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Old     (srock)      Join Date: Mar 2002       07-18-2007, 4:57 AM Reply   
Florida is going to adopt the same emissions standards that California has proposed. These standards are just waiting the federal govt's approval. Can someone tell me what the means for our tow vehicles? What about diesel engines?
Old     (mkperceptions)      Join Date: Jan 2007       07-18-2007, 7:22 AM Reply   
It means that you might actually have to fix your cars hahaha. All my friends that live in florida ride there cars with the check engine lights on for years and dont even care. As far as tow vehicles and diesels we have them here and it isn't a problem. Pretty soon everyone will have the emmissions standards and in all honesty it isn't the end of the world. Don't worry Tim you will survive :-)
Old     (srock)      Join Date: Mar 2002       07-18-2007, 8:04 AM Reply   
I just hear and read things like green stickers for dirtbikes, 50 state legal including California, California requires notice that this item contains cancer or birth defect causing materials.

Sounds like my new car may have just have a warning sticker not to breath the air at the tailpipe.

When you look at the mandated fuel economy standards of the bill, you know something is going to change.
Old     (mkperceptions)      Join Date: Jan 2007       07-18-2007, 8:06 AM Reply   
yea it is jut a sticker. How can something change when we already have it here and no doubtedly you have a car that will meet or exceed california emissions standards. we have already been over this here in california and are WAY past it. Green stickers etc are for 4 strokes, 2 strokes get a red sticker and can only be run certain months. Get use to it
Old     (mkperceptions)      Join Date: Jan 2007       07-18-2007, 8:18 AM Reply   
remember this, no one cares that these emmissions standards started when they did for california because it didnt affect them but now when it starts affecting you now you care. LOL man just like WWII
Old     (srock)      Join Date: Mar 2002       07-18-2007, 8:54 AM Reply   
WWII? No one cares?

If I recall correctly the reason California had issues in the first place was because you were all choking on your own smog. Why would I care or more so follow that local issue.

I know as much about California's smog problem as the average Californian knows about the Everglades water and pollution problem. How much do you care about the Everglades?

It seems we all share a common concern at this point and I'm curious about it's impact.
Old    deltahoosier            07-18-2007, 8:54 AM Reply   
Considering Florida is a lower income state compair to cali, it gets real expensive if they are going to car emmisions like cali. It will be a huge burden on poorer people. For instance if you even change a battery within 50 to 100 miles of a smog check you can not do the check until you drive enough miles. It is very hard to mod a car. If they change fuel to california fuel, you will drop in fuel effeciency and will be paying higher gas prices for the special formula. If you can, fight it with everything you got.
Old     (srock)      Join Date: Mar 2002       07-18-2007, 9:02 AM Reply   
Florida use to have smog checks but they found most vehicles, like 98%++ were not in violation.

What has happening was the testing centers were privatized and very profitable. These center's owners spent a lot of money lobbying to keep the centers open but they were finally eliminated.
Old     (mkperceptions)      Join Date: Jan 2007       07-18-2007, 9:07 AM Reply   
poorer state and the living costs are significantly lower too. I work on engine management and the readiness codes you are talking about depend on the car make some wont flag codes. As for mods there are ways to do it and if you are poor you shouldnt be modding your car LOL. Tell people in Oakland that florida should get a exception because the people are poor hahaha
Old     (srock)      Join Date: Mar 2002       07-18-2007, 9:36 AM Reply   
Low living costs = lower wages. Some things are proportionally relevant.

A poor person in any state suffers from the ills associated with older cars. Maybe its smog tests or maybe its batteries and starters.
Old     (srock)      Join Date: Mar 2002       07-18-2007, 9:38 AM Reply   
Hey Rick, sounds like you would be poor in either State.

(Message edited by srock on July 18, 2007)
Old     (liquidmx)      Join Date: Jun 2005       07-18-2007, 9:48 AM Reply   
Tim, It means a lot more if your a car enthusiast. If you want aftermarket parts on a smog required car (which is anything thats 25yrs or newer if my memory serves me correct) you must purchase smog legal parts. If you ride dirtbikes you will need to deal with the whole green sticker issue which allows you only to ride certain months of the year if you have a red stickered bike (unless its on a private track, then the "sticker rules" dont apply.

Basically you cant stick a carbed 351 windsor in that new mustang or ride a new dirtbike on public property certain months of the year.

P.S. I think Diesels have smog requirements starting on 2008 correct?
Old     (mkperceptions)      Join Date: Jan 2007       07-18-2007, 10:21 AM Reply   
i doubt im poor I fix all the broken cars hahaha. but seruiously I think all the past cars would be fine and just the new cars would be subject to the new stuff. no need to worry I was pointing out that it isnt as bad as it looks or seems
Old     (srock)      Join Date: Mar 2002       07-18-2007, 11:19 AM Reply   
Yes, diesels are changing in 08 and again in 2010, I think. Also, we will see the use of low sulfur fuels.

I was considering the purchase of a diesel truck but I also read that GM will be releasing 1/2 ton truck and other diesel car applications. I like that since I don't necessary want a 3/4 ton truck so maybe I'll wait.

My guess the release of these engines is timed with new requirements on the Federal level. However, the tougher "California" requirements proposed by many states may delay or change avaialbility.

I see Arnold may sue to Fed govt because California has been trying to adopt tougher standards since 2005.

(Message edited by srock on July 18, 2007)
Old     (mkperceptions)      Join Date: Jan 2007       07-18-2007, 11:44 AM Reply   
yea we will see where the deisel market goes but it seems that we always find ways to conform so dont worry we will just build em stronger, faster, and more efficient. That is why we are Americans :-)
Old     (liquidmx)      Join Date: Jun 2005       07-18-2007, 12:36 PM Reply   
Tim, I have been preaching FOREVER that if chevy made a diesel tahoe I would be all over it!
Old    deltahoosier            07-18-2007, 1:33 PM Reply   
Rick. Hate to tell you but it is a burden and the only people getting rich are the people fixing the cars and the government with all the special fees that allow you get your car smogged. No matter which way you slice it, it is another financial drain. Not sure where you live in Florida, but, to buy a house in Oakland it will cost you near a million dollars. Also, driving around the bay area I am hard pressed to find too many old cars. When I visit my family in florida and indiana I see tons of old cars. Cars pretty much have the same sticker price accross the country. There are more higher paying jobs in Cali than almost anywhere in the country.

On fixing cars, you just can not go down an buy this or that part. Try replacing a Cat Converter in california. You are for it because you sound like a person who can cash in on it. The reality is, it is a burden and Florida does not have mountains that hold in smog like they do in California. I don't see the reason for Florida to do this. If I was quoted correctly and could be way off on the price, but are you ready to buy the $30,000 machine to do smogs or pretty much be ran out of business if you can't?
Old     (shawns_no_good)      Join Date: Jul 2007       07-18-2007, 1:39 PM Reply   
California started these laws because they were the only ones who would be able to force a change in the automotive industry. If other states like OK or FL were to have started, many automakers would have just said "screw it, it's not that much of a loss". When you represent as much of the industries consumers as California does, you're going to get people bending over backwards to fit your laws. Like it's been said before. Most any cars any of you drive will meet the new standards already since the automakers have been trying to meet CA's standards, it will mostly only affect older vehicles that are in need of maintenance and modified exhaust systems.
Old     (mkperceptions)      Join Date: Jan 2007       07-18-2007, 2:13 PM Reply   
Rod i do not live in florida I live in the california bay area and my house is work almost a million dollars. I did not pay that much for it but that is what it is worth here. we go by the moto " you gotta pay to play." I help people get there vw's through smog everyday. Some dont care weather it is time for smog or not they just want it fixed, some wait till it is time. Do smog regulations suck yea. But if there were not so many people in one area we wouldn't have to worry about it but that is not how it is around here. I am a tech I don't cash in on people needed a car to pass smog, in all honesty I would rather just do a brake job instead of smog work.
Old     (srock)      Join Date: Mar 2002       07-18-2007, 2:22 PM Reply   
Well there are 11 states so far that have joined the California bandwagon to institute the same limits on mileage efficiency and tailpipe emissions. It also addresses other green house gases on things like factories and power plants. It's in response to global warming.

The individual state enforcement/testing is a another issue.


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