr 2013       10-21-2016, 12:46 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by bftskir View Post
Probably the #1 way to reduce chances of injury is to have no alcohol of any kind before or during boating/participating in watersports
I'll have to try that some time. Does it really work?
Old     (ottog1979)      Join Date: Apr 2007       10-21-2016, 1:45 PM Reply   
Hah! Liquid courage. A little goes a very long way. Also discussed on the boat this morning: The only difference between Courage and Stupidity is the Outcome.

San V! It feels REALLY good to get the home lake back.
Old     (bill)      Join Date: Feb 2001       10-26-2016, 6:34 AM Reply   
pick another sport like running or biking lol
Old     (TC_Mastercraf_X5)      Join Date: Feb 2013       10-26-2016, 6:56 AM Reply   
You can get the book a lot cheaper than that if you wait for the annual wake world charity event!

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