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Old     (harryhog)      Join Date: Mar 2003       01-11-2004, 12:20 PM Reply   
just wondering where i should start my roll, should it be the moment i pop and leave the water, or up the wake, i'm currently throwing it too early and loosing all my pop, so i'm thinkin i should maybe throw it in the way i'd do a backflip on a tramp(ie as i leave the tramp)
Old    eyesman            01-11-2004, 6:04 PM Reply   
hi harry.

i just watched a video on england today and they had a waterskiier on knottingham. it was filmed in the 80s so from your post it looks like wakeboarding has made it there too!

as far as the backroll - it definitely needs to be thrown with some pop. this is easy to say but it doesn't really help people for timing. so the advice i got that helped me was to start to initiate it as soon as you find yourself straddling the wake - in other words, as you move over the wake and the crest is inbetween your feet - that is a good time to send the signal to your brain that its time to initiate. by the time the signal transfers to an action in your body it will be right when you are getting your pop - assuming your reaction time is similar to mine

Good luck!
Old     (3puttwilson)      Join Date: Apr 2002       01-12-2004, 5:49 AM Reply   
On hs just think of doing a regular wake jump and when you get your pop off the wake put your right ear to your right shoulder(regular stance) and it will pull you right around. It's really easy to get flipped around. The harder part is landing it. You'll be shocked how easy it is to get all the way around..I got that from Wake Physics.
Old     (talltigeguy)      Join Date: Sep 2003       01-12-2004, 6:37 AM Reply   
I'm no good at it, but I read about it a lot, and everyone says the rookie mistake is to initiate the spin too soon. Wait and get your pop first.
Old     (harryhog)      Join Date: Mar 2003       01-12-2004, 8:26 AM Reply   
yep that all makes sense when i look at myself on vid, i was just wondering how to iniate it at the top, but i assume that at the pop i then thro my head and therefore weight to my back foot which will rotate me, and obviously keep my handle in.

so i guess the next stage is just to see where i land and try to get used to it to eventually spot the landing, cheers everyone
Old     (stephan)      Join Date: Nov 2002       01-12-2004, 3:04 PM Reply   
Don't try and throw it off the wake, that is not how wakeboarding works. You have to load the line and create some resistance. It's all in the edge and how much tension you have as you edge up the wake.

Old     (typhoon)      Join Date: Jul 2001       01-12-2004, 3:11 PM Reply   
where did you get all your water time?
Old     (stephan)      Join Date: Nov 2002       01-12-2004, 11:44 PM Reply   
Well it all started when I was like 12, I'm 22 now so basically I've been at this game for awhile. My dad has a house out at Lake Havasu where we keep the boat. I make it out there for at least one week and 6 or so weekends a year. I live in SLO and try and ride as much as possible, but it's hard without a boat. This past summer I also went on a week long houseboattrip to Powell, that was nice. Pretty much I just ride as often as possible, when I have a girlfriend thay always know that I may cancel on them to go riding, it's just understood.

Here's a pic of a backroll at Powell after sunset.
Old     (butterflybdr540)      Join Date: Apr 2001       01-13-2004, 10:25 AM Reply   
It took me forever to get a back roll. I think I landed on my head 100 times.
What helped me is not cutting out too far and making sure I have a progressive edge and cut to the wake. When you get to the top of the wake look up and over your leading shoulder while turning your board away from the boat. Throw this as you leave the wake. It whips me around every time now. No more landing on my head. Just gotta figure out how to keep the board from slipping out.

Here are a few of my puney backroll pictures when I first started rotating. Not like a pro but its a start!!


Old    eyesman            01-13-2004, 10:27 AM Reply   
butterfly!! you are landing backrolls now.
You rock!!!
Old     (butterflybdr540)      Join Date: Apr 2001       01-13-2004, 10:32 AM Reply   
Thanks ICEMAN! I am so happy about it. I get around every time now it is like a rush every time I go.

I am going to try a tantrum next and then a raley will be on the top of the list. I would like to try my 180s but I just don't get into them I don't know why.
Old     (solo)      Join Date: Oct 2001       01-13-2004, 11:06 AM Reply   
The biggest piece of advise I could give someone would be that your body position when leaving the wake is how you'll land. If you squat when leaving, you'll butt check on the landing. Stand tall at the wake and when coming out of your rotation look for the shoreline.
Old    upupnaway            01-13-2004, 11:15 AM Reply   
Are there any pics or clips with a grabbed backroll?
Old     (butterflybdr540)      Join Date: Apr 2001       01-13-2004, 11:26 AM Reply   
Of course you would have to out do me Hahn! ;)

Old    murrayair            01-15-2004, 1:49 PM Reply   
A lot of stuff i have heard or read from pros is that the board should initiate and carry you through the flip. When i was first learning my backroll, i kept jumping and then throwing my body and that worked sometimes, but i was using so much energy and working so hard to get the rotatation right that i would never have been able to add a grab or 180. When i started letting the board do the work on inverts i started working less hard to do the flip. It took me a while to get used to, though once i did it is soooo much better.
Old     (rock_n_boardin)      Join Date: May 2003       01-15-2004, 2:31 PM Reply   
Hey Butterfly, I am curious, do you work for American General?
Old     (jarrod)      Join Date: May 2003       01-15-2004, 2:38 PM Reply   
Mike, Here's a video I made of Dan Klopp. He does a grabbed HS roll and a grabbed TS roll, and a bunch of other cool stuff. Hope this helps.

Old     (butterflybdr540)      Join Date: Apr 2001       01-15-2004, 2:53 PM Reply   

Broker Dealer is ING Financial Partners. We sell AG Products. Why?

Old    wakeboard_iraq            01-15-2004, 7:44 PM Reply   
Butterfly - you are also bending at the waist - look at Steve Hahn (solo) and notice that he is tall all of the way through the rotation. You are making a common mistake which will cause you to lose your pop and land on your head. Get your hips forward.

Harry - nobody has paid dues like I have for the backroll but I finally have it and it is easy now (not bragging - but I literally crashed 200 times trying that trick - always landing on the board, then stuffing the nose or slipping out).

Anyway, I had a really bad crash throwing the backroll for the first time on my new board (Parks) which is a lot faster than my old board (premier). I hit my face so hard on the water that I had double vision for a while. So, you might imagine - I was a little skittish about throwing the trick. After about two months of not trying it I decided I'd go for it behind Sean Jacksons boat. Still being nervous about the trick I threw it super easy - expecting to crash but not as hard. To my surprise I landed on the downside of the far wake and rode away (which, by the way, is a lot nicer than waiting for the boat to circle and bring you the handle). I land this trick all of the time now.

The moral to the story is to take it easy when "throwing" the back roll. Try shortening the rope to 55' and going SUPER EASY and you might just be surprised. You should not be popping you hips or pumping your legs - just roll with it nice and easy.

Good luck.
Old     (butterflybdr540)      Join Date: Apr 2001       01-16-2004, 9:29 AM Reply   
Maybe this is better.. This was two days later. I am getting all the way around but landing on the wake. I know I can pull the rope in but I am determined to get it at 70 feet.

Thanks for the tip
backroll2lastdayFBresize4.bmp (36.1 k)
Old     (butterflybdr540)      Join Date: Apr 2001       01-16-2004, 9:30 AM Reply   
Okay why is it doing that. I had to resize it 4 times and then now this.. UGH..

Old     (butterflybdr540)      Join Date: Apr 2001       01-16-2004, 9:37 AM Reply   
I know what it is now geez I am blonde sorry.

Old    eyesman            01-16-2004, 9:40 AM Reply   

If you are determined to get it at 70, the first thing that i would be interested in is what speed you are going? if you are boarding at 19 mph clearing at 70 will be much more difficult than at 23mph. i am a whimp so i only ride just below 22mph and i land out in the flats. i think what really helps to get out there is waiting until you get the pop and then throwing it. when i first tried these i spun really quick,right off the wake, and arms tucked in - i cased everytime so i had the driver shorten the rope to 60feet hence cheating at little when i got a little more comfortable with being inverted i went back out to 70, took my time, rotated slower, and let my arms out just a little which slowed the rotation down a lot. all things aside you are doing you backrolls! that is sweet!

Old    wakeboard_iraq            01-16-2004, 10:16 AM Reply   
Butterfly - great job with the backrolls - I dont know too many people that throw them and even fewer women. Great job!
Old     (butterflybdr540)      Join Date: Apr 2001       01-16-2004, 11:32 AM Reply   
ICEman.. I know but I am stubborn!!

yeah just wait when I can post a picture of me doing a raley!! That will be saweeet!!

Old     (stephan)      Join Date: Nov 2002       01-16-2004, 2:56 PM Reply   
Bfly, from your pictures I can tell that you are trying to flip the trick off the wake and are giving too much of a slicing motion as you push off the wake. You don't want to initiate the flip until you are in the air. When I do them I coast in and only edge when I hit the spray( it takes the trick up more). You want to hit the wake with as much tension on the line as possible. i would also think about thinking "UP" and taking your whole body up off the wake as opposed to trying to get your board up in the air. You've heard that your body follows where your head is, well if your not clearing the wake then you need to get your head up. I can tell this by seeing that your chin is tucked into your collarbone which is down, no muy bien. Think about creating as much space between your chin and collarbone, this will take you higher, allows a slower laid out rotation and makes the trick real smooth. Hold on w/ both hands throughout the trick.


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